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Between a rock and a hard place

alpine_saint

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alpine_saint

alpine_saint

Posted
Posted

SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

The usual Alpine utter drivel.

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alpine_saint

alpine_saint

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Because its a thinly veiled attack on the club.

 

Its a genuine question regarding our ongoing strategy. I think the strategy for-heaven's_saint is describing is a nonsense and will not make for a stable squad and club. Players and coaching staff with a little tastse of success will leave because of ambition.

 

We have to decide if we are a selling club or not and set our sights accordingly.

 

Whether you all like it or not, we sold less and were more stable under Cortese.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

Posted
Posted
Why is it drivel ?

 

WTF is the matter with you today ?

All your contributions to this site are drivel.

 

You think we are a tin pot club with no ambition. Fine. We get it.

 

The rest of us will get on with supporting the club and team. After all they pi ss ed all over your doom laden drivel predictions last season, didn't they?

 

The rest of us will settle in ready for your snivelling "well, it's all easy with hindsight" catchphrase when you roll that out in a few weeks or months time.

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saint michael

saint michael

Posted
Posted

I don't believe it is ever done in one step or will be very quick without ploughing millions in as city have done.

 

It is frustrating when it feels like we are close and can push on with a couple of big additions but maintaining a sensible cost base is going to be the way forward.

 

I am more keen to see us holding our good players for longer and them developing together.

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alpine_saint

alpine_saint

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All your contributions to this site are drivel.

 

You think we are a tin pot club with no ambition. Fine. We get it.

 

The rest of us will get on with supporting the club and team. After all they pi ss ed all over your doom laden drivel predictions last season, didn't they?

 

The rest of us will settle in ready for your snivelling "well, it's all easy with hindsight" catchphrase when you roll that out in a few weeks or months time.

 

What predictions are you talking about ? I didnt make any. Pretty sad when you have to refer to cliches and stereotypes.

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Redslo

Redslo

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

Possibly there is no way forward in the sense you mean. However, the fact that you don't see it is meaningless since you are not inside the club with knowledge of their plans. Maybe Reed and company do see a way forward.

 

Either way, I am not sure what you are upset about. Nearly six years ago you were complaining that Lallana and Schneiderlin were not good enough for League 1 and had suspect temperament and commitment (whatever that means). http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16021-The-midfield-is-the-problem http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16361-List-the-players-still-at-SFC-with-suspect-temperament-commitment

 

I was going to link to some of your other posts since then to further demonstrate your excessive pessimism, but I decided not the bother because I am confident that issue is not in dispute.

 

Your club has had a remarkable run of improvement during the past six years after nearly disappearing completely. Why not enjoy this and try to be happy instead of always looking for the worst and spreading doom and gloom?

 

The new season is a blank slate. We might win the Europa League and qualify for the Champions League. We might drop off a bit with all the games we could have to play (possibly as many as 73 although that is very unlikely) but relegations seems unlikely so you should be able to enjoy your club playing at the highest level again the year after next.

 

How is any of this intolerable? Or if it really is intolerable, why are you tolerating it. Just become a fan of Chelsea, Man U, Man City, or Barcelona. They don't have a glass ceiling so I am sure you would find nothing to complain about with them.

 

Its a genuine question regarding our ongoing strategy. I think the strategy for-heaven's_saint is describing is a nonsense and will not make for a stable squad and club. Players and coaching staff with a little tastse of success will leave because of ambition.

 

We have to decide if we are a selling club or not and set our sights accordingly.

 

Whether you all like it or not, we sold less and were more stable under Cortese.

 

We were the big fish in a smaller pond and, as a result, our players didn't look that good to clubs that could afford to out spend us. The one player that did look that good Cortese sold.

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ericofarabia

ericofarabia

Posted
Posted

Some good Cup Runs and battling till the last game of the season for a spot in The Europa Cup, whilst playing attractive football and bringing through more players from our fabled academy.

 

Flirting with a Top 4 place through the season, and bloodying the noses of some of the big boys, whilst crumbling to a few minnows - it just wouldn't be Saints any other way!!

 

Please also let us finish above Scousehampton and the North london yobbos, and win all our matches against them. ;)

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Lazlo78

Lazlo78

Posted
Posted
Either way, I am not sure what you are upset about. Nearly six years ago you were complaining that Lallana and Schneiderlin were not good enough for League 1 and had suspect temperament and commitment (whatever that means). http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16021-The-midfield-is-the-problem http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16361-List-the-players-still-at-SFC-with-suspect-temperament-commitment

 

I was going to link to some of your other posts since then to further demonstrate your excessive pessimism, but I decided not the bother because I am confident that issue is not in dispute.

 

:toppa:

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St Jim

St Jim

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

 

 

:mcinnes:

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Graffito

Graffito

Posted
Posted
Possibly there is no way forward in the sense you mean. However, the fact that you don't see it is meaningless since you are not inside the club with knowledge of their plans. Maybe Reed and company do see a way forward.

 

Either way, I am not sure what you are upset about. Nearly six years ago you were complaining that Lallana and Schneiderlin were not good enough for League 1 and had suspect temperament and commitment (whatever that means). http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16021-The-midfield-is-the-problem http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?16361-List-the-players-still-at-SFC-with-suspect-temperament-commitment

 

I was going to link to some of your other posts since then to further demonstrate your excessive pessimism, but I decided not the bother because I am confident that issue is not in dispute.

 

Your club has had a remarkable run of improvement during the past six years after nearly disappearing completely. Why not enjoy this and try to be happy instead of always looking for the worst and spreading doom and gloom?

 

The new season is a blank slate. We might win the Europa League and qualify for the Champions League. We might drop off a bit with all the games we could have to play (possibly as many as 73 although that is very unlikely) but relegations seems unlikely so you should be able to enjoy your club playing at the highest level again the year after next.

 

How is any of this intolerable? Or if it really is intolerable, why are you tolerating it. Just become a fan of Chelsea, Man U, Man City, or Barcelona. They don't have a glass ceiling so I am sure you would find nothing to complain about with them.

 

 

 

We were the big fish in a smaller pond and, as a result, our players didn't look that good to clubs that could afford to out spend us. The one player that did look that good Cortese sold.

 

Good answer but you're wasting your time on him.

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saintsmike

saintsmike

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

How could make this so-called step up, they will always be seen as traditionally bigger clubs. Tottenham have a good stadium/money consistency of finishing near or in the top seven, while Liverpool have the same but with the history of trophies etc.

 

This isn't an "intolerable" situation it's a very welcome problem that will be hard to solve, but one that we are doing the right way to doing through producing excellent players that will mean we continue to be sustainable and profitable as a club.

 

In the long run given Financial Fairplay we will be in a much stronger position than both as bar Harry Kane and perhaps Ryan Mason, Tottenham don't produce players, and the same goes for Liverpool if you put aside Jordan Ibe who is excellent.

 

I'd rather see us consistently hit the top 10 the right way than get into loads of debt with tonnes of failed signings like these two clubs. We have an exciting season with European football and more of our young players set to make their mark, I don't think we'll hit the same heights but another top eight finish is well within our reach and hopefully it will be good to see Sam Gallagher and Ryan Seager start to impact the first team and bang in a few goals.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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Posted
What predictions are you talking about ? I didnt make any. Pretty sad when you have to refer to cliches and stereotypes.

A lecture from Alpine about cliché and stereotypes. Seriously, you couldn't make it up.

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Shance

Shance

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

To answer your question, the only way to do it is for someone to pump unlimited millions into the squad like man city for example. ATM if we threaten to dislodge clubs like spurs and liverpool (who have the same aim as us) then they will pillage us. They can both outspend us not only on transfer fees but more importantly, wages.

 

They are historically bigger clubs as well. If we had an Arab billionaire in charge that was willing to give players up to 100k a week then we would be competing with the top 4 by now as our players would've been priced out of the market.

 

In short, we are punching above our weight and the bigger clubs don't like it.

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Turkish

Turkish

Posted
Posted

2014 - http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?50319-Adrift-on-brown-stuff-creek-without-a-paddle

2013 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?45266-SFC-still-run-like-a-crappy-seaside-B-amp-B#.VZop9H-9KSM

2012 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?41043-We-dont-belong-in-the-PL

2011 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?30809-Why-we-start-the-season-so-badly#.VZoqw3-9KSM

2010 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?23861-Brutally-honest-forget-its-me-posting-this-who-is-disappointed-in-our-transfers#.VZoq43-9KSM

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?23072-Different-Ownership-and-Managment-same-old-summer#.VZorfX-9KSM

 

:lol:

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hypochondriac

hypochondriac

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Posted

 

:lol: owned.

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Shance

Shance

Posted
Posted

 

Good god!!

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ericofarabia

ericofarabia

Posted
Posted

 

You could nearly set your alarm clock to his pre season "meltdown" :rolleyes:

You have to give credit for being consistent though :lol:

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Lorne Malvo

Lorne Malvo

Posted
Posted

 

picard_clapping.gif

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View From The Top

View From The Top

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Posted

 

He'll be whinging about the club not stocking XXXXL shirts next,

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Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

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Posted
I think this is a genuine question worthy of debate but Alpine's pro Cortese comment does undermine his argument, for us to be a big club like Spurs we need a bigger fan base and a bigger stadium for starters!

 

Saints need to grow in terms of support and income, at the moment it's hard as we are seen to produce good players which will always interest those clubs we are trying to usurp and not big enough to get the international recognition. So the club will need to try and carry on producing better and better players to compete, gain European competition experience and the club needs to grow it's brand here and more so abroad to get the additional commercial income. So I would guess the five year plan will hope to address these issues, let's see where we are then.

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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

I'm going to start supporting Chelsea. Maybe Arsenal would be better because they have more Saints players, but then Chelsea have more of a chance of winning something.

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

Posted
Posted
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

Intolerable? Really?

 

intolerable

adjective

unable to be endured

Are you really unable to endure the football team you claim to support finishing 7th with 60 points? Their highest league position for 25 years and achieving European football.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders.

 

We were 2 points away from 6th, 4 points away from 5th. How is that not contending for the top 6? How is a mere 2 point gap insurmountable?

 

You say we are "unwilling" to make the step up, yet under Liebherr ownership have risen from 68th to 7th in England (2 points away from 6th) in the space of 6 years.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

You were a doom merchant last summer (as you always are), and yet Saints just had their most successful ever season in the Premier League. You thought last summer we were looted, but ended up with a better squad and closed the gap significantly on Spurs and Liverpool.

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S-Clarke

S-Clarke

Posted
Posted

I don't know why anyone is bothering to engage with him. He's no where to be seen when things are going well, but as soon as a bit of doom is on the horizon up he pops.

 

There are seemingly quite a few posters who linger in the hope of bad news, to then try and ram their views down our faces. I'll tell you what is intolerable - this forum during pre-season.

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Shance

Shance

Posted
Posted
I disagree with Alpines post but have to say that some of the posters above will change their tune if we have a bad run.

 

Its going to happen sooner or later. Unfortunately the last 6 or so years of success seem to have developed a bit of a winning expectation amongst some of our younger fans and even some of the older ones. You'd think that where we have come from and what we've been through would've instilled some humility but the expectations are astronomical!

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doddisalegend

doddisalegend

Posted
Posted
Its going to happen sooner or later. Unfortunately the last 6 or so years of success seem to have developed a bit of a winning expectation amongst some of our younger fans and even some of the older ones. You'd think that where we have come from and what we've been through would've instilled some humility but the expectations are astronomical!

 

 

Woah you're not allowed to play the look where we were card on here anymore......forum rules.

 

Got to agree though I'm always surprised when I hear saints fans talking about breaking the bank or signing players to compete for top six it's almost like the club going bust never happened.

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Redslo

Redslo

Posted
Posted
I don't know why anyone is bothering to engage with him. He's no where to be seen when things are going well, but as soon as a bit of doom is on the horizon up he pops.

 

There are seemingly quite a few posters who linger in the hope of bad news, to then try and ram their views down our faces. I'll tell you what is intolerable - this forum during pre-season.

 

Clearly, any post that could bring Turkish, CB Fry, MLG, and hypochondriac (and possibly other worthies whose notoriety I am too new here to recognize) together serves a useful purpose. Also, I am trying to cheer alpine up so he can live a fuller and happier life--albeit by becoming a Manchester United fan.

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Saint86

Saint86

Posted
Posted
Why is it drivel ?

 

WTF is the matter with you today ?

 

Alpine you raised a serious point and predictably CB Fry and Batman were here to troll you ASAP. Stick them both on ignore and you'll have far less grey hairs ;)

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Wrensup

Wrensup

Posted
Posted

Thread idea good... execution not so good. Ignoring all the other crap posted. I would say some how increase the wages we offer. This obviously isn't that easy to do, as we would already be doing that, but money speaks.

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

Posted
Posted
Thread idea good... execution not so good. Ignoring all the other crap posted. I would say some how increase the wages we offer. This obviously isn't that easy to do, as we would already be doing that, but money speaks.

 

Is it? We were a mere 2 points from 6th, 4 points from 5th. How is that not competing for the top 6? The gap between the sides last season was small and not insurmountable.

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

Posted
Posted (edited)

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

Us to continue wisely in the transfer market as we have for the last 6 years of Liebherr ownership. Which has seen us rise from 68th to 7th in England and close the gap significantly to Spurs and Liverpool.

 

CI0wPxjWoAAtIYW.png:large

Edited by Matthew Le God
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Colinjb

Colinjb

Posted
Posted (edited)
SFC is in an intolerable situation, imo.

 

We are better than also-rans and mid-table mediocrity - we were top 3 for most of last season.

 

We are unable or unwilling to make the step up to genuine Top 6 contenders. The ease with which Liverpool and Tottenham pick off our players and staff testifies to that.

 

Every time we threaten to smash the glass ceiling, we get looted.

 

What REALLY is the way forward - to make progress - for SFC ? I dont see it.... :(

 

It depends on the context. Have we been in this position for a decade like Everton or have we just started to tap on the door?

 

It's clearly the later. We are not going to break open the door immediately, but there is a structure in place that has seen us make remarkable progress to challenge them in the first place. We need to give this time to see what the club can do in the medium term.... Short termism and knee jerk reactions like yours Alpine will only be counter productive. Sorry chap.

Edited by Colinjb
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Shance

Shance

Posted
Posted

If you actually deconstruct his post he makes a valid point about struggling to push on to the next level. You're unfortunately unable to do that, especially when it gives you the opportunity to belittle another poster.

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