badgerx16 Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Ministers should waste no time to make unpopular cuts to pensioner benefits, a think tank director has said. Many of those hit by a cut to the winter fuel allowance might "not be around" at the next election, said Alex Wild of the Taxpayers' Alliance. And others would forget which party had done it, he added. "The first of which will sound a little bit morbid - some of the people... won't be around to vote against you in the next election. So that's just a practical point, and the other point is they might have forgotten by then." He added: "If you did it now, chances are that in 2020 someone who has had their winter fuel cut might be thinking, 'Oh I can't remember, was it this government or was it the last one? I'm not quite sure." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34439965 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 This is just obscene. Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Ministers should waste no time to make unpopular cuts to pensioner benefits, a think tank director has said. Many of those hit by a cut to the winter fuel allowance might "not be around" at the next election, said Alex Wild of the Taxpayers' Alliance. And others would forget which party had done it, he added. "The first of which will sound a little bit morbid - some of the people... won't be around to vote against you in the next election. So that's just a practical point, and the other point is they might have forgotten by then." He added: "If you did it now, chances are that in 2020 someone who has had their winter fuel cut might be thinking, 'Oh I can't remember, was it this government or was it the last one? I'm not quite sure." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34439965 Did you have a point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 I thought it was a great bit of satire at first....sadly I think it's just people thinking out loud, and making ruthless but valid electioneering points that you don't want people to hear. I think I'd be more upset if I was a hardworking family who is now being targeted for cuts in a U-turn from the manifesto message. It seems the turkeys voted for Christmas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 There has been a big shift in share of wealth to the old from the young in the last 10 years, which needs to be reversed imo. That said this isn't about evening things up, its about making more tax cuts for the wealthy. The cynicism is breathtaking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 There has been a big shift in share of wealth to the old from the young in the last 10 years, which needs to be reversed imo. That said this isn't about evening things up, its about making more tax cuts for the wealthy. The cynicism is breathtaking. That's rubbish. Where is all this wealth? I can't see any. With interest rates at virtually zero for the last few years the wealth has been going the other way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 5 October, 2015 Author Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) Did you have a point? I thought it might make for an interesting discussion. If you want to know my personal opinion; at best it simply shows that the left wing of politics doen't have a monopoly on 'loonies', at worst it shows how dangerous and spiteful zealots might be feeding ideas into real policy - not that Ian Duncan Smith really needs any help. Is that OK for you ? Edited 5 October, 2015 by badgerx16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Fair enough. The internet is chock full of idiotic quotes by halfwits, I just wondered why you randomly chose to re-post that one on a football forum without making any comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) That's rubbish. Where is all this wealth? I can't see any. With interest rates at virtually zero for the last few years the wealth has been going the other way. Is that a serious point? - its rubbish because you cant see any? Low interest rates is exactly one of the mechanisms by which wealth transfers to the old - by driving up property prices and rents. Whilst there have been cuts in nearly all government spending, spending on the NHS (used mostly by the over 60s) and pensions has increased. The young are paying more in tax, losing tax credits, find it harder to buy a home and receiving less services. The old are using more public services, getting higher state pensions and benefitting from increased property values (although I accept being capital rich and income poor doesn't benefit you). http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/11775373/Young-and-old-how-big-is-the-wealth-gap.html Edited 5 October, 2015 by buctootim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Ministers should waste no time to make unpopular cuts to pensioner benefits, a think tank director has said. Many of those hit by a cut to the winter fuel allowance might "not be around" at the next election, said Alex Wild of the Taxpayers' Alliance. And others would forget which party had done it, he added. "The first of which will sound a little bit morbid - some of the people... won't be around to vote against you in the next election. So that's just a practical point, and the other point is they might have forgotten by then." He added: "If you did it now, chances are that in 2020 someone who has had their winter fuel cut might be thinking, 'Oh I can't remember, was it this government or was it the last one? I'm not quite sure." http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34439965i think it must be a joke and there has been no real austerity anyway has we are borrowing more than ever and most pensioners are not rich and are on fixed income,and the young are punished has they are a easy target has they don,t get out and vote otherwise politians would take notice of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) ... Edited 5 October, 2015 by buctootim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 I thought it was a great bit of satire at first....sadly I think it's just people thinking out loud, and making ruthless but valid electioneering points that you don't want people to hear. I think I'd be more upset if I was a hardworking family who is now being targeted for cuts in a U-turn from the manifesto message. It seems the turkeys voted for Christmas.thats about right but the hedge funds who fund the party are just trying to push there interests so they can avoid paying tax,if they pay any at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) I love it how the word "austerity" has negative connotations as if it is something bad. Simply put, it means living within your means. How can anyone be anti-living-within-your-means when it is totally immorral to pass on your debts to your children??? So austerity is no bad thing at all. How it is achieved is another thing. Some argue budget cuts, some argue tax increases, but austerity in itself is what we should strive for. Any one who is anti-austerity is irresponsible and not fit to govern Edited 5 October, 2015 by Johnny Bognor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Is that a serious point? - its rubbish because you cant see any? Low interest rates is exactly one of the mechanisms by which wealth transfers to the old - by driving up property prices and rents. Whilst there have been cuts in nearly all government spending, spending on the NHS (used mostly by the over 60s) and pensions has increased. The young are paying more in tax, losing tax credits, find it harder to buy a home and receiving less services. The old are using more public services, getting higher state pensions and benefitting from increased property values (although I accept being capital rich and income poor doesn't benefit you). http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/11775373/Young-and-old-how-big-is-the-wealth-gap.html Too right it's serious. Using the NHS doesn't make you any wealthier and the value of your own home is totally irrelevant. Any savings you migh have are eroded by inflation in order to reduce the government's debt. As for the highlighted part, the value of living in a home that you have bought and paid for has not changed. It's still the same home. Pensions are index-linked but they are not tax-free and they have been paid for by a lifetime of contributions. As I said, I don't see any wealth amongst the old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 I love it how the word "austerity" has negative connotations as if it is something bad. Simply put, it means living within your means. How can anyone be anti-living-within-your-means when it is totally immorral to pass on your debts to your children??? So austerity is no bad thing at all. How it is achieved is another thing. Some argue budget cuts, some argue tax increases, but austerity in itself is what we should strive for. Any one who is anti-austerity is irresponsible and not fit to govern Depends how you do it though. The Tories have been cutting taxes and cutting services unevenly across different sectors. If they had maintained taxes at previous levels and cut recurrent spending whilst putting new money into short term labour intensive capital projects such as home insulation and school improvements we'd arguably balance the budget far more quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Depends how you do it though. The Tories have been cutting taxes and cutting services unevenly across different sectors. If they had maintained taxes at previous levels and cut recurrent spending whilst putting new money into short term labour intensive capital projects such as home insulation and school improvements we'd arguably balance the budget far more quickly. Which tax cuts are you thinking of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 i think it must be a joke and there has been no real austerity anyway has we are borrowing more than ever and most pensioners are not rich and are on fixed income,and the young are punished has they are a easy target has they don,t get out and vote otherwise politians would take notice of them. I think it must just be an attempt at a joke. During the next four years there will be loads of new pensioners. I don't know the demographics but I'm pretty sure that there will be more new recruits than thos slipping away. I don't think that the winter fuel allowance will sway anybody either way. In my opinion it should just be lumped in with the state pension along with the Christmas bonus. Then it would be liable for tax along with all the other payments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Too right it's serious. Using the NHS doesn't make you any wealthier and the value of your own home is totally irrelevant. Any savings you migh have are eroded by inflation in order to reduce the government's debt. As for the highlighted part, the value of living in a home that you have bought and paid for has not changed. It's still the same home. Pensions are index-linked but they are not tax-free and they have been paid for by a lifetime of contributions. As I said, I don't see any wealth amongst the old. I dunno, most oldies I know have ridden the housing bubble nicely and have decent sized pensions despite not even being particularly clever or hardworking. Things do seem particularly tough for the young nowadays, getting on the housing ladder is very hard, a decent education leaves you 50K in debt. Maybe the old should give up some of their pension to help pay off the debt they created? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Which tax cuts are you thinking of? Off the top of my head - Corporation tax, inheritance tax, raising the 40% tax threshold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Off the top of my head - Corporation tax, inheritance tax, raising the 40% tax threshold. Corporation Tax will bring more businesses and jobs into Britain and will leave companies with more money that they can spend on investment and employment. It will also help to offset the costs of auto-enrolment in pensions. Inheritance Tax will pass on more money to the younger generations so no complaints there, surely? The 40% threshold has not been indexed and is still subject to fiscal creep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 I dunno, most oldies I know have ridden the housing bubble nicely and have decent sized pensions despite not even being particularly clever or hardworking. Things do seem particularly tough for the young nowadays, getting on the housing ladder is very hard, a decent education leaves you 50K in debt. Maybe the old should give up some of their pension to help pay off the debt they created? That's a very extreme figure. Even Cambridge charge 'only' £9000 p.a. so that would be £27,000. Student loans are not a normal debt and should not be considered as such. They are not repayable on demand and may never be repayed at all. They should be thought of more as a graduate tax which is not payable below a certain threshold. Decent sized pensions are the exception, unless the individuals used to work in certain areas of the Public Sector. Gordon Brown killed all the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 That's a very extreme figure. Even Cambridge charge 'only' £9000 p.a. so that would be £27,000. Student loans are not a normal debt and should not be considered as such. They are not repayable on demand and may never be repayed at all. They should be thought of more as a graduate tax which is not payable below a certain threshold. Decent sized pensions are the exception, unless the individuals used to work in certain areas of the Public Sector. Gordon Brown killed all the rest. Even without fee's students rack up a sizeable debt. When I graduated I wasn't too bad but some of my mates were in double figures - and that was with no fees at all, just living costs, rent etc. Even if it is 30-40K that is more than older generations had to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Too right it's serious. Using the NHS doesn't make you any wealthier and the value of your own home is totally irrelevant. Any savings you migh have are eroded by inflation in order to reduce the government's debt. As for the highlighted part, the value of living in a home that you have bought and paid for has not changed. It's still the same home. Pensions are index-linked but they are not tax-free and they have been paid for by a lifetime of contributions. As I said, I don't see any wealth amongst the old. good post and i own my own home but don,t see myself has wealthy either and if the government built more houses ,the price would fall ,the trouble is its good politics to have the young blame the old for there problems,if the young were not so apathetic and got out and voted the politicians would realise that they were important block to win there seats . what ever happened to the 1960,s spirit of protest from the young,now all they want to do is buy silly i phones at stupid prices or play games and other material things.most of those older generation have paid over 40 plus years for there pensions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Even without fee's students rack up a sizeable debt. When I graduated I wasn't too bad but some of my mates were in double figures - and that was with no fees at all, just living costs, rent etc. Even if it is 30-40K that is more than older generations had to pay. My two children went through university in the 1990s, my son for 4 years and my daughter for 3. It cost me over £40,000 to do it. My daughter came out debt-free but my son owed quite a bit which he has only just paid off. Most of his went on booze. In my day (Cambridge 1968 ) there were no tuition fees and there was a grant of up to £400 but this was means-tested and only the poor got the full grant. Getting a job during the vacations is the important thing. Personally, I don't agree with the big drive to send everybody to 'university' and then get them to have to pay for it all. I think that apprenticeships are a much better course to a career for a lot of youngsters. You're earning money whilst you''re learning and by the time your contemporaries have graduated you're some way along the career path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 I love it how the word "austerity" has negative connotations as if it is something bad. Simply put, it means living within your means. How can anyone be anti-living-within-your-means when it is totally immorral to pass on your debts to your children??? So austerity is no bad thing at all. How it is achieved is another thing. Some argue budget cuts, some argue tax increases, but austerity in itself is what we should strive for. Any one who is anti-austerity is irresponsible and not fit to govern My favourite part of the Labour conference was when McDonnell claimed another world is possible by "rejecting austerity while also living within our means". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 My favourite part of the Labour conference was when McDonnell claimed another world is possible by "rejecting austerity while also living within our means". Did you really not understand that? wow. Living within your means is balancing your income and expenditure. If you increase income you don't need to cut expenditure - therefore no austerity. Not the most difficult concept Id venture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint si Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 We're living in one of the wealthiest countries in the world... "where is the wealth?". Go take a look at the developing world for some perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Did you really not understand that? wow. Living within your means is balancing your income and expenditure. If you increase income you don't need to cut expenditure - therefore no austerity. Not the most difficult concept Id venture. Except that you'll need to increase expenditure accordingly to generate the extra income. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Did you really not understand that? wow. Living within your means is balancing your income and expenditure. If you increase income you don't need to cut expenditure - therefore no austerity. Not the most difficult concept Id venture. Taxation is not income. It's taking away somebody else's income. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) Did you really not understand that? wow. Living within your means is balancing your income and expenditure. If you increase income you don't need to cut expenditure - therefore no austerity. Not the most difficult concept Id venture. If you increase income (through taxation) to balance the books, that is austerity. Austerity means balancing the books. Raising taxation is an austerity measure, as is cutting spending. Which measure is is the right thing to do is up for debate, but austerity itself is not a negative thing (despite lefties having you believe otherwise). So stop peddling austerity as a negative thing. Cuts may have negative connotations. But tax rises do too. It just depends on which side of the fence you sit, but we all must embrace the concept of austerity.... we owe it to future generations. I would have thought caring sharing lefties wouldn't want to burden future generations with their own excesses. It is something you would expect of someone of a selfish me-me-me right wing disposition. Edited 5 October, 2015 by Johnny Bognor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 If you increase income (through taxation) to balance the books, that is austerity. Austerity means balancing the books. Raising taxation is an austerity measure. Not by most definitions. Its means reducing expenditure, tightening belt etc. I have no problem with balancing the books http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/austerity http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/austerity http://www.thefreedictionary.com/austerity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Not by most definitions. Its means reducing expenditure, tightening belt etc. I have no problem with balancing the books http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/austerity http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/austerity http://www.thefreedictionary.com/austerity Dictionary definitions are a bit simplistic compared to the FT and the Economist.... http://lexicon.ft.com/Term?term=austerity-measure http://www.economist.com/blogs/buttonwood/2015/05/fiscal-policy So with this in mind, reducing taxation is as much anti-austerity as is raising public expenditure. Maybe Corbyn and Cameron aren't that different afterall... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Not by most definitions. Its means reducing expenditure, tightening belt etc. I have no problem with balancing the books http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/austerity http://www.macmillandictionary.com/dictionary/british/austerity http://www.thefreedictionary.com/austerity I tend to agree with you on this, austerity comes from the word 'austere' and doesn't mean tightening your belt a little, it means going without. I asociate austerity programmes with the post-war years and if you think that what we are doing now is austerity then it just doesn't compare. I suppose that words change their meanings over time but for me this one won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Winter fuel allowence and free TV licences should go . The triple lock is also pandering to older folks just because they vote. I get it that people on fixed income should have their retirement income linked to prices , but that should be it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 http://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/comment/articles/2015-09/12/tony-parsons-voting-conservative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 5 October, 2015 Author Share Posted 5 October, 2015 http://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/comment/articles/2015-09/12/tony-parsons-voting-conservative However many times Tony Parsons states that "11 million voted Conservative" to justify his article, he misses the point that nearly 20 million of those who voted didn't vore tory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 However many times Tony Parsons states that "11 million voted Conservative" to justify his article, he misses the point that nearly 20 million of those who voted didn't vore tory. it is the system we have and they won Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 However many times Tony Parsons states that "11 million voted Conservative" to justify his article, he misses the point that nearly 20 million of those who voted didn't vore tory. He doesn't though. And he nails the current Labour party 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 He doesn't though. And he nails the current Labour party 100%. this is what the labour party are all about, now corbyn is in charge http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3260444/Manchester-police-force-defends-use-snipers-Tory-conference.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Did they all get a day off work to attend the protest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 (edited) this is what the labour party are all about, now corbyn is in charge http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3260444/Manchester-police-force-defends-use-snipers-Tory-conference.html It's OK Batman, I'll cut you a break and lend you a brain cell for once: If you hold a conference in the city where one of the most Assad-like murderous government (tory government) ordered mass killings of innocent citizens happened and you justify this with a Daily Mail link then I'm afraid...well, you're either being a bit simple or just outright moronic. I'll put it simpler....IF you think holding a Tory party conference where the Peterloo massacres happened, at a time like this is not incitement, then you are living in a very odd and special place indeed. Either way, Lord Duckhunter has a point here and so does Whitey Grandad. There are lots of added things that could be cut from pensioners (wealthy pensioners in particular...but then they'll say "we've worked for that"). Balancing books is fine but it's intertwined with conservative doctrine that's the problem: hitting those who would not normally vote for them, pretending the living wage is anything of the sort while removing essentially a thousand pounds a year from people who could ill afford it...that's not austerity, that's doctrine. But I've found this lovely link from the sun (cripes, the Sun, often a conservative vote winner for the public....shocking!...As they point out, if you agree to this, which clearly a lot of you on here do...you might be just a little bonkers) http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/politics/6674334/Government-tax-credit-cuts-to-affect-three-million-Brits.html Edited 5 October, 2015 by Hockey_saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 this is what the labour party are all about, now corbyn is in charge http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3260444/Manchester-police-force-defends-use-snipers-Tory-conference.html Pfft that's pretty tame compared to storming tory hq five odd years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Good article. Encapsulates perfectly why the tories won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Good article. Encapsulates perfectly why the tories won. But the title of this thread is "in a caring society" where's the caring bit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 http://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/comment/articles/2015-09/12/tony-parsons-voting-conservative What a sh!t article. I agree with the fact thatt people voted conservative because there was no other option but that is so badly written, no substance whatsoever. It's just a load of insults, one of these pointless online features aimed at getting people to comment. All this " Labour won't get in power again" is all complete ******** and anyone who says they will vote for a party for the rest of their life is just a ***t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 What a sh!t article. I agree with the fact thatt people voted conservative because there was no other option but that is so badly written, no substance whatsoever. It's just a load of insults, one of these pointless online features aimed at getting people to comment. All this " Labour won't get in power again" is all complete ******** and anyone who says they will vote for a party for the rest of their life is just a ***t. Wrong forum dude, I completely agree with you but most here won't. But it is why Labour won't get back into power whilst people believe such right-wing nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 But the title of this thread is "in a caring society" where's the caring bit? The workers need caring for too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hockey_saint Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 The workers need caring for too. Are you suggesting those on low incomes who'll lose a fair old amount thanks to the loss of tax credits are NOT workers? I mean, I would suggest to you that it is those very low paid workers who need caring for the most....not being punitively punished. Please don't mention the "living wage" because we both know it's noting of the sort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 But the title of this thread is "in a caring society" where's the caring bit? I think the tories should care more but they are currently the only party that is realistic about things and doesn't go off into some fairyland world or be motivated by the politics of envy. The article was saying that although he is a reluctant tory, he believes that disastrous labour policy would have been a lot less caring because it would have turned out a whole lot worse. I agree with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 5 October, 2015 Share Posted 5 October, 2015 Wrong forum dude, I completely agree with you but most here won't. But it is why Labour won't get back into power whilst people believe such right-wing nonsense. Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. "it's all those thick idiots who believe all that right wing stuff." heaven forbid that people weighed things up and made an intelligent choice that the labour party simply were not the party they wanted to lead the country (and they still aren't.) it's your attitude primarily that turns people off from the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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