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By Saint Garrett,
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Turkish

Turkish

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James Beattie was a big lad, for the first 6-8 games of every season he was usually pretty dreadful, off the pace and lacked mobility. I pretty sure sure he actually admitted once that it took him a few games into the season to get up to speed. Pelle isn't a 10 stone winger, he's a big lad too and I would think he is the same, add to that a new new club, new country and new league. Seriously those dinlows on his back today should be absolutely ashamed of themselves giving a player abuse on his home debut because he wasn't brilliant straight away. We really do have some utter bellends for fans.

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Batman

Batman

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I asked when we signed Pelle, what was it that turned him from a striker that rarely scored into one that was prolific at Feyenoord? It must have been with the tactics and service to him. I assume Feyenoord played 433 so who supplied him?

 

And the league he was in

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Graffito

Graffito

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And the league he was in

 

I'm aware of that but he's playing here now for Saints and I'd like to understand how Koeman wants to play to get him scoring. We're short of creative quality no question but how do we play to get goals from Pelle? The answer may be how it was done at Feyenoord.

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Batman

Batman

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I'm aware of that but he's playing here now for Saints and I'd like to understand how Koeman wants to play to get him scoring. We're short of creative quality no question but how do we play to get goals from Pelle? The answer may be how it was done at Feyenoord.

 

He has to get used to this league. My guess is that he was able to bully defenders regularly in holland without having to work so much. The prem is a completely different level. Lambert would move all over the front line to find space and had the ability to play in the hole. That is not pelle'a game.

 

He is going to have to step it up and improve his movement and touch. He obviously has the ability to finish. That will come if he is able to beat his man to the front post or hold the ball up better etc

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Turkish

Turkish

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He has to get used to this league. My guess is that he was able to bully defenders regularly in holland without having to work so much. The prem is a completely different level. Lambert would move all over the front line to find space and had the ability to play in the hole. That is not pelle'a game.

 

He is going to have to step it up and improve his movement and touch. He obviously has the ability to finish. That will come if he is able to beat his man to the front post or hold the ball up better etc

 

Shut up about lambert FFS he's gone, stop beating Pelle up because he isn't lambert.

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Turkish

Turkish

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I'm not beating him. Just saying what he might have to do to succeed in this league. A bit a bit more clever like lambert

 

Or, just stay as he is and see how he goes

 

I'm sure he's right now eagerly scanning this forum for advice on what he needs to do to cut it in the premier league.

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Turkish

Turkish

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Maybe he is.

 

I don't doubt it, like I've said before this place is an up tapped resource for football expertise. I'm sure first thing Monday morning he'll be asking Ronald to teach him how to move across the front line after reading what a navy chef said he needs to do if he's going to survive in this league.

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Whitey Grandad

Whitey Grandad

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He has to get used to this league. My guess is that he was able to bully defenders regularly in holland without having to work so much. The prem is a completely different level. Lambert would move all over the front line to find space and had the ability to play in the hole. That is not pelle'a game.

 

He is going to have to step it up and improve his movement and touch. He obviously has the ability to finish. That will come if he is able to beat his man to the front post or hold the ball up better etc

 

I thought he showed signs of improvement as the game went on. He's obviously going to need time to adapt to this league.

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Graffito

Graffito

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Have to say I've seen nothing from Pelle so far to suggest he will regularly perform for us, and the fact he's had an awful career apart from two seasons in Holland doesn't fill me with confidence either. Got a horrible feeling he'll be a massive flop.

 

It's two league matches. Let's give the man a chance.

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SarniaSaint

SarniaSaint

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£20 million for Pelle and Long - that is a real indictment of Les Reed that is. Both players at 29 and 27 should be at the top of their games - but the sad truth is neither look anywhere near good enough for the premier league.

 

That's 3 games I've watched Pelle play now - and I'm worried - I see nothing from him to suggest he going to score goals for us. I want him to be good I really do as we really need someone to score goals. He seems to lack the aggression needed, not too mention the pace and movement.

 

And he's certainly not a replacement for Lambert - he's not going to drop deep or go wide and pick up the ball and play someone else in.

 

And Long gives you what I expected - running and work rate but that's about it. He not going to give you creativity or score goals. He's a championship striker really.

 

And other than as a hard running wide forward I'm not sure where he fits in a 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 - otherwise it's him or Pelle to lead the line and at £8 million and £12 million that's expensive substitutes.

 

Right now Gallagher looks a better bet than either of them.

 

I have a horrible feeling we'll end up sending them both out on loan to Italy and the Championship next season to get rid of them as we massively overpaid for them and we won't be able to sell them for anything like £20 million we paid for them. A bit like Osvaldo really - oh and Gaston.

 

At 29 and 27 there value is only going to go down. It's a £20 million mistake we can't afford.

 

We'd have been a lot better off buying young strikers like Ings, Guidetti and Castaignos foe a lot less money - with the chance they improve and go up in value.

 

I don't think we really had a transfer strategy this summer - more that we were bullied in to selling, went for the cash and then panic bought.

 

Agree with all of that. Pelle was unknown to us but 12M for Long WTF were the board thinking.

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Rasiak-9-

Rasiak-9-

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So...

 

In drawing this debate to a conclusion, it seems like despite the inevitable mongboard spats and infighting, we're actually, incredibly, pretty much all in agreement.

 

1) People scapegoating and sarcastically cheering a Saints player after one and a half matches are complete bellends and unfortunately there seem to be more of these spoiled, entitled ****s showing up now that we're in the Premiership.

 

2) Pelle needs time to adapt and deserves our support and encouragement as much as any other player. Given time he may well prove us wrong.

 

3) Having said that, he has, admittedly, looked very poor so far and as such, the focal point of our attack seriously struggling this season appears to be a distinct possibility that any fan can be justifiably concerned about...

 

4) ...especially considering the fact that our midfield have barely a handful of goals a season in them and Shane Long has yet to get into double-figures in the Premiership in any previous seasons.

 

5) As such, Pelle being a dreadful flop is not just a possibility, but a possibility that we haven't really prepared for and could prove very costly indeed.

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

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Posted
It's two league matches. Let's give the man a chance.

 

I'm going to give him a chance. But right now, from everything i've seen of the guy so far, his technical attributes don't seem to be that great. First touch, ball control, passing ability etc.

 

Put it this way - if he's going to be a successful signing for us, then there needs to be a massive improvement on what we've seen so far.

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angelman

angelman

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James Beattie was a big lad, for the first 6-8 games of every season he was usually pretty dreadful, off the pace and lacked mobility. I pretty sure sure he actually admitted once that it took him a few games into the season to get up to speed. Pelle isn't a 10 stone winger, he's a big lad too and I would think he is the same, add to that a new new club, new country and new league. Seriously those dinlows on his back today should be absolutely ashamed of themselves giving a player abuse on his home debut because he wasn't brilliant straight away. We really do have some utter bellends for fans.

 

JRod scored for the first time in his 8th game (the 9th of the season) and his second 8 games later (19th of the season). Might just take a wee bit of time to adjust and then I am sure he'll bang them in.

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van Hanegem

van Hanegem

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Posted
He has to get used to this league. My guess is that he was able to bully defenders regularly in holland without having to work so much. The prem is a completely different level. Lambert would move all over the front line to find space and had the ability to play in the hole. That is not pelle'a game.

 

He is going to have to step it up and improve his movement and touch. He obviously has the ability to finish. That will come if he is able to beat his man to the front post or hold the ball up better etc

 

The first sentences are spot on Batman but Pelle did move all over the front line or created his own chances when playing for Feyenoord. His 50+ goals for us were mainly a result of his own abilities (and the childlike defenders over here in Holland) as our wingers (Boëtius and Schaken) are very poor when it comes to crossballs. Usually our defenders gave a long ball which Pelle controlled with his back to the goal and he would give the ball to the incoming midfielders (Clasie, Vilhena, Immers) who would set up a chance for him. I'm not sure but I don't think that this way of playing would be successful in the PL. Just like Pelle needs time to adjust to the pace, so does Koeman to find out the best system for his players in a different league with different standards.

 

Pelle is definitely no Bergkamp or Suarez who were in a class of their own while playing in Holland but I would like to compare him with Wilfried Bony from Swansea who played for Vitesse in the dutch league. There were pundits who doubted if Bony could make it in the PL but he's getting there though it took some time. Give Pelle some credit (too bad to read here about idiots who don't support their player after only two games) and cheer him on! When it doesn't work out Feyenoord would gladly take him back as we can't find a decent CA...

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van Hanegem

van Hanegem

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We'd have been a lot better off buying young strikers like Ings, Guidetti and Castaignos foe a lot less money - with the chance they improve and go up in value.

 

Don't know about Ings but I wouldn't spent my money on Guidetti or Castoignos if I were you. Feyenoord would love to bring Guidetti back to Rotterdam but they know about the illness he had some time ago and are not willing to take the risk for 2 or 3 million though we need a CA badly and we do have the cash... Castoignos is a mediocre CA who doesn't convince in the dutch league, why would you even consider him?

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Mouldy Coat

Mouldy Coat

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The thing that concerns me most is that Pelle didn't even attempt to run the channel. His first touch was poor and he barely won a single header. Yes strikers need goals but looking at his overall game, if he is not getting goal scoring opportunities then you have to work hard and do the other things well. He was very static. I am prepared to give him more time but I fear that we can't wait another 10 games before we use Long as the lone striker. Pelle's confidence would probably be shot to bits if we did that but at least Long works hard, runs the channels and occasionally his pace may get in behind them. I have only seen 4 games of Pelle but so far I am ver concerned

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Saint Fan CaM

Saint Fan CaM

Posted
Posted (edited)
well here's how pelle scored goals in holland. some nice individual skill on occasion but also a lot of sloppy defending

 

99% of those goals were taken in or around the 6 yard box and came from crosses into that area. We don't have anyone who can deliver those types of balls and consequently Pelle is having to cope with a completely different style of play - one he ultimately may not be suited to. Yes, he should be given time, but it is extremely important that (a) the club do everything to buy in a two footed wide player capable of crossing...and (b) the coaching staff work with Pelle to identify strategies to maximise his potential. If these things are not done, he will have a poor season and this might also reflect on Koemans compentency too given the history between the two.

Edited by Saint Fan CaM
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Dan Johnson

Dan Johnson

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Majority of our fans today were a complete disgrace. 99% complete ****ing bellends. It gets worse with every year we are in the Prem.

 

Agreed.

 

We only beat West Brom last year 1-0 at home & away in what were both dire games.

 

The away game certainly was destined for a 0-0 until a last minute pen, in a game were we created NOTHING, similar to yesterday.

 

All of a sudden last years team would have destroyed West Brom when in reality their performance was extremely similar to yesterday

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Chez

Chez

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Agreed.

 

We only beat West Brom last year 1-0 at home & away in what were both dire games.

 

The away game certainly was destined for a 0-0 until a last minute pen, in a game were we created NOTHING, similar to yesterday.

 

All of a sudden last years team would have destroyed West Brom when in reality their performance was extremely similar to yesterday

 

The difference between the two seasons? That little bit of individual quality (by Shaw at their place) which has left our side. I keep reading that "we are almost as strong as last season" on here, but the truth is we are not, and that reduction in quality will have an effect in lots of tiny ways throughout the game that will all add up to just not quite winning or nit quite drawing some games.

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Plastic

Plastic

Posted
Posted (edited)
The difference between the two seasons? That little bit of individual quality (by Shaw at their place) which has left our side. I keep reading that "we are almost as strong as last season" on here, but the truth is we are not, and that reduction in quality will have an effect in lots of tiny ways throughout the game that will all add up to just not quite winning or nit quite drawing some games.

 

I think the talent is there (I honestly do) to equal last years team, however the cohesion isn't yet, and the tactics need a significant amount of work.

Edited by Plastic
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Dan Johnson

Dan Johnson

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Posted
Majority of our fans today were a complete disgrace. 99% complete ****ing bellends. It gets worse with every year we are in the Prem.

 

The difference between the two seasons? That little bit of individual quality (by Shaw at their place) which has left our side. I keep reading that "we are almost as strong as last season" on here, but the truth is we are not, and that reduction in quality will have an effect in lots of tiny ways throughout the game that will all add up to just not quite winning or nit quite drawing some games.

 

Gaston played the through ball to Lallana in the home game last season. Until then we never looked like breaking them down.

 

Shaws run would have come to nothing had the defender not fouled him.

 

We aren't as good as last season because the players had evolved as a team, it's too early to compare an understanding between players.

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Cabrone

Cabrone

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Posted
James Beattie was a big lad, for the first 6-8 games of every season he was usually pretty dreadful, off the pace and lacked mobility. I pretty sure sure he actually admitted once that it took him a few games into the season to get up to speed. Pelle isn't a 10 stone winger, he's a big lad too and I would think he is the same, add to that a new new club, new country and new league. Seriously those dinlows on his back today should be absolutely ashamed of themselves giving a player abuse on his home debut because he wasn't brilliant straight away. We really do have some utter bellends for fans.

 

Well said and yes Beatts was always a bit slow off the blocks, I can remember him usually getting into the groove around October and then banging them in on a regular basis. If he'd be around now I'd guess he'd have been written off before he even started by some of our uber knee jerk supporters.

 

Getting on a player's back after 2 games, a player that has come from a different league and needs time to adjust, a player that is pretty crucial to our prospects in this league is stupid, self destructive and bang out of order.

 

Get behind him and give him a chance, he's proven that he knows how to find the net so be patient.

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ALWAYS_SFC

ALWAYS_SFC

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Posted
We could spend 100m and it still not be as good as last season, what we had you can't buy, it was a one off, that team went through L1 Champ together and had a special bond that takes time that you can't buy.

I will never forgive the board no matter what player we bring in. I loved that team we had.

 

LOL...Never forgive the board...but love the players who cleared off at the wave of a handful of cash...?

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ALWAYS_SFC

ALWAYS_SFC

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Posted
James Beattie was a big lad, for the first 6-8 games of every season he was usually pretty dreadful, off the pace and lacked mobility. I pretty sure sure he actually admitted once that it took him a few games into the season to get up to speed. Pelle isn't a 10 stone winger, he's a big lad too and I would think he is the same, add to that a new new club, new country and new league. Seriously those dinlows on his back today should be absolutely ashamed of themselves giving a player abuse on his home debut because he wasn't brilliant straight away. We really do have some utter bellends for fans.

 

Well said and yes Beatts was always a bit slow off the blocks, I can remember him usually getting into the groove around October and then banging them in on a regular basis. If he'd be around now I'd guess he'd have been written off before he even started by some of our uber knee jerk supporters.

 

Getting on a player's back after 2 games, a player that has come from a different league and needs time to adjust, a player that is pretty crucial to our prospects in this league is stupid, self destructive and bang out of order.

 

Get behind him and give him a chance, he's proven that he knows how to find the net so be patient.

 

Both very sensible posts, but asking for patience on here..futile

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