A wasted Summer?

[Give it to Ron]

If he was worried about Memphis he will sh1t himself about Jefferson Montero this week who has been outstanding.

Expect to see Yoshida again then.

[Donatello]

https://mobile.twitter.com/bigadamsport/status/644888643413389312

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/bigadamsport/status/644888860468625408

 

Ta btw (thought I'd commented that yesterday).

Edited 22 September, 2015 by Donatello

[Donatello]

In any case as ronald noted in his conference, he "hates" it when players pass back to the centre half or to the keeper. So it isn't all his 'cautious system' of playing as some are saying, because he's said that isn't what he wants them to do. I think its positive he notices that, I find it unbelievably frustrating

 

Which press-conference was this? Post-ManU? Thanks in advance

[Lallana's Left Peg]

Hmm, yeah, I somewhat accept that (rotating CMs), but Davis doesn't come close to resembling a DM, so I think his selection in that role is tactical (as opposed to rotation), I.e. he's playing in the DM position in namesake only (more freedom and whatnot). And I feel it's disingenuous to suggest that Yoshida is just a CB played at RB. He clearly has a versatility which other CBs don't possess (e.g. Fonte, Lovren, Caulker, Hoovield) - Adkins thought so too. CB isn't Blind's natural position but he does a job - I see Yoshida in the same vein (jack of all trades).

 

Again, I can see what you're driving at, but I feel it's a tad unrealistic. For Southampton to have Soares/Martina/Yoshi as RB options isn't *that* bad. Soares as the starter, Yoshi as the strong but blunt presence, and Martina as out and out balanced cover. You seem to be seeking another big purchase-big wage (relative) player, which is you're prerogative/expectation. I don't mind us having to become a tad Pulis-esque at times...it certainly won't be the norm. We won't have Craig Dawson-types playing RB for anything approaching the majority.

 

Reference Juanmi, that's just hyperbole. I can't be bothered to address it.

 

He thinks Romeu is better. He thinks Stek is better. He thinks Clasie is better. Soares. VVD. That's 5 from 8 (1st team signings). Martina and Caulker were Europa players. Juanmi is a mystery but only because he hasn't made many bench appearances - for that fee, I wouldn't expect him to waltz in and claim Tadic's/Mane's spot. He's Elia's/Djuricic's replacement. Both were labelled dross by many on this forum, so any improvement with Juanmi is a positive, right? And a status quo isn't regressive.

 

I am with you in that I don't like Davis as a DM (not in our system, anyway) but Yoshida as an emergency right-back is fine but as a bonafide alternative to Soares is concerning for a club with Top 6 ambitions. Yoshida is a valuable squad member and had he been forced to play there through injuries then I have no complaints. But for him to be selected over Soares concerns me because a) it's Yoshida at right back, which defensively isn't great and going forward is a disaster, and b) it means Soares either can't be that good, Koeman doesn't fancy him, or he has some big errors in his game which will take a while to fix.

 

I think for Southampton to have Soares / Martina / Yoshida as options at right back is fine. I think for any team wanting to finish Top 6 it's laughable. And that is the way I look at things. If I look at things from a Saints perspective it is very easy to justify most of what we have done in the summer. If I look at it from a punter who gets told by the club that they want to compete on all fronts and push on I just laugh - it's not good enough.

 

Stek I will give you but with Forster out the bar was low to find better than Davis. I am quite happy with Stek and think the club have done good business there. Clasie we have to see but I suspect you are right and he will be a starter no matter what. Romeu and Soares I don't see him as thinking they are better than what he has got, but time will show there. I'm not seeking a big wage player really, but I am seeking someone ready to make an impact straight away. Because each summer if we sell high and buy low - and the replacement player is of an ilk that they will need half a season to get up to speed this club cannot and will not sustain progress and will instead just be a factory that takes punts on players and some will be hits and some will be misses. With the money we have available we should be able to do better in my opinion.

 

That said, it's all very early but when I see signings to beef out the squad that aren't better than what we have I don't think it's a good way to go about things.

[The9]

Don't agree with the assessment of most the players. Martina does look horrendous though. Think Van Dijk and Clasie will be very good signings. Cedric obviously isn't trusted by Koeman, and is nowhere near as good as some have been saying but does look good going forward. It is pretty obvious that it's hard to replace your best players every single summer and the same will happen again next summer. (Mané and Wanyama)

It does look like we've fallen behind West Ham now and maybe even Swansea.

 

I'm absolutely fine with how we're doing at the moment with the injuries, even though I think we could finish below the top 6, plus Leicester, Palace, Stoke, Swansea and Everton (lost at home). I wouldn't bat an eyelid.

 

We overperformed last season, have lost three of our best players on top of the ones we lost the year before, and we also have also had lot of concurrent injuries and whilst last year's team was the exception it often takes time for a LOT of new players to get used to each others' styles. Plus football is all about fine margins and we've been on the wrong end of a few of those this year as opposed to the right end of them last.

 

Can't see us being worse than Sunderland, Norwich (beat at home), Watford (drew away), Newcastle (drew away), West Brom (drew away), Villa or Bournemouth and probably not worse than West Ham either.

 

So somewhere midtable between 8th and 13th seems likely, with the specifics coming down to a red card here and an injury there in key moments.

 

Martina looked fine, bit ponderous on the ball once or twice but playing completely out of position at left back and MUCH better than the last time I saw him there.

[The9]

I am with you in that I don't like Davis as a DM (not in our system' date=' anyway) but Yoshida as an emergency right-back is fine but as a bonafide alternative to Soares [b']is concerning for a club with Top 6 ambitions[/b].

 

What makes you think we're one of those? We're a club with top of mid-table ambitions. Sustainable and happy to sell best players on. We were just about getting used to being that in 2003/4 too and people started moaning about missing the relegation battle.

[Lallana's Left Peg]

What makes you think we're one of those? We're a club with top of the middle 7 ambitions. Sustainable and happy to sell best players on. We were just about getting used to being that in 2003/4 too and people started moaning about missing the relegation battle.

 

Just what I get told in public by the club! Reed and Krueger in particular.

[Fabrice29]

If he was worried about Memphis he will sh1t himself about Jefferson Montero this week who has been outstanding.

Expect to see Yoshida again then.

 

Been pretty quiet for a couple of games now to be fair. Montero is all about pace, Memphis has more to his game and I wouldn't be surprised to see Soares to counter act that.

[The9]

Just what I get told in public by the club! Reed and Krueger in particular.

 

Since going out of Europe I've only heard "we might try and win a cup".

[Lallana's Left Peg]

Since going out of Europe I've only heard "we might try and win a cup".

 

This calendar year the club have been very vocal about ambition and what we want to do etc. The summers transfer business was all about that. Reed even claimed we got all our targets (which we know is BS to be fair). It went very quiet after Europe and being thumped by Everton.

[Give it to Ron]

Been pretty quiet for a couple of games now to be fair. Montero is all about pace, Memphis has more to his game and I wouldn't be surprised to see Soares to counter act that.

But Memphis has done bugger all in the Prem - had a couple of decent Champs League. Management panicked and gave them too much respect IMO. The half time substitution just compounded that error.

[Donatello]

Been pretty quiet for a couple of games now to be fair. Montero is all about pace, Memphis has more to his game and I wouldn't be surprised to see Soares to counter act that.

 

Mhmm, Montero is going down the line every time (95% of the time) (based on what I've seen).

[eddie]

Which press-conference was this? Post-ManU? Thanks in advance

 

hey sorry, made a mistake. he just had a direct interview with the echo:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/13772231.Koeman_clear_on_Southampton_tactics/?ref=mr&lp=10

[BadgerBadger]

Stekelenburg is just soooo static for everything and as for Martina, reminds me of Kenwyne Jones inasmuch that he's an athlete they think they can turn into a footballer, jurys out for me but hope I'm proved wrong.

Edited 22 September, 2015 by BadgerBadger

[Dig Dig]

Ultimately we've raised over £120M over the last two season with a positive net spend in terms of reinvestment in the squad despite the official line being that we don't need to sell to this extent for financial reasons. If off the back of that we're accepting lower mid table after two seasons of being the "best of rest" then it's disappointing and I'm amazed how quickly people are prepared to adjust their expectations without even asking any questions.

 

We should expect better quality in certain positions if the club are serious about the rhetoric around consistent Europa League placement, cup runs and the like. It looks like we had a the opportunity to keep ourselves ahead of the chasing pack but I'm not sure if we have taken full advantage tbh.

[Donatello]

hey sorry, made a mistake. he just had a direct interview with the echo:

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/13772231.Koeman_clear_on_Southampton_tactics/?ref=mr&lp=10

 

Haha, it's an outrage it is Ta.

[Greenridge]

Stekelenburg is just soooo static for everything and as for Martina, reminds me of Kenwyne Jones inasmuch that he's an athlete they think they can turn into a footballer, jurys out for me but hope I'm proved wrong.

 

I understand the Club received a call from the cousin of Ali Dia recommending Martina.

[Black Sea Saint]

You have no idea what the word rookie means, have you?

 

American English - a member of a sports team in their first full season.

British English - a ​person who is new to an ​organisation or an ​activity

 

I was using it with a little bit of artistic licence as it was a dig at Krueger, who perhaps thinks that first teamers can be replaced with less experienced players each season. Anyway, you obviously don't agree.

[Wrensup]

American English - a member of a sports team in their first full season.

British English - a ​person who is new to an ​organisation or an ​activity

 

I was using it with a little bit of artistic licence as it was a dig at Krueger, who perhaps thinks that first teamers can be replaced with less experienced players each season. Anyway, you obviously don't agree.

 

 

So what you're trying to say is plain old inexperienced.

[tajjuk]

Eh?

 

We outplayed and should have beaten a Man Utd that probably cost half a billion to assemble, I think every player they had on that pitch cost more than our most expensive player and we lost to an offside and a stupid backpass yet we get threads like this?

 

if anyone should be questioning their recruitment it's Utd, they've spent like £250 million over two seasons and still barely look a top 4 team.

 

We are fine, I love Clasie being written off because he's injured btw:mcinnes:

 

Stupid stupid post, hopefully this will be dragged up in a year or so and we can all point and laugh.

[CB Fry]

American English - a member of a sports team in their first full season.

British English - a ​person who is new to an ​organisation or an ​activity

 

I was using it with a little bit of artistic licence as it was a dig at Krueger, who perhaps thinks that first teamers can be replaced with less experienced players each season. Anyway, you obviously don't agree.

 

Krueger is not driving our transfer policy. The major players we've brought in this summer are no more "rookies" than the players we've brought in in previous summers. Like, say, Nathaniel Clyne.

[Saint_Tony]

The stupid thing is, last week at West Brom we say the defence looks solid, but we were toothless in attack. It was the opposite against utd. I have no doubt once both click we will start winning games.

 

Koeman playing Yoshida at RB was just suicidal, he cannot play there, but you can't blame him for being picked in that position.

 

Nice to see all our signings have been written off and official confirmation on here Koeman doesn't rate Soares.

 

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

[ally_uk]

Bunch of wet tarts on here! at least give the new boys time to adjust / bed in. 1st half performance against United was fantastic, we played them off the field if our finishing was a bit more clinical could of easily of been 4-0 before the half time oranges came out.

 

I think we will be fine this season, I also belive Juanmi will do a good job for us in good time probably just needs time to adjust / pick up the lingo. Also looking at the bigger picture throw bertrand and clasie into the mix happy days.

 

Jan transfer market or next season, Sam Byram, Mowatt, Dennis Praet, Witsel, Vilhena, Charlie Austin

 

We can dream

[Give it to Ron]

Bunch of wet tarts on here! at least give the new boys time to adjust / bed in. 1st half performance against United was fantastic, we played them off the field if our finishing was a bit more clinical could of easily of been 4-0 before the half time oranges came out.

 

I think we will be fine this season, I also belive Juanmi will do a good job for us in good time probably just needs time to adjust / pick up the lingo. Also looking at the bigger picture throw bertrand and clasie into the mix happy days.

 

Jan transfer market or next season, Sam Byram, Mowatt, Dennis Praet, Witsel, Vilhena, Charlie Austin

 

We can dream ��

 

Why Byram he has been awful this season? We don't play wide right so why buy him?

[Saint Garrett]

Bunch of wet tarts on here! at least give the new boys time to adjust / bed in. 1st half performance against United was fantastic, we played them off the field if our finishing was a bit more clinical could of easily of been 4-0 before the half time oranges came out.

 

I think we will be fine this season, I also belive Juanmi will do a good job for us in good time probably just needs time to adjust / pick up the lingo. Also looking at the bigger picture throw bertrand and clasie into the mix happy days.

 

Jan transfer market or next season, Sam Byram, Mowatt, Dennis Praet, Witsel, Vilhena, Charlie Austin

 

We can dream ��

 

Do you not think we have enough CM's ?!

[eddie]

Bunch of wet tarts on here! at least give the new boys time to adjust / bed in. 1st half performance against United was fantastic, we played them off the field if our finishing was a bit more clinical could of easily of been 4-0 before the half time oranges came out.

 

I think we will be fine this season, I also belive Juanmi will do a good job for us in good time probably just needs time to adjust / pick up the lingo. Also looking at the bigger picture throw bertrand and clasie into the mix happy days.

 

Jan transfer market or next season, Sam Byram, Mowatt, Dennis Praet, Witsel, Vilhena, Charlie Austin

 

We can dream ��

 

if we're including witsel in that (easily a cool 30-40+ million) we may as well just create a fantasy team.

[The9]

Do you not think we have enough CM's ?!

 

We won't have when Wanyama inevitably leaves and if we can reduce that impact by introducing someone gradually (like Juanmi for instance) then provided we can afford it we probably should.

 

Not to mention that wages could be significantly lower in January than next summer.

[Edmonton Saint]

So 5 months into the season, and our squad looks full of deadwood and dreadful players. I stick by my initial

assessment thar our summer was wasted and we spent too much money on mediocrity . The scouting certainly seems to have failed this summer.

[Saint Charlie]

Went for numbers rather than quality.

 

Clasie + Romeu hasnt replaced Schneiderlin in anyway, not even attempted to replace his key attributes of agility, high energy, stamina etc

 

Cedric has played 90mins in less than half our games and he + Martina in no way anywhere near Clyne.

 

We have gone from Clyne and Chambers competing for the RB spot to Cedric, Yoshida and Martina

 

Thats the problem.

[Batman]

I dont think VvD is as good as Toby either

but still good. Best of the summer buys

 

 

we really bought poorly this time

[Saints foreva]

Schneiderlin replaced with Clasie. A massive laugh out loud at us.

 

Nowhere near as good as last season.

[doddisalegend]

So it's that time of year when the season is ending we will finish minimum 8th and could still beat our record points total. A good time to return to a few old threads and bask in the warm glow of our words of wisdom....

Edited 3 May, 2016 by doddisalegend

[Saints foreva]

Schneiderlin replaced with Clasie. A massive laugh out loud at us.

 

Nowhere near as good as last season.

 

Well I guess I was a bit wrong here considering we could beat last season's points total.

 

[Lighthouse]

This team, when we start playing properly, will be far better than anything Sunderland, Newcastle, Villa, Norwich, Bompey or Watford are capable of. We're unbeaten away from home and lost narrowly at home to Utd. We may have gifted Utd the win but we gave them a better game than Liverpool did. The only properly poor result was Everton.

 

The time to be concerned is when we look 100 miles away from even competing in games. If we'd lost 3-0 again yesterday and not had a shot on target, then I'd be a bit worried.

 

Edit: You can add West Brom to that list, they played like the away team hoping for a 0-0 last week. Leicester and West Ham may be flavour of the month but they really aren't anything special. No different to Hull and Wigan being in the top 4 a few years ago, they both ended up fighting the drop.

 

Well I sure nailed that one!

[S-Clarke]

This thread is a fine example of why you can never snapshot a period of games and conclude the entire outcome of the season based on that period.

 

I think our early exit from Europe hurt us mentally, I think it affected us more than we let on. We fought so hard for that last year and to go out so meekly must have dropped the morale.

[Dig Dig]

Every season is relative. If only VVD wasn't the only real success from the summer.

[Saint Charlie]

Every season is relative. If only VVD wasn't the only real success from the summer.

Certainly hope for a better success rate this summer.

 

We must be in a position to sign PL ready players having finished top 10 for three seasons running.

[The9]

So it's that time of year when the season is ending we will finish minimum 8th and could still beat our record points total. A good time to return to a few old threads and bask in the warm glow of our words of wisdom....

 

I'm absolutely fine with how we're doing at the moment with the injuries, even though I think we could finish below the top 6, plus Leicester, Palace, Stoke, Swansea and Everton (lost at home). I wouldn't bat an eyelid.

 

We overperformed last season, have lost three of our best players on top of the ones we lost the year before, and we also have also had lot of concurrent injuries and whilst last year's team was the exception it often takes time for a LOT of new players to get used to each others' styles. Plus football is all about fine margins and we've been on the wrong end of a few of those this year as opposed to the right end of them last.

 

Can't see us being worse than Sunderland, Norwich (beat at home), Watford (drew away), Newcastle (drew away), West Brom (drew away), Villa or Bournemouth and probably not worse than West Ham either.

 

So somewhere midtable between 8th and 13th seems likely, with the specifics coming down to a red card here and an injury there in key moments.

 

Martina looked fine, bit ponderous on the ball once or twice but playing completely out of position at left back and MUCH better than the last time I saw him there.

 

Some of us aren't knee-jerkers, but this was posted at the end of September - and couple of weeks later I apologised for suggesting we could come 13th and said I still thought we'd come 8th... don't mind if we get 7th or 6th though.

 

Even so, we HAVE finished below all of the usual "top 6" except Chelsea and maybe Liverpool, did come below Leicester like everyone else, (but still above then-peers Palace, Stoke, Swansea and Everton), and below West Ham who I said we "probably weren't worse than" - but "can't see us being worse than Sunderland, Norwich, Watford, Newcastle, West Brom, Villa or Bournemouth" turned out to be right.

 

Nice to see my Martina assessment had already been heavily revised by then, I think it's become fairly standard that he is now preferred to Cedric in "defensive" matches and that he's not an obvious weakness, we hadn't really worked out that was the... plan(?) by then.