Leicestersaint Posted 14 January, 2015 Share Posted 14 January, 2015 What an awful game. I thought most of our team were fairly dire but full marks to Fonte, Long and Reed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint IQ Posted 14 January, 2015 Share Posted 14 January, 2015 F.A cup, I'll take 3rd place instead of 4th thankyouuuu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint IQ Posted 14 January, 2015 Share Posted 14 January, 2015 People saying 4th or even 3rd over F.A cup bemuse me. We could get into CL get knocked out straight away and go into europa or get knocked out in the group stage (which is likely) and haven't got a chance in hell of winning the thing. Will we remember that as much as an F.A win in 20, 30, 50 years time? I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 People saying 4th or even 3rd over F.A cup bemuse me. We could get into CL get knocked out straight away and go into europa or get knocked out in the group stage (which is likely) and haven't got a chance in hell of winning the thing. Will we remember that as much as an F.A win in 20, 30, 50 years time? I think not. ^^^^^ The truth, gentlemen ^^^^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpbury Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 If this 'mythical next level' of yours is defined as a club that finishes every season in the top six places then I've always thought (and still do btw) that SFC can never be that club - at least not on a sustainable basis. The question of sustainability being key here. One year in the Europe won't change SFC from what it is - a middle sized regional club - into a veritable giant of the game and neither would I sacrifice a (entirely theoretical) FA Cup triumph to keep Morgan Schneiderlin on board for another season - much as I have always admired him. What some on here are not facing up to is that the downside of European competition are that most, if not all, of the additional money generated will have to be spent on enlarging the squad and paying the increased wages that go along with European competition. Another huge problem many clubs have struggled with in the past is that the additional fixtures to be played can significant effect league form - someone told me it was 17 games to a Europa League final this season. It may be that the remarkable number of fans on here who'd put Europe before Cup glory can be explained as a generational thing - perhaps many older fans still considering the FA Cup to be a treasured competition that means something important to them, while the younger 'Sky Generation' on the other hand have been brought up watching the Champions League on TV and want of piece of that action whatever the cost. To me if that cost were to be a Cup Final then that price would be too high. I'm well aware of course that if we lose tonight this whole argument would become instantly moot ... I agree with this. My son gets really annoyed when I keep crapping on about how teams have collapsed after ten games, failed at Christmas, slumped in the second half of the season etc. I suppose we must dare to dream! Thinking back to '83, I don't recall anything other than a small glow of pride about finishing second - Liverpool had won weeks before, as Chelsea/City will probably do. Europe, I think, was a little bonus, but the only things that really mattered were Div 1 (primarily not getting relegated) and the FA Cup. Anyway, unless the choices are winning the league or the FA Cup, I pick FA cup. Would have picked league cup as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 (edited) People saying 4th or even 3rd over F.A cup bemuse me. We could get into CL get knocked out straight away and go into europa or get knocked out in the group stage (which is likely) and haven't got a chance in hell of winning the thing. Will we remember that as much as an F.A win in 20, 30, 50 years time? I think not. Those who are saying "3rd or 4th" over "FA Cup" aren't saying it because they don't want a "day to remember in 2015", they're saying it because they are looking longer term and more pragmatically (IMO). As some have highlighted, finishing in a CL spot means we'll need to assemble a much deeper and more versatile squad for next season, and we will be able to attract a higher quality of player in the process. And once we have that better squad we'll be also be better placed to challenge for a domestic cup. Win win. So, no, people advocating a top 4 league place aren't blithely discarding the chance of "a day to remember", they're simply thinking more longer term. 'The Southampton Way' is all about building-blocks. Even if we get knocked out of the CL at the first hurled, we will still have strengthened our foundations as a result of qualifying. Of course, if we end u doing both the season then everyone's a winner (babe). Just an alternative opinion of course. P.s. I actually think we'll fall short of a CL spot in the end but doesn't mean we shouldn't focus on trying to Edited 15 January, 2015 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smarmy Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 FA cup all day long. It is actually about winning things, y'know. Not qualifying for things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 (edited) Those who are saying "3rd or 4th" over "FA Cup" aren't saying it because they don't want a "day to remember in 2015", they're saying it because they are looking longer term and more pragmatically (IMO). As some have highlighted, finishing in a CL spot means we'll need to assemble a much deeper and more versatile squad for next season, and we will be able to attract a higher quality of player in the process. And once we have that better squad we'll be also be better placed to challenge for a domestic cup. Win win. So, no, people advocating a top 4 league place aren't blithely discarding the chance of "a day to remember", they're simply thinking more longer term. 'The Southampton Way' is all about building-blocks. Even if we get knocked out of the CL at the first hurled, we will still have strengthened our foundations as a result of qualifying. Of course, if we end u doing both the season then everyone's a winner (babe). Just an alternative opinion of course. P.s. I actually think we'll fall short of a CL spot in the end but doesn't mean we shouldn't focus on trying to Next season we will most likely be a top 8 to top 4 side, regardless of whether we win the FA Cup, get knocked out of the CL qualifier or make the CL group stage. Not sure we will suddenly hugely change our acquisition strategy, we're still going to be buying Tadic types. And we won't budget for regular CL campaigns, meaning we aren't going to throw 4 year CL contracts at CL "level" players. CL qualification might keep Morgan (or Toby) here but it might not. The only certainty if we win the FA Cup in 2015 is that we would have won the FA Cup in 2015. Finishing fourth might not be the gates to paradise some "long term thinkers" believe it to be. A desire to win the FA Cup is as equally a long term perspective. Edited 15 January, 2015 by CB Fry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 Next season we will most likely be a top 8 to top 4 side, regardless of whether we win the FA Cup, get knocked out of the CL qualifier or make the CL group stage. Not sure we will suddenly hugely change our acquisition strategy, we're still going to be buying Tadic types. And we won't budget for regular CL campaigns, meaning we aren't going to throw 4 year CL contracts at CL "level" players. CL qualification might keep Morgan (or Toby) here but it might not. The only certainty if we win the FA Cup in 2015 is that we would have won the FA Cup in 2015. Finishing fourth might not be the gates to paradise some "long term thinkers" believe it to be. Fair point. Yep, I agree that it wouldn't alter our recruitment policy fundamentally but I still see it as a route to increasing the overall depth and quality of the squad. Its a game of fine margins and if CL qualification results in a, say, 10% increase in squad depth and quality over and above what it would have been otherwise then that is significant enough IMO. I still want us to win the FA Cup this year as well of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 Fair point. Yep, I agree that it wouldn't alter our recruitment policy fundamentally but I still see it as a route to increasing the overall depth and quality of the squad. Its a game of fine margins and if CL qualification results in a, say, 10% increase in squad depth and quality over and above what it would have been otherwise then that is significant enough IMO. I still want us to win the FA Cup this year as well of course. Agree it could be the difference for Toby or Victor staying. CL qualification I see more as a retention driver than a recruitment driver. I worry fans are going to get carried away - European football is in our vision but so is being a sustainable club. "It" will not be "gone for". Unless that "it" is the cup.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 Its the wrong question really - ALL fans would love us to WIN the cup - history books for ever, trophy in the cabinet, open top bus... etc. NO contest against a CUP WIN... but a WIN is not guaranteed - so the question is whether a good cup run maybe getting to semis or whatever v qualifying for the champions league. For fans winning the cup is the best - but in the modern era where the top clubs have budgets that are 5-8 times that of saints, to finish 3rd or 4th would be the bigger sporting achievement. CB Fry suggests that we will probably be a 4th-8th side next season whatever happens... and that is true to some extent. But for me that is EXACTLY why we should be focused on the league this season - because we will NOT get this sort of chance to gain CL qualification every year - whereas the Cup is always there and the road to the final is as much down to the luck of the draw as anything else. CL group stage qualification would be great for fans - sure we will be fighting for the 3rd spot, but who cares if the draw is good against some European heavy weights? its a chance to experience that something different - and cup runs we CAN have every year. I think a club like Saints qualifying for the CL would also be amazing for the game in this country - fans of those top four sides who seem to believe its their right to be in those slots - when its only the cash advantage that gives them that annual success - need to be brought down a peg or two ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 4th place or FAC - FAC 3rd place or FAC - 3rd place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintSteve Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 Top four for me every time.. a good cup run is a welcome bonus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sussexsaint Posted 15 January, 2015 Share Posted 15 January, 2015 Top 4 would be a more impressive achievement than a cup win. It would send far more shockwaves through domestic football than a more 'provincial' club winning the FA cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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