Where is Cortese now?

[hypochondriac]

Does anyone else think it ironic that those who are most critical of Cortese's nastiness, are attacking posters who defend him, in such an unsympathetic way. Most confusing!

 

Posters on here aren't in charge of the football club...

[Goatboy]

Posters on here aren't in charge of the football club...

 

That's not the impression I get.

[hypochondriac]

That's not the impression I get.

 

Then you're an ignoramus.

[The9]

http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?48561-Cortese-has-left-Southampton-Football-Club-Officially-Confirmed&highlight=Cortese+leaves#.Vip9qpR4WrU

 

Classic ART bullshart comment at the start there about bringing Lowe back.

 

Also good to see the Luke Shaw PR machine spewing basically the same guff as when he somehow tweeted with a broken leg.

 

Shocked to discover also the only thing Griffo has ever posted on SaintsWeb that I agree with (and I'm not sure he wasn't being sarcastic): "Get a grip some of you. He wasn't the one with the money and he had little say on the on-field matters. Unless Pochettino goes (which wouldn't be all that much of a disaster) and all our best players leave then this is pretty irrelevant. Hopefully Le Tiss/Benali can be welcome at the club again and we can get our stripes back next season."

 

All those things actually happened.

 

I see the use of the word "gutted" by 3 people, one of whom said he was "the best thing to happen to the club in 30 years", SaintRichmond bleating on about Katharina having one thing on her mind, to sell; someone saying "maybe he's left to go to Milan" (and it wasn't Turkish, so they were genuine), Saint Charlie suggesting we'd sell Shaw for £15m, claims of Cortese buying the club, MLG linking to a video of the word "bugger", egg saying "she might have wanted to install a... man to help... buy more shrewdly", Alpine saying "f'ck the stripes", and then a post showing "apparently Katharina", as none of us actually knew what she looked like back then.

 

"We are screwed", "can't see how this is good news in any way at all", "Oh sh't", "reports that she refused to sell to a buyer Cortese arranged", "no point in having a silver lining if the cloud is about to unleash a gargantuan flood". "Can't help but feel we'll never be in such a positive position again". "If Luke leaves then clubs could be over us for our star players". "Would hope Lallana stays regardless"...

 

And the weirdly prescient: "If I were Man Utd I'd be putting in a bid for Lovren, Clyne, Shaw, Schneiderlin, Wanyama and Lallana! £120m, rebuilding done!"

 

As well as the hilariously wrong: "The whole thing smacks of either... (a) Cortese has a role lined up e.g. at AC Milan, or (b) KL wants to sell Luke Shaw and Cortese wanted to keep him here or he would leave. Or both. So perhaps we shall see the departure of Luke Shaw and possibly others such as Lallana and Schneiderlin before the end of the January window."

 

Nothing about crying in the first two-hundred and twenty posts though.

[The9]

This old poll sums up what the bunch of sheep on this site really thought when Cortese threatened to resign, before he was pushed. As I posted at the time:

 

That full list of people who did not want Cortese to stay on 14/5/2013, about 8 months before he went (the 5.7% "NO" vote): 110_Persaint, Brother Smith, conaero, croydonsaint, Dan, dazzlesfc, FMPR, gary50, Guided Missile, Hagiology, hypochondriac, IFHP, Isla Wight, jjsaint, JRM, Kingsland Nick, La BoIS Saint, London Saint, mack rill, Massimo Osti, Merovingian, Mr X, patred44, Saint Billy, scorchio21, Seaford Saint, Sergei Gotsmanov, sir woody, solentstars, St Lej, St.JonB, The9, Third Division South, Tomobz, Treesaint, yorkie

 

2 of them (Merovingian and mack rill) are known Skates, for the record - at least I was consistent.

[The9]

So it's easy to do what we did and anyone can do it? I'd love to hear the views of Leeds wolves Sheffield clubs Nottingham forest and countless others who have struggled for years in the lower leagues with and without money

 

Whatever you may think cortese with all his faults and like everyone he had many was the right man in the right place and with the help of others too oversaw a remarkable change around in the way the club was managed brought huge success and left a legacy of good management practice that remains there today

 

I disagree that what he did was either easy or achievable without the vision and single minded ruthlessness he brought to the club . His approach and methodology and single minded determination to impose change is why we are where we are today and to think otherwise is naive in the extreme

 

I am glad we are now more respectful of our old players history and the community but without the changes made non of what we are doing now would be possible

 

Anyone else with the backing of the Liebherrs could have done much of the same thing. As for "ask some teams who have and haven't had money how easy it is", well you've just listed lots of badly mismanaged teams, all without money. There are plenty of well managed teams without money too, the money makes it a lot easier, especially in lower divisions.

[The9]

"Dejan Lovren ‏@DejanLovren05 18m

Thank you Nicola Cortese for everything . #respect"

 

[Saint Without a Halo]

Anyone else with the backing of the Liebherrs could have done much of the same thing. As for "ask some teams who have and haven't had money how easy it is", well you've just listed lots of badly mismanaged teams, all without money. There are plenty of well managed teams without money too, the money makes it a lot easier, especially in lower divisions.

 

Really? I have my doubts about that statement

He was of course chosen by Markus for the job also it is worth remembering the contribution of others such as Reed et al it was after all a team effort that turned Saints around but there were too many bad management practices from the past that needed single minded ruthlessness to change and Nicola was the right man to bring that change whether he was the right man for the steady state after the changes were made and imbedded is of course a very different question

 

There have been plenty of clubs with money who have failed and continue to fail unlike us who have gone from L1 to an established premier place in 4 seasons yes we had the right managers and the right players but you also need good leadership for that to happen and flourish

There may have been discontent in areas of the club during his leadership as some of the changes were resisted but he certainly got it right on the pitch where it counts with his teams mangers and the team working ethos as well as managing transitions between managers with minimum effect on team moral and results ( not that easy to do)

[Saint Without a Halo]

I see what you are getting at but there are so many clubs that don't do the things right we did it would be unfair to say Cortese did not do a good job - whether that is putting people in the right roles or attracting and keeping players at the club.

 

In aftermath of his departure it came to light more than ever what an egotistical and spiteful man he was, however his vision and bloody-mindedness at where he wanted Saints to be convinced many of our best players to sign new deals at the club, something our current regime have failed to do.

 

In all likelihood Cortese's spending and management style was unsustainable, but we shouldn't write off his role in helping to establish this club as what it is today.

 

Short Concise and spot on

[CB Fry]

Really? I have my doubts about that statement

He was of course chosen by Markus for the job also it is worth remembering the contribution of others such as Reed et al it was after all a team effort that turned Saints around but there were too many bad management practices from the past that needed single minded ruthlessness to change and Nicola was the right man to bring that change whether he was the right man for the steady state after the changes were made and imbedded is of course a very different question

 

There have been plenty of clubs with money who have failed and continue to fail unlike us who have gone from L1 to an established premier place in 4 seasons yes we had the right managers and the right players but you also need good leadership for that to happen and flourish

There may have been discontent in areas of the club during his leadership as some of the changes were resisted but he certainly got it right on the pitch where it counts with his teams mangers and the team working ethos as well as managing transitions between managers with minimum effect on team moral and results ( not that easy to do)

 

What changes would have been "resisted" then that haven't subsequently been reversed?

 

[ie Appalling kit selections, treating ex-players, local companies and the media with contempt, rampant ego driven over spending on facilities]

Edited 25 October, 2015 by CB Fry

[david in sweden]

To be fair there were people outside of the club saying that Adkins could be the next England manager too. Not sure the word "great" was used.

 

to be fair....there was a period in the second L1 and Championship seasons, when (injuries aside)...the team almost picked itself.

Not to take anything away from Nigel ....but he hit the balance that was needed almost perfectly and there were very few "hiccups" in the results.

 

In the high days (1960-70's) when Bill Shankly (and his successors) managed those great Liverpool sides, and churned out results and title wins season after season,

........there was a joke that suggested.....(the side was so predictable).... that the Anfield tea-lady could pick the team for the next match.

[sadoldgit]

to be fair....there was a period in the second L1 and Championship seasons, when (injuries aside)...the team almost picked itself.

Not to take anything away from Nigel ....but he hit the balance that was needed almost perfectly and there were very few "hiccups" in the results.

 

In the high days (1960-70's) when Bill Shankly (and his successors) managed those great Liverpool sides, and churned out results and title wins season after season,

........there was a joke that suggested.....(the side was so predictable).... that the Anfield tea-lady could pick the team for the next match.

 

I am sure if some owners could get away without managers they would do It is easier to manage with good players but the manager still has a job to do. I remember Mick Channon saying that Lawrie McMenemy used to buy good players and let them play. Sounds easy but Liverpool and Chelsea have both found that there is more to it than that.

[sadoldgit]

I see what you are getting at but there are so many clubs that don't do the things right we did it would be unfair to say Cortese did not do a good job - whether that is putting people in the right roles or attracting and keeping players at the club.

 

In aftermath of his departure it came to light more than ever what an egotistical and spiteful man he was, however his vision and bloody-mindedness at where he wanted Saints to be convinced many of our best players to sign new deals at the club, something our current regime have failed to do.

 

In all likelihood Cortese's spending and management style was unsustainable, but we shouldn't write off his role in helping to establish this club as what it is today.

 

You mention keeping players at the club. I just wonder if you think that still would have been the case more recently without CL football and with the option of a higher wages elsewhere? I also wonder whether, if Cortese had remained, whether Ronald Koeman would be here now?

[CB Fry]

You mention keeping players at the club. I just wonder if you think that still would have been the case more recently without CL football and with the option of a higher wages elsewhere? I also wonder whether, if Cortese had remained, whether Ronald Koeman would be here now?

Quite. I'd be interested to know which players would have needed to be "convinced" to sign new deals being that no CL level clubs came in for any of our players in the entire time NC was in charge.

 

Oh, sorry, one did. And he was sold.

[Batman]

I was a big Cortese fan

more so as brilliant stuff happened on his watch

his eye for a manager was superb

 

however, it appears he was a bigger **** that I thought/wanted to believe

 

I thought the club would go backwards a bit when he left. That was way off.

 

he could have been remembered far more fondly than he is but hey ho.

[sadoldgit]

I don't think the word fond is something anyone could use to describe feeling towards Cortese. He is not the type of guy who generates warm fuzzy feelings is he? Perhaps you could say he could have been remembered with more respect?

I think people are generally happy with what he achieved even if his methods sucked. I am just please that we have a management team now who show that you can still do well without megalomaniac tendencies.

[hypochondriac]

That full list of people who did not want Cortese to stay on 14/5/2013, about 8 months before he went (the 5.7% "NO" vote): 110_Persaint, Brother Smith, conaero, croydonsaint, Dan, dazzlesfc, FMPR, gary50, Guided Missile, Hagiology, hypochondriac, IFHP, Isla Wight, jjsaint, JRM, Kingsland Nick, La BoIS Saint, London Saint, mack rill, Massimo Osti, Merovingian, Mr X, patred44, Saint Billy, scorchio21, Seaford Saint, Sergei Gotsmanov, sir woody, solentstars, St Lej, St.JonB, The9, Third Division South, Tomobz, Treesaint, yorkie

 

2 of them (Merovingian and mack rill) are known Skates, for the record - at least I was consistent.

 

Good to see I'm on there. The crying comment was on another thread.

[david in sweden]

I don't think the word fond is something anyone could use to describe feeling towards Cortese.

He is not the type of guy who generates warm fuzzy feelings is he? Perhaps you could say he could have been remembered with more respect?

I think people are generally happy with what he achieved even if his methods sucked.

I am just please that we have a management team now who show that you can still do well without megalomaniac tendencies.

 

 

those of us who remember back to the 1960's will recall the name ...Dr.Beeching. A man given the job of restructuring the unprofitable British Railway system.

 

He made masses of cutbacks, closed down 30% of the stations.....saved the country £millions, put a lot of people out of work and did the job he was asked to do...

.....and he didn't make many friends, either....(not outside of the Government anyway). He was well-paid, and left the job when it was done.

 

Nicola Cortese (former Chairman of SFC 2009-2014)...DAJFU...was well-paid for his efforts and (according to another thread)....only a few people cried when he left.

 

Friendship didn't come into it - it was just business.

[Surman4no7shirt]

those of us who remember back to the 1960's will recall the name ...Dr.Beeching. A man given the job of restructuring the unprofitable British Railway system.

 

He made masses of cutbacks, closed down 30% of the stations.....saved the country £millions, put a lot of people out of work and did the job he was asked to do...

.....and he didn't make many friends, either....(not outside of the Government anyway). He was well-paid, and left the job when it was done.

 

Nicola Cortese (former Chairman of SFC 2009-2014)...DAJFU...was well-paid for his efforts and (according to another thread)....only a few people cried when he left.

 

Friendship didn't come into it - it was just business.

 

Good example, both executing policy colossally shortsighted and incredibly damaging in the long term on something that wasn't theirs.

[sadoldgit]

Good example, both executing policy colossally shortsighted and incredibly damaging in the long term on something that wasn't theirs.

 

Indeed. And it is possible to do a difficult job without being a complete ahole.

[SuperSAINT]

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/13928858.GOSSIP__Which_club_is_ex_Saints_chairman_Cortese_looking_to_take_over_/?ref=rss

[Sarnia Saint]

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/13928858.GOSSIP__Which_club_is_ex_Saints_chairman_Cortese_looking_to_take_over_/?ref=rss

 

He was in Guernsey this week and was asked what club he would buy now. He said Leeds as big fan base history etc but was not saying he was fronting a bid! 2 +2 =5 as usual

[Turkish]

Heard he had auditioned for the role of R2D2 in the new Star Wars film.

[sadoldgit]

He was in Guernsey this week and was asked what club he would buy now. He said Leeds as big fan base history etc but was not saying he was fronting a bid! 2 +2 =5 as usual

 

Leeds to be playing CL football within a couple of seasons then!

[Guided Missile]

This mornings Sunday Times:

NICOLA CORTESE, the former Southampton chairman and mastermind of the club’s rise from League One, is eyeing a takeover of Leeds United.

 

Cortese is considering an attempt to buy out Massimo Cellino, the controversial Italian who presides at Elland Road. He believes that Leeds, who won 3-0 at Huddersfield yesterday, could be a leading force in English football again and are ripe for the kind of transformation he effected upon Southampton.

[david in sweden]

Leeds to be playing CL football within a couple of seasons then!

 

....even quicker than that maybe ....considering that Leeds are already in the Championship...

 

......mind you, one wonders how his "management style " might go down with the Yorkshire folk !

 

The recently-appointed Leeds manager ought not to move house too quickly though....Cortese almost certainly has a new manager in mind....

 

.....(someone give him the 'phone number to White Hart Lane )

Edited 8 November, 2015 by david in sweden

[Patrick Bateman]

This mornings Sunday Times:

 

Could be interesting. For me, Leeds are the dictionary definition of a "sleeping giant". By far the biggest traditional club outside the Premier League and despite an old ground, it's one they'll fill with a decent income. So yes this could be very interesting to see if he does buy them (or get some other rich person to buy them again) and what happens there.

[Badger]

Could be interesting. For me, Leeds are the dictionary definition of a "sleeping giant". By far the biggest traditional club outside the Premier League and despite an old ground, it's one they'll fill with a decent income. So yes this could be very interesting to see if he does buy them (or get some other rich person to buy them again) and what happens there.

 

That's probably closer to the mark. Wonder if they'll leave him to run it without being accountable though.

[kwsaint]

Would have thought that Cortese was ideal for Leeds. The current owner is banned from being a director of a football club for avowing tax on an imported yacht, the new manager is the odious Steve Evans, who was successfully prosecuted for tax evasion when at Boston. Add to that the history surrounding Don Revie and the culture of gamesmanship that he left.

 

What could possibly go wrong

[Saint Charlie]

He probably is ideal for them if they want to get back to the PL.

[angelman]

He probably is ideal for them if they want to get back to the PL.

 

But at what cost? If you get there but leave behind the fans, is that really ideal?

[Saint Charlie]

But at what cost? If you get there but leave behind the fans, is that really ideal?

It can't really be any worse than they have now.

 

Saints fans had a (mostly) fantastic time under Cortese, certainly on the pitch which is what matters most. Surely every Saints fan would rather have had Cortese when we did than someone else?

 

I'm sure any Leeds fans would rip your arm off for even half of the success and structure Cortese brought us in a football sense.

[John B]

I am just glad he is not at SFC now

[shurlock]

But at what cost? If you get there but leave behind the fans, is that really ideal?

 

This isn't the moral maze, you pompous plum.

[angelman]

Your idea of pomposity might be unique to you.

[Batman]

But at what cost? If you get there but leave behind the fans, is that really ideal?

 

How many saints fans did he leave behind?

10, 30 maybe 100?

[Saints foreva]

This mornings Sunday Times:

 

Bad news for Leeds fans who actually care about their heritage and history.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

This mornings Sunday Times:

 

Who's money is he going to use I wonder?

[CB Fry]

Bad news for Leeds fans who actually care about their heritage and history.

 

Just think how many millions of new fans they will gain China in once Leeds start stepping out in their new all-red kit. They'll look so modern and forward thinking.

[hutch]

Bad news for Leeds fans who actually care about their heritage and history.

 

Absolutely. They're gonna hate being back in the top 10 of the Premier League.

[CB Fry]

Absolutely. They're gonna hate being back in the top 10 of the Premier League.

Arf. The cult lives on.

[VectisSaint]

Just think how many millions of new fans they will gain China in once Leeds start stepping out in their new all-red kit. They'll look so modern and forward thinking.

Given they have already had their heritage changed dramatically once in their history when they changed to all white in the 60s, it probably is not much of a bother for them. Traditionally they played in blue and white or blue and yellow. so your usual sniping at anything Cortese-inspired is a bit silly really.

[Turkish]

Absolutely. They're gonna hate being back in the top 10 of the Premier League.

 

We never finished in the top 10 of the premier league under Cortese, we has to get someone else in to take us to that level. He might get them up but will no doubt step aside to let someone else take them to the next level like he did with us.

 

In any case this will be just a smokescreen to finally get AC Milan to offer him the job. After chasing him for four years whilst at saints they won't want to miss out again.

[CB Fry]

Given they have already had their heritage changed dramatically once in their history when they changed to all white in the 60s, it probably is not much of a bother for them. Traditionally they played in blue and white or blue and yellow. so your usual sniping at anything Cortese-inspired is a bit silly really.

 

You think Leeds switching to an all-red kit would be "not much of a bother for them?". Okay then.

[Gemmel]

....even quicker than that maybe ....considering that Leeds are already in the Championship...

 

Would be impossible to be quickerQUOTE]

[Noodles34]

I am just glad he is not at SFC now

 

why, what went wrong under Cortese?

[david in sweden]

....even quicker than that maybe ....considering that Leeds are already in the Championship...

 

Would be impossible to be quickerQUOTE]

 

 

well....sadoldgit made that suggestion on #124, but ....

 

....a new manager sparking a revival this season, could do enough to get them promoted in the play-off place, and then qualify in the Prem's. top four next season....

 

.....surely nothing's impossible ...for a club with a history like Leeds?

[Wrensup]

 

 

well....sadoldgit made that suggestion on #124, but ....

 

....a new manager sparking a revival this season, could do enough to get them promoted in the play-off place, and then qualify in the Prem's. top four next season....

 

.....surely nothing's impossible ...for a club with a history like Leeds?

 

What do you have against commas, seriously now!

[The Kraken]

why, what went wrong under Cortese?

Who is saying anything "went wrong" with him. That's the standard and simplistric response to anyone who criticised him in any way at all for certain aspects of what he was doing and how he was doing.

 

Personally I'm very glad he's not at SFC right now. He did a brilliant job with the team and building behind the scenes with the training ground. He also made some big errors with over-spending and his promises to have the club running on an even financial keel, which just wasn't going to happen. Being as Kat wasn't prepared to fund the financial shortfall any more some big changes were needed.

 

The current team at the top have taken all the good things that were built up and they have continued/improved them further them, while they have also improved the club and operations in other areas. SFC feels more inclusive these days whereas Cortese made it feel like " his baby", his own personal fiefdom.

[sadoldgit]

Who is saying anything "went wrong" with him. That's the standard and simplistric response to anyone who criticised him in any way at all for certain aspects of what he was doing and how he was doing.

 

Personally I'm very glad he's not at SFC right now. He did a brilliant job with the team and building behind the scenes with the training ground. He also made some big errors with over-spending and his promises to have the club running on an even financial keel, which just wasn't going to happen. Being as Kat wasn't prepared to fund the financial shortfall any more some big changes were needed.

 

The current team at the top have taken all the good things that were built up and they have continued/improved them further them, while they have also improved the club and operations in other areas. SFC feels more inclusive these days whereas Cortese made it feel like " his baby", his own personal fiefdom.

 

Indeed. Also I feel that SFC has gone back to being a nice friendly family club again which is one of the reasons I started supporting the club (back in 1966 when I lived in London) in the first place. If I wanted some Corporate Project there are plenty to chose from elsewhere. Cortese and Leeds are a perfect match. I hope it happens and will be very interested to see how it plays out if it does.