Is losing to Saints really the last straw for Louis van Gaal ?

[david in sweden]

......losing a match to Saints is the last straw, at least to the " big clubs" ...and as we wait for the latest news from Old Trafford we can only ask the question..

 

Did he jump, or was he pushed?. Louis van Gaal is on the brink of the end of his management career with MU after suffering the ignominy of losing to Saints. Journalists even enlisted the help of a lip reading expert to decipher the words uttered by Sir Alex Ferguson, and (shown on TV).... as he (apparantly) condemned LvG for the dreary MU performance , and defeat against Saints.

 

Older fans will recall another MU side, who came to the Dell in November 1986, expecting to win a League Cup replay, when a precocious teenager named Matthew Le Tissier ...came off the Saints bench, scored twice inside 10 minutes..... and Saints won 4-1.

 

MU manager Ron Atkinson was gone from his office inside 36 hours....such was the disgrace. Losing to Saints, it seems is just too much for the MU board, and after two home defeats at the hands of..." we South Coast upstarts " it is surely too much for them. One defeat was unfortunate.... two is beyond redemption.

 

It can't be too long before LvG is clearing his desk at Old Trafford, and yet another top manager will place his head on the block, and await the jeers and booing of the Old Trafford " faithful " when results don't go the way that they have been brought up to expect.

 

The job of managing United has become a " Catch 22 " situation. Take the job and succeed and you are a legend....fail ..and your career is forever blighted.

 

Just now, I am wondering if there will be any journalist questions to Ronald Koeman .....at his next press conference?.

Edited 25 January, 2016 by david in sweden

[Fatboy40]

I doubt losing to us is in particular is such a big worry for him, it's just a continuation of their poor form, but if I was him I'd be more concerned about losing to Koeman and how considering Man U's funds and assets (players) another Dutch manager new to the Premier League showed him how to do it properly !.

[angelman]

Is the question really about how we are perceived in the media and in sporting terms? Last season, no, there was no ignominy involved as we were flying at the beginning. This season, we have had our slump, so people in the press might have underestimated us and thought we were a busted flush, instead turning their favour on other "smaller" clubs - Leicester (naturally), West Ham and Stoke, now that Palace and Watford are in the midst of their sticky patches. This seemed very much to be the case during the last transfer window when Stoke and Palace in particular were making some decent signings and then started well.

 

So is it bad that MU lost to us? To them yes, as they do not expect to lose to anyone, let alone a small club. There is realism that you are unlikely to win every game, but the ones they lose are against (supposed) fellow title rivals, which we aren't. If you spend £250m, you don't expect to lose to smaller teams.

[Batman]

When a team spends £250m and loses at home to southampton is going to get a negative reaction.

They sacked Moyes for having more points after 23 games with a quater of the dosh spent

 

 

what is worse is the way they play. Absolutely dire. Forget the money spent, a club like the size of United playing disgusting football like that is just plain odd

[scotty]

When a team spends £250m and loses at home to southampton is going to get a negative reaction.

They sacked Moyes for having more points after 23 games with a quater of the dosh spent

 

 

what is worse is the way they play. Absolutely dire. Forget the money spent, a club like the size of United playing disgusting football like that is just plain odd

 

What always amused me about the moyes sacking was thinking back to fergies farewell address to the old trafford "faithful". He reminded them that he had a poor first season, and told them that their job now was to get behind the new manager come what may. Cue a wave of heartfelt applause from the crowd....

 

How long was it before the plastics turned against moyes, who was promptly sacked? Sums up the club for me,if we've got van gaal the boot I couldn't care less. He must have known what he was in for, and they really are a poor team under him given the massive investment.

[Mr Biscuits]

If he goes I won't be down to us, that's just coincidence. He'll go because the team just aren't performing under him.

[angelman]

If he goes I won't be down to us, that's just coincidence. He'll go because the team just aren't performing under him.

 

exactly. No one ever gets sacked for losing one match. We might be the straw that breaks the camel's back, but there is a lot of weight already on that back.

[VectisSaint]

It may have happened in the past but really there is nothing to suggest that losing to Saints is the last straw. Its simply that the Utd fans are fed up with the awful performances, 0 first half goals, worst team in PL history based on points after 23 games. No signs of improvement and boring football.

[Whitey Grandad]

Unless we are perceived as being a poor team who these big teams should be able to roll over and that losing to us is somehow the worst disgrace in football.

 

No, it's just the last straw in a run of poor results, but I'd like to think that somehow we could take some credit for it.

 

Has he gone yet?

[angelman]

Has he gone yet? No.

 

But as MUFC is listed on the NYSE, it might have to wait until they are open.

[scotty]

Unless we are perceived as being a poor team who these big teams should be able to roll over and that losing to us is somehow the worst disgrace in football.

 

No, it's just the last straw in a run of poor results, but I'd like to think that somehow we could take some credit for it.

 

Has he gone yet?

 

My thoughts exactly, and I don't suppose Koeman would be unhappy to think that

[angelman]

Not that I really care whether he goes or not - actually prefer him to stay as at this rate, we could finish above them - but apparently he cancelled training yesterday and went to Netherlands, leaving Giggs to take training today.

[Saint_clark]

I did think watching his post match interviews that he looked and sounded a lot more emotional than i'd ever noticed before, almost on the verge of tears. I actually felt a little sorry for him.

[sadoldgit]

Oh the ignamy of losing to Koeman who many here wanted out a couple of weeks ago! Seriously though it isn't losing at home to Southampton that upsets them. It is losing full stop. Maybe they could just about bear losing at home to a "top four" club but certainly not to any team below them.

[sadoldgit]

Not that I really care whether he goes or not - actually prefer him to stay as at this rate, we could finish above them - but apparently he cancelled training yesterday and went to Netherlands, leaving Giggs to take training today.

 

I hope he goes sooner rather than later and that "one of their own" Giggs takes over and just does just as poorly.

[beatlesaint]

He will go when Derby knock them out the Cup on Friday night IMHO !

[DT]

Vulture man Mourinho is flapping his wings, about to land at Old Trafford (probably). Must sense another massive pay-off.

[sadoldgit]

Vulture man Mourinho is flapping his wings, about to land at Old Trafford (probably). Must sense another massive pay-off.

 

I bet the plastics cant wait! Attacking football at last....oh wait.

[angelman]

I did think watching his post match interviews that he looked and sounded a lot more emotional than i'd ever noticed before, almost on the verge of tears. I actually felt a little sorry for him.

 

I have to admit that I do as well. OK, that is tempered by the fact that he is earning millions but I don't like kicking a man when he is down - and he is down. It started off with far too much pomposity and he needed to be taken down a peg or two and given that it was Utd, everyone was eagerly anticipating failure with gay abandon. The bigger you are etc etc. Utd's solution to everything was to spend spend spend. Something not right, spend a bit more. So £250m later (OK, maybe they have cashed in £100m) and they are no further forward than they were, which I think is "funny".

[Saint86]

United will not recover and it is Naive to think they will tbh. Look at Liverpool and there is very little difference between the two.

 

This isn't spain or Germany where once a team drops off the worse they can do is expect to come 2nd or 3rd. We are blessed with a competitive league and as soon as someone falls of the pace there is another team ready and waiting. City are no established with Chelsea and that pairing ended Liverpool's flirtations with the top 4. United have now fallen, and this has allowed another team (likely tottenham) to squeeze in.

 

Plus Leicester are going to get top 4 this year.

 

United are now saddled with huge wages, massive ego's and ridiculous expectations, something which all their top 4 rivals do not have to deal with. They are done. It is Tottenham's time now I think.

[ScepticalStan]

I'd be surprised if Spurs were able to usurp United in the long term. The money and status that United have will always enable them to swoop in for big, big players in the various transfer windows and I'm afraid that they'll probably get it right eventually. Having said that, the presence of Chelsea and City at the top table of English football will make the next decade or so very interesting indeed.

 

Chelsea were able to survive a few wilderness years outside the top four and eventually their spray-and-pray strategy of spending yielded Willian, Hazard (this season notwithstanding), Oscar, Costa (both starting to come good again) Azpilicueta and Matic (again, this season not withstanding) as much as it did Torres, Mikel and David Luiz. They'll invariably head straight back into the transfer market in the summer and replace what they need to before giving their failing players (Hazard) another season to improve. If they fail to do so, then they'll simply replace those as well.

 

City did exactly the same thing. Remember Robinho, Roque Santa Cruz, Adebayor, Shaun Wright-Phillips, Jo, Kolo Toure, Bellamy, Elano?

 

It wasn't just the spending that was shocking, it was their ability to not only spend, but barely make any sort of real effort to persevere with players that they had invested upwards of £20Mn on rather than just toss them aside and simply try again with another round of £100Mn-per-transfer-window spending when those players hadn't instantly come good.

 

And sure enough, eventually they got themselves squads including the likes of Aguero, De Bruyne, Dzeko and Yaya Toure - with the likes of failures such as Balotelli and Bony being totally affordable even when costing upwards of £50Mn total.

 

That kind of spending power just can't be matched.

 

Likewise, United will always be able to throw their weight around in the transfer market more so than Tottenham and Liverpool, so I'd be very surprised if they don't regain their footing in the top four sooner or later, regardless of where they end up this season.

[david in sweden]

I have to admit that I do as well. OK, that is tempered by the fact that he is earning millions but I don't like kicking a man when he is down - and he is down. It started off with far too much pomposity and he needed to be taken down a peg or two and given that it was Utd, everyone was eagerly anticipating failure with gay abandon. The bigger you are etc etc. Utd's solution to everything was to spend spend spend.

Something not right, spend a bit more. So £250m later (OK, maybe they have cashed in £100m) and they are no further forward than they were, which I think is "funny".

 

 

I think the difference ..apart from the odd £150 million, is that LvG had bought in a series of " talented individuals " but failed miserably to mould them into a real team.

 

TBH....Saints would be an even better side .....if we had only one of their " big money " signings in our squad. I'd take Mata - if the new manager doesn't want him.

Edited 25 January, 2016 by david in sweden

[Pamplemousse]

Pochettino would be the perfect fit for Man Utd. Good football, development of young players, let's hope karma comes back to bite Spurs on the árse.

[Dark Munster]

I did think watching his post match interviews that he looked and sounded a lot more emotional than i'd ever noticed before, almost on the verge of tears. I actually felt a little sorry for him.

Don't worry, he'll be crying all the way to the bank soon.

[Redslo]

I'd be surprised if Spurs were able to usurp United in the long term. The money and status that United have will always enable them to swoop in for big, big players in the various transfer windows and I'm afraid that they'll probably get it right eventually. Having said that, the presence of Chelsea and City at the top table of English football will make the next decade or so very interesting indeed.

 

Chelsea were able to survive a few wilderness years outside the top four and eventually their spray-and-pray strategy of spending yielded Willian, Hazard (this season notwithstanding), Oscar, Costa (both starting to come good again) Azpilicueta and Matic (again, this season not withstanding) as much as it did Torres, Mikel and David Luiz. They'll invariably head straight back into the transfer market in the summer and replace what they need to before giving their failing players (Hazard) another season to improve. If they fail to do so, then they'll simply replace those as well.

 

City did exactly the same thing. Remember Robinho, Roque Santa Cruz, Adebayor, Shaun Wright-Phillips, Jo, Kolo Toure, Bellamy, Elano?

 

It wasn't just the spending that was shocking, it was their ability to not only spend, but barely make any sort of real effort to persevere with players that they had invested upwards of £20Mn on rather than just toss them aside and simply try again with another round of £100Mn-per-transfer-window spending when those players hadn't instantly come good.

 

And sure enough, eventually they got themselves squads including the likes of Aguero, De Bruyne, Dzeko and Yaya Toure - with the likes of failures such as Balotelli and Bony being totally affordable even when costing upwards of £50Mn total.

 

That kind of spending power just can't be matched.

 

Likewise, United will always be able to throw their weight around in the transfer market more so than Tottenham and Liverpool, so I'd be very surprised if they don't regain their footing in the top four sooner or later, regardless of where they end up this season.

 

The Spurs are going to have a new stadium. I can see a future where that, combined with their presence in London and all the advantages that brings causes them to become a regular top four club. They will need to get more money through world wide sponsorship deals--like Man U does now--but that is doable. But if they start (continue?) doing sensible recruiting it is within their reach.

 

Man U's financial strength should allow them to continually be at or near the top, but they are forced to pay more for player transfers and to pay their players higher salaries. If they don't recruit the right players that turns the financial strength into something of a disadvantage because it becomes impossible to get rid of their mistakes except at a big loss.

 

Of course, if Man U hires Poch away from Spurs this summer (and Paul Mitchell follows) all of these statements are inoperative and Man U will return to the top--at least until Poch moves on to Barcelona or Real Madrid or LA Galaxy.