The Not a Derby Derby

[Miltonaggro]

Ok Bournemouth is a derby but there is no history or any rivalry between the sides whatever they wish . There is much more between us and Brighton with some right scraps in the 80's .

 

In terms of 'right scraps', us giving them a good shoeing if memory services ;-)

[shurlock]

was it The9 or MLG?

 

[david in sweden]

Southampton v Bompey is a derby because we're from the same area (Hampshire, or County of Southmpton if you prefer).

 

Just because some idiot politicians changed the county boundary in 1972 makes no difference.

 

.....perhaps the tax income from all those rich retired folk in Bournemouth is needed to help balance Dorset's economy ?

[explorer saint]

In terms of 'right scraps', us giving them a good shoeing if memory services ;-)

 

Fa cup early eighties at theirs won 2-0 cockerill and Townsend or Moran ?? Happy memories !

[Pat from Poole]

They don't do they! I could never work out why. I know its an easy journey by train from Croydon but don't know why the rivalry. Anyone know?

 

I think Alan Mullery had a lot to do with it.

[Miltonaggro]

Fa cup early eighties at theirs won 2-0 cockerill and Townsend or Moran ?? Happy memories !

 

Great day out, SFC invasion, one side of the ground Biley baiting, and fun and games in the park on the way back to the station!

[Whitey Grandad]

.....perhaps the tax income from all those rich retired folk in Bournemouth is needed to help balance Dorset's economy ?

 

That was the real reason.

[The9]

Is there a specific distance that determines whether a game is a derby or not? And do you have to be in the same county?

 

Originally derbies are only matches within the same town/city, due to media hype, that now gets extended to any kind of rivalry with a geographical similarity, which is of course nonsense. The Dockyard Derby and various South Coast derbies between the likes of Brighton and Plymouth are symptomatic of this daft rubbish. It takes hours to get between some south coast teams in matches the media claims are derbies, yet I don't see anyone pitching Southend v Hartlepool as an east coast derby, for instance.

 

Cardiff/Swansea is a rivalry, but it isn't a "derby", though because of the lack of other options ( ) it's referred to as the "South Wales Derby". The cities are 40 miles apart and since 1974 have been in different counties. It's a local rivalry with the locality being South Wales. My mandatory Newport County mention here would point out that Newport is 4 times closer to Cardiff than Swansea is, and they actually share a border, which Swansea and Cardiff don't. But that "rivalry" is as one-way as Saints/Bournemouth.

 

Derby v Forest isn't a derby according to the original definition either, but Forest v Notts County is (subject to some argument about county boundaries in Nottinghamshire). There's no correlation between rivalry and derby, derbies are only about proximity.

[The9]

was it The9 or MLG?

 

Funny you should mention that... see above. And yeah, Saints v Portsmouth isn't a derby. It's a local rivalry.

Edited 1 March, 2016 by The9

[The9]

I would be quite happy if the premier league didn't have any team further north than Manchester but instead had

Bournemouth

Brighton

Reading

Any of the West Country teams

Ideally other teams in the SO postcode

All in it as long as saints are top dog getting the positive results

We could do with healthy rivalry & sparing partners

 

I can get to Manchester from Southampton quicker than I can get to Bristol, Exeter, Plymouth or Yeovil.

[sadoldgit]

Originally derbies are only matches within the same town/city, due to media hype, that now gets extended to any kind of rivalry with a geographical similarity, which is of course nonsense. The Dockyard Derby and various South Coast derbies between the likes of Brighton and Plymouth are symptomatic of this daft rubbish. It takes hours to get between some south coast teams in matches the media claims are derbies, yet I don't see anyone pitching Southend v Hartlepool as an east coast derby, for instance.

 

Cardiff/Swansea is a rivalry, but it isn't a "derby", though because of the lack of other options ( ) it's referred to as the "South Wales Derby". The cities are 40 miles apart and since 1974 have been in different counties. It's a local rivalry with the locality being South Wales. My mandatory Newport County mention here would point out that Newport is 4 times closer to Cardiff than Swansea is, and they actually share a border, which Swansea and Cardiff don't. But that "rivalry" is as one-way as Saints/Bournemouth.

 

Derby v Forest isn't a derby according to the original definition either, but Forest v Notts County is (subject to some argument about county boundaries in Nottinghamshire). There's no correlation between rivalry and derby, derbies are only about proximity.

 

Thank you! This was exactly the answer I was looking for. When I grew up a derby was, as you say, teams from the same town or city. The boundaries seem to have stretched somewhat over the years!

[Whitey Grandad]

Thank you! This was exactly the answer I was looking for. When I grew up a derby was, as you say, teams from the same town or city. The boundaries seem to have stretched somewhat over the years!

 

Derby v Forest has always been a derby though. Is that because one of the teams is called Derby?

 

Also Sunderland v Newcastle, Norwich v Ipswich and many others `I can't be bothered to list.

[sadoldgit]

Derby v Forest has always been a derby though. Is that because one of the teams is called Derby?

 

Also Sunderland v Newcastle, Norwich v Ipswich and many others `I can't be bothered to list.

 

Derby are involved in an awful lot of derbies! As for the others, derbies or local rivalries?

[The9]

Derby v Forest has always been a derby though. Is that because one of the teams is called Derby?

 

Also Sunderland v Newcastle, Norwich v Ipswich and many others `I can't be bothered to list.

 

I'm fairly sure that as there used to be so much less written about football and so much less media, that the "original" definition probably came from maybe one source (Charles Buchanan or Brian Glanville, maybe even as late as being promoted by Brian Moore or Jimmy Hill on 3-channel terrestrial tv with no live matches except the FA Cup Final) and the term rapidly became used for wider local rivalries in media.

 

There's definitely something out there somewhere which said "only within the same city/town", but modern usage is "we found a thing in common so it's a derby". Somewhere in between is the wider definition of "area", eg the Tyne/Wear derby, the East Anglian derby and so on, which are all regional extra-city rivalries.

 

Little point in worrying about it in a society that literally thinks literally means figuratively.

[david in sweden]

judging from the " rough and tumble " in last night's game..it will surely be considered a "derby game " in the future......

[david in sweden]

Derby v Forest has always been a derby though. Is that because one of the teams is called Derby?

 

Also Sunderland v Newcastle, Norwich v Ipswich and many others `I can't be bothered to list.

 

 

 

There's an interesting page on Wikipedia called ...a list of sporting rivalries..with some alternative suggestions.

[Whitey Grandad]

There's an interesting page on Wikipedia called ...a list of sporting rivalries..with some alternative suggestions.

 

If nobody knows how the term 'derby' originated then surely it's acceptable to use it wherever you want? Anyway, there are some who argue that usage of English determines its meaning and not the other way round.

[The9]

If nobody knows how the term 'derby' originated then surely it's acceptable to use it wherever you want? Anyway, there are some who argue that usage of English determines its meaning and not the other way round.

 

Literally not true.