John McGrath's Jockstrap Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Can I just say what a ridiculous amount of bedwetting posts I have seen in the last few weeks..... So as a really (I hope) balanced opinion, can I say the following: 1. The Cortese idyll is gone. It was never going to happen. Why should it?. KT's father bought an asset for sub £20M on a punt, he probably really truly enjoyed at the time and it is now worth at least x5 as much but.... ML is gone, and KL is left with somewhat of a poisoned chalice. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. She has made some (and inherited some) poor back room management choices post Cortese not suited to cutting edge English PL management culture and it shows. Why should she not sell it rather than read the peurile rubbish on this site?. I feel for her while she has some sub standard executive management, on the basis of evidence so far, in charge of her assets and inheritance. 2. We are now (but always have been) a selling club. Look back in history. Truth be told that we will always produce good young talent but we will ultimately sell it at the right price. This will never change. We will never be a top 4 club.Accept it - be a Saints fan rather than a plastic. 3. We might win a cup if our manager believes in it enough. Ultimately the key to our side, which I think Koeman will get, is blending the good yound talent that we CAN keep with hardened pros like a Pelle - if SLR can get the deal done. History always a good predictor of this......look at Saints of the past 30 years. 4. What really does p*ss me off if the reverence posters seem to show towards Guan, mehball etc etc on this site. The truth of it is you are in some really junior position on the very periphery somewhere in the club with no concept of how businesses are really run let alone how to influence them. ITK - read - in the kak. 5.. Forget Llalana, Lovren et al. Who gives a sh*t about them. Take the money and invest in the Academy, and blend with some great 28/29 year old players who the kids can learn from. Ball, Case, Mills, Marsden, Lambo etc. Finally, as a seasoned Saints supporter - COYR and loved the past 4 years more than any other time in the past 30. Keep the faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joneth Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 The voice of reason has spoken. Ok mods, you can close the forum now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 there is a bit of bedwetting as a team under no real financial constraints is seemingly being torn apart by players who cant wait to get out like we have never seen before in this league that will always bring a level of concern Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordswoodsaints Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Did we really need another thread started for this drivel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Nobody cares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Worthy of a jockstrap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 What is annoying me is the fact people calling others bedwetters..... Showing concern for the club means you care. Blindly not giving a crap what happens just makes you stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 We will never be a top 4 club... ...History always a good predictor of this......look at Saints of the past 30 years. 30 years ago we came 2nd. So, your post is twaddle. Voice of Reason, my arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 (edited) Can I just say what a ridiculous amount of bedwetting posts I have seen in the last few weeks..... 5.. Forget Lallana, Lovren et al. Who gives a sh*t about them. Take the money and invest in the Academy, and blend with some great 28/29 year old players who the kids can learn from. Ball, Case, Mills, Marsden, Lambo etc. Finally, as a seasoned Saints supporter - COYR and loved the past 4 years more than any other time in the past 30. Keep the faith. Now that bit makes sense. But surely it's unfair to criticise KL. and Board because so far we've made over £60 million by selling players who - for various reasons - and on their own admission... wanted to leave. AND... if there's another £40 mill. in the pipeline GOOD. Let's be off with all those who don't want to be here. Some people on here are suggesting we'll need twice as much to get replacements- RUBBISH. The prices that these " big clubs " are paying out are only a sign of their paranoia to succeed....Let them spend it all...and we'll get the benefit. Why do we comtinue to brag about the Academy, yet very few posterrs seem to have the confidence that there are more Lallana's, Shaw's and Ward-Prowse's just waiting to get their chance. We don't have to pay out a fortune to get in World Cup stars to SMS, but the right balance of new signings with good experience will help our youngsters enormously, as it has done before. I'm not expecting to win the Prem. title next season,(if ever) and a Euro place seems just as far away as it did last August, but I do expect to see a steady improvement, and not break the bank to do it. Edited 7 July, 2014 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckenham Saint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 I find it absolutely hilarious that someone who calls himself John McGrath's Jockstrap can then go on to proclaim himself the voice of reason! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Bedwetting! Anyone familiar with the book of revelation, and you all should be as it is the basis of our club song, will have recognised in recent events not the normal ebb and flow of a mid-sized football club but the clear onset of metaphorical rapture! Not one, not two, but FOUR of our whitest saints have already ascended to the higher realm, and those left behind, the unworthy, the base, the vile scum of humanity, the remaining first team squad, are turning fist on their brother. Humanity is collapsing around our ears, and you talk of Reason! The trumpet has sounded, the end of days are nigh! Do not submit to reason, but put your faith in The Lord. Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceman Spiff Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Judging by the serious responses, it is clear that I was wrong. Some people do care. I can't understand why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Bedwetting! Anyone familiar with the book of revelation, and you all should be as it is the basis of our club song, will have recognised in recent events not the normal ebb and flow of a mid-sized football club but the clear onset of metaphorical rapture! Not one, not two, but FOUR of our whitest saints have already ascended to the higher realm, and those left behind, the unworthy, the base, the vile scum of humanity, the remaining first team squad, are turning fist on their brother. Humanity is collapsing around our ears, and you talk of Reason! The trumpet has sounded, the end of days are nigh! Do not submit to reason, but put your faith in The Lord. Amen. Jesus Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beckenham Saint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Jesus Christ. Ah cheers, was wondering what he was referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revolution saint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Can I just say what a ridiculous amount of bedwetting posts I have seen in the last few weeks..... So as a really (I hope) balanced opinion, can I say the following: 1. The Cortese idyll is gone. It was never going to happen. Why should it?. KT's father bought an asset for sub £20M on a punt, he probably really truly enjoyed at the time and it is now worth at least x5 as much but.... ML is gone, and KL is left with somewhat of a poisoned chalice. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. She has made some (and inherited some) poor back room management choices post Cortese not suited to cutting edge English PL management culture and it shows. Why should she not sell it rather than read the peurile rubbish on this site?. I feel for her while she has some sub standard executive management, on the basis of evidence so far, in charge of her assets and inheritance. 2. We are now (but always have been) a selling club. Look back in history. Truth be told that we will always produce good young talent but we will ultimately sell it at the right price. This will never change. We will never be a top 4 club.Accept it - be a Saints fan rather than a plastic. 3. We might win a cup if our manager believes in it enough. Ultimately the key to our side, which I think Koeman will get, is blending the good yound talent that we CAN keep with hardened pros like a Pelle - if SLR can get the deal done. History always a good predictor of this......look at Saints of the past 30 years. 4. What really does p*ss me off if the reverence posters seem to show towards Guan, mehball etc etc on this site. The truth of it is you are in some really junior position on the very periphery somewhere in the club with no concept of how businesses are really run let alone how to influence them. ITK - read - in the kak. 5.. Forget Llalana, Lovren et al. Who gives a sh*t about them. Take the money and invest in the Academy, and blend with some great 28/29 year old players who the kids can learn from. Ball, Case, Mills, Marsden, Lambo etc. Finally, as a seasoned Saints supporter - COYR and loved the past 4 years more than any other time in the past 30. Keep the faith. I think you may be taking things too seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Can I just say what a ridiculous amount of bedwetting posts I have seen in the last few weeks..... So as a really (I hope) balanced opinion, can I say the following: 1. The Cortese idyll is gone. It was never going to happen. Why should it?. KT's father bought an asset for sub £20M on a punt, he probably really truly enjoyed at the time and it is now worth at least x5 as much but.... ML is gone, and KL is left with somewhat of a poisoned chalice. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. She has made some (and inherited some) poor back room management choices post Cortese not suited to cutting edge English PL management culture and it shows. Why should she not sell it rather than read the peurile rubbish on this site?. I feel for her while she has some sub standard executive management, on the basis of evidence so far, in charge of her assets and inheritance. 2. We are now (but always have been) a selling club. Look back in history. Truth be told that we will always produce good young talent but we will ultimately sell it at the right price. This will never change. We will never be a top 4 club.Accept it - be a Saints fan rather than a plastic. 3. We might win a cup if our manager believes in it enough. Ultimately the key to our side, which I think Koeman will get, is blending the good yound talent that we CAN keep with hardened pros like a Pelle - if SLR can get the deal done. History always a good predictor of this......look at Saints of the past 30 years. 4. What really does p*ss me off if the reverence posters seem to show towards Guan, mehball etc etc on this site. The truth of it is you are in some really junior position on the very periphery somewhere in the club with no concept of how businesses are really run let alone how to influence them. ITK - read - in the kak. 5.. Forget Llalana, Lovren et al. Who gives a sh*t about them. Take the money and invest in the Academy, and blend with some great 28/29 year old players who the kids can learn from. Ball, Case, Mills, Marsden, Lambo etc. Finally, as a seasoned Saints supporter - COYR and loved the past 4 years more than any other time in the past 30. Keep the faith. Bedwetting in the other direction. Actually that brings images to mind which I could do without. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 be a Saints fan rather than a plastic. I'll get my coat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horley CTFC Saint Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 30 years ago we came 2nd. So, your post is twaddle. Voice of Reason, my arse. 30 years ago there was no Premier League Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW5 SAINT Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 30 years ago we came 2nd. So, your post is twaddle. Voice of Reason, my arse. And reached FA Cup semis, should have our double winning year. Seen off by the scousers again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint86 Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 Now that bit makes sense. But surely it's unfair to criticise KL. and Board because so far we've made over £60 million by selling players who - for various reasons - and on their own admission... wanted to leave. AND... if there's another £40 mill. in the pipeline GOOD. Let's be off with all those who don't want to be here. Some people on here are suggesting we'll need twice as much to get replacements- RUBBISH. The prices that these " big clubs " are paying out are only a sign of their paranoia to succeed....Let them spend it all...and we'll get the benefit. Why do we comtinue to brag about the Academy, yet very few posterrs seem to have the confidence that there are more Lallana's, Shaw's and Ward-Prowse's just waiting to get their chance. We don't have to pay out a fortune to get in World Cup stars to SMS, but the right balance of new signings with good experience will help our youngsters enormously, as it has done before. I'm not expecting to win the Prem. title next season,(if ever) and a Euro place seems just as far away as it did last August, but I do expect to see a steady improvement, and not break the bank to do it. Great post Dave! Their are some true gems in the academy. Can't wait to see players like Rowe, sims, Sinclair and seager make the fringes and push through and they have a real chance under koeman as opposed to mopo as he actually will play wingers! Target, reed, gallagher, cha!beds and prowse are all the proof you need that the production line is continuous. As were dyer, surman, best, lallana, oxlade, shaw etc. With sound management this club will go up and up. We're selling players for 25m and buying as good replacements for half the fee in tadic and pelle. The big clubs will fund us and our academy.... Some fans are just divs like the OP who thinks we will never be a top 4 club yet excludes the 80s even on the back of 30years support. We have a great club, great setup and great potential... Plus we are actually cash rich, the future is bright and the next 5 years will show us organically grown into a European cub IMHO. This season maybe a tad bumby, but we have undergone change and ditched the rotten staff to make way for the new batch. COYR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westofshannonsaint Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 1. The Cortese idyll is gone. It was never going to happen. Why should it?. KT's father bought an asset for sub £20M on a punt, he probably really truly enjoyed at the time and it is now worth at least x5 as much but.... ML is gone, and KL is left with somewhat of a poisoned chalice. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. She has made some (and inherited some) poor back room management choices post Cortese not suited to cutting edge English PL management culture and it shows. Why should she not sell it rather than read the peurile rubbish on this site?. I feel for her while she has some sub standard executive management, on the basis of evidence so far, in charge of her assets and inheritance. ML left us in a much better position than when he arrived, that is all i asked when he bought the club & I ask the same of his daughter. If she feels that she cannot improve the club or is worried about what is said on a football forum she should sell. 2. We are now (but always have been) a selling club. Look back in history. Truth be told that we will always produce good young talent but we will ultimately sell it at the right price. This will never change. This had changed. Before SRL the last first eleven player I remember being sold was AOC. What would Puncheon have to say about fighting for a transfer away from Saints? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 30 years ago there was no Premier League Correct, in those days the No 1 League was called " Division One " By and large, it had the same Big Name teams in it as there are today The biggest difference is that in those days it was the "English" Division One. And in those days we had an England Team worthy of the name Today of course it is mainly for Foreigners, and we don't really compete at National level any more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 Correct, in those days the No 1 League was called " Division One " By and large, it had the same Big Name teams in it as there are today The biggest difference is that in those days it was the "English" Division One. And in those days we had an England Team worthy of the name Today of course it is mainly for Foreigners, and we don't really compete at National level any more We had a very English division one in the seventies and couldn't even qualify for the world cup. We did great in 86 (still a terrible group phase performance), okay in 82 but appalling in 88 and didn't qualify in 1984. Oh for an English only football league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 We had a very English division one in the seventies and couldn't even qualify for the world cup. We did great in 86 (still a terrible group phase performance), okay in 82 but appalling in 88 and didn't qualify in 1984. Oh for an English only football league. Very true C.B. Going from memory From 1986 1990 P7 W3 D3 L1 out on pens in Semi v W Germany 1994 Did Not Qualify 1998 P4 W2 D1 L1 out in last 16 on pens v Argentina 2002 P5 W2 D2 L1 out in quarters v Brazil 2006 P5 W3 D2 L0 out pens quarters to Portugal 2010 P4 W1 D2 L1 out in last 16 v Germany 2014 P3 W0 D1 L2 Failed to get out of the Group stage As you rightly say, Oh for an English only Football League Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpturner Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 I used to wet the bed until the age of 7 - there, I've said it. It feels good to be out at last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 The voice of reason has spoken. Ok mods, you can close the forum now. I think you'll find that MINTY is the voice of reason, and has been for a very long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 I used to wet the bed until the age of 7 - there, I've said it. It feels good to be out at last. Think you may be looking for the Tell the Truth thread there KP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 Did we really need another thread started for this drivel? Nobody cares Worthy of a jockstrap. Oh and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpturner Posted 8 July, 2014 Share Posted 8 July, 2014 Think you may be looking for the Tell the Truth thread there KP.I saw this thread as a less public way of coming out, in the hope that it would filter through surreptitiously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 9 July, 2014 Share Posted 9 July, 2014 What is annoying me is the fact people calling others bedwetters..... Showing concern for the club means you care. Blindly not giving a crap what happens just makes you stupid. There is showing (or feeling) concern and then there is dissecting every last rumour and putting a negative spin on it - which is what has been happening big time of late. Media rumours have been picked up and used as "evidence" of asset stripping, fire sales, no ambition etc. Some posters seem to want to believe this is true - even after we appointed Koeman (which if that isnt a statement of ambition I dont know what is). Bedwetter, wrist slitters, call them what you will, but they exist and they make this place stink. I'll give an example. One of the more negative posters on here constantly refers to something that came from the press saying would not accept less than £40m for Shaw and uses that as a stick to beat the Board with despite the fact that there is not a single bit of evidence to show that this was ever the case. Nevertheless, in this prsons mind it is a fact and the Board are weak for selling Shaw for less. As it happens we got a record fee for a teenager so why this is bad business by the Board I dont know. The manager and some players have left. Some more might go. Guess what? The world is still spinning and the sun still rises. Come the start of the season SFC will still be in the Premiership and will field a squad put togther by one of the most high profile managers this club has ever emplolyed. If there is anything that need concern us we wont really know until the season is underway but to be fair, if Pochettino had stayed there is no guarantee that we would have the same type of season as last year. Let us just wait and see what happens before we slit our wrists eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 9 July, 2014 Share Posted 9 July, 2014 Very true C.B. Going from memory From 1986 1990 P7 W3 D3 L1 out on pens in Semi v W Germany 1994 Did Not Qualify 1998 P4 W2 D1 L1 out in last 16 on pens v Argentina 2002 P5 W2 D2 L1 out in quarters v Brazil 2006 P5 W3 D2 L0 out pens quarters to Portugal 2010 P4 W1 D2 L1 out in last 16 v Germany 2014 P3 W0 D1 L2 Failed to get out of the Group stage As you rightly say, Oh for an English only Football League No idea what point you're trying to make with this list of WC performances that we all know. The prem was far more English in 1994 than now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 9 July, 2014 Share Posted 9 July, 2014 No idea what point you're trying to make with this list of WC performances that we all know. The prem was far more English in 1994 than now. That is true. Apart from 1990 and 1966, we are (losing) quarter finalists at best, more like losers from the "round of 16". Why there is a thought that we are one of the power houses of world football, is anyone's guess. Actually, I do kno - it's part press, part for commercial reasons. Looking at world football, we do undeniably have one of the strongest leagues out there. If you use CL as evidence, there was a danger a few years back, that the semi-finals could be an all English affair. Since then, things have slightly changed, but in general I still think that overall we have the strongest league. The problem with Spain and Germany is that it is hugely dominated by 2 teams. So when we have our leagues full of foreign players, it seems all that we are doing is improving players for other countries But then there is a huge thing to add to that. Those improved players are proud to play for their country. I am not sure how many people you would find who would say the same about the English players. All they want to do is pick up their vast and ridiculous pay cheque. They're not going to disrespect the England shirt, but their priority is their club. Supporters of the big clubs are the same - they don't care how their players perform for country, just club, and as a whole the country is very much second to their clubs. Until this competition, it was impossible to say what supporters of smaller clubs felt about their players playing for England, as none were ever picked!! I like many Saints was immensely proud of what they/we had achieved - and then it all went Pete Tong. Before the Saints call ups, I wasn't too interested by the national side, because of the players' attitude to it all, and their continued dire performances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 9 July, 2014 Share Posted 9 July, 2014 I know most will disagree with me but I do believe that players are still proud to play for England. I also think that they probably see the pinnicle of their career as getting a gig at a club playing in the CL. It cannot do the national side any good having more English players either bench warming, loaned out or plying their trade in the Championship than we used to. Take JRod. When we first signed him I would have said he was a Championship level striker with potential. By playing in the Prem with better quality players he has grown into a Prem quality striker (I still think he isnt International level yet though - still some work to be done). Stuart Pearce bangs on about the need to groom players properly through the ranks. Shaw at 18 was rushed into the senior squad when we had two decent left backs - he should be getting experience and learning his International trade through the Under 21s. We do it all the time because we dont have enough qulaity at senior level so its bring on the kids. Bring them on yes, but when they are ready and they have worked their way up. I remember a Englisg Under 21 side play the full England team with the likes of Allan Clarke and Mick Channon playing for the U21s. Now they would be playing for the full squad at that age. There is also the fear factor. We build our team up ( even though the odds were not great of either getting out of the group or going further than the last 16 this time round) and the expectations are bigger than the team's chances of delivering. They know that so much is expected of them and it is as if the expectations put a lead weight around ther shoulders when they pull on an England shirt. We dont play with freedom and expression (well not often). We play constricted football because we are so scared of losing. You see it with the other teams as the WC goes on. Apart from last night when Brazil fell apart, the goals have dried up. As teams go further they have more to lose. We seem to be like that from the off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 12 July, 2014 Share Posted 12 July, 2014 I'll get my coat I'm still searching! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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