Wanyama and Mane, Boo or cheer??

[IronCitySaint]

I know someone else asked but not sure if there was an answer, but surely the team travels to away games together? Therefore, how can just one player be late? If they are allowed to travel individually to away games it is not surprising team spirit is so low.

[DuncanRG]

I know someone else asked but not sure if there was an answer, but surely the team travels to away games together? Therefore, how can just one player be late? If they are allowed to travel individually to away games it is not surprising team spirit is so low.

 

They had travelled to Norwich the night before.

[stevegrant]

I know someone else asked but not sure if there was an answer, but surely the team travels to away games together? Therefore, how can just one player be late? If they are allowed to travel individually to away games it is not surprising team spirit is so low.

I assume this was a meeting held at the hotel on Saturday morning, so he'd have been in the same building, but each player has their own room so if he's been lazy/tardy in the morning then easy to see how he could miss a meeting there.

 

The point has been made by someone else, but Mané's performances have been fine this season, I don't think his application on the pitch has been questioned once. As a result, I'm not sure dropping him is necessarily the right punishment as it also punishes the team as a whole, given how much we rely on him. Fine him whatever amount of money you choose, but I think Ron's cutting his nose off to spite his face by dropping him.

 

Wanyama, on the other hand, has had a **** attitude all season, only bothering to play at 100% when it's against Arsenal or Chelsea (basically what Celtic fans told us he'd be like). We're not going to make any money from him now, he's got 18 months left on his contract, he's nowhere near as good as he thinks he is and has been stinking up the place in terms of his attitude and seemingly dragging everyone down with him. Given the amount of money we were willing to spend to get rid of Osvaldo, we should be prepared to lose the £8m or so we might sell Vic for, stick him in the U21s for the remainder of his contract. Send a message to players that, while we may allow players to leave if they "deserve" the opportunity to play Champions League football and the price is right, we're not going to bow to players who throw their toys out and disrupt everything.

[Give it to Ron]

I assume this was a meeting held at the hotel on Saturday morning, so he'd have been in the same building, but each player has their own room so if he's been lazy/tardy in the morning then easy to see how he could miss a meeting there.

 

The point has been made by someone else, but Mané's performances have been fine this season, I don't think his application on the pitch has been questioned once. As a result, I'm not sure dropping him is necessarily the right punishment as it also punishes the team as a whole, given how much we rely on him. Fine him whatever amount of money you choose, but I think Ron's cutting his nose off to spite his face by dropping him.

 

Wanyama, on the other hand, has had a **** attitude all season, only bothering to play at 100% when it's against Arsenal or Chelsea (basically what Celtic fans told us he'd be like). We're not going to make any money from him now, he's got 18 months left on his contract, he's nowhere near as good as he thinks he is and has been stinking up the place in terms of his attitude and seemingly dragging everyone down with him. Given the amount of money we were willing to spend to get rid of Osvaldo, we should be prepared to lose the £8m or so we might sell Vic for, stick him in the U21s for the remainder of his contract. Send a message to players that, while we may allow players to leave if they "deserve" the opportunity to play Champions League football and the price is right, we're not going to bow to players who throw their toys out and disrupt everything.

 

I agree with that but I am blaming Koeman - why does Wanyama play 90 minutes regardless of how crap he is ? After the Spurs game he shouldn't have been picked again this season and sold to highest bidder.

Wanyama should have been subbed straight after the first booking let alone after the next warning.

[stevegrant]

I agree with that but I am blaming Koeman - why does Wanyama play 90 minutes regardless of how crap he is ? After the Spurs game he shouldn't have been picked again this season and sold to highest bidder.

Wanyama should have been subbed straight after the first booking let alone after the next warning.

I'd certainly agree that he shouldn't be in the side right now, and I guess we'll get a decent look at how we're going to fare without him over the next two games as he serves his suspension.

 

I don't agree that we should sell to the highest bidder - what's the point? The only bidders are likely to be clubs barely better than us. Wanyama has a very high opinion of his own ability which isn't matched by reality. If he, as a player who struggles to pass the ball 5 yards, thinks he would fit in at Arsenal, he's very much mistaken. I doubt if Spurs would be interested anymore as Dier and Alli have stepped up this season and outperformed him by a country mile, so why would they want to disrupt that? So where else is he going to go? Nobody will give us enough to make it worth our while, IMO.

[Give it to Ron]

I'd certainly agree that he shouldn't be in the side right now, and I guess we'll get a decent look at how we're going to fare without him over the next two games as he serves his suspension.

 

I don't agree that we should sell to the highest bidder - what's the point? The only bidders are likely to be clubs barely better than us. Wanyama has a very high opinion of his own ability which isn't matched by reality. If he, as a player who struggles to pass the ball 5 yards, thinks he would fit in at Arsenal, he's very much mistaken. I doubt if Spurs would be interested anymore as Dier and Alli have stepped up this season and outperformed him by a country mile, so why would they want to disrupt that? So where else is he going to go? Nobody will give us enough to make it worth our while, IMO.

 

I think I am just a bit bemused by Koeman's treatment of him compared to Romeu and even Reed. I don't think it would be too hard to replace Wanyama and thats maybe why I want him replaced - at least try and find a midfielder who can score - currently we don't have one and the Wanyama money can help that.

Mane has worked his nuts off every game and at least performed whereas Wanyama Arsenal apart has been awful yet plays 90 minutes.

[VectisSaint]

I'd certainly agree that he shouldn't be in the side right now, and I guess we'll get a decent look at how we're going to fare without him over the next two games as he serves his suspension.

Hadn't realised he got a 2 game ban. Apparently its 2 games because it was his second dismissal of the season.

 

We should not be looking to sell. He is still a high class player, just needs to get his head sorted. Don't believe Arsenal or Spurs will pursue him anyway, at least not in January. Can't see anyone else coming in for him either. The Club need to do what they are paid to do and get him back into shape, mentally.

[stevegrant]

Hadn't realised he got a 2 game ban. Apparently its 2 games because it was his second dismissal of the season.

 

We should not be looking to sell. He is still a high class player, just needs to get his head sorted. Don't believe Arsenal or Spurs will pursue him anyway, at least not in January. Can't see anyone else coming in for him either. The Club need to do what they are paid to do and get him back into shape, mentally.

Difficult to change the mentality of a player who never seemed to convince anyone that he ever wanted to be here in the first place. Remember how long it took to get the signing over the line three years ago.

 

I'd take serious issue about him being a "high class player", he was excellent for most of last season, but has been absolute toss this season. That suggests that the presence of Morgan Schneiderlin alongside him had a significant impact on his performances, and understandably so as Schneiderlin is a world-class defensive midfielder, but when he's been asked to step up and be the midfield leader, he's been unable to do so.

[saint1977]

Difficult to change the mentality of a player who never seemed to convince anyone that he ever wanted to be here in the first place. Remember how long it took to get the signing over the line three years ago.

 

I'd take serious issue about him being a "high class player", he was excellent for most of last season, but has been absolute toss this season. That suggests that the presence of Morgan Schneiderlin alongside him had a significant impact on his performances, and understandably so as Schneiderlin is a world-class defensive midfielder, but when he's been asked to step up and be the midfield leader, he's been unable to do so.

 

Exactly, I've never liked Victor that much in the first place and minus Morgan this season he's been shown up for what he is. Great V Arsenal when a destructive role was required (which reminds me of the famous blunt Jack Charlton quote on his own limitations but effectiveness) but as he showed Saturday when he's required to dominate play, even basic ball retention over 5-10 yards is beyond him. Lucky to be at SFC IMO. Morgan must have a bad back from carrying him. I'd let him go for £8-12m upfront and bring in a decent AMC. This won't happen as RK has drawn this as a red line so I'd like to see RK take Victor down a few pegs, as Dave Jones did with Carlton Palmer - say in public that he's the water carrier and there to get the ball to those that can play and stop the opposition, which at that time was MLT and now would be Clasie/Mane/Tadic. I've a feeling that might puncture Victor's pride sufficiently to get us through to the end of the season with a bit more effort and anger to prove the club wrong and attract a summer buyer.

 

Mane is a different story, he is very much needed but attitude clearly off. I'd have played him Saturday but fined him 2 week's wages and publicly criticised him, which Koeman did. To criticise players in public shouldn't be done lightly but clearly there is a need to 'name and shame'.

[Batman]

Agree with you in that RK should tell the public what Vic is.

 

He was not afraid to tell us all that reed lacked footballing qualities (which I doubt)

[saint1977]

To answer the original OP:

 

Cheer Mane, as many have posted he appears to have given his all on the pitch

 

Boo Wanyama - I hate booing our own players but his attitude reeks and I've no time for him as a player, useless stack of sh*t. Chanting Reed, Romeu and Clasie's names could be more effective however.

[angelman]

I'll never boo a player wearing a Saints shirt. It would be detrimental to the team.

 

That X or Y might be a tool and not want to be here, well, I'm pragmatic about these sort of things and don't really expect anyone to show undying love for Saints when a bigger fish sniffs around. Why would anyone expect them to behave in a gentlemanly manner?

[ALWAYS_SFC]

Agree with you in that RK should tell the public what Vic is.

 

He was not afraid to tell us all that reed lacked footballing qualities (which I doubt)

 

You doubt what he says but want him to tell you anyway...you are strange to say the least.

 

If RK came out and said Wanyama was ok and sincerely sorry for his performance and his antics in early season you wouldnt belive him anyway....

 

But i guess you just want another stick to hit the club with...

[Bourne Valley Saint]

Wanyama rarely, if ever, acknowledges the fans - even those stupid enough to chant about "The Mighty Kenyan". At least Tadic, Long, JWP and plenty others acknowledge us at both home and away games. His performances this season have been way below what is expected, if not in terms of skill then in endeavour. His performance at Norwich showed complete disregard to his teammates (who were already under the cosh thanks to Mane's stupidity) and to the 2500 fans who made the long and difficult (by train for us at least)journey. For the amount of money he's on per week (probably more than most on here earn in a year!) you would think he would show some responsibility. In answer to the original question - give me a good reason why he should not be booed. Please don't say it puts him or the team off as he couldn't give a flying **** and I'm sure his teammates feel the same as we do.

[St_Tel49]

Is being late for a team meeting really that big a deal? I know he has done it before, but not sure why RK didn't on both occasions punish him with a fine and keep it in house rather than tell the press.

Yes it is. It is about attitude and respect for your manager and team mates. That is all part of togetherness.

[naiser]

Not the type of fan who would jeer a player at the stadium. I'd complain on here, or curse them over a cuppa but come match day, we cheer.

 

Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

[Whitey Grandad]

I cheer the team, not the players.

[Wurzel]

I assume this was a meeting held at the hotel on Saturday morning, so he'd have been in the same building, but each player has their own room so if he's been lazy/tardy in the morning then easy to see how he could miss a meeting there.

 

The point has been made by someone else, but Mané's performances have been fine this season, I don't think his application on the pitch has been questioned once. As a result, I'm not sure dropping him is necessarily the right punishment as it also punishes the team as a whole, given how much we rely on him. Fine him whatever amount of money you choose, but I think Ron's cutting his nose off to spite his face by dropping him.

 

Wanyama, on the other hand, has had a **** attitude all season, only bothering to play at 100% when it's against Arsenal or Chelsea (basically what Celtic fans told us he'd be like). We're not going to make any money from him now, he's got 18 months left on his contract, he's nowhere near as good as he thinks he is and has been stinking up the place in terms of his attitude and seemingly dragging everyone down with him. Given the amount of money we were willing to spend to get rid of Osvaldo, we should be prepared to lose the £8m or so we might sell Vic for, stick him in the U21s for the remainder of his contract. Send a message to players that, while we may allow players to leave if they "deserve" the opportunity to play Champions League football and the price is right, we're not going to bow to players who throw their toys out and disrupt everything.

 

Is the Saturday morning team meeting not the one where the team is announced, tactics discussed etc? Difficult to plan for the game when one of those involved isn't there to listen and/or have an input. Guess they could have sent someone up to his room to fetch him but a) he's done it before and b) what message does that send to the rest of the squad who do take the responsibility to be there on time. Think if I were in RK's shoes I'd have done the same and gone ahead and pick/plan from those in front of me, that line-up in all reality should still have been strong enough to win the game.

 

Agree about Wanyama, I'd love to see a Billy Big ******** dumped in the reserves, not just in his case but at any club, just to send a message to the highly paid prima donnas that a contract is a contract.

[angelman]

What annoys me about all this is how they have had their heads turned so easily. Whether it is their agent, or other clubs slipping titbits to journalists, the stories have been out there for months. Still ****ed off with Wanyama effectively playing like a pussy and getting knocked out of Europe. I know that it is incredibly naive to think that tapping up isn't going to happen, but it seems to happen so easily with our players and they go to **** so easily with it. Maybe that is the idea. Big club wants our player. Feeds pet journo, or the agent does the feeding. Player goes to **** to the detriment of the team, so solution is to cash in. I like Ian Wright's view - Mané needs to pull his socks up and get Saints out of the mire we are in if he wants his move because as he is at the moment, he doesn't deserve to go anywhere.

 

It's the ugly side of football which I find so depressing that it always leads me to question why I in fact bother still go when I find the financial side of things so abhorent. And then we get games like Boxing Day...!

[VectisSaint]

I assume this was a meeting held at the hotel on Saturday morning, so he'd have been in the same building, but each player has their own room so if he's been lazy/tardy in the morning then easy to see how he could miss a meeting there.

 

The point has been made by someone else, but Mané's performances have been fine this season, I don't think his application on the pitch has been questioned once.

Steve, the meeting was at 1pm, 2 hours before kick-off. Ronald says this in an interview. It has to be just a short meeting to go over tactics again before they travel to the ground, the team would have already been selected (again Ronald said the team was already selected). How can you run such a meeting when one of the players isn't there because he doesn't have respect for his team mates or the manager? I don't really agree with how Ronald deals with this however, like Ian Wright said (I think it was Wright) deal with it privately and after the match, the Norwich team must have been cock a hoop when they found out our most dangerous player was being dropped.

 

By the way I think Mane has been poor several times this season, they really have been short of "fine" on a number of occasions.

[shurlock]

Steve, the meeting was at 1pm, 2 hours before kick-off. Ronald says this in an interview. It has to be just a short meeting to go over tactics again before they travel to the ground, the team would have already been selected (again Ronald said the team was already selected). How can you run such a meeting when one of the players isn't there because he doesn't have respect for his team mates or the manager? I don't really agree with how Ronald deals with this however, like Ian Wright said (I think it was Wright) deal with it privately and after the match, the Norwich team must have been cock a hoop when they found out our most dangerous player was being dropped.

 

By the way I think Mane has been poor several times this season, they really have been short of "fine" on a number of occasions.

 

Worth remembering that the last time Mane was dropped for disciplinary reasons (i.e. the Liverpool game), he was still brought on with more than 30mins to go. That Koeman didn't introduce him till the 80th min had more to do with tactics than wanting to send out a message (at least until we went 1 down).

[Fitzhugh Fella]

There is an article in the DT today saying that the meeting was rescheduled 10 mins earlier and there were problems in the hotel that led to a confusion as to the meeting's venue. It seems Mane has been excused

[jasoneuelllfanclub]

Here is the article. Wilson also reaffirms that Mane has no intention of extending his contract and will likely leave in the summer along with Wanyama.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/12082182/Man-Utd-transfer-news-Southampton-will-resist-bids-for-Sadio-Mane.html

[derry]

There is an article in the DT today saying that the meeting was rescheduled 10 mins earlier and there were problems in the hotel that led to a confusion as to the meeting's venue. It seems Mane has been excused

 

I saw that and if true Koeman went off half cocked. Surely it's not beyond the wit of man to firstly ascertain the facts and to act accordingly. From our union work I've experienced this was not a common occurrence with some managers.

[derry]

Here is the article. Wilson also reaffirms that Mane has no intention of extending his contract and will likely leave in the summer along with Wanyama.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/12082182/Man-Utd-transfer-news-Southampton-will-resist-bids-for-Sadio-Mane.html

 

His contract runs to July 2018. He'll only go in the summer if the club want to sell him. Still has two and a half seasons left on it. Good job I'm not a manager, I'd point that out and make him train on his own, after the players have left, without a ball, without supervision and not let him play or join in anything.

[stevegrant]

By the way I think Mane has been poor several times this season, they really have been short of "fine" on a number of occasions.

I meant as in his effort this season has been "fine", no reason to question whether he's been pulling his weight when he's been on the pitch. Performances have been up-and-down from the whole squad.

[The9]

Fair to say Mane's effort this season has been on a par with last. Can't say the same against Wanyama, though I only really obviously noticed it in the League Cup game against Liverpool when he ambled back from the halfway line ignoring Lallana sprinting past him and in doing so also left Can with 10 yards of space to run into once he'd turned Clasie.

[sadoldgit]

I saw that and if true Koeman went off half cocked. Surely it's not beyond the wit of man to firstly ascertain the facts and to act accordingly. From our union work I've experienced this was not a common occurrence with some managers.

 

It appears that everyone else managed to get there on time though.

[sadoldgit]

Just read the article and they are saying that Koeman moved the meeting forward by 10 minutes and there was also some confusion over unfamiliarity with the hotel. Apparently Mane was 2 hours late so not sure how that excuses him!

[derry]

Just read the article and they are saying that Koeman moved the meeting forward by 10 minutes and there was also some confusion over unfamiliarity with the hotel. Apparently Mane was 2 hours late so not sure how that excuses him!

 

I think it was two hours before kick off.

[adrian lord]

Meeting-Gate.