trousers Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 not tying him down before now was a big mistake. What safeguards would that have achieved? How would it have stopped Everton making an approach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Fred Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 The thing that irks me is that Koeman talks about the clubs ambition and not selling players this season to prove it yet is the first out the door. He knows the damage this will do to our selling club reputation that we were trying to lose with the signings of new contracts for FF VVD etc Seeing out his contract then moving on would not have been the same. In it for one person and one person only. IMO he (if he goes) probably is worse that MP Lovren etc who never pretended to be anything other than in it for the money. . He wrote an article saying he had taken these players as far as he could, so perhaps it is best for all that he goes and let's someone who can see the obvious gaps we need filling in the squad and actually believes we can push on. IMO the right manager could do something really good with the squad. Shame though two wins at Old Trafford etc he would have got a great reception if he left with some honour but has chosen to be another pantomime villian..I am sure he isn't bothered though, we were always just a job to him...however he has always love Scousers 2 and has always wanted to be their manager and all his dreams have come true so it's different being their manager! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToreSF Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 I think the whole new contract is irrelevant. Koeman could have signed in Feb and all this would have happened anyway. So I fail to see how Board could have behaved differently. When it comes to ambition, we have to live within our means. Clearly saints have ambition but also have financial constraints on how to achieve it. We simply can't offer what Everton are without jeopardising clubs security. I fully agree with this. Let's face it, Koeman has had his head turned by massive money both salary and transfer budget. Neither of which Saints could match. I think the club believed Koeman would honour his words about seeing out his contract but have been caught out by his change of mind. So I am not holding board to blame on this one. Les should keep his mouth shut until ink is dry on contract though. Agree with everything here. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 So.........what facts do we know? After trawling through about 5 pages to catch up with the night posters, we are none the wiser bar noting who is doing the pre slagging offs to all parties so they can be right some where. Great stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lallana's Left Peg Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 If someone wants to make you one of the best paid Managers in the world and you are clearly not one of the best Managers in the world I suppose it makes complete sense to pursue the offer. There is no way Saints could (or should) offer him £7m a year and a £100m transfer kitty. He will find it tough there, there is a different set of expectations to Saints with that sort of money being thrown at him and it hasn't gone too well for him at other clubs with bigger pressures but he should always try and better himself. Saints need to act decisively with his replacement and we'll only know how much it matters losing Koeman based on how good his replacement is. I am a little worried about the message this sends out to the players we want to keep though. Lets hope for no clauses in the contract of VvD as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toussaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Time for Liebherr to sell,bring in people with enough financial clour to take the Club to the next level. The alternative is stagnation and eventually falling back to pre Cortese/Markus I think we have achieved beyond our wildest dreams, I don't think there is a "next level" for Saints. If by next level you mean Arsenal, Chelsea , man City etc? We could do a Leicester perhaps, but they are not at the next level, it was a one off I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toussaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them Or you could say an arbitrary statement like that gave him an easy get out? We were always a stepping stone, I expected to lose him, just not to an inferior club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them Welcome back. Been far too long since your last post (17th October 2015). Coincidentally, you've come back at just the right time. We've just entered another meltdown phase and we need all the rational posters we can muster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCholulaKid Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 In it for one person and one person only. IMO he (if he goes) probably is worse that MP Lovren etc who never pretended to be anything other than in it for the money. If another employer came to anyone on this forum and offered the same role, double the money and a massively increased budget to potentially turn their workplace into a market force then they'd leave too. I know I would - you'd have to be more or less mental not to. Koeman's not a Saints fan - he's a professional football manager. Why should he stay? He's given us our best ever Premier League finish and guaranteed 6 games of European football. It's disappointing for us but that's the way football works. Always has been. People need to stop being fannies about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them You're right about it being one reason, but got the wrong reason. This is about money. Apologies for the lack of random but dramatic capital letters. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ooh it's a corner Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them If you think he is going for ambition, answer this question: Would he go and work for Everton if they offered him £50,000 a year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pluto Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Tell Everton fans, if Barcelona come calling at anytime he will be off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InvictaSaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them So where do Adam Blackmore's comments about Koeman having met the board and being happy with what was on offer before having his head turned by a new agent fit into that logic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Plenty of stirring on here this morning. Haven't seen Richmond since the summer of despair If Ron is ****ing off, I hope he does it soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 The board want profit and as long as we are in the EPL then they are happy . When you say profit, do you mean avoid making losses that add to our debt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Good to see all the usual characters getting plenty of bites on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Fred Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 If another employer came to anyone on this forum and offered the same role, double the money and a massively increased budget to potentially turn their workplace into a market force then they'd leave too. I know I would - you'd have to be more or less mental not to. Koeman's not a Saints fan - he's a professional football manager. Why should he stay? He's given us our best ever Premier League finish and guaranteed 6 games of European football. It's disappointing for us but that's the way football works. Always has been. People need to stop being fannies about this. You are right..put the for sale signs up! Let every player who can get a bit more cash elsewhere leave! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 I blame the Owners Shame on them ...for not adding to our debt or spending more of her own money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 One factor not yet mentioned is that Ron seemed close to signing before his holiday but cool on his return. Maybe he wasn't as happy as he made out, although he was very clear in his statements, and could have authorised his agent to test the water elsewhere, or maybe the megabucks offer came whilst away. Either way, he will have had thinking time with his family and it's not inconceivable that family would put increased financial security ahead of loyalty. But then, they probably haven't seen Merseyside yet. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 ...for not adding to our debt or spending more of her own money? You're forgetting that's the model his football club have preferred to follow in recent years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 One factor not yet mentioned is that Ron seemed close to signing before his holiday but cool on his return. Maybe he wasn't as happy as he made out, although he was very clear in his statements, and could have authorised his agent to test the water elsewhere, or maybe the megabucks offer came whilst away. Either way, he will have had thinking time with his family and it's not inconceivable that family would put increased financial security ahead of loyalty. But then, they probably haven't seen Merseyside yet. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk How many people can walk away from a double your money deal? Usually you have to go to China or the UAE for that. Double your dough and stay in the PL at a team that clearly want to spend. Its hard to resist that. He has probably increased his salary almost sevenfold since being at Feyenoord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them GUESS WHO'S BACK Back AGAIN Swivel eyes is BACK Tell a FRIEND Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint77 Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched hi Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them Absolute garbage mate his head has been turned by the $ nothing else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Fred Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 One factor not yet mentioned is that Ron seemed close to signing before his holiday but cool on his return. Maybe he wasn't as happy as he made out, although he was very clear in his statements, and could have authorised his agent to test the water elsewhere, or maybe the megabucks offer came whilst away. Either way, he will have had thinking time with his family and it's not inconceivable that family would put increased financial security ahead of loyalty. But then, they probably haven't seen Merseyside yet. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk He will soon get ****ed of living next to Klopp...the celebrations every time he cuts his grass will have RK fuming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Charteris Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 "The Saints are facing an exodus of players with midfielder Victor Wanyama and strikers Shane Long and Graziano Pelle set to follow Ronald Koeman out of St Mary's. (Sun)" And I thought these guys were here for the long haul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 "The Saints are facing an exodus of players with midfielder Victor Wanyama and strikers Shane Long and Graziano Pelle set to follow Ronald Koeman out of St Mary's. (Sun)" And I thought these guys were here for the long haul. This story is in the Sun editor's calendar - repeats every 12 months. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatlesaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 I'd welcome him if he said money wasn't everything after all (whilst accepting his pay rise from saints ). But don't think this will happen Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Ironic that he more or less said that in an interview about players leaving, something along the lines of money does not always equal the best career move. Umm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Ironic that he more or less said that in an interview about players leaving, something along the lines of money does not always equal the best career move. Umm it is because ronald is full of shyt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamsaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 It shouldn't be too hard to improve Everton ,with a big budget. Improving Saints from sixth though is a big ask. This move ought to enhance his reputation, as well as his bank balance, and be a stepping stone to a genuine CL club. It makes sense for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 If another employer came to anyone on this forum and offered the same role, double the money and a massively increased budget to potentially turn their workplace into a market force then they'd leave too. I know I would - you'd have to be more or less mental not to. Koeman's not a Saints fan - he's a professional football manager. Why should he stay? He's given us our best ever Premier League finish and guaranteed 6 games of European football. It's disappointing for us but that's the way football works. Always has been. People need to stop being fannies about this. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them About this new owner of theirs, loaded up with "ambition". Remind us who all these wealthy Middle Eastern Arab billionaires are that keep shovelling their own cash by the truckload into football clubs? I'm talking about wealthy businessmen, not state-owned corporations like Qatar Airways, or Etihad, or Emirates. I remember Pompey had a couple. And I think Leeds have got one. Notts County had "ambition" as well a few years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Convict Colony Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 You've just got to laugh haven't you, again we enter the summer in a similar place as the last few summers. New manager = new optimism If we got any of Unemry, AVB or Sampoli I would see it as a management upgrade. If we got Howe, Martinez etc then I'm joining the Alpine fan club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JxgrSaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 This. In fairness I did turn down an offer of 1.5 x my current London salary based in Reading (so at least double when living expenses are taken into account) from a rival company as my prospects where I am are good enough that long term it won't matter and I really like the company I work for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 (edited) Had resigned myself to accepting he would go at the end of next season and can also see the argument about being a lame duck come next Spring and therefore nipping it in the bud, BUT Everton???? Always thought he would go on to a much bigger role than Everton (even allowing for some money being thrown around). All recent leavers have at least moved to bigger clubs, sometimes a pi5fser, but they have all stepped up, but this is sideways at best! On the continent my percrption is that managers have a short tenure, but just can't get my head around these quick stints. Edited 4 June, 2016 by um pahars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maysie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 IMHO Koeman is leaving for ONE reason AMBITION He said recently that he would be having talks with the Owners, to see if their Ambitions Matched his Obviously, they don't, so he's going to go to a BIGGER Club, who DO have Ambition I don't blame him one bit, I blame the Owners Shame on them The way you use capitalisation is astounding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Koeman overall has done a great job but I think our position in the season just gone, like Leicester's and West Ham's, was a bit of a false one. I don't buy this "shake up" nonsense off the back of Leicester's success. It'll be business as usual within a season or two. So, I think Ron has done a great job but he never seemed like one for the long haul. If Everton want to make him one of the highest paid managers in the world then that's their problem, not ours. It's like someone offering £25million and 250k a week for Shane Long. He's done well recently but it suggests a pretty clueless approach. If Everton want to be the Peter Storrie and 'Arry Redknapp of the league then more fool them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BARCELONASAINT Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 How many years of continued success have we had now??....How many managers have either been moved on or have moved on themselves?.....and yet we continue to be successful. Why? we have a very attractive club for any manager, run properly and will not sell all its silver on the hope of buying immediate success. I have said it before and i will say it again.....both players and managers come to us because we are an established, very well run club in the best league in the world where stupid salaries are paid. We pay players and managers more than they were previously earning and then a bigger predator comes along and ups those offers......PLEASE don't try and sell me this it's all about ambition tosh because it's not!.....It's all about greed and once you accept that you can move on and get excited about who will be our new players and manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leslie Charteris Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 "...the average tenure for a manager has now fallen to 1.31 years" (Guardian) So RK has been with us for longer than average. The Plan is in place, we get a big wedge in compensation, The Black Box replaces RK, we march on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kermitsaint Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 When you say profit, do you mean avoid making losses that add to our debt? Yes . Exactly that . Why own a football team in the EPL if all you want to do is avoid debt ? This is why I don't believe the team when they mention ambition and Champions League . I don't believe for a second that the board really want that as they lack the attitude to fund it . Its all ******** to fool the fans Sent from my SM-G925I using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forester Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 "...the average tenure for a manager has now fallen to 1.31 years" (Guardian) So RK has been with us for longer than average. The Plan is in place, we get a big wedge in compensation, The Black Box replaces RK, we march on. Agree with this. I can see a regular theme of self pity and "why us again" but reality is that if someone had offered us 14th, 8th, 7th and 6th three and a half years ago under Nigel, who we all are eternally grateful to, we would have bitten their arm off. If other clubs continue to court our manages it means things are going well. Don't get me wrong I hope Ron stays as any change is a gamble, but sooner or later he will go. The abuse Les gets on here is mad given the facts of progress listed above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Professor Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Fish, Sea, plenty of. But some are better than others. If one gets away, carry on fishing. Next one might be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints foreva Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 "...the average tenure for a manager has now fallen to 1.31 years" (Guardian) So RK has been with us for longer than average. The Plan is in place, we get a big wedge in compensation, The Black Box replaces RK, we march on. Let's hope the black box does better replacing RK than it did replacing Clyne and Schneiderlin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Grown men desperately needing someone to blame. Maybe saints have ambition and everton have more? Maybe they just have more money? Maybe their short term strategy is more appealing? We're the the second biggest small club after Leicester at the moment and the most successful the last few years despite just being promoted. We lose staff because we have a lot of quality. It's painfully obvious yet our resident morons need to start the same tedious threads on it over and over as if our board are revelling in it. We just finished 6th and will have a good team again next season. Grow up FFS. Grown men getting all upset about what people they don't know write on a football forum. You seem more frustrated than most. Are you sure you're ok? FFS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 Grown men desperately needing someone to blame. Maybe saints have ambition and everton have more? Maybe they just have more money? Maybe their short term strategy is more appealing? We're the the second biggest small club after Leicester at the moment and the most successful the last few years despite just being promoted. We lose staff because we have a lot of quality. It's painfully obvious yet our resident morons need to start the same tedious threads on it over and over as if our board are revelling in it. We just finished 6th and will have a good team again next season. Grow up FFS. Exactly. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 I see one negative. Because of the Euros, there might be limited pre season time for a new manager to get the best from the squad. But looking forward to the new season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints1976 Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 But no-one knows what Everton's ambition is. Yes, they have a new owner making a lot of aggressive noise and splashing the cash, but it takes more than that to actually succeed. And Saints do consistently state their ambition, but have an intention to do it in a sustainable way. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk It's clear that Koeman does and he likes what he sees. The owner has only been in since March and he's paying massive wages to the new manager, making money available and he's in talks about a new state of the art 55,000 seater stadium on the waterfront. That's real ambition being shown in what is only a few weeks in which he's been the majority shareholder. We simply can't match that or our owners aren't willing to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rshephard3 Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 It shouldn't be too hard to improve Everton ,with a big budget. Improving Saints from sixth though is a big ask. This move ought to enhance his reputation, as well as his bank balance, and be a stepping stone to a genuine CL club. It makes sense for him. Exactly this. 6th is topping out with Saints. Best finish for over 3 decades. Everton have been poorly managed by Martinez and it won't take much to get their fans more excited than last season. Simply a better chance of beating Evertons league position than that of Saints. Then with doubled salary and a huge transfer budget the only question left is whether he wants to move from beautiful Hampshire to Merseyside. Shame as he's been our best manager of my lifetime but the reality of breaking those consistent CL contenders season in season out is a pipe dream for Saints and 6th is an extremely hard season to match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrZuess1979 the 2nd Posted 4 June, 2016 Share Posted 4 June, 2016 It's clear that Koeman does and he likes what he sees. The owner has only been in since March and he's paying massive wages to the new manager, making money available and he's in talks about a new state of the art 55,000 seater stadium on the waterfront. That's real ambition being shown in what is only a few weeks in which he's been the majority shareholder. We simply can't match that or our owners aren't willing to. Sounds like The Pompy way of selling a dream Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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