Gaston Ramirez

[sadoldgit]

Are you sure he is done here ? We could play him in the League Cup games and possibly the FA Cup games. If he comes good maybe consider him as an impact game in the EPL games ?

 

Not at all sure and I really hope that he can turn things around with us. Not holding by breath but I would love to be proved wrong.

[VectisSaint]

Will be interesting to see how we use him from here on in. He'll clearly be here until January at the very least, can't imagine we'll be paying him to sit about if he's fit.

There are still some places where the window is still open, Russia for one and Romania. Not sure about Argentina this year, last year we were able to ship Osvaldo out there, but that was possibly because they were in a transition season. I don't think we will ship him out, it was clear to me that as a member of the first team squad there was no plan for him to leave, but technically there are still some options.

[alpine_saint]

Will be interesting to see how we use him from here on in. He'll clearly be here until January at the very least, can't imagine we'll be paying him to sit about if he's fit.

 

He can cut the half-time oranges, sweep the floor, even sell chicken balti pies if needs..........

[eddie]

I can definitely see him getting a game or two in the first team between now and christmas. I think RK/EK will get to know him very well watching him train each week, and maybe as their confidence in his best position and ability to step up increases, they may well stick him in for a game or two. Probably come on in last 20 mins of a game when we're 3-0 up, first.

 

not ITK, just a hunch

[alpine_saint]

I can definitely see him getting a game or two in the first team between now and christmas. I think RK/EK will get to know him very well watching him train each week, and maybe as their confidence in his best position and ability to step up increases, they may well stick him in for a game or two. Probably come on in last 20 mins of a game when we're 3-0 up, first.

 

not ITK, just a hunch

 

Always been a flat-track bully, not a game-changer.

 

Not what we need........

[John B]

Always been a flat-track bully, not a game-changer.

 

Not what we need........

 

I agree cannot see him playing unless most of the team are injured or suspended

[benjii]

I think it's clear that his problem is either fitness or a lack of commitment/attitude (or both).

 

He had several promising spells under Adkins and Pochettino and every time a spot was about to open up for him in the first team (ie. Lallana/Puncheon/Rodriguez/Davis etc out injured) he would invariably get injured himself and by the time he was "fit" again, the window would have closed for the time being.

 

Same at Hull. Bruce gave him enough chances but he didn't grasp them and ended up injured a lot of the time.

 

Last season he was involved in pre-season; I remember him playing against Brighton and then we shipped him out again.

 

It's clearly not an ability/footballing issue as one thing the squad is obviously lacking is a genuine number 10 type, which would be his best position, and he clearly has ability.

 

I'm not sure if he regrets moving to England, is depressed, has been genuinely unlucky with injuries or whatever but I am guessing that the likelihood of things turning round now for him at Saints are pretty slim.

[Raging Bull]

Always been a flat-track bully, not a game-changer.

 

Not what we need........

 

What does this even mean?

[Toomer]

The only impact we get from Gaston is on the wage bill.

[eddie]

Always been a flat-track bully, not a game-changer.

 

Not what we need........

 

Not sure what you mean....!

[Patrick Bateman]

What does this even mean?

 

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/flat-track-bully

 

He's right.

[eddie]

http://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/flat-track-bully

 

He's right.

 

that's extremely helpful

 

although alpine_saint what do you mean by inferior opposition? lots of teams that were of lower quality than us last season toward December/Christmas time started to just sit back and play the long game, hitting us on the counter and making the playing space so tight that we couldn't pass around them. was he good at breaking down those kind of teams of lower quality, or do you just mean in general teams that were poor that ran at us would get torn apart?

[SaintJackoInHurworth]

Another question is whether he will be able to get a place in the first team squad. With more foreign players not developed in England, will we have a squad place to offer him? If not he will either have to wait for cup games or find a club able to take him on emergency loan.

[the saint in winchester]

I can definitely see him getting a game or two in the first team between now and christmas. I think RK/EK will get to know him very well watching him train each week, and maybe as their confidence in his best position and ability to step up increases, they may well stick him in for a game or two. Probably come on in last 20 mins of a game when we're 3-0 up, first.

 

not ITK, just a hunch

 

Yeah, we have to use him. It's daft to pay him and not use him at all. He knows he is drinking in the last-chance saloon and surely he would take his chance?

[mrfahaji]

Can he not be used as a winger? I was recalling how when I saw some of those inevitable YouTube clips when he signed, a lot of his best bits seemed to be out wide and beating players. He's never really been put there at Saints, so I'm guessing not, but it might be easier to give him a run out in that position.

[Saint Rees]

Seems strange that he's been in training with the rest of the first team for a few weeks now but hasn't been in any of the match day squads. If he wasn't in Koeman's plans then surely he'd have been shipped out? Perhaps he's still getting up to match sharpness and we might start seeing him on the bench in the coming weeks

[alpine_saint]

Seems strange that he's been in training with the rest of the first team for a few weeks now but hasn't been in any of the match day squads. If he wasn't in Koeman's plans then surely he'd have been shipped out? Perhaps he's still getting up to match sharpness and we might start seeing him on the bench in the coming weeks

 

Yeah, right. I guess Uruguay have a game coming up.

[NewYorkSaint]

'Prone to injury' has always struck me as an unfair label. It *might* be true, but if you're talking about, say, five different instances of getting injured, that could also easily just be bad luck. Also, any super-fast, tricksy player tends to get hacked down a lot. At his best, Gaston is beautiful to watch. Personally I hope he gets a chance this year to prove the naysayers wrong.

[VectisSaint]

Yeah, right. I guess Uruguay have a game coming up.

He's not in the Uruguay squad (they are playing Paraguay tomorrow). Hasn't been for some time. Currently training with the rest of the non/ex-internationals group, smallish group of about 9/10 players.

[saint1977]

Looked very bright under Adkins until that muscle injury flared up and then when he got fully fit again MP had come in and again looked good (W Ham and QPR home notably). However, once MP's very intense pressing game was established, that was never going to suit Gaston's strengths and not surprising he fell out of favour and probably contributed to his injuries.

 

I've wondered if he needs a slightly different training regime to get the best out of him and agree that he's a genuine number 10, that's where Nigel played him and got some great results. We do have a vacancy there so if he could get himself fit - physically and mentally - who knows but Koeman sounded quite frustrated in pre-season so must be something behind that in terms of resilience, which Tim Vickery hinted at when Gaston was linked with is.

 

For all the great things Cortese did, I've never understood why he spent so much on Gaston, a player who fitted Nigel's system (and reduced Lallana's effectiveness in the first season + injury v Reading) but clearly didn't fit the system and philosophy of the manager he was intending to bring in later that season.

[Totton Sotton]

Takes too long on the ball, always an extra touch he wants. Maybe if he learns to release the ball or cones deeper when we have control of the play he could be handy. He doesn't have the movement of Davis however Davis doesn't have the vision or finishing or gaston. People are forgetting he was a quality attacking assett and scored some cracking goals!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[The9]

Can he be better than Davis in attacking midfield? I'd say he can.

 

Better than Rodriguez or Mane (or Clasie for that matter) in the same position though?

[Lighthouse]

Can he be better than Davis in attacking midfield? I'd say he can.

 

Not with the attitude he seems to be showing recently.

 

If we're at home and we want to attack then it's Mané, J Rod and Tadic IMO. If we're away or defending a lead, you would probably want Davis or JWP in there. Kind of leaves Ramirez in no man's land.

[Jez]

He's not in the Uruguay squad (they are playing Paraguay tomorrow). Hasn't been for some time. Currently training with the rest of the non/ex-internationals group, smallish group of about 9/10 players.

 

That can only help him. Those long trips abroad and extra games never helped him to ingratiate himself into the team.

I love watching him play and hope he gets another chance - and actually takes it! Can't say I am very expectant he will do unfortunately.

[saint-crinny]

Been a defender of Gaston to a point, but where we are now, it's hard to imagine that he'll ever cut it for us in the Prem.

 

Ah well, we'll always have the spectacular false dawn that was his brilliant performance against Villa at home

[VectisSaint]

Not with the attitude he seems to be showing recently.

What attitude issues has he shown recently?

The problem with Gaston is not his attacking, but the trouble he gets us into with his ability to give the ball away and lack of defensive capabilities.

By the way someone asked if there is a squad place available, answer is yes. If I have got it right we have 16 overseas players and 8 home-based over 21s (K Davis, Long, S Davis, J Rod, Bertrand, Caulker, Isgrove & Forster), so actually we still have 1 "unused" squad place for an overseas player.

[Lord Duckhunter]

When are people going to give it up. " Clearly got talent " are people on a wind up? Mr Woo clearly had talent, he could juggle the ball, do all sorts of circus tricks , the problem comes when there' s other people trying to get the ball off him .

 

Some people completely and utterly over rate him which is laughable considering he never plays. Its nothing to do with injuries or managers not using him correctly and everything to do with him not being very good.

 

To say he's better than Steve Davis is an insult to a proper footballer. Why some people are baffled he's still here if Rons not going to use is beyond me . The reason he's still here is very simple, nobody else wants him.

[a1ex2001]

When are people going to give it up. " Clearly got talent " are people on a wind up? Mr Woo clearly had talent, he could juggle the ball, do all sorts of circus tricks , the problem comes when there' s other people trying to get the ball off him .

 

Some people completely and utterly over rate him which is laughable considering he never plays. Its nothing to do with injuries or managers not using him correctly and everything to do with him not being very good.

 

To say he's better than Steve Davis is an insult to a proper footballer. Why some people are baffled he's still here if Rons not going to use is beyond me . The reason he's still here is very simple, nobody else wants him.

 

Hi success in Italy and decent international record would suggest that somewhere in there is a half decent footballer, not Messi but he clearly knows his way around the pitch we have sadly only had a glimpse or two here maybe he isn't suited to the english game he wouldn't be the first Juan Veron was clearly quality but didn't do it here.

[Colinjb]

Ah well, we'll always have the spectacular false dawn that was his brilliant performance against Villa at home

 

Had Nigel Adkins stayed with Gaston in his more open attacking system I think he would have had a chance, alas.....

[Lord Duckhunter]

Hi success in Italy and decent international record would suggest that somewhere in there is a half decent footballer, not Messi but he clearly knows his way around the pitch we have sadly only had a glimpse or two here maybe he isn't suited to the english game he wouldn't be the first Juan Veron was clearly quality but didn't do it here.

 

He has not got a " decent international record" .

 

If its just a question of the English game, then surely a foreign club would be interested in him, even on loan. Even that head banger Osvaldo attracted suitors .

 

Maybe Aston Villa should buy him. After that performance revered in Saints folklore, forget The Mathews Final, " The Villa game" will be remembered long after we're all gone. The day that a **** poor shambles of a side we're ripped apart by the legend that is Gaston . The £12m performance , worth every penny.

 

Had Levy , Rodgers or Redknapp signed him and then kept banging on about one performance against sheite opposition , telling everybody he " clearly has talent" this forum would be collectively ****ing themselves laughing.

[alpine_saint]

He has not got a " decent international record" .

 

If its just a question of the English game, then surely a foreign club would be interested in him, even on loan. Even that head banger Osvaldo attracted suitors .

 

Maybe Aston Villa should buy him. After that performance revered in Saints folklore, forget The Mathews Final, " The Villa game" will be remembered long after we're all gone. The day that a **** poor shambles of a side we're ripped apart by the legend that is Gaston . The £12m performance , worth every penny.

 

Had Levy , Rodgers or Redknapp signed him and then kept banging on about one performance against sheite opposition , telling everybody he " clearly has talent" this forum would be collectively ****ing themselves laughing.

 

Brilliant.

 

As for the decent international record, one statistic stands head and shoulders above all others: He has never managed to play more than three professional games in a row

[saint-crinny]

He has not got a " decent international record" .

 

If its just a question of the English game, then surely a foreign club would be interested in him, even on loan. Even that head banger Osvaldo attracted suitors .

 

Maybe Aston Villa should buy him. After that performance revered in Saints folklore, forget The Mathews Final, " The Villa game" will be remembered long after we're all gone. The day that a **** poor shambles of a side we're ripped apart by the legend that is Gaston . The £12m performance , worth every penny.

 

Had Levy , Rodgers or Redknapp signed him and then kept banging on about one performance against sheite opposition , telling everybody he " clearly has talent" this forum would be collectively ****ing themselves laughing.

 

I didn't say that one performance meant he was some sort of superstar or worth the money, in fact, i basically said the opposite - that from his ill-fated time here, that is all we'll have to remember.

 

It was good though wasn't it, i genuinely thought we signed an absolute world beater after that

[Sydenhampton]

He was in the De Vere with his agent (I assume) on Thursday night, well technically early Friday morning - I noticed them post drowning my sorrows, they were sat on a sofa by the lift going through some documents. He looked sad.

 

Well I bet one of those documents wasn't his P60.

 

When he joined he was asked, why Southampton? I remember his response being "they want to pay me lots of money" or similar! Fast-forward to today and we still do. No-one will touch him with a barge pole while he's under contract with us, so he'll be quite happy to run the contract down & take his pay until it's ended. He's not stupid, he knows he won't get a fraction of what he's getting paid by us anywhere else so he won't go, even if he could.

 

No sympathy here and no expectancy of him doing a Puncheon either. I hope he enjoys one more freezing winter & that his boiler packs in.

[VectisSaint]

He has not got a " decent international record" .

Oh dear.

34 appearances for 17th ranked country in the world (and much higher when he was actually regularly in their squad which he hasn't been for the last 12 months) would suggest otherwise. All this at the age of 24. He had a lot more than one decent performance for us as well. Still, you and Alpine think he's rubbish so I guess you must be right. But, his biggest weakness remains him giving away the ball far too easily in centre midfield, if he sorts that out then he has a future.

[shirleysfc]

Brilliant.

 

As for the decent international record, one statistic stands head and shoulders above all others: He has never managed to play more than three professional games in a row

 

Is that actually true or is it one of those made up "facts" on here that has become gospel over time?

[Batman]

Oh dear.

34 appearances for 17th ranked country in the world (and much higher when he was actually regularly in their squad which he hasn't been for the last 12 months) would suggest otherwise. All this at the age of 24. He had a lot more than one decent performance for us as well. Still, you and Alpine think he's rubbish so I guess you must be right. But, his biggest weakness remains him giving away the ball far too easily in centre midfield, if he sorts that out then he has a future.

throw in Koeman and Pochetinno also. He could buy a game from them

[SW5 SAINT]

The signing of this man and Osvaldo must rank as Saints worst wastes of money of all time, with no sell on value on either. Even Spurs seemed to get to some money back from Soldado, Paulinho and the rest. No wonder Cortese got shown the door.

[tajjuk]

Can he not be used as a winger? I was recalling how when I saw some of those inevitable YouTube clips when he signed, a lot of his best bits seemed to be out wide and beating players. He's never really been put there at Saints, so I'm guessing not, but it might be easier to give him a run out in that position.

 

I seem to remember from when we beat Liverpool at St Mary's he played wide right and cut in with his left foot and had really good game, either setting up a goal or two but then was removed half time, presumably through another knock.

 

Comments from Koeman seem to suggest he's just always injured, whenever he's played the work rate seems to be there and there is plenty of quality there but he has never seemed able to string games together.

 

He also always looks happy and content at training (when he us training), seems to get on well with other squad members and there has not been much speculation or media about him agitating for a move or not happy.

 

I don't really get it, my only explanation is injuries, like he's never been fully fit.

[St Lej]

Gotta love Gashy.

[Mowgli]

Looked very bright under Adkins until that muscle injury flared up and then when he got fully fit again MP had come in and again looked good (W Ham and QPR home notably). However, once MP's very intense pressing game was established, that was never going to suit Gaston's strengths and not surprising he fell out of favour and probably contributed to his injuries.

 

I've wondered if he needs a slightly different training regime to get the best out of him and agree that he's a genuine number 10, that's where Nigel played him and got some great results. We do have a vacancy there so if he could get himself fit - physically and mentally - who knows but Koeman sounded quite frustrated in pre-season so must be something behind that in terms of resilience, which Tim Vickery hinted at when Gaston was linked with is.

 

For all the great things Cortese did, I've never understood why he spent so much on Gaston, a player who fitted Nigel's system (and reduced Lallana's effectiveness in the first season + injury v Reading) but clearly didn't fit the system and philosophy of the manager he was intending to bring in later that season.

 

Lord duck hunter would do well to read your post again. A very balanced and rational analysis of why a talented footballer does not fit in to our style of play. So much more informative than the emotional rants displayed elsewhere.

[Batman]

Lord duck hunter would do well to read your post again. A very balanced and rational analysis of why a talented footballer does not fit in to our style of play. So much more informative than the emotional rants displayed elsewhere.

 

who's style does he fit? no one really wants him do they

[Verbal Kint]

Looked very bright under Adkins until that muscle injury flared up and then when he got fully fit again MP had come in and again looked good (W Ham and QPR home notably). However, once MP's very intense pressing game was established, that was never going to suit Gaston's strengths and not surprising he fell out of favour and probably contributed to his injuries.

 

I've wondered if he needs a slightly different training regime to get the best out of him and agree that he's a genuine number 10, that's where Nigel played him and got some great results. We do have a vacancy there so if he could get himself fit - physically and mentally - who knows but Koeman sounded quite frustrated in pre-season so must be something behind that in terms of resilience, which Tim Vickery hinted at when Gaston was linked with is.

 

For all the great things Cortese did, I've never understood why he spent so much on Gaston, a player who fitted Nigel's system (and reduced Lallana's effectiveness in the first season + injury v Reading) but clearly didn't fit the system and philosophy of the manager he was intending to bring in later that season.

 

Good post. would also add I don't think playing him with a target man will suit him, so playing him with Lambert and then Pelle may not work. We do lack genuine no. 10s though and it looks as though he's staying, so let's hope Koeman can get something out of him

[hughieslastminutegoal]

They don't. If you had read the original link you would have noticed it referred to Bologna's return to Serie A, the whole reason for the speculation in the first place.

 

Sorry you didn't understand that when quoting that sentence I was asserting that Ramirez wasn't good enough for B (let alone A).

[Dalek2003]

The signing of this man and Osvaldo must rank as Saints worst wastes of money of all time, with no sell on value on either. Even Spurs seemed to get to some money back from Soldado, Paulinho and the rest. No wonder Cortese got shown the door.

 

Yes, those tow signings were 'heads gone' decisons, without a doubt.

[Patrick Bateman]

For all the great things Cortese did, I've never understood why he spent so much on Gaston, a player who fitted Nigel's system (and reduced Lallana's effectiveness in the first season + injury v Reading) but clearly didn't fit the system and philosophy of the manager he was intending to bring in later that season.

 

Isn't it obvious? It was his billy big b*llocks, "look at how much I can spend on one player regardless of how they'll fit the system" approach.

[Convict Colony]

Isn't it obvious? It was his billy big b*llocks, "look at how much I can spend on one player regardless of how they'll fit the system" approach.

 

Thats exactly the sort of irrational approach that successful swiss bankers are known for.

[Lighthouse]

Thats exactly the sort of irrational approach that successful swiss bankers are known for.

 

Swiss banker or not Cortese pretty much proved it with the Osvaldo signing, which was pretty much all about his own ego IMO. I'm sure it was more about his own reputation, going from -10 in League 1 to buying an Italian international striker and Serie A marksman.

 

I don't think Gaston was quite the same but there are some similarities, no coincidence that he also came from Italy.

[shirleysfc]

Swiss banker or not Cortese pretty much proved it with the Osvaldo signing, which was pretty much all about his own ego IMO. I'm sure it was more about his own reputation, going from -10 in League 1 to buying an Italian international striker and Serie A marksman.

 

I don't think Gaston was quite the same but there are some similarities, no coincidence that he also came from Italy.

 

I always thought Osvaldo was a Poch signing.

[a1ex2001]

He has not got a " decent international record" .

 

If its just a question of the English game, then surely a foreign club would be interested in him, even on loan. Even that head banger Osvaldo attracted suitors .

 

Maybe Aston Villa should buy him. After that performance revered in Saints folklore, forget The Mathews Final, " The Villa game" will be remembered long after we're all gone. The day that a **** poor shambles of a side we're ripped apart by the legend that is Gaston . The £12m performance , worth every penny.

 

Had Levy , Rodgers or Redknapp signed him and then kept banging on about one performance against sheite opposition , telling everybody he " clearly has talent" this forum would be collectively ****ing themselves laughing.

 

Scored 12 goals in 54 appearances for a mediocre team in Italy and has played 34 times for one of the best international sides yes he's total crap, lol. I love football fans,

[Lord Duckhunter]

Lord duck hunter would do well to read your post again. A very balanced and rational analysis of why a talented footballer does not fit in to our style of play. So much more informative than the emotional rants displayed elsewhere.

 

Doesn't fit Poch 's system, or Rons or even Steve Bruce's . Personally I don't buy the played well under Adkins either, weren't the Gastonettes hoping that Porch would give him the chances Adkins never did.

 

Whose system will he fit, because I'm sure we'd loan him out. Ask yourself why he can't find a club then decide who is the emotional one.