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Guided Missile

By Guided Missile
in The Lounge

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Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum  

221 members have voted

  1. 1. Saints Web Definitely Not Official Second Referendum

    • Leave Before - Leave Now
      46
    • Leave Before - Remain Now
      11
    • Leave Before - Not Bothered Now
      2
    • Remain Before - Remain Now
      129
    • Remain Before - Leave Now
      8
    • Remain Before - Not Bothered Now
      1
    • Not Bothered Before - Leave Now
      3
    • Not Bothered Before - Remain Now
      5
    • I've never been bothered - Why am I on this Thread?
      3
    • No second Ref - 2016 was Definitive and Binding
      13

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aintforever

aintforever

Posted
Posted
Ok, cool, so if I can blamed for people voting Brexit, can people who actually voted Brexit be blamed for what happens after it?

 

Pre-vote, I don't remember there being massive amounts of racist calling pre-Brexit, as most Remainers never thought people in this country were that STUPID. But then you watch programs like Jeremy Kyle, look on Social Media and you feel an idiot that you didn't recognise the symptoms.

 

There was plenty of racist calling. I would imagine that those in areas most effected by mass immigration may have been put off the remain campaign by being labelled racist. Shows a lack of empathy for their situation.

Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
There was plenty of racist calling. I would imagine that those in areas most effected by mass immigration may have been put off the remain campaign by being labelled racist. Shows a lack of empathy for their situation.

 

So they voted to get poorer. That showed us.

shurlock

shurlock

Posted
Posted
It is not acceptable to simply reject the other side’s proposals without a detailed explanation and counter proposals...so we now need to hear from the EU what the real issues are and what their alternative is so that we can discuss them

 

:mcinnes:

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted

Think this is the end for the Tories, whole thing has been handled like a complete mess. EU don't want to negotiate, so just leave or stay put and call and general election. Then we can get JC in charge and really crank things up to crazy.

Batman

Batman

Posted
Posted
Think this is the end for the Tories, whole thing has been handled like a complete mess. EU don't want to negotiate, so just leave or stay put and call and general election. Then we can get JC in charge and really crank things up to crazy.

 

EU are interested in hard cash. IF (big IF) the UK walks. that is a huge lot of hard cash they wont get. They are doing everything they can (with help of Blair) to get us to stay.....its what they do

 

I guess they could tax the greeks a bit more to make up the shortfall if we do walk.

shurlock

shurlock

Posted
Posted
EU are interested in hard cash. IF (big IF) the UK walks. that is a huge lot of hard cash they wont get. They are doing everything they can (with help of Blair) to get us to stay.....its what they do

 

I guess they could tax the greeks a bit more to make up the shortfall if we do walk.

 

The cash is irrelevant in the big picture. It’s not a large amount. That’s why it was easiest thing for the UK to concede.

Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

Posted
Posted (edited)
You think? May is in such a weak position now. She gambled everything on her Chequers deal and now it's (pretty much) been rejected, she's a dead woman walking. No way the extremist Brexiters in her party are going to let her stay in post now. She has ruled out a second referendum, so her only hope of clinging to power now is to call another GE.

 

It’s not the PM’s decision anymore, she can’t tag a confidence vote onto legislation like John Major did to get Maastricht through. She can’t just call a GE because it needs a 2/3rd majority in the house. The only other way to is she has to put down a confidence motion in herself, which Parliament has to pass, however my understanding is that in these circumstances Corbyn could try and form a Government. Either way I can’t really see enough Tory MP’s wanting her to lead the party into a GE again, so it’s doubtful she’ll get the numbers for either option.

 

Interestingly Michael Portillio mapped out a scenario where he feels there maybe one, but she’d have to give the Brexiters what they want because of the numbers they have. She negotiates something the majority of the Tory party can get behind, a Canada type deal. She can’t get it through Parliament so calls for a vote in Parliament on a GE, Labour will have to back it, so it’ll get the 2/3rd majority. She’ll then run a short single issue campaign, you want to leave the EU then kick out your Remain MP. It would in effect be a vote on her deal, but on a FPTP system which massively favours Leave. Portillo reckons she’ll get an increased majority and get the DUP off her back, which gives more flexibility around the NI border.

 

Personally don’t think she’s got the balls. She also doesn’t believe in Brexit, so I doubt she’d negotiate the acceptable deal in the first place. So I’m still going for no GE with her in charge. New leader, playing the above Portillio scenario, I can see. Not her though.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Edited by Lord Duckhunter
Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
Who is? Poorer than when? Last Financial crash?

 

Look, I’m pretty busy, but I’ve summed it up below for you:

 

- The vote resulted in a sharp fall in the value of the pound as investors lost confidence.

- This has resulted in more expensive imports, including food and fuel.

- We have seen increases in both petrol prices and fuel costs, making people poorer.

- To exacerbate this, these increases have contributed to a higher rate of inflation.

- To combat this inflation, the BoE has increased interest rates, which has in turn increased the cost of mortgages, and increased the cost of rents from Buy to Let properties as Landlords hand down the shortfalls.

- In addition to this, an increase of people selling their houses to safeguard their money, and a lack of confidence in the market has led to a decrease in house prices, with people losing equity and LTV, resulting in more expensive mortgages if they want to move after the above increase rate rises.

Batman

Batman

Posted
Posted
Look, I’m pretty busy, but I’ve summed it up below for you:

 

- The vote resulted in a sharp fall in the value of the pound as investors lost confidence.

- This has resulted in more expensive imports, including food and fuel.

- We have seen increases in both petrol prices and fuel costs, making people poorer.

- To exacerbate this, these increases have contributed to a higher rate of inflation.

- To combat this inflation, the BoE has increased interest rates, which has in turn increased the cost of mortgages, and increased the cost of rents from Buy to Let properties as Landlords hand down the shortfalls.

- In addition to this, an increase of people selling their houses to safeguard their money, and a lack of confidence in the market has led to a decrease in house prices, with people losing equity and LTV, resulting in more expensive mortgages if they want to move after the above increase rate rises.

 

UK house prices rose by 3.1% in the year to July 2018

Someone is not telling the truth

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted
Look, I’m pretty busy, but I’ve summed it up below for you:

 

- The vote resulted in a sharp fall in the value of the pound as investors lost confidence.

- This has resulted in more expensive imports, including food and fuel.

- We have seen increases in both petrol prices and fuel costs, making people poorer.

- To exacerbate this, these increases have contributed to a higher rate of inflation.

- To combat this inflation, the BoE has increased interest rates, which has in turn increased the cost of mortgages, and increased the cost of rents from Buy to Let properties as Landlords hand down the shortfalls.

- In addition to this, an increase of people selling their houses to safeguard their money, and a lack of confidence in the market has led to a decrease in house prices, with people losing equity and LTV, resulting in more expensive mortgages if they want to move after the above increase rate rises.

 

Same symptoms of the last crash, 8-10 year cycle. End.

Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
righto. London

 

Sorry, very London-centric as I live there or thereabouts - as do you don't you?

 

Either way that's the view as it is in London, and you can take out the LTV drop and just apply the rest to the rest of the UK if you like?

Batman

Batman

Posted
Posted
I'm not.

 

So we aren't.

 

Nor am I. My house has gone up in value and very recently chopped to a better mortgage deal.

 

Then, I do not live in (or near) London, so it does not matter

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted
Oh, OK, so even though as a country we're poorer, as far as you're concerned it doesn't matter, as you're fine. Cool.

 

You are basing the whole country on being poorer because you are. You are generalizing, by saying "we're", not all of us are.

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted (edited)
*Sigh*

 

You're just not getting it are you. This is why I know I'm better than you.

 

I'm getting it, you don't know and have no answers. That's what i "get". You are not better than anyone else on this planet, just a mere spec in the grand scheme of things, one that is poorer.

 

You are the exact reason people voted leave or don't vote. . Sad really.

Edited by Cabbage_Face
Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
I'm getting it, you don't know and have no answers. That's what i "get". You are not better than anyone else on this planet, just a mere spec in the grand scheme of things, one that is poorer.

 

I have given you answers, I have given you what has happened. Just because you haven't seen the effects personally does not mean we are not poorer as a country.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/cf51e840-7147-11e7-93ff-99f383b09ff9

 

I think getting poorer is something that you only really notice if you are poor. For instance, I know I'm paying more for fuel and gas now, as well as food, as I would assume pretty much everyone in the country is, including yourself. Now, you may have been lucky and got another McDonald's star (as an example), but that doesn't mean in real terms you are better off.

 

What has made you better off since Brexit?

Batman

Batman

Posted
Posted
I have given you answers, I have given you what has happened. Just because you haven't seen the effects personally does not mean we are not poorer as a country.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/cf51e840-7147-11e7-93ff-99f383b09ff9

 

I think getting poorer is something that you only really notice if you are poor. For instance, I know I'm paying more for fuel and gas now, as well as food, as I would assume pretty much everyone in the country is, including yourself. Now, you may have been lucky and got another McDonald's star (as an example), but that doesn't mean in real terms you are better off.

 

What has made you better off since Brexit?

 

I think you need to leave London

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted
I have given you answers, I have given you what has happened. Just because you haven't seen the effects personally does not mean we are not poorer as a country.

 

https://www.ft.com/content/cf51e840-7147-11e7-93ff-99f383b09ff9

 

I think getting poorer is something that you only really notice if you are poor. For instance, I know I'm paying more for fuel and gas now, as well as food, as I would assume pretty much everyone in the country is, including yourself. Now, you may have been lucky and got another McDonald's star (as an example), but that doesn't mean in real terms you are better off.

 

What has made you better off since Brexit?

 

Ok lets take fuel as an example, in 2012 it was 142p for Unleaded and 148p for Diesel. Currently we are 131 ish for Unleaded and 134ish for diesel, 2009 we had 85p and 97p, 2016 100p and 101p. Totally normal.

 

Food shop in Aldi.

 

Im not better off or worse off, i'm the same, i cut my cloth accordingly.

Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
Ok lets take fuel as an example, in 2012 it was 142p for Unleaded and 148p for Diesel. Currently we are 131 ish for Unleaded and 134ish for diesel, 2009 we had 85p and 97p, 2016 100p and 101p. Totally normal.

 

Im not better off or worse off, i'm the same, i cut my cloth accordingly.

 

How much was it pre-Brexit vote compared to now? Also, how much was oil a barrel at that point compared to now. We should be paying around 30% less for our fuel than we are now, considering the cost of a barrel of oil and our current exchange rate.

 

You cut your cloth accordingly - that doesn't mean you're not poorer. You do know that?

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted
How much was it pre-Brexit vote compared to now? Also, how much was oil a barrel at that point compared to now. We should be paying around 30% less for our fuel than we are now, considering the cost of a barrel of oil and our current exchange rate.

 

You cut your cloth accordingly - that doesn't mean you're not poorer. You do know that?

 

So why in 2012 was it so high? We were in the loving arms of the EU at this point?

 

Not at all, im not poorer. I'm the same. I'll let you know if this changes. Of course when something big like Brexit happens, the world reacts prices go up and change very quickly, especially when we have scaremongering.

Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
So why in 2012 was it so high? We were in the loving arms of the EU at this point?

 

Not at all, im not poorer. I'm the same. I'll let you know if this changes. Of course when something big like Brexit happens, the world reacts prices go up and change very quickly, especially when we have scaremongering.

 

The cost of a barrel of oil. In 2012 it was $103. Now it's $69.

 

What do you think has made that difference? I'll give you a clue - it's in my post explaining why the country is poorer.

Cabbage_Face

Cabbage_Face

Posted
Posted
The cost of a barrel of oil. In 2012 it was $103. Now it's $69.

 

What do you think has made that difference? I'll give you a clue - it's in my post explaining why the country is poorer.

 

So why is France, Portugal, Denmark, Greece, Holland more expensive than us, currently? Brexit?

shurlock

shurlock

Posted
Posted
So does anyone actually know the truth?

 

BoE has calculated that the UK has already lost around 2% of expected growth and 4% from household incomes since the referendum.

Unbelievable Jeff

Unbelievable Jeff

Posted
Posted
So why is France, Portugal, Denmark, Greece, Holland more expensive than us, currently? Brexit?

 

I don't think fuel is more expensive in those countries, but for instance, France has increased duty on fuel massively over the last year, which is why they are paying a larger amount now.

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