Man Utd probe sordid sex tape claims

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Have You Seen The Women Jeff Hangs Out With Tho Deano?

 

Propah nawty gurls.

[Coxford_lou]

This pretty much sums up what I, and I think Lou though I don't want to put words into her mouth, have been getting at. It's the varying perceptions of the people involved.

 

I'm not buying this "oh the story is about her, that's why I'm calling her a slag" crap. It's utter nonsense wrappedI up as an excuse to attack a woman for being involved in a consensual act between a man and woman.

 

I don't mean to single you out, or attack you personally UJ - and I genuinely apologise if it comes across that way, but this is a good example of what I am trying to get at.

 

Why should the perception of either party be different? Why should 'you come to expect it from blokes', or have a 'lower promiscuity factor than women' - you recognise yourself the inconsistency in attitudes towards the two people involved, based on their gender. Before talking about how much of a slapper she is, but not him.

 

Look, I'm not exactly extolling the virtues of getting hot and heavy in the toilets of a nightclub. It's not something I've done, or will likely ever do. But, the reactions highlight some of the broader issues in attitudes towards men and women. Everyone jumps to call her a bint, slag, slapper etc. If she dares say that she's upset at being filmed, it's her own fault. Again, this is nonsense, as with every single person who has made this stupid argument they don't seem to be so happy for someone to film them using the toilet (quite right too). Just because they are 'public toilets' (named so because they are open to use by the public at large, as opposed to private toilets used only by you or your guests in your home), doesn't mean you would expect anyone and everyone to have a good gander at what you are doing, and share it round to anyone.

 

It's the exact same ploy used against the victims of the photo hackings recently, who were mostly but not entirely female - "Well, if you didn't want your photo's all over the internet, you shouldn't have taken them". It's bullsh!t, and it's just yet another in a long history of men dictating what women should or should not do, and absolving their own ****ty actions. There's little blame or even worry that people are hacking people's phones, accessing and distributing private, intimate photographs. But, hey, these women are taking provocative photographs they are whores, they practically deserve this.

 

This attitude is damaging to everyone. Men and women. The ideas of what makes a man, and what makes a woman and any deviation from this makes you weird, or gay, or slag, or slapper etc places great pressure on men or women to act in a narrowly defined manner. It is bad for everyone.

 

Spot on KRG ! You definitely speak for me!!

[Coxford_lou]

It's an interesting credo Lou, and I've been running scenarios through it, and I agree that most of the time it seems to work.

 

I'm sure you'll tell me that you also see "shades of grey" in between the black and the white of your christo-hedonistic philosophy, but one area where the test fails - or at least comes under strain is where two people view the same act differently.

 

Let's assume that Cubicle Woman was in the toilets with Robin from Despatch, and not Robin from Wilmslow. And let's assume that no photographs were taken, but instead many people in the male toilets saw her in the act.

 

Let's then assume that one of the males that saw the act told his mate, who told his Mum, who is best mates with Cubicle Woman's mother in the tiny village where they live.

 

Perhaps Cubicle Woman felt she was living life to the full and enjoying the sort of sexual freedom that her generation has 'fought' for, but it might be that in the tiny village where they live, her mother may not hold the same view.

 

And to show balance, the story works the same way if the offended party was Robin from Despatch's mother - or father for that matter.

 

My reaction to the story, and perhaps that of a few others here, comes from imagining the sort of scenario I've described above.

 

I recognise that if social norms weren't challenged, then you might still be living in the barn with the cattle, so the situation above might be the motivation for Cubicle Woman to sit down with her mother and persuade her that things have changed, and that her mother must adjust her now-prudish views.

 

But even in that scenario, someone was still going to be hurt.

 

No?

 

I always enjoy a Bletch post, even though they're quite long. And even though he hurt my feelings by describing me as 'holier than thou' (though with training from Bear, I'm starting to toughen up).

 

The only trouble is, to give a proper response takes thought and time, which I've got none of today!

 

So I just wanted to apologise to Bletch if I don't respond. It's not because I don't want to.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Spot on KRG ! You definitely speak for me!!

 

God, he's such a ****ing suck up

[Lighthouse]

I don't think anyone is arguing this woman in a slapper because she got caught on video. She is a slapper because she hangs around with footballers in nightclubs and sucks them off in the gents. Same with the celebrity topless photos, I haven't seen anyone saying Jennifer Lawrence is a slag because of that.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

I don't think anyone is arguing this woman in a slapper because she got caught on video. She is a slapper because she hangs around with footballers in nightclubs and sucks them off in the gents. Same with the celebrity topless photos, I haven't seen anyone saying Jennifer Lawrence is a slag because of that.

 

A lot fitter than I thought beforehand though...

[bridge too far]

Spot on KRG ! You definitely speak for me!!

 

Me too

[saintbletch]

I always enjoy a Bletch post, even though they're quite long. And even though he hurt my feelings by describing me as 'holier than thou' (though with training from Bear, I'm starting to toughen up).

 

The only trouble is, to give a proper response takes thought and time, which I've got none of today!

 

So I just wanted to apologise to Bletch if I don't respond. It's not because I don't want to.

 

I want you to know Lou, that I'm purposely shooting wide from 5 yards here, and deliberately missing the open-goal opportunity to say that you're not the only female to say I'm too long (or male for that matter. ericofarabia was the last to cry "enough" whilst trying to accommodate my length.)

 

But for the record, I didn't call you 'holier than thou'. Or, if I did, I didn't intend to.

 

I actually (think) I said that you might need to be holier than thou in your arguments - if you're going to call others on inappropriate sexual stereotyping.

 

You may recall that you had deeply offended my sensibilities by intimating that I slept with my secretary, and said that us guys (presumably all of us) have a notion of women being angels on pedestals.

[Coxford_lou]

I want you to know Lou, that I'm purposely shooting wide from 5 yards here, and deliberately missing the open-goal opportunity to say that you're not the only female to say I'm too long (or male for that matter. ericofarabia was the last to cry "enough" whilst trying to accommodate my length.)

 

But for the record, I didn't call you 'holier than thou'. Or, if I did, I didn't intend to.

 

I actually (think) I said that you might need to be holier than thou in your arguments - if you're going to call others on inappropriate sexual stereotyping.

 

You may recall that you had deeply offended my sensibilities by intimating that I slept with my secretary, and said that us guys (presumably all of us) have a notion of women being angels on pedestals.

 

Oh shoot, I completely missed this Bletch! Sorry, I wasn't ignoring you!!

 

Well in that case, can I make an OFFICIAL APOLOGY to the Bletch. For any mistaken misunderstandings about whatever we were talking about at the time. We're all our own complex person and respond to the world in our own unique ways, and that is a fact, no matter how much society (whatever that means) wants to pressurise us into conformity.

 

Big love to ya on Valentine's Day. xxx

 

 

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