Mallagroth Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Anyone would think dribbling past people was a risky business which often resulted in possession turnovers and that he did it a lot, or something - does it also show how many times his quick feet and control enabled us to retain possession from low quality balls in tight situations in the attacking third? Untwist thou knickers, it's just an interesting stat that's not been highlighted before. Of course some possession would be lost in making attacking runs, but for Lallana to be the most guilty in the prem came as quite a surprise to me. I also think this will be a useful stat to trot out in the inevitable Ramirez debates, note it down troll hunters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 one thing Lallana certainly didn't have was a loose touch. He had the best first touch whilst on the run that I have ever seen in a Saints shirt. It's only because so many have gone that we aren't all worrying about how badly we miss these individual players. I think some fans have seriously forgotten how good Lallana and Shaw were for us last season. Tadic and Bertrand have a lot to live up to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 one thing Lallana certainly didn't have was a loose touch. He had the best first touch whilst on the run that I have ever seen in a Saints shirt. It's only because so many have gone that we aren't all worrying about how badly we miss these individual players. I think some fans have seriously forgotten how good Lallana and Shaw were for us last season. Tadic and Bertrand have a lot to live up to. Give it 5 games before is will be the trendy thing to suggest that Bertrand is better than shaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 one thing Lallana certainly didn't have was a loose touch. He had the best first touch whilst on the run that I have ever seen in a Saints shirt. It's only because so many have gone that we aren't all worrying about how badly we miss these individual players. I think some fans have seriously forgotten how good Lallana and Shaw were for us last season. Tadic and Bertrand have a lot to live up to. Absolutely. Although more Tadic than Bertrand in my view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallagroth Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 one thing Lallana certainly didn't have was a loose touch. He had the best first touch whilst on the run that I have ever seen in a Saints shirt. It's only because so many have gone that we aren't all worrying about how badly we miss these individual players. I think some fans have seriously forgotten how good Lallana and Shaw were for us last season. Tadic and Bertrand have a lot to live up to. Chez i'm with you but I'm just relaying the stat in this article that ART posted, take it up with ESPN but I doubt they're saying it as disgruntled saints fans. http://www.espnfc.co.uk/barclays-premier-league/23/blog/post/1967239/southamptons-ex-appeal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Give it 5 games before is will be the trendy thing to suggest that Bertrand is better than shaw I already think he's better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 When he was being linked with Chelsea, wern't a fair few of their supporters saying RB was as good as LS, so no need for him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Give it 5 games before is will be the trendy thing to suggest that Bertrand is better than shaw Give it 5 mins into first game before you are making some sarcastic ****ish comment about him or some other player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Give it 5 games before is will be the trendy thing to suggest that Bertrand is better than shaw And here I was thinking it is 'trendy' to say Shaw is the greatest LB the country has ever seen. Let's be honest with ourselves shall we? Shaw has had a cracking season (and I will missed bellowing Luuuuuuuke at him) but Ryan Bertrand has been, until last year, regularly quoted by 'those in the know' (coaches, england setup, Chelsea staff) has being the natural successor to Cashley. Sure, he (RB) might have had a virus which kept him out and found himself third choice at CFC thanks to Mourihno playing a RightBack at Left Back; but I believe we have made something of a coup with this signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 And here I was thinking it is 'trendy' to say Shaw is the greatest LB the country has ever seen. Let's be honest with ourselves shall we? Shaw has had a cracking season (and I will missed bellowing Luuuuuuuke at him) but Ryan Bertrand has been, until last year, regularly quoted by 'those in the know' (coaches, england setup, Chelsea staff) has being the natural successor to Cashley. Sure, he (RB) might have had a virus which kept him out and found himself third choice at CFC thanks to Mourihno playing a RightBack at Left Back; but I believe we have made something of a coup with this signing. without belittling bertrand why isnt he and never really been close to being Cashleys relief? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Ash Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 If Bertrand scores or creates a goal he's done more than Shaw. It's not all about running flat out up and down the wing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farawaysaint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 (edited) .... Edited 31 July, 2014 by farawaysaint Ah, screw it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 (edited) without belittling bertrand why isnt he and never really been close to being Cashleys relief? Err José wants very little to do with Englishmen ? How many does he have left now, Terry,Cahill...isn't that about it? Old Englishmen...he'll make an exception, youngsters...they can fark right off. How they are getting round the home grown rule I just couldn't say, by reducing their PL + CL squads to 17 + 2 I suppose. Edited 31 July, 2014 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 If Bertrand scores or creates a goal he's done more than Shaw. It's not all about running flat out up and down the wing. No, it's about being able to defend your flank and stop the crosses. Attacking/assists and goals are bonuses. Shaw defended very well and was for the first half of the season, a key cog in the best defence in European football. I hate the constant belittling of players once they've left. Bertrand isn't as good as shaw, will never be as good as shaw..so there's no point really debating that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 If Bertrand scores or creates a goal he's done more than Shaw. It's not all about running flat out up and down the wing. And then putting in a sh*t ball because you're farked after too much Nando's. Shaw is vastly overated, good deal, even I congratulate the board on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 If Bertrand scores or creates a goal he's done more than Shaw. It's not all about running flat out up and down the wing. i'd rather he defends as good as shaw did. we created plenty last season 8th most in the league. Only a couple of clear chances behind arsenal!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granadino Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Lovely stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 And then putting in a sh*t ball because you're farked after too much Nando's. Shaw is vastly overated, good deal, even I congratulate the board on that one. He really isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 He really isn't. Lets wait and see how he gets on at Utd eh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Lets wait and see how he gets on at Utd eh. Team of the year, as voted for by the players. A group of professionals, or you? I know whose judgement I will go with on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 without belittling bertrand why isnt he and never really been close to being Cashleys relief? I think Cole outplayed himself in the 2012/13 season, where Ryan was beginning to get a look in under Di Meteo (sometimes as a midfielder?) can't remember if Benitez rated him or not, sorry, and then Mourihno has played RightBack Azpillicueta as LeftBack (somewhat bizarrely, but hey, he does seem to known his stuff ☺ ). Aside from that I'd say Bertrand has come close, a virus kept both him and cCashley out of the first team a bit too and the style changed under Mourihno. Honestly, I dont think Ryan was good enough last year to help Chelsea's cause when he had a fully competitive Cashley ahead of him as the backup LB (yep, Cole - last season - was IMO as good if not better than Shaw, yet still not good enough for Chelsea or England. Yeah right!) Oh yeah, did you watch the 2012 Champions League Final? Ryan Bertrand was more than an adequate relief! I think, as has been mentioned, Chelsea see a loan out as a good way to keep tabs on a (often homegrown) player before either cashing in on him or giving him a shot at the first team. See Lukaku - better than Torres surely, but finally offloaded for 28m: even Chelsea are a selling club! or our own Jack Cork. Cork nowhere near the Chelsea team thanks to Lampard et al But who would you want NOW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 if bertrand has come close how come he never really has? how come he is not there now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 (edited) if bertrand has come close how come he never really has? how come he is not there now? Because they've signed yet another Brazilian LB, José wants nothing to do with English players, it's pretty obvious. If you look at their recruitment it's all foreigners, the only home grown senior players that they have left are Cahill and Terry, when those 2 are retired they'll be down to zero. Thus their PL squad will be reduced to 17 + U21s. Edited 31 July, 2014 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 I think Cole outplayed himself in the 2012/13 season, where Ryan was beginning to get a look in under Di Meteo (sometimes as a midfielder?) can't remember if Benitez rated him or not, sorry, and then Mourihno has played RightBack Azpillicueta as LeftBack (somewhat bizarrely, but hey, he does seem to known his stuff ☺ ). Aside from that I'd say Bertrand has come close, a virus kept both him and cCashley out of the first team a bit too and the style changed under Mourihno. Honestly, I dont think Ryan was good enough last year to help Chelsea's cause when he had a fully competitive Cashley ahead of him as the backup LB (yep, Cole - last season - was IMO as good if not better than Shaw, yet still not good enough for Chelsea or England. Yeah right!) Oh yeah, did you watch the 2012 Champions League Final? Ryan Bertrand was more than an adequate relief! I think, as has been mentioned, Chelsea see a loan out as a good way to keep tabs on a (often homegrown) player before either cashing in on him or giving him a shot at the first team. See Lukaku - better than Torres surely, but finally offloaded for 28m: even Chelsea are a selling club! or our own Jack Cork. Cork nowhere near the Chelsea team thanks to Lampard et al But who would you want NOW? Remember him playing against us at SMS under Benitez (we won 2-1) when they had that massive backlog of cup fixtures. Always seems to play scared when he's in possession and making a pass. Maybe this is just ultra risk-aversion rather than limited technique and a bit of stability will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 if bertrand has come close how come he never really has? how come he is not there now? See the below posts. In was being generous as said a Change Of Playing Style, but Windows has it right too. Farming out VERY good players on Loan is a Chelsea (and recently ManCiteh) speciality. They don't always make sense. See Lukaku on loan last seaaon whilst Torres was still being sh!te. Because they've signed yet another Brazilian LB, José wants nothing to do with English players, it's pretty obvious. I think Cole outplayed himself in the 2012/13 season, where Ryan was beginning to get a look in under Di Meteo (sometimes as a midfielder?) can't remember if Benitez rated him or not, sorry, and then Mourihno has played RightBack Azpillicueta as LeftBack (somewhat bizarrely, but hey, he does seem to known his stuff ☺ ). Aside from that I'd say Bertrand has come close, a virus kept both him and cCashley out of the first team a bit too and the style changed under Mourihno. Honestly, I dont think Ryan was good enough last year to help Chelsea's cause when he had a fully competitive Cashley ahead of him as the backup LB (yep, Cole - last season - was IMO as good if not better than Shaw, yet still not good enough for Chelsea or England. Yeah right!) Oh yeah, did you watch the 2012 Champions League Final? Ryan Bertrand was more than an adequate relief! I think, as has been mentioned, Chelsea see a loan out as a good way to keep tabs on a (often homegrown) player before either cashing in on him or giving him a shot at the first team. See Lukaku - better than Torres surely, but finally offloaded for 28m: even Chelsea are a selling club! or our own Jack Cork. Cork nowhere near the Chelsea team thanks to Lampard et al But who would you want NOW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Always seems to play scared when he's in possession and making a pass. Maybe this is just ultra risk-aversion rather than limited technique and a bit of stability will help. Probably just trying to hard to not make a mistake during one of his limited opportunities to impress. I imagine playing regulalrly will / would improve him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 See the below posts. In was being generous as said a Change Of Playing Style, but Windows has it right too. Farming out VERY good players on Loan is a Chelsea (and recently ManCiteh) speciality. They don't always make sense. See Lukaku on loan last seaaon whilst Torres was still being sh!te. How many Chelsea youngsters have truly made it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiSaint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 No, it's about being able to defend your flank and stop the crosses. Attacking/assists and goals are bonuses. Shaw defended very well and was for the first half of the season, a key cog in the best defence in European football. I hate the constant belittling of players once they've left. Bertrand isn't as good as shaw, will never be as good as shaw..so there's no point really debating that. Ahh - OK. Anything else there's no point in debating? Prat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Remember him playing against us at SMS under Benitez (we won 2-1) when they had that massive backlog of cup fixtures. Always seems to play scared when he's in possession and making a pass. Maybe this is just ultra risk-aversion rather than limited technique and a bit of stability will help. Been chatting all morning with a very savvy Chelsea fan and he would agree that Bertrand has limitations but also thinks he has as just as much in his locker as Shaw (from what he has seen). He has the attacking qualities of Shaw, or maybe more like classic Cole, crossing is good but is a beat-yer-man-first type (unlike Shaw, who can whip it around almost magically, sigh). But yes, can be a bit hasty playing out of defence, "Doesn't like to stand around" was the direct quote (I have been told to write that), basically a cracking defender of breakaway attacks, but can look a little static if he is too deep, and excellent in attack but maybe needs to pick his head up a bit and play the ball a bit brighter in midfield. Hopefully (for him, us and even Chelsea) all quite coach-able by Koeman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 (edited) How many Chelsea youngsters have truly made it? Well sort of none'ish, well not English ones anyway. Oscar was recruited very young, can't remember if that was by José though, Hazard was young as well. Mourinho is win at all costs and he has no time for home grown players. Look at their signings this summer. Fabregas,Costa,Felipé Luis,Drogba all experienced and Pasalic who they'll no doubt loan out again. José would rather have Drogba than Lukaku because he says Lukaku's attitude is wrong. Edited 31 July, 2014 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohio Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 French obviously not your strong point!! I think, if I can translate from some form of pidgin French, "I am called an ice cream please". Maybe it is the patois they use in Alsace!! You underestimate Bearsy's comic genius. The part of MS is being played by the English spy playing the French Gendarme in Allo Allo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaroid Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 How many Chelsea youngsters have truly made it? At Chelsea? Few. But that's well known - they have a fantastic youth (kids and schools groups) set up across the entire south east, but for the senior squad they focus on purchases and WAGES to win. Very difficult for them to make the gamble of turning to their academy, and why should they? Wages win matches and Chelsea are one of a few clubs that can pay a squad of 20plus players an average of 90k a week (the first team averages around 120k) this gives their current manager the pick of the worlds best. Why bother giving youth a chance? Other managers might (Di Mateo did as he knew the youth players) but they tend to get sacked! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenridge Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 I see SSN are still reporting that MS 'has requested a move away from St.Mary's' despite other news outlets (Daily Echo) suggesting this is not the case - well, not a written transfer request anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 SSN reporting he's back in training but will not play tonight at Brighton. He's off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_ed Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 I see SSN are still reporting that MS 'has requested a move away from St.Mary's' despite other news outlets (Daily Echo) suggesting this is not the case - well, not a written transfer request anyway. That tweet is as good as a transfer request. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nolan Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 SSN reporting he's back in training but will not play tonight at Brighton. He's off. Of course he won't play after 2 days training. He isn't near match fitness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Of course he won't play after 2 days training. He isn't near match fitness. Call me old fashioned but I thought friendlies were all about reaching match fitness. If anything you'd want him to play at least a half to gain some fitness. He's off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbyboy Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 The thing I get most from this particular work is that it's probably the only time we'll see Morgan wearing the new kit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nolan Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Call me old fashioned but I thought friendlies were all about reaching match fitness. If anything you'd want him to play at least a half to gain some fitness. He's off. Don't be an idiot. There's a reason our first pre season friendly was 10 days after training started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Don't be an idiot. There's a reason our first pre season friendly was 10 days after training started. Another reason why he's off? Krueger was the man picked to make the announcement he was staying. Can't help but think he's being set up for his own sacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakkoUK Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Good news everybody! Adam Blackmore @bigadamsport 12m Ronald Koeman: "I spoke to Morgan two days ago - he's a Southampton player, will continue to be a Southampton player & should play v Bayer" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascadia Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Good news everybody! Adam Blackmore @bigadamsport 12m Ronald Koeman: "I spoke to Morgan two days ago - he's a Southampton player, will continue to be a Southampton player & should play v Bayer" Er... Should someone tell him what's happened since then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Er... Should someone tell him what's happened since then? What's that then? Listen to the interview it's posted on here somewhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 31 July, 2014 Share Posted 31 July, 2014 Not sure if this is just a translation thing, but his comments here don't sound as reassuring what so ever: Of his discussions with Schneiderlin he added: “The conversations are between us and not to the media because we like to keep those sort of things inside. “He was not in a good shape to play because he has been training only for five or six days and normally he will play next week against Leverkusen at home. “About his situation, we wait. “He is a player of Southampton and I hope he will continue as a player of Southampton.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd_barrett_saint Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 Not sure if this is just a translation thing, but his comments here don't sound as reassuring what so ever: Yep, and you'd think that if Koeman told Schneiderlin that these sorts of things should be kept inside, that if Morgan had any intention of building bridges, he would have deleted the tweet by now. It would be the professional, respectful thing to do. Unless of course Morgan isn't very tech savvy and can't work out how to delete it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mallagroth Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 Yep, and you'd think that if Koeman told Schneiderlin that these sorts of things should be kept inside, that if Morgan had any intention of building bridges, he would have deleted the tweet by now. It would be the professional, respectful thing to do. Unless of course Morgan isn't very tech savvy and can't work out how to delete it? another argument would say that deleting it would be a cowardly sheepish thing to do. he's made his point time to get on with it no point trying to pretend it didn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd_barrett_saint Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 another argument would say that deleting it would be a cowardly sheepish thing to do. he's made his point time to get on with it no point trying to pretend it didn't happen. That's an argument, but at the very least he has to do something out of respect for the people who pay his very large wages. Either delete the tweet, or post again saying that he over-reacted as his emotions briefly got the better of him. You can't go around destabilising the organization you work for with such a public negative statement, and then expect to do nothing about it. Unless of course, you still have zero intention of remaining with that company much longer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascadia Saint Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 Christ you've got an odd perspective of what constitutes trolling. Next time should I write something like this?... ***PLEASE NOTE, I AM AWARE OF THE TRUE MEANING OF WHAT I AM QUOTING. THE FOLLOWING SENTENCE IS DELIBERATE MISUNDERSTANDING AND MEANT ONLY IN JEST. PLEASE DO NOT TAKE SERIOUSLY*** Less than 48 hours after RK said he wouldn't be leaving! More incompetence from the bungling board ***PLEASE NOTE, I AM AWARE OF THE TRUE MEANING OF WHAT I AM QUOTING. THE PRECEDING SENTENCE IS DELIBERATE MISUNDERSTANDING AND MEANT ONLY IN JEST. PLEASE DO NOT TAKE SERIOUSLY*** Haha!! Don't worry mate, Art doesn't do humour. Straight as an arrow is our Art, bless him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascadia Saint Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 What's that then? Listen to the interview it's posted on here somewhere Never mind. Whoosh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musesaint Posted 1 August, 2014 Share Posted 1 August, 2014 Unless of course Morgan isn't very tech savvy and can't work out how to delete it? He only started his twitter account a few weeks ago if that helps ease anxieties ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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