Current + Potential Denfensive Midfielder Comparisions

[Convict Colony]

Didn't want to hijack the jack cork thread with this so just thought i'd start one to start one that compares our current midfielders with ones we are linked with as a comparison for those that are interested.

 

As a basis for comparison I made Matic as the "current" most well regarded DM in the premier league who has 8 beast ratings (green) and is currently is rated 82 on Fifa 15 http://www.futhead.com/15/players/1044/nemanja-matic/

 

Current:

 

Morgan is rated as 81, he has 6 beast ratings (green) his strengths are stamina, passing, tackling and interceptions - http://www.futhead.com/15/players/11832/morgan-schneiderlin/

 

Vic is rated 75, he has 6 beast ratings (green) his strengths are stamina, aggression, stamina and shot power - http://www.futhead.com/15/players/16593/victor-wanyama/

 

Cork is rated 75, he has 0 beast ratings (green) his strengths are stamina, short passing, tackling and interceptions - http://://www.futhead.com/15/players/9864/jack-cork/

 

Harry is rated 62 but has potential 77, he has 1 beast rating (green) his strengths are balance, agility and short passing - http://://www.futhead.com/15/career-mode/players/9695/harrison-reed/

 

Potential:

 

Clasie is rated 76 but has potential 81, he has 5 beast ratings (green), his strengths are balance, stamina, ball control - http://://www.futhead.com/15/career-mode/players/7772/jordy-clasie/

 

Vilhena is rated 73, he has 1 beast rating (green), his strengths are ball control, reactions - http://www.futhead.com/15/players/198/tonny-vilhena/

[Grigsy]

What the **** is this? Jesus Christ.

[ericb]

have you just used a fu.cking computer game to do comparison's? Jesus christ there are some dins on here.

[nta786]

have you just used a fu.cking computer game to do comparison's? Jesus christ there are some dins on here.

 

this.

 

:mcinnes::mcinnes:

 

you've used fifa; seriously.

[Patrick Bateman]

have you just used a fu.cking computer game to do comparison's? Jesus christ there are some dins on here.

 

[Ulrich van Gobbel]

Unbelievable, imagine Premier League teams using a computer game as a scouting tool..

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/11025724/Football-Manager-player-database-to-be-used-by-Premier-League-clubs-after-deal-with-Prozone-Sports.html

[Saint Charlie]

have you just used a fu.cking computer game to do comparison's? Jesus christ there are some dins on here.

 

Auditioning for the role of internet forum hardman?

[Patrick Bateman]

Auditioning for the role of internet forum hardman?

 

Reaffirming your position as a forum dinlo?

[Wrensup]

okay.....

 

I play Fifa, but yeah Fifa is no way to judge.

 

on a side note I always sign Gergory Sertic as hes good on the game. Seen him play a few games for Bordeaux and thought he was decent.

 

Windows? you've seen him loads probably, any good in real life?

[Convict Colony]

Hahahaha given the love for Football Manager I reached out for something that can be used as a basis for comparison for our midfield v potential targets.

 

I wasn't saying recruit so and so due to their football ratings I was using 1 tool to review the same group of players to compare. Happy to use another basis if anyone has their own blackbox handy

[Wrensup]

http://www.whoscored.com

 

this website is full of stats, eg tackes per game, aerial duels and all that.

[Convict Colony]

http://www.whoscored.com

 

this website is full of stats, eg tackes per game, aerial duels and all that.

 

Doh thanks, I remember Man City were releasing their playing data so they could get fans to utilise sabermetrics all they had to do was register online, anyone know how that went ?

[shurlock]

Doh thanks, I remember Man City were releasing their playing data so they could get fans to utilise sabermetrics all they had to do was register online, anyone know how that went ?

 

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/09/premier-league-football-clubs-computer-analysts-managers-data-winning

 

Whenever anyone talks about stats, including our own salt-of-the-earth Les Reed, am pretty it's just glorified benchmarking.

 

Of course, there maybe good reasons for this as I don't think the use of advanced stats -say for predictive purposes- would generate much insight above what managers have intuitively understood since time immemorial.

[Convict Colony]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/09/premier-league-football-clubs-computer-analysts-managers-data-winning

 

Whenever anyone talks about stats, including our own salt-of-the-earth Les Reed, am pretty it's just glorified benchmarking.

 

Of course, there maybe good reasons for this as I don't think the use of advanced stats -say for predictive purposes- would generate much insight above what managers have intuitively understood since time immemorial.

 

Yeah 100% agree, stats just form a benchmark hence i just grabbed the 1st comparison tool I found. I think we will buy Clasie is Morgan goes as was widely reported during the summer.

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/southampton-plan-jordy-clasie-transfer-3903311

[Convict Colony]

Ok used squwaka as another option given its easy comparison style.

 

[cellone]

that's tiny

[Convict Colony]

basically says Morgan is the best at possession, Vic at attacking and Clasie at Defence

[cellone]

Then we need Clasie for the set.

[Secret Site Agent]

Unbelievable, imagine Premier League teams using a computer game as a scouting tool..

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/11025724/Football-Manager-player-database-to-be-used-by-Premier-League-clubs-after-deal-with-Prozone-Sports.html

It's not that he used a computer game but Fifa 15.

There's nothing wrong with using Football manager.

And what do you think our 'Black Box ' is?

[shurlock]

It's not that he used a computer game but Fifa 15.

There's nothing wrong with using Football manager.

And what do you think our 'Black Box ' is?

 

Come on, Football Manager has more in common with FIFA 15 than not.

[sotonist]

fifa is probably more credible than your average tabloid.

[iansums]

I had the most enormous dump this morning, for which I received two 'beast ratings'.

[Saint Luke]

My 14 year old son always quotes FIFA stats to me and even about players I know nothing about.

When I said we had signed Elia on loan I got a raft of information quoted to me - which all means nothing in real life.

Bl00dy FIFA

[Saint_clark]

Unbelievable, imagine Premier League teams using a computer game as a scouting tool..

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/11025724/Football-Manager-player-database-to-be-used-by-Premier-League-clubs-after-deal-with-Prozone-Sports.html

 

Have you read that article properly? Some of the info from FM is fed into a database used by clubs all over the world. Hardly Wenger sitting down at a computer with a copy of FM15 and using the "player search" function to find a new player is it.

[Convict Colony]

I would like to point out I've never played FIFA in my life, it was just the first result of a comparison search on google which I thought would play well to the audience.

 

I think everyone is getting distracted from what I was trying to initiate which was a discussion based on a tool for comparison of our midfielders.

 

Think based on FIFA and Squwaka I would let Jack go and recruit Clasie, 40k a week for Clasie would make him happy and upgrades on cork whilst also being able to step in for Morgan.

Edited 25 January, 2015 by Convict Colony

[Redslo]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/mar/09/premier-league-football-clubs-computer-analysts-managers-data-winning

 

Whenever anyone talks about stats, including our own salt-of-the-earth Les Reed, am pretty it's just glorified benchmarking.

 

Of course, there maybe good reasons for this as I don't think the use of advanced stats -say for predictive purposes- would generate much insight above what managers have intuitively understood since time immemorial.

 

That's what all the experts said about baseball until they stopped saying it because it made them look stupid.

[Redslo]

Have you read that article properly? Some of the info from FM is fed into a database used by clubs all over the world. Hardly Wenger sitting down at a computer with a copy of FM15 and using the "player search" function to find a new player is it.

 

A team who purchases access to the Prozone product has full searchable access to the FM database which is probably updated more often for Prozone than it is for the game. (And may include additional data.) It is not the same as doing a player search in game because that is deliberately limited in terms of effectiveness because, of course, the FM data base stats reflect the "real" game world so providing direct access to them is not realistic. Providing direct access to them in the real world is just another form of scouting--one that is more complete and efficient than Wenger using the FM player search function, but not really that different.

[Saint_clark]

A team who purchases access to the Prozone product has full searchable access to the FM database which is probably updated more often for Prozone than it is for the game. (And may include additional data.) It is not the same as doing a player search in game because that is deliberately limited in terms of effectiveness because, of course, the FM data base stats reflect the "real" game world so providing direct access to them is not realistic. Providing direct access to them in the real world is just another form of scouting--one that is more complete and efficient than Wenger using the FM player search function, but not really that different.

 

So the article trying to make out that Premier League teams are using Football Manager to scout players is utterly ridiculous and completely false, then.

[shurlock]

That's what all the experts said about baseball until they stopped saying it because it made them look stupid.

 

Baseball is arguably different from football, though. Football is more dynamic (yet there are fewer goals scored etc), making it difficult to isolate variables and come close to a controlled experiment. By contrast, at-base situations are fairly limited - if there is one aspect of football that has the nice cosy and tractable simplicity of baseball, it's probably corners and setpieces, though it is a small part of the game.

 

The article discusses some interesting, very nascent approaches (network theory) which might be more at home with the complexity of football: let see if they can uncover things that tika taka and its understanding of possession and pressing, which is pretty sophisticated, cannot.

Edited 26 January, 2015 by shurlock

[Redslo]

So the article trying to make out that Premier League teams are using Football Manager to scout players is utterly ridiculous and completely false, then.

 

No. Some teams were using FM before it became available in the more convenient form. (Some might still be using it because it is undoubtedly cheaper.) Also, using the FM database is different from using Prozone's product, but not enough different to make "utterly ridiculous and completely false" a fair characterization.

[Redslo]

Baseball is arguably different from football, though. Football is more dynamic (yet there are fewer goals scored etc), making it difficult to isolate variables and come close to a controlled experiment. By contrast, at-base situations are fairly limited - if there is one aspect of football that has the nice cosy and tractable simplicity of baseball, it's probably corners and setpieces, though it is a small part of the game.

 

The article discusses some interesting, very nascent approaches (network theory) which might be more at home with the complexity of football: let see if they can uncover things that tika taka and its understanding of possession and pressing, which is pretty sophisticated, cannot.

 

I basically agree. Baseball is, in many ways, a sequence of independent incidents with well over 100 years of data to look at. This makes if far more susceptible to analysis that football. My critique of the earlier statement is the idea that "what managers have intuitively understood since time immemorial" is likely to turn out to be correct. Sure some of it will, but some of it will turn out to be hilariously wrong. In baseball, for example, managers were right about the platoon advantage, but wrong about the relative value of walks, base hits, and stolen bases.