All things Labour Party

[Batman]

Just find Corbyn odd

 

ask questions to Cameron the way he does just allows the PM to tell the world (positively) what they have done about it.

 

nice one

[Whitey Grandad]

I am actually Jewish...so no, I am not...have you any clue what a semite is by the way? You can actually call someone from Malta a semite. Either way, the worst anti-semite at the moment is the Israeli prime minister and the horrific acts he's commiting against the Arab Palestines.

 

Yes, you are clearly not "understanding" what I'm saying: The AREA of what is now Israel housed a large number of Jewish and Arab peoples before the Mandate was enacted...But oddly enough, when we turned our backs on agreements we made (under a conservative foreign minister) all hell broke loose. So no, it's fair to say that was one heck of a starting point. Most of the "Jewish refugees" were actually Russian/East European converts who historically had no roots to the "promised land" anyway.

 

And thanks, (whoever it was that said Hitler was left wing...Not Whitey Grandad) that's some seriously mental news that one, Hitler being left wing....kinda blows his theory that communism (actually, not his theory, initially Generals from the first world war) is inextricably linked to world Jewry.....Mate, if you believe that, you are off your rocker.

 

I haven't used any of these words.

 

Are you really, seriously, blaming the Conservative Party for the state of politics today in Israel/Palestine? I don't think you'll find one person on either side who would even think of that.

[shirleysfc]

Just find Corbyn odd

 

ask questions to Cameron the way he does just allows the PM to tell the world (positively) what they have done about it.

 

nice one

 

What's made the news today, the PM's responses or the fact Corbyn gave the general public a voice at PMQs?

[Badger]

He played there for the Nazi XI. With Goebbels on the right wing they were the 1930's equivalent of Stuart Ripley and Jason Wilcox.

 

On the topic of which here he is, sat behind Corbyn.

 

[hypochondriac]

What's made the news today, the PM's responses or the fact Corbyn gave the general public a voice at PMQs?

 

That's because it's something new. He would have made the news whatever he did. He might get away with it once or twice but if he does that every week then it's not going to look good for him.

[shirleysfc]

That's because it's something new. He would have made the news whatever he did. He might get away with it once or twice but if he does that every week then it's not going to look good for him.

 

I could be wrong but I don't think anyone's suggested he will do it this way every time.

[sandwichsaint]

 

I'm not sure about a Hotpoint washer/dryer, we've always used a Filipino.

[CB Fry]

What's made the news today, the PM's responses or the fact Corbyn gave the general public a voice at PMQs?

So the news reported a gimmick. Well done Jeremy. Genius.

 

If he'd asked six consecutive questions about, say, the housing crisis, then the news would have had to report on the housing crisis, the BBC would have had to have start pulling together packages explaining what the crisis is. The leader of the opposition driving the agenda.

 

Instead he gave Cameron six unchallenged open goals to calmly explain Conservative policy. Well played Jeremy.

[Hockey_saint]

I haven't used any of these words.

 

Are you really, seriously, blaming the Conservative Party for the state of politics today in Israel/Palestine? I don't think you'll find one person on either side who would even think of that.

 

You implied I was prejudiced against Jewish people....I am not. My point is that nothing develops on their own Israeli politics grew out of the initial Balfour agreement and everything that has happened since is the result of that. So for the party who signed that agreement to ask "oh why are there extremist Palestinians"...well, you'd have to be pretty darn fickle (then again, it was Boris Johnson who I quoted) to forget this.

[Lord Duckhunter]

So the news reported a gimmick. Well done Jeremy. Genius.

 

If he'd asked six consecutive questions about, say, the housing crisis, then the news would have had to report on the housing crisis, the BBC would have had to have start pulling together packages explaining what the crisis is. The leader of the opposition driving the agenda.

 

Instead he gave Cameron six unchallenged open goals to calmly explain Conservative policy. Well played Jeremy.

 

The other thing I found odd was that there was no comeback ,it was onto the next question . Normally the follow up question would contain a killer line or rebuttal of the answer just given . I maybe could understand if Corbyn took the subject and even the first question from the public , but the rest needs to be framed around Cameron's answer. It was bizarre .

 

Cameron could have given an answer along the lines of " I don't really care about Mary from Islington and her welfare payments as I'm too busy having sex with Rebbeca Brookes and giving chunks of the NHS to my buddies " , and old Jezza would look at his notes and replied " Fred from ealing wants to know why house prices are so high"

[buctootim]

The other thing I found odd was that there was no comeback ,it was onto the next question . Normally the follow up question would contain a killer line or rebuttal of the answer just given . I maybe could understand if Corbyn took the subject and even the first question from the public , but the rest needs to be framed around Cameron's answer. It was bizarre .

 

Cameron could have given an answer along the lines of " I don't really care about Mary from Islington and her welfare payments as I'm too busy having sex with Rebbeca Brookes and giving chunks of the NHS to my buddies " , and old Jezza would look at his notes and replied " Fred from ealing wants to know why house prices are so high"

 

Thats true and if he planned to do it every week it would be a mistake. However there were positives as well as negatives - it demonstrated a willingness to get away from yah boo politics. The fact they were real questions from real people made it impossible to dismiss them as 'just the opinion of a left wing head banger'. PMQs is normally just a pantomime of people saying things they often dont believe because the other party has said the opposite. Theres more to effective opposition than contradiction.

[Nolan]

Just seeing Jeremy Corbyn squirming when told by the sky news interviewer he has to kneel before the queen to join the privy council... The horror in his eyes. The visible gulp. never ever seen a politician act like that.

 

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[Johnny Bognor]

 

And thanks, (whoever it was that said Hitler was left wing...Not Whitey Grandad) that's some seriously mental news that one, Hitler being left wing....kinda blows his theory that communism (actually, not his theory, initially Generals from the first world war) is inextricably linked to world Jewry.....Mate, if you believe that, you are off your rocker.

 

if you look at the national socialist party manifesto from 1920, at least 15 of the policies from a total of 24 would comfortably fit into a labour manifesto. Only 8 of the 24 look like tory policy.

[CB Fry]

Just seeing Jeremy Corbyn squirming when told by the sky news interviewer he has to kneel before the queen to join the privy council... The horror in his eyes. The visible gulp. never ever seen a politician act like that.

 

Sent from my HTC Desire 310 using Tapatalk

 

I've said it a few times on this thread but bears repeating - he didn't want to be leader at the start of the process and you can see he really doesn't want to be leader now. Not only is he utterly incapable of leading a team, setting a direction and bringing people with him, he has no gift or grasp for the fundamental basics of life as the leader of Her Majesty's Opposition.

 

He spent his first weekend shuffling off to his comfort zone of singing The Red Flag in a pub, or turning up at some refugee fundraising fete. Those days are gone, Jeremy.

 

If he gets through 18 months he's done well.

[buctootim]

if you look at the national socialist party manifesto from 1920, at least 15 of the policies from a total of 24 would comfortably fit into a labour manifesto. Only 8 of the 24 look like tory policy.

 

Interesting you chose 1920 instead of 1933 or 1939. Im pretty sure he didnt set out to leave 30 million dead and Germany in ruins. Its what he did that matters - not what he said he was going to do in order to get elected.

[Hockey_saint]

Interesting you chose 1920 instead of 1933 or 1939. Im pretty sure he didnt set out to leave 30 million dead and Germany in ruins. Its what he did that matters - not what he said he was going to do in order to get elected.

 

You should have a look at Mein Kampf.....He pretty much spells that out quite clearly actually. But either way, I just don't the understand sneery people who dismiss the toil of countless generations simply because some zealots went mad for a couple of decades. When I say sneery, I mean people like that Sky News reporter. I mean, who owns Sky again? oh yes, Rupert Murdoch...that'll be completely impartial then.

 

*and he wrote that when he was in prison in the '20s....fair bit of warning I'd say.

Edited 16 September, 2015 by Hockey_saint

[hutch]

What's made the news today, the PM's responses or the fact Corbyn gave the general public a voice at PMQs?

All the news I saw was about the leader of Her Majesty's opposition refusing to sing the National Anthem at an official function.

 

Maybe I need to poke around a bit deeper to find the positive stuff about Jeremy.

[eurosaint]

I think that he's going to have to ditch the 'Angela asks' and 'Marie says' quite soon because serious political figures need to display their credentials for running a country of nearly 70 million people ! It's a bit like saying "my mate down the pub told me" when referring to football matters, it's just not statesmanlike !

The job requires top level diplomacy, negotiation, consultation and and much compromise along the way ! Sticking to his long held principles of republicanism etc. will not encourage the majority even if they respect his conviction and his right to think and do as he feels !

[Nolan]

Interesting take from Lord Ashcroft.

 

http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2015/09/corbyn-is-doing-the-job-as-he-understands-it-and-as-his-supporters-intended/

 

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[Whitey Grandad]

You implied I was prejudiced against Jewish people....I am not. My point is that nothing develops on their own Israeli politics grew out of the initial Balfour agreement and everything that has happened since is the result of that. So for the party who signed that agreement to ask "oh why are there extremist Palestinians"...well, you'd have to be pretty darn fickle (then again, it was Boris Johnson who I quoted) to forget this.

 

I meant to imply nothing of the sort and I'm surprised that you should have taken it that way.

 

'Everything that has happened since'? It would take an extreme leap of belief to lay the blame/credit for the creation of the state of Israel at the doors of the Conservative Party.

[Trader]

if you look at the national socialist party manifesto from 1920, at least 15 of the policies from a total of 24 would comfortably fit into a labour manifesto. Only 8 of the 24 look like tory policy.

 

Political party in not sticking to pledges in manifesto when in power shocker!

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Corbyn may well have brought a new generation of supporters to the Labour cause. However, if this new poll is any guide he may he may be in danger of scaring off large numbers of existing Labour voters:

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/11876480/One-in-five-Labour-voters-more-likely-to-defect-to-Tories-after-Corbyn-victory-poll-finds.html

[Nolan]

Greece's dabble with the far left may be ending.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/06/centre-right-level-with-syriza-in-greek-polls

[badgerx16]

Greece's dabble with the far left may be ending.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/06/centre-right-level-with-syriza-in-greek-polls

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34307795

Greece election: Conservative New Democracy admits defeat

 

"Greece's conservative New Democracy party has admitted defeat to Alexis Tsipras's left-wing Syriza in the nation's fifth election in six years.

 

The concession came as Syriza was given a lead of 35% to New Democracy's 28%, with 21% of votes counted, interior ministry data showed.

 

This would not give Syriza an absolute majority, and the party would need partners to form a government."

[ant]

Ah well, at least Corbyn didn't roger a dead pig.

[buctootim]

Ah well, at least Corbyn didn't roger a dead pig.

 

He hasn't specifically denied that afaik.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Ah well, at least Corbyn didn't roger a dead pig.

 

Diane Abbott or a dead pig, not too much in it.

[bridge too far]

Not just pigs, it seems

 

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/04/02/uk-britain-cameron-sheep-idUKBRE9310KZ20130402

[bridge too far]

[Ex Lion Tamer]

Corbyn's first @YouGov leadership satisfaction rating is -9% (30%/39%). That's 29% worse net than Ed Miliband's first one (43%/23%)

 

 

Previously we were told that Corbyn's new clear and simple policies were going to be much more appealing to the electorate, but now the cry is that we have to give him time to majestically win over the British public. Perhaps he can do it, but he has a **** of a long way to go.

[Nolan]

Jeremy Corbyn is the first political leader of the big two to start off on a negative approval rating in the Ipsos / Mori Poll

 

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/9480

[buctootim]

Jeremy Corbyn is the first political leader of the big two to start off on a negative approval rating in the Ipsos / Mori Poll

 

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/9480

 

Thats a third party report of a poll. The actual MORI summary of the poll gives more detail and is more interesting. There are two approaches to getting elected - be marmite or be plain vanilla.

https://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3626/Corbyn-seen-as-more-honest-than-most-politicians-but-Cameron-leads-on-other-PM-attributes.aspx

 

Less than two weeks into his tenure as the new Labour leader Ipsos MORI’s detailed image ratings show the public’s views on Jeremy Corbyn and the party he leads. More than half (54%) of Britons say Jeremy Corbyn is ‘more honest than most politicians’ compared to three in ten (30%) who say the same for David Cameron. However only 32% think he’s a capable leader compared to 62% saying this for David Cameron. When asked if either ‘has sound judgment’ 32% say Mr Corbyn possesses this while 46% say Mr Cameron does. Less of the public however believe that Jeremy Corbyn is ‘out of touch with ordinary people’ when compared to David Cameron (39% versus 64%), but he falls far behind David Cameron when being seen as ‘patriotic’ (37% compared to 76%).

 

Mr Corbyn’s Labour party leads the Conservatives as concerned about people in real need (61% versus 32%). Forty-three per cent also say Labour is the party that ‘looks after the interests of people like me’ compared to 37% who say the same of the Conservatives. More Britons however see the Conservatives as a party fit to govern (56% compared to 35%) as well as being a party with a ‘good team of leaders’ (49% compared to 27%). Worryingly for Labour three in four (75%) see the party as being divided compared to 38% who say the same for the Conservatives.

 

When asked to compare the party leaders with their parties, 37% of Britons say they like Mr Corbyn while four in ten (40%) say they like the Labour party. Jeremy Corbyn is liked slightly more than Ed Miliband was in March 2015 (30% liked Miliband then, compared to 37% who like Corbyn now). David Cameron fares slightly better than Jeremy Corbyn with 44% of Britons saying they like him. His party shares similar ratings to Labour with four in ten (41%) saying they like the Conservative party.

 

In his first ratings as leader one in three (33%) say that they are satisfied with Jeremy Corbyn doing his job compared to 36% who are dissatisfied, while three in ten (31%) are yet to make up their mind. This compares with Ed Miliband’s first ratings as Labour leader in October 2010 of 41% satisfied and 22% dissatisfied. Forty-two per cent say they are satisfied with David Cameron doing his job as Prime Minister while 52% are dissatisfied.

 

September’s Political Monitor voting intention figures show a Conservative lead over Labour. Thirty-nine percent say they would vote Conservative if a general election were held tomorrow while 34% would vote Labour. The Liberal Democrats stand on 9%, while 7% say they would vote UKIP.

Edited 25 September, 2015 by buctootim

[TopGun]

So one of Corbyn's key advisors has been suspended by the Labour Party.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34751471

 

Also interesting to note that as against Labour's official shadow ministerial roles selected by Corbyn and accepted by those new in post, others that have been since elected to Labour departmental backbench committees are all being filled by the non-Corbynistas - http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/nov/05/labour-moderates-flex-muscles-capturing-key-backbench-offices These are roles voted for within the Parliamentary Labour Party.

 

A shadow shadow cabinet? Corbyn has his friends close and his enemies elsewhere perhaps?

Edited 6 November, 2015 by TopGun

[Jonnyboy]

Edited 9 November, 2015 by Jonnyboy

[sadoldgit]

 

My FaceBook pages have been full of the "angle of the bow" outrage (which apparently was the same as the Queen's bow). Funny how Corbin's other activities on the day didn't get as much media coverage. Not a Labour supporter but I think the way he is treated by the Tory press is rubbish.

[Jonnyboy]

http://economistadentata.tumblr.com/post/132863533122/it-was-the-sun-wot-dun-it

[sadoldgit]

Corbyn's first @YouGov leadership satisfaction rating is -9% (30%/39%). That's 29% worse net than Ed Miliband's first one (43%/23%)

 

 

Previously we were told that Corbyn's new clear and simple policies were going to be much more appealing to the electorate, but now the cry is that we have to give him time to majestically win over the British public. Perhaps he can do it, but he has a **** of a long way to go.

 

Hardly surprising given the way he is being portrayed in the media. Perhaps he needs to start putting his old chap in a dead pigs mouth or lying over tax credits. Funny that the Sun hasn't made such a huge fuss about those issues but gets itself into a lather about an antiquated dirge and the angle of a bow. I am no Labour supporter but I am fed up with the way that we are being manipulated by the media. Lets deal with the proper issues that face the country and stop playing the man as happened with Milliband too. It is all just a big diversion and Murdoch especially needs to keep the Tories in power to maintain his own power base.

[buctootim]

 

Whereas Cameron's father jailed people for peaceful protest against nukes at Greenham common and his brother defended Rebekah Brookes in her phone tapping trial.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

It's always fascinating to see just how far and fast the English language continues to evolve. For example, being interested in naval history, I well know that ''Angle on the Bow'' was originally a technical term (commonly employed by submarine crew) used to describe how far 'ahead' of moving target you must aim your torpedoes in order for them to hit successfully.

 

I presume this new meaning attached to the term refers to those (prematurely) attacking Corbyn now so that they might hurt him before the next electron?

[Unbelievable Jeff]

The way the Tory press are treating Corbyn is risible, but at the same time it's not as if we haven't seen similar (although possible not on this scale) the other way round. But hey, who actually listens to the press nowadays anyway, all factions are a joke.

[buctootim]

The way the Tory press are treating Corbyn is risible, but at the same time it's not as if we haven't seen similar (although possible not on this scale) the other way round. But hey, who actually listens to the press nowadays anyway, all factions are a joke.

 

A lot of people still do unfortunately. 10-15 years ago I thought the growth of the internet and multiple digital channels would make us all better informed and less hostage to biased reporting. Instead all it seems to have done is cripple the serious newspapers and give airtime to any crackpot out there. Reasonably objective and informed news is harder to find than ever before imo.

[rallyboy]

Anyone who is buying all of the media spin on Corbyn needs to look at who is producing it and why they want you to buy into their agenda - and then perhaps take a long hard look at themselves.

I treat those stories with the same disdain as the ones that tell us we should all be watching Strictly, Downton and Bake-Off while worshipping Katie Price, Richard Hammond and One Direction.

 

It's drifted so far from electoral mischief into blatant untruth that it is now damaging those who publish it - yes, the ones that hacked the phones of dead soldiers' families to make a buck and who are now lecturing us on respect for war dead.

[sandwichsaint]

If you read one thing today, read this piece.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/11/david-cameron-letter-cuts-oxfordshire

 

Now tell me, are the Government merely incompetent or do they really not care? Looking at this exchange Cameron (or the lackey who actually wrote the letter) have absolutely no idea how their austerity plays out in real life.

[buctootim]

If you read one thing today, read this piece.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/11/david-cameron-letter-cuts-oxfordshire

 

Now tell me, are the Government merely incompetent or do they really not care? Looking at this exchange Cameron (or the lackey who actually wrote the letter) have absolutely no idea how their austerity plays out in real life.

 

I think they genuinely have very little idea of the impact of doctrinaire policies in practice. The ministers have no experience of the services they are responsible for and normally neither do the civil servants implementing the minister's policy. Its classic blind leading the blind, in search of the massive mythical pile of waste waiting to be cut for no pain gains. The paradox is that their changes frequently mean more bureacracy, not less

 

I used to work at a teaching hospital, one of only two non clinical managers in a department of over 600 staff. The advent of the Tories' internal market which was supposed to increase competition and efficiency resulted in the forced recruitment of another 16 people - data collectors, contract managers, expensive IT systems and support staff. These additional people wee employed to require the doctors and nurses to log and code every activity they did, taking time away from patient care. The data was then collated so the hospital could negotiate contracts with the Healthy Authority - who had also massively scaled up staffing. Nett result c30 extra admin staff and probably 12% of clinical time spent form filling so productivity down by around 17%.

 

One day in a subsequent job I was relating to my CEO how crazy that reorganisation was. she happily piped up "oh I designed that!" very proud she was too. After talking to her it turns out she had spent most of her mandarin years in the Home office but had spent two years in the Department of Health. No experience of health or of markets but nonetheless designed the system we are all now stuck with. The Conservatives will tell you it is driving choice and efficiency.

 

You can cut waste in heath services by cutting out the fat that ill advised government policies force it to carry. Perhaps the worst thing the internal market has done is to erode the public service ethos and replace it with a market mentality. Government has said to staff for years -" you're old fashioned, you need to compete in the market, the market decides value and worth". Guess what? eventually people have listened. You have CEOs earning three times what they did before. Nurses who wont work directly employed but will earn three times more as bank staff. You reap what you sow.

Edited 11 November, 2015 by buctootim

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Anyone else feel really depressed with politics right now?

 

The current incumbants don't really know what they're doing, and they're just trying to cut anything and everything they see.

 

New old Labour also don't know what they're doing, and have now become pretty much unelectable.

 

The Lib Dems were destroyed at the last election, and no-one will trust them.

 

What we need is a new middle party to take up the slack and apathetic voters. The country is crying out for it.

[badgerx16]

If you read one thing today, read this piece.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/11/david-cameron-letter-cuts-oxfordshire

 

Now tell me, are the Government merely incompetent or do they really not care? Looking at this exchange Cameron (or the lackey who actually wrote the letter) have absolutely no idea how their austerity plays out in real life.

The point is that many councils are looking at at least a further 20-30 % cut over the next 2-3 years, whilst being asked to take yet more responsibility for public health and adult social care, transferred from the local NHS. Lancashire County Council reckon that in 3 years time, after accounting for statutory services, ( Education and Social Care ), there may be nothing at all left in the kitty.

[Batman]

The point is that many councils are looking at at least a further 20-30 % cut over the next 2-3 years, whilst being asked to take yet more responsibility for public health and adult social care, transferred from the local NHS. Lancashire County Council reckon that in 3 years time, after accounting for statutory services, ( Education and Social Care ), there may be nothing at all left in the kitty.

 

says something when many council chiefs are on more than the prime minister.

lots of savings to be had there

[buctootim]

says something when many council chiefs are on more than the prime minister.

lots of savings to be had there

 

So the budget of my local authority is £227m and the CEO is paid £148,000. How do you save £68m from that? Maybe your bank nurse should hand some of her money back? or is that different?

[badgerx16]

says something when many council chiefs are on more than the prime minister.

lots of savings to be had there

Getting rid of the CEO wouldn't account for a budget cut of 30%. In my case I was one of 300 'middle managers' given the chop - a typical 'non job', having been the technical manager responsible for the management of the IT network, telephony, and IT security.

[Batman]

So the budget of my local authority is £227m and the CEO is paid £148,000. How do you save £68m from that? Maybe your bank nurse should hand some of her money back? or is that different?

 

Just saying savings can be made there. Which is quite obvious.

 

Never said it was a solution of any sorts