How do you make a quality player stay at Saints!

[SaintTex]

[Cohen]

Massive release clause and five year contracts and stay strong when teams come in,at the moment we seem to be a shop window to with bigger clubs and a bit of a soft touch

[Saint-Armstrong]

Lewis Grabban does a runner from the Norwich team hotel and gets a train south to force through a move to Bournemouth after a third bid was turned down by the Canaries.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3210635/Norwich-striker-Lewis-Grabban-goes-AWOL-team-hotel-Capital-One-Cup-snub-bid-force-Bournemouth-return.html

 

 

 

Madness...

[Matthew Le God]

Massive release clause

 

That doesn't stop players leaving.

 

and five year contracts

 

Players have to agree to the contracts, plus once a player is down to 1 or 2 years left the problem arises regardless if a top club wants him.

 

and stay strong when teams come in

 

They did with Schneiderlin last summer and they weren't accepting the first offers for the other players.

 

at the moment we seem to be a shop window to with bigger clubs and a bit of a soft touch

 

Although they've been sold, Saints have received huge amounts of money, so they are hardly a soft touch.

[Cohen]

As a fan I am not interested how much they are sold for,I pay to watch the best team we can afford and not accepting first offers is not staying strong it's just to get more money.I do agree with what you are saying but if you don't pay big wages contracts are the only way to force players to stay but very much not ideal

[Lallana's Left Peg]

Location is definitely a factor when signing a player. There are countless examples of it mattering.

[Matthew Le God]

Location is definitely a factor when signing a player.

 

Who said it wasn't?

[Lallana's Left Peg]

Who said it wasn't?

 

Let me rephrase it then - I think it is a significant factor that is only overcome through money.

[CB Fry]

They sign for us with the expectation that they'll catch the eye of a big club. It's like asking how can you keep the passengers on a train when it reaches it's destination!

It's a brilliant reason for players to sign. Anyone thinking Clasie, Mane and Co haven't considered this is nuts.

 

If Mane ends up at Manchester United next year it's because he's been brilliant for us. Ditto Clasie in two years time.

[SaffaSaint]

We have to remeber by developing and selling overpriced english and pl experienced players we are probably ahead of where a club of our size could expect to be.

 

Sent from my GT-S5301 using Tapatalk

[Saint Without a Halo]

It's bloody obvious, you don't.

 

We can through as much money as we like at the problem, but we aren't Man Utd, Liverpool. Barca, Real Madrid etc etc. These clubs have worldwide pedigree. Not only can they pay the wages, but people still want to play for them.

 

In the last two years, name a player we could have kept by throwing more cash at them.

Lovren - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lallana - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lambert - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature & hometown club)

Shaw - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and we got f**k loads of cash for him

Morgan - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and play Champions League football and we couldn't deny him

Chambers - F**k knows, but we did well out of that deal to be honest

Clyne - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Toby - The club messed that transfer up and Spurs took advantage, so not appropriate

 

Until we start winning trophies, European trophies and have a worldwide appeal, we'll always be little old Southampton - it's how I grew up knowing my club, it's actually what I still like about our club. I don't want a team full of money-driven mercenaries. I want more young players breaking through along with the odd Jimmy Case or Alan Ball to help them. We may keep the odd loyal one, but if making them and selling them keeps me my football club in good health, enabling me, my children and grandkids to watch for generations, then fair enough.

 

All I ask of the club is the odd trophy occasionally with some European adventures.

 

Spot on and the fact we are known to allow young players to prove themselves when they would never get a first team place at a top club means we can get the Clynes, Wanyamas and Manes to join ius as see us as an essential career stepping stone and we get up to three years of their services. This is not a bad model for a club like ours and helps attracxt young talent rather than burned out talent it is both cheaper and more exciting

[ecuk268]

Massive release clause and five year contracts and stay strong when teams come in,at the moment we seem to be a shop window to with bigger clubs and a bit of a soft touch

 

It'll be interesting to see how "strong" Everton are now that Stones has handed in a transfer request.

[Saint Without a Halo]

Massive release clause and five year contracts and stay strong when teams come in,at the moment we seem to be a shop window to with bigger clubs and a bit of a soft touch

 

Talented youngsters will very rarely sign five year contracts and these are also a risk to us if the player fails to succeed and can cost lots of money (look at Osvaldo Gaston etc) if we deny players a move and stand in their way other good players will be wary of signing for us too. Older players nearing the end of their career will sign five year contracts but do we really want them in the team when their money is based on a deteriorating performance as they get older. Better to get ambitious younger unproven players on cheaper contracts whose standard improves ahead of their cost and then sell them off for a profit this is a much more sustainable plan and yes it has its risks in identifying good talent but is the best strategy for a club of our current size and finance.

 

Maybe it is because we allow players to develop their careers here that we get the good ones other teams later want in the first place?

[doddisalegend]

Any idea's?

 

Also, is it possible to compete in this league with players that are not sought after?

 

Well it's not really a problem. Having read through the forum the last few weeks it's clear that all our players are, frankly, pants..............or so I'm told

[Cohen]

Yes totally agree,the post asks how we keep players and I am not sure we can.I believe we are attracting better players because they get a top six move if they do well with us but this will put us in a position where we will either be rebuilding or not succeeding

[tajjuk]

You can't and despite what these players say which is largely BS IMO, the only one who I think was genuine is Lambert the rest have gone for cash pure and simple.

 

yeh you can talk rubbish about big clubs and history blah blah blah but the likes of Spurs and Liverpool are not champions league, haven't won anything for a while, nor are they looking likely any time soon, but they flash the cash that we simple can't pay that much, our max is around 50 - 60k I reckon which is what we have probably offered all these players to keep them, whereas the likes of Liverpool and Spurs are offering players £100k a week plus.

 

Until we have a spending cap and a wages cap like say the MLS it will continue to happen. If European football got that it would be the best thing to happen to all the top leagues IMO.

[Mosin]

It's bloody obvious, you don't.

 

We can through as much money as we like at the problem, but we aren't Man Utd, Liverpool. Barca, Real Madrid etc etc. These clubs have worldwide pedigree. Not only can they pay the wages, but people still want to play for them.

 

In the last two years, name a player we could have kept by throwing more cash at them.

Lovren - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lallana - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lambert - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature & hometown club)

Shaw - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and we got f**k loads of cash for him

Morgan - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and play Champions League football and we couldn't deny him

Chambers - F**k knows, but we did well out of that deal to be honest

Clyne - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Toby - The club messed that transfer up and Spurs took advantage, so not appropriate

 

Until we start winning trophies, European trophies and have a worldwide appeal, we'll always be little old Southampton - it's how I grew up knowing my club, it's actually what I still like about our club. I don't want a team full of money-driven mercenaries. I want more young players breaking through along with the odd Jimmy Case or Alan Ball to help them. We may keep the odd loyal one, but if making them and selling them keeps me my football club in good health, enabling me, my children and grandkids to watch for generations, then fair enough.

 

All I ask of the club is the odd trophy occasionally with some European adventures.

 

 

I dont agree with this at all, Chelsea and City where no world wide brand when they started signing who ever they wanted, and if for one min your trying to say that money is not a BIG factor then i think you need to think about it more, Lallana is on more at Liverpool than he was at Saints, Lovren is too, Lambert was too...... Clyne earns loads more too, Toby likes the quite life and the country side and his partner loves it, how much is in London that she can go on horse rides round? but yet he now lives n plays in London , Shaw pure money in every way ( Even Chelsea told him to do one......... ), Chambers again money........ out of every player that has left saints every single one got quite a huge pay rise for leaving Saints........ no two ways about it as it is fact, Name me one who took a wage cut to leave Saints. players are told what to say when they sign for a new club, they are hardly going to come out with " well United offered me 200 k a week but such and such only offered me this " cause if they really did say the truth then the footballing world would soon lose its bubble and fans would soon stop watching.

 

If we did a city / Chelsea and Kat started pumping huge sums of cash into the club we WOULD keep the best players and add top players too, but as i said earlier, Kat is not as committed to the club as other owners are, am not taking nothing away from her dad as i believe if he was still with us he would as he loved the club and had huge ambitions for the club and wanted it to challenge for honors, i just dont feel Kat shares the same love and affection he did.

[Whitey Grandad]

I dont agree with this at all, Chelsea and City where no world wide brand when they started signing who ever they wanted, and if for one min your trying to say that money is not a BIG factor then i think you need to think about it more, Lallana is on more at Liverpool than he was at Saints, Lovren is too, Lambert was too...... Clyne earns loads more too, Toby likes the quite life and the country side and his partner loves it, how much is in London that she can go on horse rides round? but yet he now lives n plays in London , Shaw pure money in every way ( Even Chelsea told him to do one......... ), Chambers again money........ out of every player that has left saints every single one got quite a huge pay rise for leaving Saints........ no two ways about it as it is fact, Name me one who took a wage cut to leave Saints. players are told what to say when they sign for a new club, they are hardly going to come out with " well United offered me 200 k a week but such and such only offered me this " cause if they really did say the truth then the footballing world would soon lose its bubble and fans would soon stop watching.

 

If we did a city / Chelsea and Kat started pumping huge sums of cash into the club we WOULD keep the best players and add top players too, but as i said earlier, Kat is not as committed to the club as other owners are, am not taking nothing away from her dad as i believe if he was still with us he would as he loved the club and had huge ambitions for the club and wanted it to challenge for honors, i just dont feel Kat shares the same love and affection he did.

 

Have you forgotten FFP?

[Redslo]

Any idea's?

 

Also, is it possible to compete in this league with players that are not sought after?

 

Well, we have to look at other teams and how they keep their players.

 

West Ham, Everton - pay big.

 

Stoke might be a better team to compare ourselves to, or Crystal Palace/Swansea.

 

Aston Villa seem to have sold their best 2 players, a bit like us.

 

Spurs is an interesting club in how they manage. They hardly ever offer CL but seemingly people want to go there because it is a big club. Presume they mean they pay well.

 

A Chelsea/Man City/PSG style takeover.

 

Although very rich, Liebherr isn't running the club in that way. But we have still risen from 68th to 7th in English football between 2009 and 2015. So the Liebherr's can hardly be knocked for what they've done.

 

 

 

If Saints didn't have players the top clubs wanted then that is the time to worry, as it would indicate the quality of our squad has declined from the level of the last two seasons.

 

FFP would limit the effectiveness of a big money takeover. And it doesn't look like we are losing players to spurs on money. (It appears that we were willing to pay Toby enough money, he just chose Spurs.) Likely, living in London has its attractions. But I am not an expert on that, all of England is too cold for me.

 

Everton does not pay that much more than we do and it is not clear that they will be able to continue outpaying us at all. Everton has shown a willingness to sign a big expensive player when we have not but I am not sure that demonstrates that they are better able to retain players. Lukaku may view playing for a bigger club in the same way we hope Bertrand does--been there, done that, rather player first team football.

 

Buy them from a Top 4 PL club (we'll see if it works for Bertrand and Romeu).

 

Exactly. Although, to the extent the top four club evaluates talent correctly, this means we can not catch them. But that is probably true anyway.

 

Pay lots, qualify for europe every season, win some trophies, and above all, invest billions making Southampton a far more attractive city.

 

Why not just build a high speed rail line from Southampton to London so the trip takes less than a half hour?

 

Perhaps we should employ a hot physio like Chelsea?

 

She is actually the doctor. Or maybe I was being sexist in my assumptions and you were referring to the physio, Jon Fearne. My apologies.

 

You tell Schneiderlin he can't leave. Was that the punchline you were after?

 

It is possible to compete with players that aren't sought after, but they're not the ones who leave when you do well.

 

So basically, we can't compete with sides with massive income and probably shouldn't try to unless FFP changes so it doesn't just favour the top 4, and someone decides to spend a few billion.

 

But that really only works for one season. Eventually, if a player won't sign a new contract, you are going to lose him.

 

FFP changes sound like a good idea, but they only hold us back if our owner is willing to invest hundreds of millions. Clearly, she is not.

 

Quite right, there's no example of players preferring to live in London right?

 

Ive supported saints 25 years, but if I were a premier league player, I'd rather be playing for a London club, or move abroad. Yes you can commute but who the hell wants to do that when they don't have to?

 

you have all that money and a very average city to spend it in. It's a huge long term limiting factor and the main reason Spurs are bigger than us IMO

 

I don't disagree, but London's population is an advantage too. There are more people to buy tickets and other stuff and the richer ones are willing to pay higher prices for tickets and stuff so ipsy doopsy there is more money to put into the club.

 

get them to marry a local bird, who has them under the thumb and wont move away from her family

 

This may be the only realistic idea anyone has suggested. But I am at a loss as to how to make an actually club strategy out of it.

[Redslo]

My prior response exceeded the character limit so I continue it here:

 

Stop trying to do things on the cheap. Pay the same money that our rivals seem prepared to pay and bring in quality players that will show our intent to progress. There's surely nothing worse than seeing your team mates leaving and being replaced by mediocrity. That's probably half the problem with Vic. He sees who's gone and looks and who's come in and thinks 'WTF'. How is this progression?

 

You do understand that FFP limits the clubs ability to just throw money at the situation even if Liebherr was willing to do that? I don't think Wanyama is looking at the new players who have come in and concluding their are mediocre compared to those who left. It clearly wasn't the case last year and (despite three bad games to start the season) is probably not the case this year. Also, I doubt Wanyama is an big expert at judging talent.

 

this seems to me to be the only way.

 

I keep reading on here that we can't compete, because we can't pay £100k a week wages, but why not? We may not be able to pay the £250k a week like united, or £100k a week to all the players, but why not £120k a week to the likes of Morgan, Lallana, Clyne and Shaw? Perhaps if we hadn't wasted god knows how many millions on Osvaldo etc. the money might have been there to do exactly that?

 

We could certainly pay one or two players that much, but then everyone else would want something similar or they would leave. As for the money wasted on Osvaldo, I agree, but the problem is knowing in advance what transfers will turn out to be a waste of money. Ramirez didn't work out either but he was viewed as one of the best young prospects in the world when we signed him.

 

If paying £6.25m a year in wages to several players was that straightforward why aren't more clubs our size doing it?

 

The simple answer is "they were" (albeit in times when wages were lower) and that is why clubs like Portsmouth (and probably us) had financial troubles and why FFP was created.

 

No, they've done magnificent and I don't think there is one person who can knock them for what they've done.

 

That aside, if we do, as a club, have any intention of "breaking the glass ceiling" (Les Reed's words, not mine), then we cannot continue to turn over the number of quality players year in, year out. You mention the Liebherr's don't run the club in that way, fair enough, but Kenwright, with significantly less resources at Everton, hasn't sold off their coveted players in bulk floggings.

 

I think the main thing people are concerned about - and the fans aren't stupid - is that sure, clubs can want our players but are we

 

(a) doing enough to keep them here in the first place (If it's money, can we do more - most people cite that it's money that is the allure, the glamour of playing for a big club, personally, I think it's a mesh of both)

(b) investing enough in their replacements. We did the previous close season after huge outcry, but we've tried to go under the radar and do it cheaply this time. We, as fans and the players currently in the squad aren't stupid - some of them from last year's successful campaign must be thinking "Where is the club going exactly?" and you can't blame them, either.

 

I hope we aren't selling the club to prospective players as a "stepping stone" to greater riches. Sure, we'll always have our place in the food chain but it's f()cking agonising to watch the squad, year after year, be torn apart because we possibly aren't doing as much as we could to keep those players - and putting our owners wealth aside, this is also despite all the new Premier League riches we have.

 

So, is it a fair question to ask "Where are Southampton FC going?" then I believe yes, yes it is. Whether you'll get an honest, sincere and frank answer from Ralph or Les or just a fan-friendly soundbite prior to season ticket renewals is another thing altogether.

 

Your questions are valid but hard to answer from the inside. To take an example, last year it was revealed after the transfer window closed that the club sold Chambers because they viewed Clyne as the better choice and were happy to take the money rather than have an unhappy Chambers sitting on the bench. The problem with this approach is that one year later we have lost Clyne as well. I would have offered Clyne a new contract with a big raise before selling Chambers. Why didn't that happen? Or did it and Clyne refused? We outsiders can't know, but that is the question I am most curious about with respect to the last year's plus transfer activities.

 

On the other hand, I think we have to be realistic about what we tell players. If Mane was sold on coming here by being told that if he plays well for two years we will be selling him at a big profit to a big club, there is nothing wrong with that as opposed to telling him that if he did well we would refuse to sell him even if Barcelona came calling. If we get a reputation for not letting players move up, we will have trouble recruiting good prospects. On the other hand, if we let them know clearly in advance that we expect two (or three) good years out of them before we will sell then it is a win win situation. (Unless the player turns out to be no good.)

 

It's bloody obvious, you don't.

 

We can through as much money as we like at the problem, but we aren't Man Utd, Liverpool. Barca, Real Madrid etc etc. These clubs have worldwide pedigree. Not only can they pay the wages, but people still want to play for them.

 

In the last two years, name a player we could have kept by throwing more cash at them.

Lovren - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lallana - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Lambert - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature & hometown club)

Shaw - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and we got f**k loads of cash for him

Morgan - Wanted to play for the biggest club in the world and play Champions League football and we couldn't deny him

Chambers - F**k knows, but we did well out of that deal to be honest

Clyne - Wanted to play for Liverpool (worldwide stature)

Toby - The club messed that transfer up and Spurs took advantage, so not appropriate

 

Until we start winning trophies, European trophies and have a worldwide appeal, we'll always be little old Southampton - it's how I grew up knowing my club, it's actually what I still like about our club. I don't want a team full of money-driven mercenaries. I want more young players breaking through along with the odd Jimmy Case or Alan Ball to help them. We may keep the odd loyal one, but if making them and selling them keeps me my football club in good health, enabling me, my children and grandkids to watch for generations, then fair enough.

 

All I ask of the club is the odd trophy occasionally with some European adventures.

 

I think it could be fairly said that the last trophy we won was an odd one.

You can't and despite what these players say which is largely BS IMO, the only one who I think was genuine is Lambert the rest have gone for cash pure and simple.

 

yeh you can talk rubbish about big clubs and history blah blah blah but the likes of Spurs and Liverpool are not champions league, haven't won anything for a while, nor are they looking likely any time soon, but they flash the cash that we simple can't pay that much, our max is around 50 - 60k I reckon which is what we have probably offered all these players to keep them, whereas the likes of Liverpool and Spurs are offering players £100k a week plus.

 

Until we have a spending cap and a wages cap like say the MLS it will continue to happen. If European football got that it would be the best thing to happen to all the top leagues IMO.

 

The MLS salary cap seems to be breaking down somewhat with the increasing number of designated players. But more relevantly, a real salary cap is inconsistent with a relegation based league structure especially with European competition. The only way Football is getting a salary cap is if the big clubs throughout Europe break off into a superleague and impose revenue sharing for that league. That might be fun to watch, but Southampton is not likely to be invited into the superleague.

 

Have you forgotten FFP?

 

Everyone forgets FFP when these discussion start.

Edited 26 August, 2015 by Redslo

[andoru]

1. Buy disaffected squad fillers from the so-called big clubs who want to get their careers back on track. They'll be less inclined to leave, and can also act as an example to other players thinking of moving on. Koeman needs to have Bertrand and Romeu sit down with every one of our players and drum it into them how much it sucks not even getting on the bench at Chelsea.

 

2. Don't be afraid to damage a few egos. A lot of players move to big clubs because they believe they are good enough to go straight into the first team. When they arrive they are shocked to find it's not that simple, and they sit on the bench. In addition to point 1 then, we need someone prepared to bring a few players down to size, and not let them believe their own hype.

 

3. From the day a player arrives, indoctrinate them with the following message: If Lallana was Champions League quality, and Clyne was, and Morgan, and Lovren, and Toby, and Shaw, and Chambers, and Walcott, and Bale, and Chamberlain, and now Mane and Wanyama are all supposedly good enough to step up, doesn't that mean that together they'd have made a Champions League quality team? Sometimes staying put and being patient brings the rewards, and not chasing a short cut solution.

[CB Fry]

I dont agree with this at all, Chelsea and City where no world wide brand when they started signing who ever they wanted, and if for one min your trying to say that money is not a BIG factor then i think you need to think about it more, Lallana is on more at Liverpool than he was at Saints, Lovren is too, Lambert was too...... Clyne earns loads more too, Toby likes the quite life and the country side and his partner loves it, how much is in London that she can go on horse rides round? but yet he now lives n plays in London , Shaw pure money in every way ( Even Chelsea told him to do one......... ), Chambers again money........ out of every player that has left saints every single one got quite a huge pay rise for leaving Saints........ no two ways about it as it is fact, Name me one who took a wage cut to leave Saints. players are told what to say when they sign for a new club, they are hardly going to come out with " well United offered me 200 k a week but such and such only offered me this " cause if they really did say the truth then the footballing world would soon lose its bubble and fans would soon stop watching.

 

If we did a city / Chelsea and Kat started pumping huge sums of cash into the club we WOULD keep the best players and add top players too, but as i said earlier, Kat is not as committed to the club as other owners are, am not taking nothing away from her dad as i believe if he was still with us he would as he loved the club and had huge ambitions for the club and wanted it to challenge for honors, i just dont feel Kat shares the same love and affection he did.

 

Markus Leibherr would not have been pumping money in to turn us into a Chelsea/Man City.

 

Really strange to see someone equate "love and affection for the club" with a desire to "pump huge sums of cash" into it to pi ss away on fees and wages.

 

I am delighted we don't do that, and delighted we never will under our current ownership.

[trousers]

The answer is staring us in the face...

 

Katharina should set up an underpants folding company (a company that folds underpants).

 

Each player we sign also gets employed by the underpants folding company. The general public send in their disheveled underpants and each 'employee' spends 1 hour a year folding underpants for which they get paid £5million.

 

Given the underpants folding business has nothing to do with football, it is outside the governance of the FFP rules ergo we end up with players who are as wealthy as players at the 'big 6' clubs. They just happen to earn half their wages from a non-football industry.

 

And who hasn't got disheveled underpants? There's certainly a demand for this service out there. Its a win win for the players and the general public at large.

Edited 26 August, 2015 by trousers

[Saint Billy]

The answer is staring us in the face...

 

Katrina should set up an underpants folding company (a company that folds underpants).

 

Each player we sign also gets employed by the underpants folding company. The general public send in their disheveled underpants and each 'employee' spends 1 hour a year folding underpants for which they get paid £5million.

 

Given the underpants folding business has nothing to do with football, it is outside the governance of the FFP rules ergo we end up with players who are as wealthy as players at the 'big 6' clubs. They just happen to earn half their wages from a non-football industry.

 

And who hasn't got disheveled underpants? There's certainly a demand for this service out there. Its a win win for the players and the general public at large.

 

What a pants job!

[hutch]

Do they have to be clean? Your business plan was vague on that issue.

[Saintsteve7]

I read the other day that City have spent close to £1 billion getting to where they are now, that's ludicrous and the exact reason FFP was bought in. Same with Chelsea, if Roman suddenly ended up arrested with his assets frozen (not out of the quart tin with the Russians) Chelsea would be screwed!

I'm happy with the way we run our club, it's the most likely way to be around in 50 years time.

[Lallana's Left Peg]

I read the other day that City have spent close to £1 billion getting to where they are now, that's ludicrous and the exact reason FFP was bought in. Same with Chelsea, if Roman suddenly ended up arrested with his assets frozen (not out of the quart tin with the Russians) Chelsea would be screwed!

I'm happy with the way we run our club, it's the most likely way to be around in 50 years time.

 

FFP was not brought in to stop investment in football. It was brought in to stop clubs spending money they don't have and stop clubs being screwed if their wealthy owners leave them. Unfortunately the existing FFP rules also do a brilliant job of maintaining the status quo in football which needs to be looked at.

 

Personally I don't have an issue with 'sugar daddy' owners as long as their investment is safeguarded and they can't just walk away from the club and leave it in a bad state. The current rules make the assumption that as long as the owner doesn't have a criminal record he won't do that, which is pathetic.

[Saintsteve7]

My point is that Man City managed to that just before the gate was bolted shut! It would now be impossible for that to happen again with incurring fines and deductions etc. therefore it's almost become pointless for a sugar daddy to buy a club and pump in billions.

[ally_uk]

You can't Wanyama and Mane will be off next summer and the rebuild will happen again all over

[aintforever]

Lewis Grabban does a runner from the Norwich team hotel and gets a train south to force through a move to Bournemouth after a third bid was turned down by the Canaries.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-3210635/Norwich-striker-Lewis-Grabban-goes-AWOL-team-hotel-Capital-One-Cup-snub-bid-force-Bournemouth-return.html

 

 

 

Madness...

 

Makes sense, Bournemouth has nice beaches, is near the New Forest and has a nice selection of bars. I expect their next target is Aguero who can't be happy with the weather in Manchester.

[Saint Without a Halo]

I dont agree with this at all, Chelsea and City where no world wide brand when they started signing who ever they wanted, and if for one min your trying to say that money is not a BIG factor then i think you need to think about it more, Lallana is on more at Liverpool than he was at Saints, Lovren is too, Lambert was too...... Clyne earns loads more too, Toby likes the quite life and the country side and his partner loves it, how much is in London that she can go on horse rides round? but yet he now lives n plays in London , Shaw pure money in every way ( Even Chelsea told him to do one......... ), Chambers again money........ out of every player that has left saints every single one got quite a huge pay rise for leaving Saints........ no two ways about it as it is fact, Name me one who took a wage cut to leave Saints. players are told what to say when they sign for a new club, they are hardly going to come out with " well United offered me 200 k a week but such and such only offered me this " cause if they really did say the truth then the footballing world would soon lose its bubble and fans would soon stop watching.

 

If we did a city / Chelsea and Kat started pumping huge sums of cash into the club we WOULD keep the best players and add top players too, but as i said earlier, Kat is not as committed to the club as other owners are, am not taking nothing away from her dad as i believe if he was still with us he would as he loved the club and had huge ambitions for the club and wanted it to challenge for honors, i just dont feel Kat shares the same love and affection he did.

 

 

Just what Pompey did?

[Saint Without a Halo]

Markus Leibherr would not have been pumping money in to turn us into a Chelsea/Man City.

 

Really strange to see someone equate "love and affection for the club" with a desire to "pump huge sums of cash" into it to pi ss away on fees and wages.

 

I am delighted we don't do that, and delighted we never will under our current ownership.

 

Agree totally how many of us who have great love and affection for the club would plough our families money into it in full? If that's the basis of measuring affection we would have virtually no fans

[JonnyOldBoy]

you don't make anyone stay anywhere. You try your best to sign players who will respect the contract norms and want to play for us for 3-4 seasons. its really as simple as that.... if a few shallow money grabbers like Clyne are in-and-out more quickly then that matters not if we have overall stability. I think at the moment the balance is right... just.

[pimpin4rizeal]

I think we could start by pushing for more extortionate prices for our players when a club does try to take them,

Take the approach of if you want em pay up or F off.

If you look at what Liverpool received for Stirling when they where not in a strong bargaining position, what Everton want for stones or to be extreme what Tottenham got for bale, I can't help thinking if any of those transfers was ours we would have caved in for 20-30 million and then heard the usual player wanted to go stuff spouted on here.

[Lallana's Left Peg]

I think we could start by pushing for more extortionate prices for our players when a club does try to take them,

Take the approach of if you want em pay up or F off.

If you look at what Liverpool received for Stirling when they where not in a strong bargaining position, what Everton want for stones or to be extreme what Tottenham got for bale, I can't help thinking if any of those transfers was ours we would have caved in for 20-30 million and then heard the usual player wanted to go stuff spouted on here.

 

I think that is unfair - for a club of our size we get incredible fees for our players.

[pimpin4rizeal]

I think that is unfair - for a club of our size we get incredible fees for our players.

 

I think most of them where bordering on fair deals but not incredible. When you think we shell out between 10-15 million a lot of times on players who are completely unproven in the premiership, the fees we have recieved have been for players who have now proved they can do a fantastic job in the premiership making the price more fair imo

I think we got a good deal on shaw

Lallana not so much considering he was one of the best attacking midfielders in the league that season

Lovren was probably fair after the season he had for us and the fact we paid 8 million one season earlier,no hindsight included.

 

My point is other teams like spurs liverpool everton etc, will want a lot more before they roll over and get there bellies tickled

Stirlings season last year was far from vintage he had made it clear he didnt want to play for them ,yet liverpool stood strong didnt get screwed over by taking a silly fee and got a cracking deal.

Do you think we would have got held out for the ammounts stirling,bale and stones have gone for/going if they was on our books ?

[CB Fry]

I think most of them where bordering on fair deals but not incredible. When you think we shell out between 10-15 million a lot of times on players who are completely unproven in the premiership, the fees we have recieved have been for players who have now proved they can do a fantastic job in the premiership making the price more fair imo

I think we got a good deal on shaw

Lallana not so much considering he was one of the best attacking midfielders in the league that season

Lovren was probably fair after the season he had for us and the fact we paid 8 million one season earlier,no hindsight included.

 

My point is other teams like spurs liverpool everton etc, will want a lot more before they roll over and get there bellies tickled

Stirlings season last year was far from vintage he had made it clear he didnt want to play for them ,yet liverpool stood strong didnt get screwed over by taking a silly fee and got a cracking deal.

Do you think we would have got held out for the ammounts stirling,bale and stones have gone for/going if they was on our books ?

Sterling and Bale are better than anything we've sold and Liverpool and Spurs are bigger, richer clubs and were sold to even bigger, even richer clubs.

 

If Everton get £30m for Stones good luck them but it doesn't make the deal we did on Lallana a poor one. I wonder how many Liverpool fans think they mugged us? How about zero Liverpool fans.

[Mosin]

Just what Pompey did?

 

No Pompey took loans out they could not afford to pay, they did not have an owner that could fund the costs like we could and City and Chelsea.

 

"Agree totally how many of us who have great love and affection for the club would plough our families money into it in full? If that's the basis of measuring affection we would have virtually no fans "

 

Do you not think fans already do this buying shirts going round the UK to attend away games, buying a season ticket? ive been doing it for 30 years and do it instead of going on holidays every year, So yes i do spend all my spare cash on the club already.......... if i had a billion to spend i would more than likely put it into the club. it is not like it would be a bad investment, of course i wouldnt waste it i would spend it wisely and not be a complete retard and pay 100 million on a player, but i would be happy to hand a player an extra 20 - 30 k wages a week out of my pocket to keep them at the club to help the club achieve the ultimate goal of Champions League Football, once that is achieved then the club would self run after 2 - 3 years of competing in the Champions league just like Chelsea have managed and continue to make profit every year for the last 6 - 7 years after Romans initial investment the club now supports itself.

 

 

" Have you forgotten FFP? "

 

No, FFP rules ( Premiership FFP rules ) allow upto 105 million lose over the course of 3 years. with 50 million plus being boosted by a huge tv deal next year and a bigger payment the year after it would not be to hard to invest 100 million and balanced the books over the following 3 years, Also they are currently discussing changing the rules to allow owners to invest into the clubs they own cause PSG and City have threatened to take Uafa to The Court of Arbitration for Sport. Once Champions league football is achieved then it changes and loses must be kept under 45 million over 3 years, with Champions league bringing in a min of 27 million just for reaching group stages then this is not to hard to achieve either.

 

 

" Markus Leibherr would not have been pumping money in to turn us into a Chelsea/Man City.

 

Really strange to see someone equate "love and affection for the club" with a desire to "pump huge sums of cash" into it to pi ss away on fees and wages.

 

I am delighted we don't do that, and delighted we never will under our current ownership. "

 

Did we not do a Chelsea / City to get back into the Premiership? if i recall we did spend more than any other club in the championship in wages and transfers ( while we where in league 1 and failed to make a profit till we got into the premiership ) and again when we got into the championship, this spending only stopped once we made the prem and Nicola got replaced by Ralph, So i hope your still delighted now you have found out we brought are way back into the prem ( so in theory we did a City / Chelsea .. sorry if i made you feel sad )............... to say Marcus would not have continued to put money into the club to reach Champions league as he wanted is not right as it was his plan for the club when he brought it.

 

you see, although you argue my points and try to prove me wrong history tells a different story, the Spending of the club only changed once Kat decided she didnt want any more of " her " money being put into the club, was this why Nicola left? you have to ask your self this question, but as we all know, it is why he left, he was told that the club had to support its self to get to the champions league, as Kat would no longer put money into the club, then pochy and star players decided it was time to leave.

 

Please, in detail put down the out goings of player sales and incoming of player purchases, funds received from player sales are not allowed to be counted towards the wage bill, so dont come out with " some funds went towards paying players wages " ( as this is against FFP rules in its self. ) so that is stuck at 4 % rise a year - only commercial deals can allow a bigger rise than 4 % on wages which we have not done. have we spent more money on players coming in than we have received on out going players? plus the extra money we got from the tv deal this year? Stoke City have spent more money than us and pay more wages than us yet have less income than us ( when you take away money received from player sales ) so dont try tell me the ambition of the club is the same cause it is NOT, this is why players are leaving, they know this. take your rose tinted glasses off and stop licking arse........

[Mosin]

just for some additional information for Saint Without a Halo, if i had 1 billion in the bank ( a big if never going to happen but IF ) i would earn 120 - 130 k every single day, so i wouldnt be spending all my familys money by paying 20 - 30 k of a lets just say 10 players wages every week, i would still be making money sitting on my fat arse living of the interest

[Gemmel]

just for some additional information for Saint Without a Halo, if i had 1 billion in the bank ( a big if never going to happen but IF ) i would earn 120 - 130 k every single day, so i wouldnt be spending all my familys money by paying 20 - 30 k of a lets just say 10 players wages every week, i would still be making money sitting on my fat arse living of the interest

 

 

47.5 million a year on a billion pounds in the bank... Just off interest??. Are you sure?....hmmm at 4.7% I guess you are right.

Edited 27 August, 2015 by Gemmel

[CB Fry]

No Pompey took loans out they could not afford to pay, they did not have an owner that could fund the costs like we could and City and Chelsea.

 

"Agree totally how many of us who have great love and affection for the club would plough our families money into it in full? If that's the basis of measuring affection we would have virtually no fans "

 

Do you not think fans already do this buying shirts going round the UK to attend away games, buying a season ticket? ive been doing it for 30 years and do it instead of going on holidays every year, So yes i do spend all my spare cash on the club already.......... if i had a billion to spend i would more than likely put it into the club. it is not like it would be a bad investment, of course i wouldnt waste it i would spend it wisely and not be a complete retard and pay 100 million on a player, but i would be happy to hand a player an extra 20 - 30 k wages a week out of my pocket to keep them at the club to help the club achieve the ultimate goal of Champions League Football, once that is achieved then the club would self run after 2 - 3 years of competing in the Champions league just like Chelsea have managed and continue to make profit every year for the last 6 - 7 years after Romans initial investment the club now supports itself.

 

 

" Have you forgotten FFP? "

 

No, FFP rules ( Premiership FFP rules ) allow upto 105 million lose over the course of 3 years. with 50 million plus being boosted by a huge tv deal next year and a bigger payment the year after it would not be to hard to invest 100 million and balanced the books over the following 3 years, Also they are currently discussing changing the rules to allow owners to invest into the clubs they own cause PSG and City have threatened to take Uafa to The Court of Arbitration for Sport. Once Champions league football is achieved then it changes and loses must be kept under 45 million over 3 years, with Champions league bringing in a min of 27 million just for reaching group stages then this is not to hard to achieve either.

 

 

" Markus Leibherr would not have been pumping money in to turn us into a Chelsea/Man City.

 

Really strange to see someone equate "love and affection for the club" with a desire to "pump huge sums of cash" into it to pi ss away on fees and wages.

 

I am delighted we don't do that, and delighted we never will under our current ownership. "

 

Did we not do a Chelsea / City to get back into the Premiership? if i recall we did spend more than any other club in the championship in wages and transfers ( while we where in league 1 and failed to make a profit till we got into the premiership ) and again when we got into the championship, this spending only stopped once we made the prem and Nicola got replaced by Ralph, So i hope your still delighted now you have found out we brought are way back into the prem ( so in theory we did a City / Chelsea .. sorry if i made you feel sad )............... to say Marcus would not have continued to put money into the club to reach Champions league as he wanted is not right as it was his plan for the club when he brought it.

 

you see, although you argue my points and try to prove me wrong history tells a different story, the Spending of the club only changed once Kat decided she didnt want any more of " her " money being put into the club, was this why Nicola left? you have to ask your self this question, but as we all know, it is why he left, he was told that the club had to support its self to get to the champions league, as Kat would no longer put money into the club, then pochy and star players decided it was time to leave.

 

Please, in detail put down the out goings of player sales and incoming of player purchases, funds received from player sales are not allowed to be counted towards the wage bill, so dont come out with " some funds went towards paying players wages " ( as this is against FFP rules in its self. ) so that is stuck at 4 % rise a year - only commercial deals can allow a bigger rise than 4 % on wages which we have not done. have we spent more money on players coming in than we have received on out going players? plus the extra money we got from the tv deal this year? Stoke City have spent more money than us and pay more wages than us yet have less income than us ( when you take away money received from player sales ) so dont try tell me the ambition of the club is the same cause it is NOT, this is why players are leaving, they know this. take your rose tinted glasses off and stop licking arse........

 

There is a world of difference between the over investment we made to get to the Premier League (which I am quite aware of) and what you are expecting our billionaire owner to do now.

 

Once we got to the Premier League we are then generating enough income to become self-sustaining. Being sustainable was always in the plan.

 

"Pumping" millions and millions into the hope of getting in the champions league is not self sustaining for a club like us, it's just pis sing money away. We would not have done it under Markus and we are never going to do it under our current ownership and bloody good job too.

 

The fact that you compare our billionaire owner pumping in hundreds of millions of her own money just because you want to see us sign Neymar with your own purchase of a replica kit shows you have a pretty childish grasp of football finances.

 

Katharina is supporting a sustainable football club and will not be "pumping" her own cash into the club just to satisfy your FIFA 2015 football fantasies.

 

It ain't going to happen and quite right too.

[the saint in winchester]

They sign for us with the expectation that they'll catch the eye of a big club. It's like asking how can you keep the passengers on a train when it reaches it's destination!

 

LOL.

[Mosin]

There is a world of difference between the over investment we made to get to the Premier League (which I am quite aware of) and what you are expecting our billionaire owner to do now.

 

Once we got to the Premier League we are then generating enough income to become self-sustaining. Being sustainable was always in the plan.

 

"Pumping" millions and millions into the hope of getting in the champions league is not self sustaining for a club like us, it's just pis sing money away. We would not have done it under Markus and we are never going to do it under our current ownership and bloody good job too.

 

The fact that you compare our billionaire owner pumping in hundreds of millions of her own money just because you want to see us sign Neymar with your own purchase of a replica kit shows you have a pretty childish grasp of football finances.

 

Katharina is supporting a sustainable football club and will not be "pumping" her own cash into the club just to satisfy your FIFA 2015 football fantasies.

 

It ain't going to happen and quite right too.

 

 

 

Read what i said again, take a good look at the part that says i would not buy players of 100 million, infact my point was that the club pay less money out than it should, the fact Stoke City pay more wage, spend more on players ( with out selling first ) still make a profit AND HAVE A LESS INCOME THAN SOUTHAMPTON FC! Is a joke and is wrong... at no point in my rambling did i say we should spend millions on buying players, i stated we should be doing more to keep players who are clearly leaving for more money, which is what the topic is all about, or did you forget that?

 

 

I made the most important bit bold and underlined it for you CB fry as you seem to be unable to understand that a richer club Us Southampton fc who receive more money per year from sponsors and so on ( with out kats money ) is being out spent by Stoke city on transfers who also pay more in wages.

[John B]

Read what i said again, take a good look at the part that says i would not buy players of 100 million, infact my point was that the club pay less money out than it should, the fact Stoke City pay more wage, spend more on players ( with out selling first ) still make a profit AND HAVE A LESS INCOME THAN SOUTHAMPTON FC! Is a joke and is wrong... at no point in my rambling did i say we should spend millions on buying players, i stated we should be doing more to keep players who are clearly leaving for more money, which is what the topic is all about, or did you forget that?

 

 

I made the most important bit bold and underlined it for you CB fry as you seem to be unable to understand that a richer club Us Southampton fc who receive more money per year from sponsors and so on ( with out kats money ) is being out spent by Stoke city on transfers who also pay more in wages.

 

Please can you supply the figures behind this post as your facts could be a load of Bollix very much like are esteemed PM David Cameron but of course you maybe right

[simondo]

i think the argument to buy players from the top 6 clubs that haven't made it, and therefore have something to prove is a good one..

however if they then do well and a top 6 come calling, they'll be off just as quickly...

 

the only way to keep them is £££... and then it would have to be a lot more £££ than a top 6 club would offer to counter not playing in CL etc...

 

i think we have to accept the situation and just ensure Saints gets the best from the player while they are our and then gets the top dollar when the move....

[van Hanegem]

Suppose we live in a fantasy world and most of the European clubs are fed up with the protection of the filthy rich and say to Barcelona, Chelsea, Manu, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich and so on: "start your own league as we will have one of our own..." This means a new competition in which many different European subtop clubs could take part, playing each weekend. This would mean a devaluation of the UEFA league (which will probably end) but also a devaluation of the different competitions like the PL (no more Chelsea, Mancity, Manu, Arsenal and probably Liverpool), Bundesliga, Eredivisie etc. Would you like to see Southampton in this new competition or would you prefer staying in the PL? I know it's far fetched but I would like to know how sacred the PL is for you...

[st alex]

Much as Everton fans are disgruntled at their owners for not investing enough in the club, they are doing something right.

 

They signed Lukaku for big money and he's been a good signing. They've also consistently held onto their players.

 

Baines, Coleman, Barkley have been there for some time despite being linked with moves away. I'm not sure how they do it. It seems like they just value the players more than the money, and they realise as it's not that easy to just go out and replace £20/30 million player. Not sure where Everton finished last year, but they didn't have particularly good season and if they do sell anyone it looks likely to be Stones, but for an absolutely ridiculous fee.

 

I don't think Saints have helped themselves, we seem to have gotten a reputation as somewhere to buy players from, maybe this works against us whereas Everton have a stronger resilience that detracts teams from being linked/interested in their players.