Sustainable Football?

[Son of Bob]

People seem to be panicking that our current form is unsustainable and that we'll inevitably tail off like we did last year but we do we have one or two major advantages over last seasons team. Koeman has changed the way we play as a team and his style, in my eyes, is far less fragile than Pochettino's. As we saw last season our pressing game was great until everyone else woke up to it and figured how to counter it but our new style is based on strength in defence and patient possession.

 

This change means our form should be far more sustainable as it's difficult for opposing teams to come up with a plan to counter it. If you're defending as well as we are there's only so much any other team can do to break that down.

 

Also, it was clear last season that there was no plan B to our pressing game and when we came up against teams that were well drilled in how to play against that style, it fell to pieces. Koeman strikes me as having far more tactical nouse than Pochettino and I'd have far more faith in him having a plan B and, if required, a plan C and D as well.

 

Personally, I'm not sure we have the legs to make a top 4 finish but I see no reason why we couldn't finish a solid 6th or even 5th this season which would be fantastic progress for us. I'd like to be proved wrong but I guess only time will tell on that one!

[Fitzhugh Fella]

It's the "legs" bit that concerns me - our squad is too thin to stay in the top 4. I see on Saturday Koeman was referring to the fact the players are feeling tired and that is before the really busy/ardous six weeks starts in earnest. What we have done up to now is truly admirable and way beyond expectations. It has made us all proud but without back up for some important areas (Pelle's for instance) I can't see us being in serious CL contention come the spring.

[Doctoroncall]

It's the "legs" bit that concerns me - our squad is too thin to stay in the top 4. I see on Saturday Koeman was referring to the fact the players are feeling tired and that is before the really busy/ardous six weeks starts in earnest. What we have done up to now is truly admirable and way beyond expectations. It has made us all proud but without back up for some important areas (Pelle's for instance) I can't see us being in serious CL contention come the spring.

 

That is a surprise as the players said trading under Poch was more intense and Koeman has introduce more technical trading over the physical side.

 

I suppose most teams will be about the same at this stage, but interesting to see number of minutes on the pitch for all players tosee what difference there is.

[Son of Bob]

People keep talking about how much more depth we have this season but other than midfield, we will start to become stretched once injuries and suspensions rear their ugly head. If we were to lose Alderweireld to an injury and then Fonte was to get suspended we'd suddenly look very thin at the back.

Edited 10 November, 2014 by Son of Bob

[S-Clarke]

People keep talking about how much more depth we have this season but other than midfield, we will start to become stretched once injuries and suspensions rear their ugly head. If we were to lose Alderweireld to an injury and then Fonte was to get suspended we'd suddenly look very at the back.

 

So would any team! (Look at Utd!) We do have plenty more to chose from. We're not an injury from Jos any more, or Guly, Or Danny Fox, Lee etc. We've got Gardos who is a very good CB, Matty Target who is a very able and promising full back.

 

We then have Shane Long, Mane, Jay (shortly), Gallagher, Tadic, Pelle all in the attacking area's. I think we're notably stronger in terms of depth, obviously not as much as the 'big sides' but we've got more than we did last year, which was emphasised when Long came on and changed the game on Saturday.

[Son of Bob]

Anyway we digress. The whole point of the thread was that our current style of football seems far more sustainable than the high pressing game favoured by Pochettino.

[John Boy Saint]

There was a game last season that we had won comfortably and during the post match interviews on Solent the question was asked "it must be buzzing in the dressing room right now" to which the reply came back "no it's pretty quiet, there are a lot of tired players in there as it's been a very hard week".

i remember thinking that's not clever as we have had no midweek game and the players are worn out more by a weeks training rather than 90 minutes of a match.

[View From The Top]

People keep talking about how much more depth we have this season but other than midfield, we will start to become stretched once injuries and suspensions rear their ugly head. If we were to lose Alderweireld to an injury and then Fonte was to get suspended we'd suddenly look very thin at the back.

 

That applies to any team.

[stevegrant]

Anyway we digress. The whole point of the thread was that our current style of football seems far more sustainable than the high pressing game favoured by Pochettino.

Absolutely agree. While we've maintained a lot of the good traits of that system, I think we use our energy more intelligently under Koeman. If an opponent wants to pass the ball among their back 4 and goalkeeper when they're 1-0 down, they're welcome to do so as they're absolutely no threat to us 80 yards from our goal.

[washsaint]

We do have cover........Lb - Targett, RB Toby/Cork, CB Gardos and Yoshi, Midfield - plenty of options, Strikers: Long/Mane/Rodriguez

 

I would argue we are far better prepared for injuries than last season and Koeman has them playing far more intelligently and conserving energy than Pochettino ever did.

 

Top 4 is a stretch but why not? Better to aim high than settle for mediocrity. Other teams also don't have this mythical "strength in depth" - key injuries affect them badly (see Sturridge at Scousehampton) and Man U not having any defensive backup at all. Ditto Arsenal.

[Son of Bob]

Absolutely agree. While we've maintained a lot of the good traits of that system, I think we use our energy more intelligently under Koeman. If an opponent wants to pass the ball among their back 4 and goalkeeper when they're 1-0 down, they're welcome to do so as they're absolutely no threat to us 80 yards from our goal.

 

Just out of interest Steve, where do you think we'll finish this season?

[CanadaSaint]

I agree with Steve that "we use our energy more intelligently under Koeman" - and that's not just in matches but in training sessions as well.

 

There were times last year when we either didn't play the press very well or didn't play it at all, and I think that was down to the fact that it was unsustainable - very demanding practices (and some two-a-days) followed by very demanding matches. I'm not sure it was down to other teams "rumbling us" as much as to us being unable to keep it going. I suspect that Pochettino knew this and that it was a large part of the reason for him de-prioritizing the cups and being so dismissive of the Europa league.

 

The problem was compounded as soon as we had an injury that would necessitate bringing in players like Jos, Gazzaniga, Fox.

 

We are well short of having a Top 5 bench but we're a long way ahead of last year.

[stevegrant]

Just out of interest Steve, where do you think we'll finish this season?

Genuinely no idea. A lot depends on squad fitness, we've been relatively lucky so far this season that it's only Ward-Prowse who's been in the team and then on the treatment table (I've not included Rodriguez there as we didn't have him to begin with in August), and he plays in the position where we undoubtedly have the most depth.

 

I wouldn't be especially surprised if we levelled out a bit and finished 8th again, albeit almost certainly closer to the top 4 than we've ever been in the PL era. Continued progress in the Capital One Cup could be a factor as well - let's face it, we're not far off being safe from relegation already, so if we managed to get to the final, all eyes and minds would be focused on that, which would almost certainly result in a dip in league form. For whatever reason, it seems to affect almost every team who wins the League Cup (Man City last season being the exception).

 

I would be very pleasantly surprised if we ended in the top 4, it seems completely unfathomable that Spurs, Liverpool, Man United, Everton and Arsenal will continue to make a complete pig's ear of things in the league over an entire season. I could see us finishing above Everton, especially if they continue to pick their strongest XI in the Europa League and progress. Spurs have a stronger squad with which to cope with it, although Poch is doing a fine job of messing it up at the moment.

[saintbob40]

You look at some of the players getting game time for Man U at the moment and perhaps we have more depth than we give ourselves credit for.

 

Also the players don't look quite so knackered as a full press all the time is hard and gets harder as the season progresses as Spurs may now be finding out