CB Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 What is particularly annoying is the loan business. With all that cash in the bank, we really should have been queuing up to get our metaphorical pants pulled down. I'm gutted the club isn't down at least 7m. No ambition. Rather a loan than a panic buy. At least this takes the pressure off and buys us two more transfer windows to either get Targett to the right level or to invest in a permanent solution. Look how much flak the board got for ossie and rameriez. If they were loan deals, people would have been screaming "no ambition" however it would have turned out to be a great decision.
Fitzhugh Fella Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere http://www.wayneleal.co.uk/pdf/The_Times_T2.pdf
trousers Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 What part of "we have no idea how he will do for us and of course I hope he does well" is being so sure of the outcome? How come you didn't pick your initial "Rubbish signing" post to back up your point?
ART Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Matteo used Ryan as a left winger with Ashley Cole at left back. Who knows Koeman's plans and get the impression he likes players who can play more than one position. I believe under Koeman, Ryan's speed will be more in demand than defending. I also feel we will be signing someone else for the left back position.
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 How come you didn't pick your initial "Rubbish signing" post to back up your point? On the face of it not impressed by the signing hence my initial reaction.
Mallagroth Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Ahh nice signing, clearly Bertrand wasn't sure about making the deal permanent in light of everything that is happening. If we have to get couple on loan for this season as a result of the exodus then it suits me fine at the moment. Apparently Tottenham were after him which is funny. Thanks Cork !
hectors house Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 A few people suggesting wehave an option to buy but this link suggests he is a free agent next summer ... http://www.chelseatrueblue.com/2014/07/bertrand-chelsea-career-over-southampton-loan.html? If true then he has effectively left Chelsea and the £10 million fee being mentioned is nonsense. Of course if he does do well (and I mean really well) then even less likely to stay, unless we have some kind of option agreed with him to sign for us (not sure if that would be legal?)
Minty Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Matteo used Ryan as a left winger with Ashley Cole at left back. Who knows Koeman's plans and get the impression he likes players who can play more than one position. I believe under Koeman, Ryan's speed will be more in demand than defending. I also feel we will be signing someone else for the left back position. Unlikely given Koeman's own words: I’ve been very impressed with how Matt Targett is doing in pre-season, but he is still young and developing, which I am sure he will continue to do over the coming seasons. Left-back is an important position in the team because it is quite specialised in terms of the attributes needed to play there, so it is nice to get this signing completed because it gives us some stability.
saints-cris Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Once I knew Shaw was as good as gone, I said we should sell Shaw and get Bertrand. Still young, relatively experienced and good left back who can still improve. Good signing.
Matthew Le God Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 A few people suggesting wehave an option to buy but this link suggests he is a free agent next summer ... http://www.chelseatrueblue.com/2014/07/bertrand-chelsea-career-over-southampton-loan.html? If true then he has effectively left Chelsea and the £10 million fee being mentioned is nonsense. Of course if he does do well (and I mean really well) then even less likely to stay, unless we have some kind of option agreed with him to sign for us (not sure if that would be legal?) That article is wrong. Ryan Bertrand signed a 5 year contract in 2012, so his Chelsea contract ends on 30th June 2017... http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19489662
farawaysaint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 That article is wrong. Ryan Bertrand signed a 5 year contract in 2012, so his Chelsea contract ends on 30th June 2017... http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/19489662 Fact checking twice in an hour MLG?
sunrise Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 For those whinging about it being a loan, not being good enough etc, all I will say is look how well(cough, cough) our club record signing did!
richard Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Happy with this, looking forward to seeing him play. Welcome to saints, Ryan.
ART Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Apologies if this has been posted elsewhere http://www.wayneleal.co.uk/pdf/The_Times_T2.pdf Top article Duncan. Hope they'll have all the players doing the same. A modern form of Strachan's running up sand dunes which is still very popular with Scots club in pre season.
farawaysaint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 For those whinging about it being a loan, not being good enough etc, all I will say is look how well(cough, cough) our club record signing did! Who? J-Rod or Big Vic? They were both briefly the record and have done very well, just the one who was a tremendous flop.
pap Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Rather a loan than a panic buy. At least this takes the pressure off and buys us two more transfer windows to either get Targett to the right level or to invest in a permanent solution. Look how much flak the board got for ossie and rameriez. If they were loan deals, people would have been screaming "no ambition" however it would have turned out to be a great decision. Actually agree, and should have perhaps stuck a couple of smilies on my post. Right now, Southampton FC have got one of the most public bank balances in the country. The loan of Bertrand might be underwhelming in the sense that we haven't permanently added to our numbers and he isn't an FM stat machine, but it does tell other clubs that we're not necessarily going to chuck mega-bucks at a problem, which will hopefully put us in stronger negotiating positions in deals to come.
georgeweahscousin Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The lowdown.... http://georgeweahscousin.com/2014/07/31/ryan-like-a-lion-in-bayern-bertrand-signs-for-saints/
sunrise Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Who? J-Rod or Big Vic? They were both briefly the record and have done very well, just the one who was a tremendous flop. Read what I put again, nowhere did I mention J-Rod or Vic. I said our club record signing, i.e Osvaldo.
farawaysaint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Read what I put again, nowhere did I mention J-Rod or Vic. I said our club record signing, i.e Osvaldo. I know, I agree, I'm just saying that the opposite of your point applies; just because we paid big money doesn't mean a signing will be Osvaldo
Dalek2003 Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Some players thrive after a move to a new club, let's hope this one does.
madruss Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The lowdown.... http://georgeweahscousin.com/2014/07/31/ryan-like-a-lion-in-bayern-bertrand-signs-for-saints/ Top stuff as always! Cheers for that
pap Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The lowdown.... http://georgeweahscousin.com/2014/07/31/ryan-like-a-lion-in-bayern-bertrand-signs-for-saints/ Nice one, Chris. This is a good format.
tpbury Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The lowdown.... http://georgeweahscousin.com/2014/07/31/ryan-like-a-lion-in-bayern-bertrand-signs-for-saints/ When's your next installment out , mate?
Wes Tender Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 What part of "we have no idea how he will do for us and of course I hope he does well" is being so sure of the outcome? Learn to read Les. I am perfectly capable of reading and indeed comprehending what I read, thank you. You learn to think rationally. Hypochondriac's various contrbutions: Rubbish signing ....underwhelming signing and a big step down from what we had previously On the face of it I think it is a poor signing. Certainly underwhelming and not of the standard I was expecting When asked what you were expecting, you responded players of the standard of Wanyama and Lovren. I really can't be arsed to go back and look, but I expect that I would find similar comments from you when we signed the misfit Lovren from Lyon and the raw Wanyama from 2nd division standard Celtic, when many of their forum revelled in mugging us for the amount we paid for him. Reading the uninformed guff that I have listed above, it is hard to comprehend how you can spout that and then try and justify the sensible position that we have no idea he will do for us and you hope that he does well. Do you suffer from a split personality?
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 At no point did I slag off the signings of Lovren and Wanyama. I thought both were good signings and said so at the time. You have just made that up to try and support your point. With everyone we sign, we have no idea how they will do for us and we all hope they do well. Having said that, normally you have an initial reaction about the signing. Not sure why you are finding that difficult to understand but as normal Les you miss the point.
Viking Warrior Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Enjoy reading that article Chris Meanwhile back to the looney bin
MarkSFC Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Ryan Bertand has a Champions League winners medal an FA Cup winners medal and England caps. He has represented England at every level and played for GB at the Olympics. Clearly all through his development he has been the best left back amongst his peers, but then he got into the Chelsea first team squad. Ahead of him was (it turned out) the most capped left-back in England history. Chelsea do not 'finish' players off, they send players to other clubs to do so. This lad has suffered by being at Chelsea, but when players go on loan they do not always fit in with a style and ethos, but hopefully, and it seems likely that here he will. This season is probably his last real chance to become a top player and to create a career where he plays in top performing teams. Otherwise he is likely to become a bit of a journey man. That's a good motivation to have in a player and because of this minor doubt a loan is perfect for Saints. If we spent say 6million on him and he just doesn't perform the moans would come later. Realistically though the lad has a very good pedigree and with different circumstances would be better at this stage. If he was we wouldn't have him. If we didn't get him in, who do we get? Rojo has been bandied about, and maybe we will still get him but he is actually a CB by trade. I hope we do get him as obviously he can play LB if necessary. Any left back who most would regard as better than Bertrand will likely cost 10m+ but we get one much cheaper who can easily be that good consistently. Two years ago when we came up I was keen that we got him. He has stalled but class and ability remain, the skill of the coach is getting people to perform. We have a top man in charge to do that, so this is an exciting signing and (hopefully) means funds saved here can get tougher targets. As always, time will tell.
domtu7 Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Things are on the up fellas! We need to take a leaf out of this guys book! - http://www.thesecretfootballer.com/articles/tsf-guest/20741/sell-sell-sell-saints-or-sinners/ Top stuff - #SaintsFC
Wes Tender Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 At no point did I slag off the signings of Lovren and Wanyama. I thought both were good signings and said so at the time. You have just made that up to try and support your point. With everyone we sign, we have no idea how they will do for us and we all hope they do well. Having said that, normally you have an initial reaction about the signing. Not sure why you are finding that difficult to understand but as normal Les you miss the point. Me: I really can't be arsed to go back and look, but I expect that I would find similar comments from you when we signed the misfit Lovren from Lyon and the raw Wanyama from 2nd division standard Celtic, when many of their forum revelled in mugging us for the amount we paid for him. Isn't it ironic when you accuse me of needing to read properly, when you have just illustrated your own inability to do so? Of course, had you just done what the more sensible posters had done and just said that although you were a little underwhelmed that we had signed him, but you hoped that he would nevertheless do well for us, then that would have been fine. But as your initial reaction was "rubbish signing", followed by the other damnation by faint praise, then you must expect to be labelled a moaner, which is what others have also called you.
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Me: Isn't it ironic when you accuse me of needing to read properly, when you have just illustrated your own inability to do so? Of course, had you just done what the more sensible posters had done and just said that although you were a little underwhelmed that we had signed him, but you hoped that he would nevertheless do well for us, then that would have been fine. But as your initial reaction was "rubbish signing", followed by the other damnation by faint praise, then you must expect to be labelled a moaner, which is what others have also called you. The only reason you said you couldn't be bothered is because you know it is untrue. Unless you can find proof of that nonsense claim then your point is irrelevant. Of course I hope he does well, it's a pointless thing to say because every single saints fan hopes that every single player does well for us.
Wes Tender Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The only reason you said you couldn't be bothered is because you know it is untrue. Unless you can find proof of that nonsense claim then your point is irrelevant. Of course I hope he does well, it's a pointless thing to say because every single saints fan hopes that every single player does well for us. The reason why I said that, was simply because of your reputation for exactly the sort of premature ejaculation, initial knee-jerk response you made about Bertrand. There was therefore a very good chance that your reactions would have been similar for previous signings. So to paraphrase your opinion on Bertram, he's rubbish, but you hope he does well for us. Is that a reasonable summary?
Village Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Damned if you do - damned if you don't springs to mind : / a player in from Chelski and still people are complaining - jeez He is championship standard player who struggled to get a game last year in the worst defence in the Premier League.
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 The reason why I said that, was simply because of your reputation for exactly the sort of premature ejaculation, initial knee-jerk response you made about Bertrand. There was therefore a very good chance that your reactions would have been similar for previous signings. So to paraphrase your opinion on Bertram, he's rubbish, but you hope he does well for us. Is that a reasonable summary? Any proof? No? I make an initial comment about most signings based on what I have seen and what I have read from others and having spoken to people. Tadic seems like a very good signing and Pelle I am unsure about. Bertrand doesn't seem like a great signing. Wanyama at the time seemed like a fantastic signing and I thought Lovren was a good one too. Also thought Ramirez was a great signing but have proven that maybe that is not the case there. Just because you would love me to slag off every signing saints make does not make it true. My opinion of Bertram is that it seems like a poor signing and I'm underwhelmed by an average signing considering our money in the bank and who he is replacing but I hope he does well.
buctootim Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 He is championship standard player who struggled to get a game last year in the worst defence in the Premier League. I wouldn't call playing in 14 of the 17 games Villa had during his loan spell "struggled to get a game".
Beckenham Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Southampton FC @SouthamptonFC · 15h Rogers: “This is another important step forward in terms of rebuilding our first team with exciting English talent at its core.” #SaintRyan Not sure if anyone else has posted this tweet, but I think it's a bit cheeky of Brendan Rogers to get direct quotes on our signings on our official twitter feed Decent enough signing, not going to set the world alight but he is an international, champions league winner who will be able to help Targett and surely will have a point to prove as he is 25 in a few weeks and will want to impress with us to either get a permanent move or get the attention of a decent club next year when his contract with Chelsea runs out. He can only help our squad, despite what a lot of the negative posters seem to say. I think it is fair to say he has been mis-managed before, considering he is clearly good enough to have sustained a top flight career (albeit mainly loans) and have a brief stint with England where a lot of other players who befall similar fates seem to drift into obscurity. Let's hope Koeman can bring out the best in him.
Beckenham Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 My opinion of Bertram is that it seems like a poor signing and I'm underwhelmed by an average signing considering our money in the bank and who he is replacing but I hope he does well. Well luckily for you, we haven't signed him.
Wes Tender Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 My opinion of Bertram is that it seems like a poor signing and I'm underwhelmed by an average signing considering our money in the bank and who he is replacing but I hope he does well. So initially it was a rubbish signing, but now its suddenly either a poor signing or even an average signing. Why don't you tell us what you really think?
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 (edited) So initially it was a rubbish signing, but now its suddenly either a poor signing or even an average signing. Why don't you tell us what you really think? Maybe my use of the word rubbish was too strong when I was initially disappointed at the calibre of player. How I feel is as I expressed in the previous post. Edited 31 July, 2014 by hypochondriac
Wes Tender Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 I wouldn't call playing in 14 of the 17 games Villa had during his loan spell "struggled to get a game". What he meant was that he struggled to get a game on those three occasions. If I remember rightly, Village Saint has previous as a WUM
Mallagroth Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Not sure if anyone else has posted this tweet, but I think it's a bit cheeky of Brendan Rogers to get direct quotes on our signings on our official twitter feed. Wait a minute who is really our financial director and why have these Liverpool sales gone so quickly…
doddisalegend Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 I wouldn't call playing in 14 of the 17 games Villa had during his loan spell "struggled to get a game". I think some people assumed Ryan was on loan at Villa all of last season when in fact he didn't join Villa until the middle of January
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Can we give some credit, as I believe it is due, to Les Reed and the 'football school' at Saints for this 'signing'? I know that all depends on whether you think its a good signing or not, however... ..Bertrand has been on our radar for some time; pretty sure he was one of those three or four unnamed players mentioned by Reed as a key target (you know the statement that was supposedly all lies?!).
Wiggles31 Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Happy with this signing. LB position now covered and he is young still has a lot to prove. Lets be honest Villa was dog sh*te last year and would have made a lot of players look crap.
Saint Billy Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Maybe my use of the word rubbish was too strong when I was initially disappointed at the calibre of player. How I feel is as I expressed in the previous post. As much as you or I wish it, we are not going to get top calibre players. The Southampton way is to turn them into top calibre players then sell them.
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 As much as you or I wish it, we are not going to get top calibre players. The Southampton way is to turn them into top calibre players then sell them. Was that the case last season?
modern matron Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 Maybe my use of the word rubbish was too strong when I was initially disappointed at the calibre of player. How I feel is as I expressed in the previous post. You talk rubbish which I find disappointing really especially as RB is a good signing.....
hypochondriac Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 You talk rubbish which I find disappointing really especially as RB is a good signing..... Good debate mate.
Heisenberg Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 As much as you or I wish it, we are not going to get top calibre players. The Southampton way is to turn them into top calibre players then sell them. Exactly - we shouldnt look at players with a past, look for players with a future.
trousers Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 He is championship standard player who struggled to get a game last year in the worst defence in the Premier League. 9.4/10
Mallagroth Posted 31 July, 2014 Posted 31 July, 2014 9.4/10 Wow you give him a higher score than I would've. Did he get more points for being a troll who can spell?
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