Tax Evasion by Dave's Dad and World Leaders

[badgerx16]

Were you not able to read the article Johnny? She repatriated the money as soon as she inherited it.

And the Telegraph printed an apology about the original story ;

[h=2]Margaret Hodge MP - Contrary to our report “Hodge faces challenge over family firm’s taxes” (Nov 20), Stemcor, in which Ms Hodge has a small shareholding, has not abused transfer pricing to avoid tax. We accept that there is no inconsistency or hypocrisy in Ms Hodge criticising other companies for tax avoidance and apologise to her for any contrary impression.[/h]

 

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/industry/9740964/Margaret-Hodge-MP-apology.html

Edited 11 April, 2016 by badgerx16

[Saint_Ash]

Anybody who thinks tax planning is different to tax avoidance is a bit simple.

 

Are you for real? You can't see the difference between tax planning and tax avoidance? There is nothing ethically wrong with what Cameron has done.

[Johnny Bognor]

Are you for real? You can't see the difference between tax planning and tax avoidance? There is nothing ethically wrong with what Cameron has done.

 

Indeed, a simple cash ISA is an incentive to save, which saves you the tax you pay on the interest received. Some people view this as a sensible way to save, whilst to others, it is nothing more than state sponsored tax avoidance LOL

[Jonnyboy]

Cash ISAs are redundant now with the new limit at which any tax on savings kicks in.

[Sheaf Saint]

Are you for real? You can't see the difference between tax planning and tax avoidance? There is nothing ethically wrong with what Cameron has done.

 

What about the fact that he failed to declare his shares in Blairmore on the parliamentary register of interests?

 

Is that not ethically wrong?

[saint si]

What about the fact that he failed to declare his shares in Blairmore on the parliamentary register of interests?

 

Is that not ethically wrong?

 

Well no because the register of interest has a threshold figure for declaring a shareholding and his holding didn't meet the requirement.

[buctootim]

Are you for real? You can't see the difference between tax planning and tax avoidance? There is nothing ethically wrong with what Cameron has done.

 

If you're going to lecture people its probably best to understand the terms first. Dave's own government disagrees with you. FWIW tax planning encompasses everything from avoidance to evasion.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/issue-briefing-taxing-multinationals-tackling-aggressive-tax-planning/issue-briefing-taxing-multinationals-tackling-aggressive-tax-planning

http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/taxation/company_tax/anti_tax_avoidance/index_en.htm

Edited 11 April, 2016 by buctootim

[buctootim]

Well no because the register of interest has a threshold figure for declaring a shareholding and his holding didn't meet the requirement.

 

Behaving ethically isnt the same as simply complying with rules and laws - as poor old Dave has discovered to his cost.

[buctootim]

Indeed, a simple cash ISA is an incentive to save, which saves you the tax you pay on the interest received. Some people view this as a sensible way to save, whilst to others, it is nothing more than state sponsored tax avoidance LOL

 

Those little green men in your head again Johnny. First those jihad terrorism loving lefties and now those saving hating lefties. Poor old Johnny.

[Johnny Bognor]

Those little green men in your head again Johnny. First those jihad terrorism loving lefties and now those saving hating lefties. Poor old Johnny.

 

Just don't get me started on Gift Aid.. stealing money from the people and giving it to charity.

[Batman]

so, have any laws or rules been broken here by the PM. Now that the dust has settled?

[buctootim]

so, have any laws or rules been broken here by the PM. Now that the dust has settled?

 

People are rightly angry about tax avoidance and evasion, especially by multi national companies. They want a PM who is serious about tackling that. Being seen as sympathetic to the practice and sailing close to the wind in his own affairs is devastating for his leadership - regardless of whether he has technically broken any laws. Starbucks, Apple, Google etc dont technically break any laws, they just dont pay tax on billions of profits.

[bridge too far]

It surprises me that intelligent, erudite posters on here can't see that the salient point is that he changed his story 6 times in a week. Doesn't fill me with confidence and now there's apparently the matter of a further £70+K in shares he's sold and not declared.

[Johnny Bognor]

so, have any laws or rules been broken here by the PM. Now that the dust has settled?

 

No laws have been broken in the same way Ken Livingstone funnelled £238k through a company he jointly owns with his wife, for his speech making and radio presenting, thus taking advantage of his wifes tax allowances, for money that he alone has earned.

[Batman]

People are rightly angry about tax avoidance and evasion, especially by multi national companies. They want a PM who is serious about tackling that. Being seen as sympathetic to the practice and sailing close to the wind in his own affairs is devastating for his leadership - regardless of whether he has technically broken any laws. Starbucks, Apple, Google etc dont technically break any laws, they just dont pay tax on billions of profits.

 

was that a yes or no to the question?

[buctootim]

was that a yes or no to the question?

 

Im sorry about your comprehension issues. Perhaps you should try something more binary - the "Where are the next points coming from?" thread maybe?

[Batman]

Im sorry about your comprehension issues. Perhaps you should try something more binary - the "Where are the next points coming from?" thread maybe?

 

yes or no?

was all I was after, cheers

[hutch]

It surprises me that intelligent, erudite posters on here can't see that the salient point is that he changed his story 6 times in a week. Doesn't fill me with confidence and now there's apparently the matter of a further £70+K in shares he's sold and not declared.

Statement #1 It's none of your business

 

Statement #2 I haven't got any offshore investments

 

Statement #3 None of my family benefits from offshore investments now or in the future

 

Statement #4 I had shares in my father's legal offshore investment fund but I sold them before I became PM and paid all the tax due

 

Statement #5 Here's details of my tax affairs

 

Did I miss something out?

[Batman]

Just watching the Daily Politics show and there is a fair bit of backtracking going on.

 

The SNP chap was struggling to admit that Cameron has done nothing wrong at all...but that is "not the point", he says.

also, suggesting that his tax returns are only 'copies' and we have not seen the originals

 

 

Saying his dad's behaviour was utterly disgusting. When pressed, admitted he also did nothing wrong.

 

Edited 11 April, 2016 by Batman

[aintforever]

He hasn’t done anything illegal (from what we know) but wether what he done is wrong or not is obviously a matter of opinion.

 

Personally, I’m not a big fan of tax avoidance, I don’t get why people with such vast amounts of money go through so much trouble to keep a bit more - I guess greed is the new norm. I just find it very sad.

 

I think the Prime Minister should be setting an example to the rest of the UK so going out of his way to avoid paying tax is not a great example. It is particularly galling in Cameron’s case because:

 

1. He’s personally been responsible for cutting public services and benefits for the disabled using lack of public funds as a reason/excuse.

 

2. He has gained political capital by pretending to be against tax avoidance.

 

Plenty wrong IMO.

[Johnny Bognor]

Personally, I’m not a big fan of tax avoidance.

 

i am personally grateful to lefties with a conscience, particularly those who refuse to use airport duty free shops, as people avoiding tax on cheap fags and booze, take money away from hospitals and schools. For me, it means the queues are shorter and I am less likely to miss my flight.

[Viking Warrior]

Has Corbyn published his tax returns Yet ? Or is he delaying it till he gets his tax affairs sorted ?

[Johnny Bognor]

Has Corbyn published his tax returns Yet ? Or is he delaying it till he gets his tax affairs sorted ?

 

No 10 states that "Potential PMs must publish their tax returns". That lets Corbyn off the hook, then

Edited 11 April, 2016 by Johnny Bognor

[hutch]

So after all that there were irregularities in the end. Unfortunately the culprit was Corbyn. As they say, you couldn't make it up.

 

And Skinner was the very epitome of what the labour party has become. It's all very sad

[Viking Warrior]

Oh mr Corbyn , how incompetent you are not filing your tax return on time , tut tut and then you could only produce a hand written one today . And you want to lead this country ,

[Hockey_saint]

So after all that there were irregularities in the end. Unfortunately the culprit was Corbyn. As they say, you couldn't make it up.

 

And Skinner was the very epitome of what the labour party has become. It's all very sad

 

As opposed to what the Nasty Party is becoming again then? You couldn't make it up, to avert attention to the disgraceful things this government have attempted...and mostly failed, to do, lets all get on the band wagon of what happened 40 years ago eh? Shall we remember what also happened 20-30 years ago too?

[Batman]

As opposed to what the Nasty Party is becoming again then? You couldn't make it up, to avert attention to the disgraceful things this government have attempted...and mostly failed, to do, lets all get on the band wagon of what happened 40 years ago eh? Shall we remember what also happened 20-30 years ago too?

 

Nothing beats being as nasty as to kill 1 million people in the Middle East.

[buctootim]

Nothing beats being as nasty as to kill 1 million people in the Middle East.

 

I dont think you should take all the blame. Just following orders.

[Hockey_saint]

Nothing beats being as nasty as to kill 1 million people in the Middle East.

 

Or potentially every Jew, gay, disabled person in this country if the majority of the appeasing-wanting Conservatives had gotten their way. Thank goodness for the Labour Party-backed Winston Churchill eh? as opposed to the tories choice of Lord Halifax.

 

In a word, a party created partly from Newpaper millionaires and imperialists has no room whatsoever to talk about the murder of innocent people right?

[Batman]

Or potentially every Jew, gay, disabled person in this country if the majority of the appeasing-wanting Conservatives had gotten their way. Thank goodness for the Labour Party-backed Winston Churchill eh? as opposed to the tories choice of Lord Halifax.

 

In a word, a party created partly from Newpaper millionaires and imperialists has no room whatsoever to talk about the murder of innocent people right?

 

Well, the loving Labour Party have that to their name. Nasty bastards

[Hockey_saint]

Well, the loving Labour Party have that to their name. Nasty bastards

 

As opposed to: The first world war, Suez and countless other ones. Nope, there's only one nasty party in the UK and it's the ones who tried to use money for the poor to give tax breaks to the rich in the last budget...until they realised how politically suicidal it would have been.

 

Besides, if the conservatives were in charge when the Iraq war (second as you know, you were there for the first) and afghan one (again, you were there for the first)...They'd have done exactly the same as the Labour party. In fact, the only UK PM to refuse to go to war with the US was a Labour one...Real Labour that is and not Tory-lite so you know, get a better argument to detract from the disgraceful bunch in power at the minute.

Edited 11 April, 2016 by Hockey_saint

[Johnny Bognor]

Well, the loving Labour Party have that to their name. Nasty bastards

 

When you consider that the shadow chancellor holds Mao in such regard, a person who butchered more poeple than stalin and hitler put together, whilst you have labour councillors tweeting that hitler was the greatest man alive, you can see why Labour are the really really really nice party. Labour, the party of hypocrisy

[Batman]

When you consider that the shadow chancellor holds Mao in such regard, a person who butchered more poeple than stalin and hitler put together, whilst you have labour councillors tweeting that hitler was the greatest man alive, you can see why Labour are the really really really nice party. Labour, the party of hypocrisy

 

But , they are not Tory's. So all good fun I guess

[Johnny Bognor]

But , they are not Tory's. So all good fun I guess

 

Even Nick Griffin wouldn't hold hitler in such high regard, as some labour members. Nice party you know, especially with Gerry Adam's best mate running it.

Edited 11 April, 2016 by Johnny Bognor

[Hockey_saint]

When you consider that the shadow chancellor holds Mao in such regard, a person who butchered more poeple than stalin and hitler put together, whilst you have labour councillors tweeting that hitler was the greatest man alive, you can see why Labour are the really really really nice party. Labour, the party of hypocrisy

 

Lovely smear I see. All big claims, but really complete rubbish. Maggie backed Ian Douglas Smith, her Idol, Enoch Powell....well, it's far too easy really a bit like the big paedo that was Ted Heath....Come on, we can do this all day.

[benjii]

Dave has done nothing wrong, legally or morally, in relation to his tax. I think that much is now obvious to all but the most rabid, myopic and ignorant.

 

Where he messed up was in giving "clever" answers when the story broke. That may have been partly an emotional response to his father being mentioned but it was a mistake nonetheless.

 

I presume there are some far more interesting and substantive stories to come from this leak - the most interesting part of this story is the turning down of the taxpayer funded £20k allowance by the PM - so let's hope the press move on to one of those soon enough.

[Batman]

Lovely smear I see. All big claims, but really complete rubbish. Maggie backed Ian Douglas Smith, her Idol, Enoch Powell....well, it's far too easy really a bit like the big paedo that was Ted Heath....Come on, we can do this all day.

 

They are all nasty, yes?

[Hockey_saint]

They are all nasty, yes?

 

In the sense that a fair few politicians are nasty, yes.

 

Besides, whilst yep, Benji's right, the press is full of right-wing backed nonsense about workers and shirkers which the PM knows full well the general public lap up so really, should he have been surprised by the fuss made? no. Of course he shouldn't.

[badgerx16]

They are all nasty, yes?

 

Yep, every single one of them.

Come the revolution...........

[Johnny Bognor]

Lovely smear I see. All big claims, but really complete rubbish. Maggie backed Ian Douglas Smith, her Idol, Enoch Powell....well, it's far too easy really a bit like the big paedo that was Ted Heath....Come on, we can do this all day.

 

Big claims?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-36009544

 

Of course we can do this all day, which shows that both parties should be held in contempt. Luckily, i dont have a pair of blinkers... nice party though, you must be proud.

Edited 11 April, 2016 by Johnny Bognor

[Sheaf Saint]

Jesus f*cking Christ! Do you lot have even the slightest idea how childish and pathetic you look to everybody reading this?

 

"Your party did this, so they must be really nasty"

"Yeah, but your party did this, so they must be even nastierer! Nerrr-nerrrr!"

 

Why don't you all get your dads to have a fight and see who is hardest?

[Jonnyboy]

When you consider that the shadow chancellor holds Mao in such regard, a person who butchered more poeple than stalin and hitler put together, whilst you have labour councillors tweeting that hitler was the greatest man alive, you can see why Labour are the really really really nice party. Labour, the party of hypocrisy

 

That was clearly a pis stake by McDonnell. Stop pretending you're so neutral when you clearly aren't.

[Hockey_saint]

Big claims?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-36009544

 

Of course we can do this all day, which shows that both parties should be held in contempt. Luckily, i dont have a pair of blinkers... nice party though, you must be proud.

 

With something classy like this....jeesus, even Tory-lite Liz Kendall calls it nasty and obnoxious:

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tory-mp-sneers-low-achievers-7734629

[JackFrost]

So after all that there were irregularities in the end. Unfortunately the culprit was Corbyn. As they say, you couldn't make it up.

 

And Skinner was the very epitome of what the labour party has become. It's all very sad

 

Even Skinner's a parody of himself now

[saint si]

Personally, I’m not a big fan of tax avoidance, I don’t get why people with such vast amounts of money go through so much trouble to keep a bit more - I guess greed is the new norm. I just find it very sad.

 

I think the Prime Minister should be setting an example to the rest of the UK so going out of his way to avoid paying tax is not a great example.

 

What tax avoidance? Not being flippant... everyone keeps mentioning tax avoidance, but can you point to the tax that he has avoided?

[Johnny Bognor]

That was clearly a pis stake by McDonnell. Stop pretending you're so neutral when you clearly aren't.

 

Take a look at my post about the budget. I laid out what the tories did well and highlighted what they got wrong. In my world, not everything the tories do is bad and not everything labour does is amazing. My politics are fairly central, maybe with a slight leaning to the right (based on economic policy as I belive in a free market) but I am not an out and out tory voter. I spoiled my ballot paper in the last election. I actually thought the coalition was a good thing, to reign the tories in. I actually like the fact that there is a small majority, over a large one, as a small number of MP's are able to hold the government to account, as they did over changes to disability benefit. I will criticise the tories when I see fit and I will criticise labour when I see fit.

 

So I may not be completely neutral in the pure sense of the word, but unlike many blind followers of one party or another, I am closer to neutrality than most.

I put your clearly biased posting down to the naivity of youth and hope that when you grow up, you too will achieve some balance in your life.

[Verbal]

It seems Corbyn may have failed to declare his pension income, which, if true, would mean he's evaded tax.

 

This focus, though, on individual politicians' tax is becoming ridiculous - a pointless competition in applying the easiest label of all, 'hypocrisy'. There's an over-fixation with all this, when the real issue is what the Panama Papers tell us about the precise ways in which the 1% hide many of their assets and income, and how governments should respond in closing down the secrecy that allows it to happen.

[buctootim]

Even Skinner's a parody of himself now

 

Not really, it was a fair point. Cameron paid off the mortgage for one house but kept the mortgage on the house he was claiming expenses for, in order to maximise his expenses income. Thats dodgy. Not uniquely dodgy, not conservatives only dodgy Im sure, but dodgy. Its part of a wider culture of screwing the system for personal benefit

[aintforever]

What tax avoidance? Not being flippant... everyone keeps mentioning tax avoidance, but can you point to the tax that he has avoided?

 

The 200 grand pressie from his mum avoided any inheritance tax from his daddies estate. Not crime of the century but but a bit hypocritical given his pretend outrage at other people's tax avoidance.

 

Plus these offshore things are always dodgy, remember the only reason we know anything at all about this one is because information was leaked and he had to say something, god knows what else his family has squirrelled away. These things are always too clever to leave a paper trail to anything illegal but it's the sneaky, greedy nature of it I don't like given his position.

[Johnny Bognor]

The 200 grand pressie from his mum avoided any inheritance tax from his daddies estate. Not crime of the century but but a bit hypocritical given his pretend outrage at other people's tax avoidance.

 

I know you have an issue with it, because I remember when you were banging on about Tony Benn (RIP) and how he put his estate worth 5 million, into trust, to avoid inheritance tax.

 

(If anyone else is interested in the Tony Benn tax dodge and how to go about it, here's some practical advice

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/tax/11189430/Tony-Benns-inheritance-tax-dodge-how-it-works-and-how-you-can-use-it-too.html)

 

NEWSFLASH: stalwarts of the left secretly hate inheritance tax too!!

Edited 12 April, 2016 by Johnny Bognor