Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Just recently I saw RK criticised for not playing Targett and pushing Bertrand forward. Now he is criticised for doing just that. RK wasn't the best manager in the world when we were 2nd and he isn't the worst now we have lost several games on the trot. We have done well to get where we are but were always going to struggle with injuries and suspensions. The real work starts now. Not by me that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaiser Soze Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Hate to say it but he's beginning to show his flaws now. Koeman out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I think that RK should have shaked Cloughs hand but by all accounts the Sheff United benches behaviour was appalling all night. They had one guy sent to the stands and were constantly questioning decisions and trying to get our players sent off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Not quite with you there but when you have 3 CMs of which one is injured and the other 2 on 4 yellows you do not send them both out against a 3 rd division side in a MM Cup game on a northern quagmire in midwinter. To boot you put your regular LB at LM and a kiddy at LB, you then realise that the kiddy isn't getting the job done at HT so you take him off, play your regular LB at LB and put a no hoper at LM. Then when you need to take one of your CMs off because the other has been booked you can't because you've wasted your sub possibilities on some half baked schema that dawned on you whilst you were having a crap or something. Koeman was criticised for some of his decisions in Spain, I can see why now. I mean when Victor got booked the game was up for him, no game on Saturday, so take Morgan off and leave Toby in MF with Victor, nope he leaves Morgan on to get booked and takes Victor off.I'm sure you are right about all the tactical stuff, but I have great sympathy for RK. he took on a club that sold a lot of quality and replaced them with untested players for the rigours of the PL. Fans like myself were concerned that the team would gel (Koeman by luck/miracle/great management made us start as champions) and also that the squad was too thin. Many of the Boards fans on here were calling fans who had genuine concerns for the longterm were called bedwetters etc. It is seems to me the chicken has come back to roost and perhaps some of the fans who were pretty scornful of me and others are now seeing that some of our concerns were sound. We need at least 5 decent players to supplement the current squad, and that is if we dont sell anyone. Koeman is the brightest part of the Summer to my mind and i think we will regret it if he gets abuse form the fanbase, he has been dealt a weak hand and must make the best of a poor lot. The much heralded talent spotters with King Les at the top is looking a little poor at present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I'm sure you are right about all the tactical stuff, but I have great sympathy for RK. he took on a club that sold a lot of quality and replaced them with untested players for the rigours of the PL. Fans like myself were concerned that the team would gel (Koeman by luck/miracle/great management made us start as champions) and also that the squad was too thin. Many of the Boards fans on here were calling fans who had genuine concerns for the longterm were called bedwetters etc. It is seems to me the chicken has come back to roost and perhaps some of the fans who were pretty scornful of me and others are now seeing that some of our concerns were sound. We need at least 5 decent players to supplement the current squad, and that is if we dont sell anyone. Koeman is the brightest part of the Summer to my mind and i think we will regret it if he gets abuse form the fanbase, he has been dealt a weak hand and must make the best of a poor lot. The much heralded talent spotters with King Les at the top is looking a little poor at present. Koeman has done a good job but he got it all wrong last night. No manager in his right mind would send his only 2 DMs out on 4 cards in the first place, to then compound it by taking the booked one off in a game that was getting tetchy even to the manager's benches, it was just suicidal. Unless of course he wanted them both to miss the Everton game and be available for Palarse and Chelsea for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Last night was poor and City did a number on us but other than that we have been a decent side so far this season and well worthy of a top 6 place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Maybe koeman should have given up before we started? We weren't going to win it anyway eh? Plank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madruss Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Hate to say it but he's beginning to show his flaws now. Koeman out. Yes, Koeman out. Let's get one of those flawless managers in. You know the ones, plenty to choose from. Then if they show any signs of being flawed, we'll just sack them too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Yes, Koeman out. Let's get one of those flawless managers in. You know the ones, plenty to choose from. Then if they show any signs of being flawed, we'll just sack them too! Andy Awford likely to be available soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Hate to say it but he's beginning to show his flaws now. Koeman out. Get back in your hole, idiot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Maybe koeman should have given up before we started? We weren't going to win it anyway eh? Plank. Talking to me ? Yes we should not have played the 2 senior CMs, just as I said yesterday, what I feared happened exactly as I feared it would. We lost and picked up suspensions by the bucket load. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iansums Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I've just logged in to have a look at the forum. I shall now be leaving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Talking to me ? Yes we should not have played the 2 senior CMs, just as I said yesterday, what I feared happened exactly as I feared it would. We lost and picked up suspensions by the bucket load. So what? We aren't going to win the league anyway. Woe is the lot of us saints fans eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trout-Tickler Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Not quite with you there but when you have 3 CMs of which one is injured and the other 2 on 4 yellows you do not send them both out against a 3 rd division side in a MM Cup game on a northern quagmire in midwinter. To boot you put your regular LB at LM and a kiddy at LB, you then realise that the kiddy isn't getting the job done at HT so you take him off, play your regular LB at LB and put a no hoper at LM. Then when you need to take one of your CMs off because the other has been booked you can't because you've wasted your sub possibilities on some half baked schema that dawned on you whilst you were having a crap or something. Koeman was criticised for some of his decisions in Spain, I can see why now. I mean when Victor got booked the game was up for him, no game on Saturday, so take Morgan off and leave Toby in MF with Victor, nope he leaves Morgan on to get booked and takes Victor off. I maybe the only one but I thought Targett did well. Didn't do anything wrong defensively and can remember him having a good run and going past a couple of players, one of whom eventually fouled him. Didn't understand why Bertrand played on the left of the front 3 though. He worked hard but he's a left back not an attacking midfielder! I always think you choose your formation and then pick the players to play their natural position. With that in mind Isgrove should have played from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simo Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I maybe the only one but I thought Targett did well. Didn't do anything wrong defensively and can remember him having a good run and going past a couple of players, one of whom eventually fouled him. Didn't understand why Bertrand played on the left of the front 3 though. He worked hard but he's a left back not an attacking midfielder! I always think you choose your formation and then pick the players to play their natural position. With that in mind Isgrove should have played from the start. Was our best player in the first half imo , should of subbed Bertrand and rejigged the midfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 So to summarise the posts across a number of threads: Long is sh1t Mane is sh1t Forster is sh1t Gardos is sh1t Pelle has become sh1t Tadic has been sh1t for a while now Clyne has been sh1t since being capped Yoshida is sh1t JWP was sh1t Koeman was a genius and is now just sh1t Alderweields hamstring is sh1t the black box is sh1t The board is sh1t (again) Les Reed is sh1t Harrison is not sh1t but only because he hasn't played yet Missed anything? Yup. Bertrand and Morgan, but let me guess, they're shït as well. Oh and SD - he'd be shït by any chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I maybe the only one but I thought Targett did well. Didn't do anything wrong defensively and can remember him having a good run and going past a couple of players, one of whom eventually fouled him. Didn't understand why Bertrand played on the left of the front 3 though. He worked hard but he's a left back not an attacking midfielder! I always think you choose your formation and then pick the players to play their natural position. With that in mind Isgrove should have played from the start. But what is a natural position? Wayne Bridge was a wing back before he was moved (was it Dave Jones?) to left back. Ashley Cole also played further forward in his early career. Bale was a left back before he was pushed forward. Both Bertrand and Clyne get forward and there is no reason why they can't adopt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 So to summarise the posts across a number of threads: Long is sh1t Mane is sh1t Forster is sh1t Gardos is sh1t Pelle has become sh1t Tadic has been sh1t for a while now Clyne has been sh1t since being capped Yoshida is sh1t JWP was sh1t Koeman was a genius and is now just sh1t Alderweields hamstring is sh1t the black box is sh1t The board is sh1t (again) Les Reed is sh1t Harrison is not sh1t but only because he hasn't played yet Missed anything? Yep..... http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?52743-Jose-Fonte#.VJGSgSusUrU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Was our best player in the first half imo , should of subbed Bertrand and rejigged the midfield Targett says he'd not been injured so the decision to hoick him and put Bertrand back to LB was purely tactical. Feckwit idea in the first place, make a plan and stick with it Ronald, if you've no confidence in the young players tell them so and leave them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trout-Tickler Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 But what is a natural position? Wayne Bridge was a wing back before he was moved (was it Dave Jones?) to left back. Ashley Cole also played further forward in his early career. Bale was a left back before he was pushed forward. Both Bertrand and Clyne get forward and there is no reason why they can't adopt. IMO when your struggling to create and score goals you don't replace one of your front 3 with a defender. I like Bertrand, he's been a good acquisition this season but he's a left back not an attacking left midfielder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 IMO when your struggling to create and score goals you don't replace one of your front 3 with a defender. I like Bertrand, he's been a good acquisition this season but he's a left back not an attacking left midfielder. I'm not saying it was necessarily the right call from Koeman, but look at how many chances Bertrand has created this season. Look at how he skinned the Burnley player for our penalty on Saturday. You can see the logic behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 I'm not saying it was necessarily the right call from Koeman, but look at how many chances Bertrand has created this season. Look at how he skinned the Burnley player for our penalty on Saturday. You can see the logic behind it. So stick with it, why take Targett off and replace him with the useless Isgrove then at half time anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Village Saint Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Sadly you have. Despite all these players being sh1t, we still should have one every game we have played over the last month and that's definitely Ronald's fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trout-Tickler Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 So stick with it, why take Targett off and replace him with the useless Isgrove then at half time anyway. I assumed it was because he thought Isgrove was more attack minded and having Bertrand their hadn't worked. Bertrand presumably replaced Targett as he's the more experienced left back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
warsash saint Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 IMO when your struggling to create and score goals you don't replace one of your front 3 with a defender. I like Bertrand, he's been a good acquisition this season but he's a left back not an attacking left midfielder. Played their in a Champions League final so maybe 2 managers know a bit more than you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Hate to say it but he's beginning to show his flaws now. Koeman out. It's not like you to post incorrect and misguided rubbish, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trout-Tickler Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Played their in a Champions League final so maybe 2 managers know a bit more than you? lol...If it worked so well why change it at HT? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 So stick with it, why take Targett off and replace him with the useless Isgrove then at half time anyway. Because it wasn't working? That doesn't stop the original logic being reasonably sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Because it wasn't working? That doesn't stop the original logic being reasonably sound. This. #saintswebhindsightlogic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 IMO when your struggling to create and score goals you don't replace one of your front 3 with a defender. I like Bertrand, he's been a good acquisition this season but he's a left back not an attacking left midfielder. But he is good going forward so why not? Okay, it didn't work this time but it is hardly asking him to do something he doesn't know how to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trout-Tickler Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 But he is good going forward so why not? Okay, it didn't work this time but it is hardly asking him to do something he doesn't know how to do. Fair enough but just highlights how paper thin the squad is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Yep..... http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?52743-Jose-Fonte#.VJGSgSusUrU :lol: Jesus wept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Because it wasn't working? That doesn't stop the original logic being reasonably sound. Can understand the logic; though would say that pointing to CL final as precedent isn't very helpful. Chelsea knew they couldn't beat Bayern in an open game of football and Bertrand was very much part of this contain strategy. Whether we needed to do something similar against L1 opposition is debatable. Would also say that Bertrand's main attacking strength is his accurate crossing but without a target like Pelle, that threat was limited. No hindsight needed to understand that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Fair enough but just highlights how paper thin the squad is. It does. We def need some more quality come January!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Even with the changes we should have had enough about us to win that game. Perhaps the players thought they just needed to turn up but they need to have a look at themselves today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 (edited) It does. We def need some more quality come January!!! What we really need is one of those strikers who scores when you need him to, RvP,Aguero,Suarez types,Bony (at a push) cost what it may, that and JRod donning his boots again, apart from that I'm good with what we've got. I might enquire after Baffi Gomis. Edited 17 December, 2014 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 After being the lone voice in the storm After being the sentinel on the dark cliff After being the brave warrior holding back the hordes Having being battered and lambasted .....I have company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 After being the lone voice in the storm After being the sentinel on the dark cliff After being the brave warrior holding back the hordes Having being battered and lambasted .....I have company. Every kn0b has a couple of nuts hanging about nearby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 17 December, 2014 Share Posted 17 December, 2014 Every kn0b has a couple of nuts hanging about nearby Very good ! LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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