Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 You still haven't answered mintys earlier question about what the answer is to all these nasty Muslims. So because thousands of people are being killed the world over in the name of Islam, I've got to have a solution for them? How does that work? Bizarre. Tell us more about Islam's contribution to western society in terms of "it encourages creativity, promotes understanding across cultures and in general means that people can assimilate into a culture quite seamlessly." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Care to point out where exactly I have expressed anything along those lines? Whilst we are at it, Christianity isn't exactly a bastion of Womens rights either, is it? Well at least in Christianity , women get a right to education . The Taliban and those with similar ideologies do not allow females any form of education or life . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Religion is backwards. Everything I think religious people do is backwards **pulls out bizarre extreme hypothetical**. If people think differently to me, they are backwards and living in the past. I truly am the tolerant one. How are your lists coming on for comparable terrorist attacks to those from Islam for 2013? Got past Guy Fawkes yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Jesus christ, what the hell has saying "religion is out-dated" got to do with being tolerant? No one is saying people can't be "religious" - stop trying to create arguments out of nothing, it's boring. I don't think he understands the points being discussed to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Kelvinsrightglove What are your views on this groups latest atrocities Boko Haram militants in Nigeria have reportedly killed dozens of people in the northeastern region of Kukawa over several days, according to witnesses.. Another episode of indiscriminate by these thugs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 The developed world has gone step, by step away from religion, and quite rightly. Most of the developed world manages quite easily without religion. http://www.pewforum.org/2012/12/18/global-religious-landscape-exec/ - Worldwide, more than eight-in-ten people identify with a religious group. A comprehensive demographic study of more than 230 countries and territories conducted by the Pew Research Center’s Forum on Religion & Public Life estimates that there are 5.8 billion religiously affiliated adults and children around the globe, representing 84% of the 2010 world population of 6.9 billion. I know it's an estimate, but you have to go quite some way even to get down to 49% to qualify your statement that 'most of the developed world manages quite easily without religion.' Perhaps you should take some time to understand a bit more about why people are religious and what it means to them, to understand it's place in modern society, before dismissing it so easily? As I said previously, I speak as an Atheist who bases his beliefs on science. But IMO to understand the world we live in, and the human race, you need to make some attempt to understand and respect all aspects of it, even those bits you don't agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 So because thousands of people are being killed the world over in the name of Islam, I've got to have a solution for them? How does that work? Bizarre. No, but all for your criticism you must have some idea of how we might go about changing things for the better? Anything at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 http://www.pewforum.org/2012/12/18/global-religious-landscape-exec/ - I know it's an estimate, but you have to go quite some way even to get down to 49% to qualify your statement that 'most of the developed world manages quite easily without religion.' Perhaps you should take some time to understand a bit more about why people are religious and what it means to them, to understand it's place in modern society, before dismissing it so easily? As I said previously, I speak as an Atheist who bases his beliefs on science. But IMO to understand the world we live in, and the human race, you need to make some attempt to understand and respect all aspects of it, even those bits you don't agree with. I don't know a single person that goes to church, prays, reads the bible and that's across various work offices, neighbours, families, friends, the lot. I'm sure loads of people "identify" with a religious group, stick on their Census form "Catholic" Or went to a "C of E" school, but actually practice the religion in any way, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 How are your lists coming on for comparable terrorist attacks to those from Islam for 2013? Got past Guy Fawkes yet? You mean the lists on the very front page of Google you couldn't find Or all the other examples you've chosen to ignore. And, predictably he doesn't understand, you're angry, you're confused etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 I don't know a single person that goes to church, prays, reads the bible and that's across various work offices, neighbours, families, friends, the lot. I'm sure loads of people "identify" with a religious group, stick on their Census form "Catholic" Or went to a "C of E" school, but actually practice the religion in any way, no. But that wasn't the point - you claimed the developed world had moved away from religion, whereas that study clearly shows it hasn't. The degree to which people practice their faith wasn't specified... is that now important? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Kelvinsrightglove What are your views on this groups latest atrocities Boko Haram militants in Nigeria have reportedly killed dozens of people in the northeastern region of Kukawa over several days, according to witnesses.. Another episode of indiscriminate by these thugs Did you find where I was endorsing the treatment of women in Islam? I'm guessing raising a totally unrelated act of violence means no. I'm not aware of this one, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say it's a vile act. Like I would any act which involves murdering people. Again, where have I said anything that suggests I would condone it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 No, but all for your criticism you must have some idea of how we might go about changing things for the better? Anything at all? The problem is, I don't think much can and will be done in practice for some while, that's the worst and most worrying thing about it. Do any of us think yesterday's attack was the last of it's kind for the time being? Do you have a solution? Do any of the powers that be have a way of stopping it, apart from last ditch, secret service activities? What I would like to see, is a concerted, long-term effort from government agencies to pull communities away from being influenced, focused, controlled by religion, particularly Islam. The problem is two fold. Being seen as "un-PC" still scares too many politicians and pushing the problem even further underground. How the world tackles something like Boko Haram, I've no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 But that wasn't the point - you claimed the developed world had moved away from religion, whereas that study clearly shows it hasn't. The degree to which people practice their faith wasn't specified... is that now important? Do a comparison between church attendance in 1850, 1950 and 2014?The degree to which people practice their faith ultimately matters completely. If they've gone from devoutly following the teachings of their clergymen and holy book to merely "identifying" with a particular religion, how is that not clearly moving away from religion. I've got mates that will always say they're Catholic, but they're the least religious people you could ever hope to meet. As a rough percentage, how many people do you know go to church regularly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 The problem is, I don't think much can and will be done in practice for some while, that's the worst and most worrying thing about it. Do any of us think yesterday's attack was the last of it's kind for the time being? Do you have a solution? Do any of the powers that be have a way of stopping it, apart from last ditch, secret service activities? What I would like to see, is a concerted, long-term effort from government agencies to pull communities away from being influenced, focused, controlled by religion, particularly Islam. The problem is two fold. Being seen as "un-PC" still scares too many politicians and pushing the problem even further underground. How the world tackles something like Boko Haram, I've no idea. How do you reckon government agencies should go about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 You mean the lists on the very front page of Google you couldn't find Or all the other examples you've chosen to ignore. And, predictably he doesn't understand, you're angry, you're confused etc. Hundreds and hundreds of Islmaic incidents from 2013 alone versus Guy Fawkes, you couldn't make it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 How do you reckon government agencies should go about that? As a quick win, no religious schools of any kind. What would your solution be to stop future attacks of this nature? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Right wing bias from the usual source I guess http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/18/lahore-high-court-asia-bibi-death-penalty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Let's be honest. There is an evil coming out of Islam at the moment. An evil we seem pretty unwilling to accept properly or sort out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Lion Tamer Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 As a quick win, no religious schools of any kind. What would your solution be to stop future attacks of this nature? A good suggestion. I would also suggest that if you raise people out of poverty then suddenly all this blasphemy stuff won't seem quite so important anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 Let's be honest. There is an evil coming out of Islam at the moment. An evil we seem pretty unwilling to accept properly or sort out. But this is the problem, laying it all at the door of Islam. The problem is religion driven fundermantalist full stop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 (edited) What do you mean "you genuinely think that's how people view religion"? Do people not pray to God? And follow Halal or Kosher etc? The developed world has gone step, by step away from religion, and quite rightly. Most of the developed world manages quite easily without religion. They do so but its a question of motivation. Am sure there are many true believers (not all of whom are murderously violent, mind you). But am equally sure that much rule-following -the type you mention, "following Halal or Kosher"- is simply a commitment device, a way to ground a community and secure the benefits of cooperation. Many zealots will be the first to point out that religious observance and religiosity are not the same thing -indeed some go so far as say that one interferes with the other. Needless to say, for every community -unless we are are talking about a truly cosmopolitan world (not on the horizon anytime soon)- there will be insiders and outsiders -and therein lies the problem. In this respect, it's debatable whether secular communities -the nation state being the obvious example- have a fantastically superior record to religious communities in managing the relationship between insiders and outsiders over the last century; but I agree they draw the boundaries of the community more inclusively, albeit perhaps with declining levels of commitment. As far as political Islam (and fundamentalism more generally) is concerned, it would be much more constructive to view it as a modern phenonomenon (and no I dont simply mean geopolitical, Papesque causes). Rehearsing hoary, Enlightenment debates about the backwardness of religion captures only a small part of what it is, what drives it and what can be done to combat it. Olivier Roy's "Globalised Islam: The Search for a New Ummah" is very convincing in this regard. Edited 9 January, 2015 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 You genuinely think that's how people view religion - I'd say it's often a cultural phenomenon with practices that help sustain a community. That can serve some pretty useful functions - notably, allowing individuals to cooperate and come to each other's assistance where mutual distrust might otherwise be the norm. The flipside to that is that it creates extreme ideology, insular societies and distrust between different religious groups and in some cases encourages violence (and lets be honest that is the case of both Christianity and Islam) There is no right or wrong answer, I am deeply Athiest, does that mean I am going to chastise people for believing in something that is so very unlikely ? No, everyone is entitled to their beliefs rightly or wrongly. The truth of the matter is there is a black and white in everything. For all the good religion brings there is bad. Religious extremism isnt anything new, and as barbaric as the shootings are it probably isnt anywhere near as barbaric as history suggests. Clamping down on islam isnt the answer, as others have said before there was no clamping down on christianity due to the rise of neo-nazism or the breivik incident. Tolerence needs to be applied on both sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 The flipside to that is that it creates extreme ideology, insular societies and distrust between different religious groups and in some cases encourages violence (and lets be honest that is the case of both Christianity and Islam) There is no right or wrong answer, I am deeply Athiest, does that mean I am going to chastise people for believing in something that is so very unlikely ? No, everyone is entitled to their beliefs rightly or wrongly. The truth of the matter is there is a black and white in everything. For all the good religion brings there is bad. Religious extremism isnt anything new, and as barbaric as the shootings are it probably isnt anywhere near as barbaric as history suggests. Clamping down on islam isnt the answer, as others have said before there was no clamping down on christianity due to the rise of neo-nazism or the breivik incident. Tolerence needs to be applied on both sides. Agreed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 The flipside to that is that it creates extreme ideology, insular societies and distrust between different religious groups and in some cases encourages violence (and lets be honest that is the case of both Christianity and Islam) There is no right or wrong answer, I am deeply Athiest, does that mean I am going to chastise people for believing in something that is so very unlikely ? No, everyone is entitled to their beliefs rightly or wrongly. The truth of the matter is there is a black and white in everything. For all the good religion brings there is bad. Religious extremism isnt anything new, and as barbaric as the shootings are it probably isnt anywhere near as barbaric as history suggests. Clamping down on islam isnt the answer, as others have said before there was no clamping down on christianity due to the rise of neo-nazism or the breivik incident. Tolerence needs to be applied on both sides. Agree - you preempt some of what I say in my follow-up post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 (edited) As a quick win, no religious schools of any kind. What would your solution be to stop future attacks of this nature? In all honesty you cant. There is a conceivable threat that there could be a retaliative attack on mosques or worse etc from christian groups. Unfortunately its so difficult to police. Personally I think that certain immigration should be curtailed, to a degree, but thats a different situation. Effectively banning Islam will, IMO, have a greater effect of pushing practising islamists into the arms of the extremists. The only real way is to effectively brush it off and not change as a society. Removing the right to follow a religion etc will be more damaging to our rights of freedom then it will be effective at stopping extremism Edited 8 January, 2015 by Smirking_Saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 8 January, 2015 Share Posted 8 January, 2015 But this is the problem, laying it all at the door of Islam. The problem is religion driven fundermantalist full stop. I'm not laying it all on Islam Just saying there is a pure evil coming from Islam. Why that is happening I do not know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 I'm not laying it all on Islam Just saying there is a pure evil coming from Islam. Why that is happening I do not know. There is arguably an equal evil rearing its head in germany right now as was apparant with the marches in Dresden etc. Ok, its not so religiously charged as the Islamic extremists are but it is still effectively a religious group denouncing another religious group. (Stereotype alert)Personally I think its all about education, we are generally more tolerant as a society compared to many islamic societies towards other ways of life and I think its because we are more educated. There are however three things that control radicalisation; Oppression (or the belief of such) - As is apparant in Germany(past and present scarily), possibly in factions such as the EDL and in islamic factions such as IS etc. Impressionable characters - Who I suggest tend to be more mentally fragile or less educated IMO. Can be convinced that they are being oppressed. Fear - IS and factions such as the original Nazi's were good at this, effectively threatening people to see things there way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 The flipside to that is that it creates extreme ideology, insular societies and distrust between different religious groups and in some cases encourages violence (and lets be honest that is the case of both Christianity and Islam) There is no right or wrong answer, I am deeply Athiest, does that mean I am going to chastise people for believing in something that is so very unlikely ? No, everyone is entitled to their beliefs rightly or wrongly. The truth of the matter is there is a black and white in everything. For all the good religion brings there is bad. Religious extremism isnt anything new, and as barbaric as the shootings are it probably isnt anywhere near as barbaric as history suggests. Clamping down on islam isnt the answer, as others have said before there was no clamping down on christianity due to the rise of neo-nazism or the breivik incident. Tolerence needs to be applied on both sides. Neo Nazis weren't religious, ultimately it was a secular movement, Brevik was a one off lunatic, that was more "anti-Islam" than "pro-Christianity", thankfully. But I'd have no problem if anyone wanted to clamp down on Christianity as a result; the difference is Christianity is slowly fading away in Western Europe (good thing in my eyes), Islam is growing (bad thing in my eyes). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 There is arguably an equal evil rearing its head in germany right now as was apparant with the marches in Dresden etc. Interesting comparison there. How many people have the marchers in Dresden killed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 I'm not laying it all on Islam Just saying there is a pure evil coming from Islam. Why that is happening I do not know. No, according to this thread, there is no difference between Islam and any other religions current impact on the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) Well at least in Christianity , women get a right to education . The Taliban and those with similar ideologies do not allow females any form of education or life . Really? It is hardly equal rights in the Bible... Timothy 2:11-15 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. Peter 3:1 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands. Colossians 3:18 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord. Titus 2:4-5 Teach the young women to be obedient to their own husbands ......... There are hundreds of other examples of some bizarre "morality" in the Bible. Edited 9 January, 2015 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 Islam is completely backwards and does not fit or integrate with modern society. Utter bol loxs. Granted a very small hardcore refuse to but the vast majority, like the rest if us, just want a quiet life and raise their kids to do well for themselves. A cherry picked version of Christianity or Islam allows for the "quiet life" as you put it. But the "moderate" Christians and Muslims are going against scripture and their Deity. If you cherry pick the bit of whichever Holy Book you follow that you like and discard the bits you don't then you are creating your own morality and in which case why do you need the scripture at all as you can do it all yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 A cherry picked version of Christianity or Islam allows for the "quiet life" as you put it. But the "moderate" Christians and Muslims are going against scripture and their Deity. If you cherry pick the bit of whichever Holy Book you follow that you like and discard the bits you don't then you are creating your own morality and in which case why do you need the scripture at all as you can do it all yourself? You've embarrassed yourself with regards to religion enough on here. I would have thought you would have learnt your lesson by now. As I predicted in that thread you would run away, ignore it and then pop up again as if nothing happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) You've embarrassed yourself with regards to religion enough on here. I would have thought you would have learnt your lesson by now. As I predicted in that thread you would run away, ignore it and then pop up again as if nothing happened. I haven't seen anything close to a good rebuttal of anything I've said about religion. You insult me, say I've "embarrassed myself", but don't offer a rebuttal. What in the post you've quoted do you disagree with and why? Edited 9 January, 2015 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 As a quick win, no religious schools of any kind. What would your solution be to stop future attacks of this nature? I think we have to accept that human nature means that sadly attacks like this are inevitable. They have existed in some form or another for as long as we have been here and so it is about minimising them through education and through continued vigilance from those in authority. Imo banning religious schools whilst I can see the argument would make not one iota of difference to the current situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) I think we have to accept that human nature means that sadly attacks like this are inevitable. They have existed in some form or another for as long as we have been here and so it is about minimising them through education and through continued vigilance from those in authority. Imo banning religious schools whilst I can see the argument would make not one iota of difference to the current situation. Religious schools make it an Us vs Them situation for impressionable youngsters. It helps breed brainwash kids into a potential path towards actions of terror if they take the scriptures word. It isn't at all helpful in the slightest and allows means children are labeled as "Catholic", "Protestant", "Christian", "Muslim" etc simply for fluke of birth being born into a family and culture. Schools should be secular, children should make up their own minds and not have labels put upon them. Edited 9 January, 2015 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 I think we have to accept that human nature means that sadly attacks like this are inevitable. They have existed in some form or another for as long as we have been here and so it is about minimising them through education and through continued vigilance from those in authority. Imo banning religious schools whilst I can see the argument would make not one iota of difference to the current situation. Fair enough, it's sad that we have to continue to accept this level of violence as part of Islam's input to our lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) Religious schools make it an Us vs Them situation for impressionable youngsters. It isn't at all helpful in the slightest and allows means children are labeled as "Catholic", "Protestant", "Christian", "Muslim" etc simply for fluke of birth being born into a family and culture. Schools should be secular, children should make up their own minds and not have labels put upon them. http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?52806-Clarke-Carlisle Anything to add to this thread? Seems like you massively embarrassed yourself and then ran away when you realised your error. I know you are trying your absolute hardest to turn this thread into another one of your militant atheist anti-religious rants but you didn't finish the last one. Edited 9 January, 2015 by hypochondriac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 Fair enough, it's sad that we have to continue to accept this level of violence as part of Islam's input to our lives. It's sad that we have to accept any violence from any number of sources throughout human history but then there has always been human nature and there has always been extremists. It's a shame I agree but as you yourself say you don't have any answers to it, so it's something we have to learn to live with and help to mitigate the effects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?52806-Clarke-Carlisle Anything to add to this thread? Seems like you massively embarrassed yourself and then ran away when you realised your error. Why do you keep quoting me as if you disagree with the post but then make no comment about why or what you disagree with? Instead you have bring up the Clarke Carlisle thread and claimed I "embarrassed myself", and AGAIN offer no explanation as to what I said that was embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 It's sad that we have to accept any violence from any number of sources throughout human history but then there has always been human nature and there has always been extremists. It's a shame I agree but as you yourself say you don't have any answers to it, so it's something we have to learn to live with and help to mitigate the effects. No, I gave you a quick answer as a starting point. You're the one that said there is no solution and we've just got to accept Islamic terrorism in our lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) It's sad that we have to accept any violence from any number of sources throughout human history but then there has always been human nature and there has always been extremists. It's a shame I agree but as you yourself say you don't have any answers to it, so it's something we have to learn to live with and help to mitigate the effects. Suicide bombers and genital mutliation are pretty much exclusively carried out for religious purposes. Religious schools label children with the religion of their parents (through fluke of birth), indoctrinate them and create an Us vs Them mentality. They aren't healthy for society and create a breeding ground for the thinking that leads to suicide bombers and religious killing sprees. Edited 9 January, 2015 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 No, I gave you a quick answer as a starting point. You're the one that said there is no solution and we've just got to accept Islamic terrorism in our lives. I think we have to accept that human nature dictates that terrorism has always existed in some form and that it will continue to exist long after we are dead unless human beings can fundamentally alter what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 I think we have to accept that human nature dictates that terrorism has always existed in some form and that it will continue to exist long after we are dead unless human beings can fundamentally alter what they are. As I said in response to you saying religious schools shouldn't be banned and you ignored.. Religious schools make it an Us vs Them situation for impressionable youngsters. It isn't at all helpful in the slightest and allows means children are labeled as "Catholic", "Protestant", "Christian", "Muslim" etc simply for fluke of birth being born into a family and culture. Schools should be secular, children should make up their own minds based on evidence and not have labels put upon them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 Night all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 Night all Time after time after time after time after time I put a rebuttal to you and you ignore it and instead go for a petty personal argument or quit the debate. Its almost as if you have no real foundation of any substance to you view, but it couldn't be that could it... surely...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 I think we have to accept that human nature dictates that terrorism has always existed in some form and that it will continue to exist long after we are dead unless human beings can fundamentally alter what they are. Can you name an example of suicide bomber that wasn't motivated by a religious cause? It is largely entirely due to religion that someone acts in such a way and they do so because they take the scripture literally rather than cherry pick it like religious moderates do. Good people do good things, bad people to do bad things, in order to get a "good" person to do a bad thing it often takes religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 A cherry picked version of Christianity or Islam allows for the "quiet life" as you put it. But the "moderate" Christians and Muslims are going against scripture and their Deity. If you cherry pick the bit of whichever Holy Book you follow that you like and discard the bits you don't then you are creating your own morality and in which case why do you need the scripture at all as you can do it all yourself? Cherrypicking says the simpleton who ignores a rich history of hermeneutics Are you surprised that nobody takes you seriously and can be bothered to respond when you reappear unrepentant from your last hiding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 Cherrypicking says the simpleton who ignores a rich history of hermeneutics Are you surprised that nobody takes you seriously and can be bothered to respond when you reappear unrepentant from your last hiding. So people don't respond to MLG because he didn't admit he'd got something wrong previously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 9 January, 2015 Share Posted 9 January, 2015 (edited) Cherrypicking says the simpleton who ignores a rich history of hermeneutics I ignore it because it is fundamentality flawed. Why would Holy scripture require hermeneutics if it was divinely inspired by an all powerful Deity? Why leave open the possibility for his word to be misunderstood? If he exists he is inept at revealing his word to the world's population throughout time. Are you a Christian? Do you believe the 10 commandments (and the other 600+ often overlooked commandments) are the law of your God? Should they be carried out in full? If not, why not? What hermeneutics have you used to decide that? Are you surprised that nobody takes you seriously and can be bothered to respond when you reappear unrepentant from your last hiding. I'm yet to have someone explain why that thread gave me a "hiding". They avoid the question, as you have done. Edited 9 January, 2015 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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