Blessing in disguise?

[DrZuess1979 the 2nd]

Going out of Europe ?

 

Don't get me wrong, I was more excited about a Europa league than I have been for say the fa cup etc but

Is it an unwanted distraction from, lets face it is our bread and butter/sugar daddy that is the premiership

 

The evidence is there, teams with a average squad size and depth struggle with the amount of games plus the traveling to the back end of Europe.

 

Middlesbrough

Fulham

Newcastle

Swansea

 

 

More recently Everton who look refreshed this season

 

I've not included Spurs as they are underachievers imo (money they spend etc)

[trousers]

Pragmatism? On the Saintsweb forum? I hope your hatch is well and truly battened down....

[S-Clarke]

I don't understand this theory to be honest. So, we don't want to be in Europe so we can have the best crack at the PL to make sure we get Europe next year?

 

We should have just embraced it, enjoyed it, shouldn't have ever feared it. This sort of thing isn't a regular occurrence for clubs like us, I hoped I'd see us make more of a fist of it as the likes of Boro, Fulham, Stoke and Swansea have done in the past.

 

Who knows when the next opportunity will come. This one was flaming 12 years and 2 relegation's in the waiting.

[Jack]

What's our best realistic Prem finish? Europa league places. What's the point in striving for that, qualifying, then making a half-arsed effort when you actually get there?

 

We should go for it in every cup competition we enter. Ron has said as much, but I think he's losing the plot. Setting up like that and playing hit and hope long ball sh*te against a team that know exactly how to deal with that sort of thing is just baffling.

[Foxstone]

I don't understand this theory to be honest. So, we don't want to be in Europe so we can have the best crack at the PL to make sure we get Europe next year?

 

We should have just embraced it, enjoyed it, shouldn't have ever feared it. This sort of thing isn't a regular occurrence for clubs like us, I hoped I'd see us make more of a fist of it as the likes of Boro, Fulham, Stoke and Swansea have done in the past.

 

Who knows when the next opportunity will come. This one was flaming 12 years and 2 relegation's in the waiting.

 

Agree - We fought hard last season to be in it, and I would have loved us to have a good run in this competition. I honestly thought that with a fair wind and a fit squad to choose from we could have gone an awful long way in this competition.

I feel very, very disappointed we went out in such a manner, and hope we can recover from this and qualify again so we can get another shot next year.

[Roger]

I don't understand this theory to be honest. So, we don't want to be in Europe so we can have the best crack at the PL to make sure we get Europe next year?

 

We should have just embraced it, enjoyed it, shouldn't have ever feared it. This sort of thing isn't a regular occurrence for clubs like us, I hoped I'd see us make more of a fist of it as the likes of Boro, Fulham, Stoke and Swansea have done in the past.

 

Who knows when the next opportunity will come. This one was flaming 12 years and 2 relegation's in the waiting.

 

This.

[Batman]

I do not believe for a second the club/manager preferred this option.

Les has talked up european football as our 'next step' and all that. Even talked up champions league dream (wish the club really wouldnt)

 

however, this summer has been a poor one for the club in the market and it is showing

also, I think RK is lost it a bit.

Walked on water last season, looked rather odd this (so far)

 

now that we are out, given the utterly weird place the team is at, probably not a disaster that we do not have the extra 6 games and the travelling etc to go with it

after all, RK has said a few times that this game in Denmark brings up our 7th games of the season already and we have little/no recovery time between games and little time to prepare for the next.

Edited 28 August, 2015 by Batman

[Super_Uwe]

Well, given our early season form, I'd agree with you.

 

Just very disappointing as we put out strong teams in every game. To get knocked out at the very last hurdle before the group stages having taken it seriously must be galling for the management team and players.

 

I still feel as though we are in an OK position for the rest of the season. Obviously the new recruits this year haven't made an instant impact, but all we can hope is that the likes of Clasie, Soares etc settle in fairly soon, and the other key players like Pelle, Tadic etc pick up their form.

 

Likewise, still a few days to get one or two new faces in. So it is by no means doom and gloom yet.

[angelman]

I was looking forward to it. I wanted to be in the same pot as Dortmund. Have some Euro nights, even if we did badly in PL. Disappointed and for me, the season has already lost a lot of it's appeal. Now we are back in a competition to make up the numbers, and if last nights performance was anything to go by, European qualification is a long way off.

[DrZuess1979 the 2nd]

Innnn comingggg

 

We are not in a position where the squad is settled.

Players are having their heads turned, the new ones need time, if they are good enough in the first place.

We have bought depth but not quality for the Europa league. If we hadn't qualified would these players be here ?

 

I am not saying the club wanted a quick exit ala West Ham, but I do think we where aiming for champions league (not at the beginning of last year but definitely near Xmas)

[UpweySaint]

Can agree to some extent. Gutted as I am our squad is not where it needs to be currently. It could be argued we need new recruits but, more than anything, I think we need to find a system and a best XI and give it time to click, with the reduced training time and extra demands brought about by europe (now matter how much most of us would have loved to done well in the competition) it may have taken even longer for a unit to gel cohesively. I was watching last night missing the fluidity of Lambert, Lallana, Rodriguez etc and the bombing on of Clyne and Shaw/Bertrand.

[alpine_saint]

Yes, considering our utterly uninspiring business over the summer.

 

Could have been different, however....

[a1ex2001]

Massively disappointed I can only remember two occasions we've been in Europe and both have been disappointingly short! It could be another decade before we qualify again so I'd like to have seen us give it a real shot and there as some big clubs in the group stage so we could have had a couple of really big games to enjoy. If it was a club decision to bottle it that would at least explain the shambles last night as we were an utter shower, the tactics, team and lack of passion were all frightening if that is the real game plan for this season.

[Convict Colony]

Calling this a blessing in disguise is giving us an excuse for failure.

[Saint Billy]

What with the loss of Clyne and Morgan, injuries/sickness, difficulties getting in a CB, perhaps the powers that be decided that advancing in the competition was a lost cause and was detrimental to improving our league form. That's the only reason I can come up with why that side was fielded last night.

 

I'm Clutching at straws !

[Special K]

We've ben on an upward curve for a consistent 5 years, so to discover we have plateaued, or even regressed a little is a bitter disappointment. This cam in the form of last nights result. The next challenge is to garner some momentum again and get a plan for the season ahead. It may not be so bad considering where we are, but it still grates considering what could have been.

[mrfahaji]

Overall am gutted not to have made it through, but had we been playing really well and looking similar to how we did in patches last season, then I would be especially down about it. Given how our team is performing at the moment, that disappointment is tinged with a "well maybe it's for the best" feeling.

 

Europa league run and a mid-to-lower-half finish = worth it

Europa league run and relegation (or even relegation scrap) = not worth it

[merrimd]

The problem as I see it is that we, like west ham, qualified through the back door. Having to qualify for the league stages has clearly put way to much strain on our squad so early in the season. Starting our campaign so early has meant less time on the training field to integrate the new players with the added problem of not having full weeks in between matches to sort out any problems. Had we qualified directly to the group stages, we would have only played 3 games so far this season and had considerably more time knitting the team together. We have to accept Europa League qualification is our main aim for the season, but we only want it if we can qualify directly.

[melmacian_saint]

If someone can tell me how the EL damaged Swansea's, Fulham's, Stoke's or Middlesborugh's usual mid-table nothingness routine it would be lovely.

 

Dumping competitions is not a sign of pragmatism, it's a sign of the mediocrity that has taken over English football: A strong league where 75% of the clubs don't mean much to anyone and effectively work as cash cow franchises.

 

And I insist, Hull were knocked out by some Belgian minnows- how did that improve their season?

[Saint86]

I do not believe for a second the club/manager preferred this option.

Les has talked up european football as our 'next step' and all that. Even talked up champions league dream (wish the club really wouldnt)

 

however, this summer has been a poor one for the club in the market and it is showing

also, I think RK is lost it a bit.

Walked on water last season, looked rather odd this (so far)

 

now that we are out, given the utterly weird place the team is at, probably not a disaster that we do not have the extra 6 games and the travelling etc to go with it

after all, RK has said a few times that this game in Denmark brings up our 7th games of the season already and we have little/no recovery time between games and little time to prepare for the next.

 

If you believe a single word Les Reed says then you are being taken for a ride.

 

His word is worth less than the ground he stands on or the air he farts.

 

The man needs to get the hell out of our club asap. Have hated him since last summer, was happy to enjoy the ride that Koeman gave us and accept that Les Reed got very lucky with how that appointment panned out. But how the hell can you cock up signing Toby when the only reason he joined saints in the first place was for Koeman, and Koeman was in regular text and phone communication with him, even came out and said we would sign him...

 

Then les Reed comes out with more PR BS to cover his backside, the simple truth is, Les Reed once again cocked it up.

 

The man has systematically shredded and removed every ounce of Cortese's team, with the club even leaking that Fonte could be for sale this summer. He got very very lucky with Koeman in that he bought in players like Tadic, Pelle, Mane and Toby. The black box did feck all in those signings, although long has turned out okay/average.

 

And what has been going on with the backroom staff under Les' watch>? Physio's, coaches, scouts... wtf is he doing? All the players said ambition had gone last summer, all would have stayed under cortese. The staff have been leaving, the first team squad has been replaced with less and less quality and a bunch of strangers.... and all I have been saying since january has where has the money gone? Net transfer profits for the last 2 seasons, massive tv monies from sky, and one of the lowest wage structures in the division throughout our time here.

 

All you have had since he got the power is a one sided barrage of PR.... against this you have your eyes...

 

"No Players will be sold" - season ticket deadline passes, then that afternoon lambert gone... followed by half the first team... and repeated promises that none would be sold.

Cork's contract, Clynes contract, letting Wanyama's run out, not renewing Koeman at the start of this summer, completely fecking up Toby and I'm sorry, but we did completley feck up toby and the only argument against that is Les' word, which as discussed is worth very little.

 

What about are kiddos? Uncles Les believes in them and wants to bring them through and have 50% of the first team consisting of academy players.... Doesn't believe in loans he says... And yet, where are they Les? On loan, sold, or having their first team opportunities blocked. People act like we are too higher level to use them now. Feck off, we did almost as well under poch, with a smaller squad, and with the kids at a younger age.

 

That man sells the team every summer and puts the money where? And he got away with it last year, trading on the back of cortese's momentum and still having a smattering of the first team with Koeman making some astute buys. But he has completed his hatchet job this summer. I don't care how we finish, I will never support an ownership model that involves selling the fan's favourite players and the clubs soul every single summer, whilst the board happily spout any PR BS they want.

[alpine_saint]

If you believe a single word Les Reed says then you are being taken for a ride.

 

His word is worth less than the ground he stands on or the air he farts.

 

The man needs to get the hell out of our club asap. Have hated him since last summer, was happy to enjoy the ride that Koeman gave us and accept that Les Reed got very lucky with how that appointment panned out. But how the hell can you cock up signing Toby when the only reason he joined saints in the first place was for Koeman, and Koeman was in regular text and phone communication with him, even came out and said we would sign him...

 

Then les Reed comes out with more PR BS to cover his backside, the simple truth is, Les Reed once again cocked it up.

 

The man has systematically shredded and removed every ounce of Cortese's team, with the club even leaking that Fonte could be for sale this summer. He got very very lucky with Koeman in that he bought in players like Tadic, Pelle, Mane and Toby. The black box did feck all in those signings, although long has turned out okay/average.

 

And what has been going on with the backroom staff under Les' watch>? Physio's, coaches, scouts... wtf is he doing? All the players said ambition had gone last summer, all would have stayed under cortese. The staff have been leaving, the first team squad has been replaced with less and less quality and a bunch of strangers.... and all I have been saying since january has where has the money gone? Net transfer profits for the last 2 seasons, massive tv monies from sky, and one of the lowest wage structures in the division throughout our time here.

 

All you have had since he got the power is a one sided barrage of PR.... against this you have your eyes...

 

"No Players will be sold" - season ticket deadline passes, then that afternoon lambert gone... followed by half the first team... and repeated promises that none would be sold.

Cork's contract, Clynes contract, letting Wanyama's run out, not renewing Koeman at the start of this summer, completely fecking up Toby and I'm sorry, but we did completley feck up toby and the only argument against that is Les' word, which as discussed is worth very little.

 

What about are kiddos? Uncles Les believes in them and wants to bring them through and have 50% of the first team consisting of academy players.... Doesn't believe in loans he says... And yet, where are they Les? On loan, sold, or having their first team opportunities blocked. People act like we are too higher level to use them now. Feck off, we did almost as well under poch, with a smaller squad, and with the kids at a younger age.

 

That man sells the team every summer and puts the money where? And he got away with it last year, trading on the back of cortese's momentum and still having a smattering of the first team with Koeman making some astute buys. But he has completed his hatchet job this summer. I don't care how we finish, I will never support an ownership model that involves selling the fan's favourite players and the clubs soul every single summer, whilst the board happily spout any PR BS they want.

 

Great post. Completely agree. I think its possible that Koemans team and tactics last night were a deliberate ploy to send Uncle Les (and maybe us) a message. I dont see otherwise how we could have performed so badly.

[East Kent Saint]

As with Everton Euro was a completely disasterous way to start a Prem season for Saints , so back to the Prem and after 10 matches we will see where the season is going !

[Daft Kerplunk]

If you believe a single word Les Reed says then you are being taken for a ride.

 

His word is worth less than the ground he stands on or the air he farts.

 

The man needs to get the hell out of our club asap. Have hated him since last summer, was happy to enjoy the ride that Koeman gave us and accept that Les Reed got very lucky with how that appointment panned out. But how the hell can you cock up signing Toby when the only reason he joined saints in the first place was for Koeman, and Koeman was in regular text and phone communication with him, even came out and said we would sign him...

 

Then les Reed comes out with more PR BS to cover his backside, the simple truth is, Les Reed once again cocked it up.

 

The man has systematically shredded and removed every ounce of Cortese's team, with the club even leaking that Fonte could be for sale this summer. He got very very lucky with Koeman in that he bought in players like Tadic, Pelle, Mane and Toby. The black box did feck all in those signings, although long has turned out okay/average.

 

And what has been going on with the backroom staff under Les' watch>? Physio's, coaches, scouts... wtf is he doing? All the players said ambition had gone last summer, all would have stayed under cortese. The staff have been leaving, the first team squad has been replaced with less and less quality and a bunch of strangers.... and all I have been saying since january has where has the money gone? Net transfer profits for the last 2 seasons, massive tv monies from sky, and one of the lowest wage structures in the division throughout our time here.

 

All you have had since he got the power is a one sided barrage of PR.... against this you have your eyes...

 

"No Players will be sold" - season ticket deadline passes, then that afternoon lambert gone... followed by half the first team... and repeated promises that none would be sold.

Cork's contract, Clynes contract, letting Wanyama's run out, not renewing Koeman at the start of this summer, completely fecking up Toby and I'm sorry, but we did completley feck up toby and the only argument against that is Les' word, which as discussed is worth very little.

 

What about are kiddos? Uncles Les believes in them and wants to bring them through and have 50% of the first team consisting of academy players.... Doesn't believe in loans he says... And yet, where are they Les? On loan, sold, or having their first team opportunities blocked. People act like we are too higher level to use them now. Feck off, we did almost as well under poch, with a smaller squad, and with the kids at a younger age.

 

That man sells the team every summer and puts the money where? And he got away with it last year, trading on the back of cortese's momentum and still having a smattering of the first team with Koeman making some astute buys. But he has completed his hatchet job this summer. I don't care how we finish, I will never support an ownership model that involves selling the fan's favourite players and the clubs soul every single summer, whilst the board happily spout any PR BS they want.

 

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