CB Fry Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 STILL NO RATIONAL REBUTTAL OF MY OPINIONS I SEE I repeat, I have not made any scenario up. What I have referred to is out there, if you care to look for it. Whether it is true or not, only time will tell Feel free to make a constructive criticism, if you have enough chalk The rational rebuttal is you have made up a situation and then got upset about it. Repeat whatever you want, you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Hey Richmond You leave my left arm out of this My left arm is out of commission for a few weeks . It knows what it's got to do but is allowing my right arm to take the lead I trust it will do the right thing And with that analogy I trust the saints to do the right thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 The flaw in your argument is that the scenario you depict can be levelled at any transfer of any player by any club. Flaw in my argument ?? What are you on about. I made no argument. Purely observations based on what has already been posted Koeman has spoken to Schneiderlin. Morgan has listened. The outcome is, (according to previous posts by others) that he may stay, if we get some Quality signings Meantime, back at the ranch, Reed has received an offer for Schneidelrin, to date, not accepted. I simply said that it would be amusing if Reed sold him, right at the time Koeman talks him into staying (right hand/left hand) Our transfer kitty does not include anything from the Leibherrs ( even you agreed that point) So, simple question. Where is our transfer kitty coming from ?? We are experiencing strange times at St Marys. Nothing is as straightforward as we might wish I can't recall any other Prem team who have had 5 or 6 of their first team who have said they want "out" at the same time (Is that fact or just another of my lunatic doom prophecies ? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 (edited) God, some of you are really falling for this nonsense. " lots of money coming in " and " up to the board " is just ****ing code for " if I get an offer from arsenal or spurs I can leave and blame the board". He's not showing any more class than lovren or lallana , he's just more media savvy, and some of you mugs are falling for it. Captain material, my arris. A captain would say they can't wait to get back to to the club, can't wait to work with RK. Captain material would be standing by the club and standing firm, not wanting your cake and ****ing eating it. " He'll stay if we make quality signings" , what is he the chief scout, the new Brian Clough, do we have to run signings by him. He'll stay if arsenal or spurs don't want him, not out of choice. Edited 6 July, 2014 by Lord Duckhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatlesaint Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Flaw in my argument ?? What are you on about. I made no argument. Purely observations based on what has already been posted Koeman has spoken to Schneiderlin. Morgan has listened. The outcome is, (according to previous posts by others) that he may stay, if we get some Quality signings Meantime, back at the ranch, Reed has received an offer for Schneidelrin, to date, not accepted. I simply said that it would be amusing if Reed sold him, right at the time Koeman talks him into staying (right hand/left hand) Our transfer kitty does not include anything from the Leibherrs ( even you agreed that point) So, simple question. Where is our transfer kitty coming from ?? We are experiencing strange times at St Marys. Nothing is as straightforward as we might wish I can't recall any other Prem team who have had 5 or 6 of their first team who have said they want "out" at the same time (Is that fact or just another of my lunatic doom prophecies ? ) You think that Reed and Koeman dont talk then ? MP and Reed spoke everyday, both said that, so I would think its the same with Koeman. Transfer kitty has come from the prize/Sky money for finishing 8th hasn't it ? Add to that the players departures which has gone straight into that pot. The reason they want out is because its the big clubs that are chasing them and offering Europe, or in Shaw's case its joining one of the biggest clubs in the World. None of them have jumped ship or are threatening to for a move to Aston Villa, Stoke or West Ham are they ? Now that would be a major concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Maybe the £50million transfer kitty is coming from the £40ishmillion we recieved upfront from shaw and lallana combined with the £70million we received from last seasons TV, with some even being covered by the minimum £60million we'll receive this coming season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delmary Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 You think that Reed and Koeman dont talk then ? MP and Reed spoke everyday, both said that, so I would think its the same with Koeman. Transfer kitty has come from the prize/Sky money for finishing 8th hasn't it ? Add to that the players departures which has gone straight into that pot. The reason they want out is because its the big clubs that are chasing them and offering Europe, or in Shaw's case its joining one of the biggest clubs in the World. None of them have jumped ship or are threatening to for a move to Aston Villa, Stoke or West Ham are they ? Now that would be a major concern. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alien Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 "Captain material, my arris. A captain would say they can't wait to get back to to the club, can't wait to work with RK. Captain material would be standing by the club and standing firm, not wanting your cake and ****ing eating it." With all due respect m'lord a captain could say abandon ship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 God, some of you are really falling for this nonsense. " lots of money coming in " and " up to the board " is just ****ing code for " if I get an offer from arsenal or spurs I can leave and blame the board". He's not showing any more class than lovren or lallana , he's just more media savvy, and some of you mugs are falling for it. Captain material, my arris. A captain would say they can't wait to get back to to the club, can't wait to work with RK. Captain material would be standing by the club and standing firm, not wanting your cake and ****ing eating it. " He'll stay if we make quality signings" , what is he the chief scout, the new Brian Clough, do we have to run signings by him. He'll stay if arsenal or spurs don't want him, not out of choice. Fair point. If we make quality signings and he still ****s off, then we'll know you were right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Fair point. If we make quality signings and he still ****s off, then we'll know you were right But who decides if the signings are quality, captain Morgan, posters on here, uncle les, RK? Once players start saying they'll stay if the board match their ambition, they looking for an excuse to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cat Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 But who decides if the signings are quality, captain Morgan, posters on here, uncle les, RK? Once players start saying they'll stay if the board match their ambition, they looking for an excuse to leave. For board matching their ambition, read paying me more money. The crux of the matter is our better players (and their agents) know they can get double, treble the money elsewhere because we quite sensibly refuse to spunk relatively ridiculous amounts on wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Ducky, at some stage one tries not to be cynical even though what you write is a very definite possibility, maybe even the likelihood. But there are some who cling on to the last vestiges of a once great sport which had plenty of decent people in it, as we naively don't want to accept the putrid business that it now is. As I have said before, having lived through the Le Tiss era, some of us are even more naive to think that this is the norm or at least can be expected to happen again. Of course we can be realistic, but it's just hope. The heart speaking, not the head. But as footie is about escapism, for me are least, then its fine to go with the heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Why? What difference does it really make. We are going to be worse than last year, not better, so if he was hoping to challenge for Europe then moving is the only way to do that. Can't blame him for wanting out. This is the root of the problem. If usually intelligent fans believe this, then what hope do the footballers have? They apparently are prone to swallow any guff a sharp chairman sells them about how they can stay with us and be playing CL football within a year or two, so if in the absence of those assurances because that chairman leaves, they are full of disillusionment about our prospects, then what can be done? It seems simple enough to me. Somebody else needs to assure the poor little darlings that the dream still exists untarnished. I had hoped that Krueger was the one to sell the dream, noted as he is supposed to be for his motivational speaking, but it seems that although he actually had a background in competitive sport, albeit not football, they would rather believe the Italian banker with none. Belief in the ongoing project can be achieved by words if those words were Cortese's but the old adage that actions speak louder than words is the most powerful ammunition the board have in their armoury. Lose players like Lallana, Shaw and Lambert and you need to replace them with better players. Signings of the like of Tadic and Pelle would begin to address that well, and of course there is the parallel situation with the manager, where most would say that Koeman is a step up from Pochettino. I don't know how the situation with Lovren will pan out, but at least we are showing a hard stance by rejecting these offers for him and with luck, that will frighten those clubs away, because they will see him as being too expensive for what he is. But both he and Lovren need to be spoken to by Koeman before they are allowed to do anything, as that is the least they owe the club. If they still want to go, then we screw the club that wants them and reinvest the proceeds wisely on players who will improve the team. If we do that, we will be beter than last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Just as an aside. If our dear beloved ex Divine Leader is so good, why hasn't another club employed him? Is he on gardening leave or something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Just as an aside. If our dear beloved ex Divine Leader is so good, why hasn't another club employed him? Is he on gardening leave or something? Nobody has the money to match his 'ambition'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cat Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 reinvest the proceeds wisely on players who will improve the team. If we do thatwe will be beter than last year. Sorry, but it's massively unlikely we are going to end up with a better team than last season after having to replace 5 key players in one transfer window. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Just as an aside. If our dear beloved ex Divine Leader is so good, why hasn't another club employed him? Is he on gardening leave or something? Funny how heavily linked he was with Milan throughout the time he was here, now he is free and single the clamour seems less so. For a man with a record of not sanctioning transfers out - loads of times he did it, loads - it's amazing no one has scooped him up yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 But who decides if the signings are quality, captain Morgan, posters on here, uncle les, RK? Once players start saying they'll stay if the board match their ambition, they looking for an excuse to leave. I'm hopeful that the quality of a signings is evident to all, considering the money we potentially have to spend. If I were in Morgans position, I don't think id be willing to commit either until I saw evidence of the clubs ambition - which I personally believe is still there. Looking at it another way, if Morgan did stand firm, say he was looking forward to working with Koeman and the new season etc, and we ended up buying only 1 or 2 cover players, you'd imagine he'd feel disappointed. He is basically echoing the sentiments of many on this forum - ie - "okay, we accept that players have gone, even if we don't like it, now show that ambition still exists by strengthening the team" Again I think this is a symptom of a World Cup year - players away from clubs, Chinese whispers, lots of informal tapping up, all compounded by the fact that we performed so well last year. Ps - I had to pay a fiver to carry on this conversation, so I hope it ends up being worthwhile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goatboy Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 I'm hopeful that the quality of a signings is evident to all, considering the money we potentially have to spend. If I were in Morgans position, I don't think id be willing to commit either until I saw evidence of the clubs ambition - which I personally believe is still there. Looking at it another way, if Morgan did stand firm, say he was looking forward to working with Koeman and the new season etc, and we ended up buying only 1 or 2 cover players, you'd imagine he'd feel disappointed. He is basically echoing the sentiments of many on this forum - ie - "okay, we accept that players have gone, even if we don't like it, now show that ambition still exists by strengthening the team" Again I think this is a symptom of a World Cup year - players away from clubs, Chinese whispers, lots of informal tapping up, all compounded by the fact that we performed so well last year. Ps - I had to pay a fiver to carry on this conversation, so I hope it ends up being worthwhile Bang goes your spare time Plastic;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Bang goes your spare time Plastic;) We'll I was here all the time anyway, have been since last May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingdomCome Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 But who decides if the signings are quality, captain Morgan, posters on here, uncle les, RK? Once players start saying they'll stay if the board match their ambition, they looking for an excuse to leave. In terms of whether to try and sign players, the board/manager decide if they are quality. In terms of leaving or not, Morgan decides if they are quality. In terms of deciding on whether Morgan was lying or not, we decide if they are quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badger Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Just as an aside. If our dear beloved ex Divine Leader is so good, why hasn't another club employed him? Is he on gardening leave or something? Still locked in private talks with Dalian Wanda (personally of course) to agree the funds to buy the club from KL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Convict Colony Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Morgan is gonna have to grow his hair out and have a beard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Fan CaM Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 "Captain material, my arris. A captain would say they can't wait to get back to to the club, can't wait to work with RK. Captain material would be standing by the club and standing firm, not wanting your cake and ****ing eating it." With all due respect m'lord a captain could say abandon ship Bit like Lallana then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW11_Saint Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Christ, that is all we need. Really thought Morgan was the one we could keep and build a team around. If guess if he foes go we have Vic, Corky and JWP to compete for his place. Don't we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Tony Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 He's only saying these things so he can leave on decent terms, as opposed to the like of Lallana and Lovren who have both acted disgracefully. Don't expect him back in training, he's gone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Sorry, but it's massively unlikely we are going to end up with a better team than last season after having to replace 5 key players in one transfer window. We could end up with better players overall, and the team understanding will come in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ART Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 WILL PEOPLE STOP SENDING INSULTING MESSAGES TO MORGAN ON FACEBOOK AND TWITTER BASED MERELY ON RUMORS HE'S LEAVING. This is no way to treat the guy or convince him to stay at the club. I'm more and more ashamed of so called supporters who do things like this when the guy is still our player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 WILL PEOPLE STOP SENDING INSULTING MESSAGES TO MORGAN ON FACEBOOK AND TWITTER BASED MERELY ON RUMORS HE'S LEAVING. This is no way to treat the guy or convince him to stay at the club. I'm more and more ashamed of so called supporters who do things like this when the guy is still our player. I didn't realise Alpine used facebook or twitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Morgan is gonna have to grow his hair out and have a beard. Yep. Morgan has challenged the board to support the manager, demonstrate ambition and kick on. He has demanded they spend the money from transfers AND the £50m from the Premiership. That's ambition, leadership, and a foil that anyone in a higher position needs. Les Reed shouldn't want yes men, but solid professionals with passion. Morgan for Captain. No-brainer. Morgan is the key now. No Morgan means an admission by the Board of no ambition. RoKo at last has a way of making the Board support him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpturner Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 WILL PEOPLE STOP SENDING INSULTING MESSAGES TO MORGAN ON FACEBOOK AND TWITTER BASED MERELY ON RUMORS HE'S LEAVING. This is no way to treat the guy or convince him to stay at the club. I'm more and more ashamed of so called supporters who do things like this when the guy is still our player.The bigger the font size, the more startling the spelling mistakes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Well, seems Morgan has told the club to put up or shut up. Which I guess many of us have said one time or another this summer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Sorry, but it's massively unlikely we are going to end up with a better team than last season after having to replace 5 key players in one transfer window. Why? By the same reasoning, it is just as unlikely that last season's team will not do as well this season, isn't it? Where it is reasonable to say that some players deemed not good enough to play at this level need to be replaced by better players, your reasoning would say that it is unlikely that we could find better replacements than them, is it? In the same way, if we spend the equivalent amount of money accrued by the sale of these three players, why should their replacements not be at least as good? In the case of the players we sold, we have achieved vastly inflated prices for them, so there is the possibility that we could buy players as good for less money. If the spare change was invested in other players as additional cover where we were short of it last season, then surely the squad would be strengthened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Why? By the same reasoning, it is just as unlikely that last season's team will not do as well this season, isn't it? Where it is reasonable to say that some players deemed not good enough to play at this level need to be replaced by better players, your reasoning would say that it is unlikely that we could find better replacements than them, is it? In the same way, if we spend the equivalent amount of money accrued by the sale of these three players, why should their replacements not be at least as good? In the case of the players we sold, we have achieved vastly inflated prices for them, so there is the possibility that we could buy players as good for less money. If the spare change was invested in other players as additional cover where we were short of it last season, then surely the squad would be strengthened. We won't have a good a team as last year, I think you should start to accept that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastor Patrón Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Yep. Morgan has challenged the board to support the manager, demonstrate ambition and kick on. He has demanded they spend the money from transfers AND the £50m from the Premiership. That's ambition, leadership, and a foil that anyone in a higher position needs. Les Reed shouldn't want yes men, but solid professionals with passion. Morgan for Captain. No-brainer. Morgan is the key now. No Morgan means an admission by the Board of no ambition. RoKo at last has a way of making the Board support him. Totally. He's 100% captain material, an outstanding player who comes across as intelligent and likeable off the pitch. He's the one player at the club we absolutely have to keep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_ed Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 WILL PEOPLE STOP SENDING INSULTING MESSAGES TO MORGAN ON FACEBOOK AND TWITTER BASED MERELY ON RUMORS HE'S LEAVING. This is no way to treat the guy or convince him to stay at the club. I'm more and more ashamed of so called supporters who do things like this when the guy is still our player. I have to agree. It's moronic and embarrassing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Arsenal, Naples,Spurs,Dortmund and Saints, will be interesting to see which one he chooses, provided the other 4 are willing to meet the asking price that is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenue Saint Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Make him captain and offer him all that is possible to keep him. This loss wont be tolerable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toon Saint Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Ne me quitte pas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Make him captain and offer him all that is possible to keep him. This loss wont be tolerable We can offer him whatever we want but not what he wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simo Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 We can offer him whatever we want but not what he wants. You mean what Dd has told him he needs to have ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 You mean what Dd has told him he needs to have ? Absolutely, the FFF will be moving their players round the chess board again this summer. Sissoko Monaco,Evra to Juve,Griezmann PSG, Debuchy.. Arsenal,Morgan..any one of 3, Lloris PSG, that leaves Remy and Valbuena to get themselves sorted with CL clubs and they'll have the complete set I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 He's only saying these things so he can leave on decent terms, as opposed to the like of Lallana and Lovren who have both acted disgracefully. Don't expect him back in training, he's gone This, he already knows the boards intentions. I have a horrible feeling the club's plan is for Lallana, Shaw and Lambert to be replaced by Ward-Prose, Targett and Gallagher in an attempt to showcase how wonderful our academy is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 We won't have a good a team as last year, I think you should start to accept that Why? Because you said so? I think that you should accept that the team we will have at the start of the season will be better. We'll just have to wait and see, won't we? That is what I'm going to do, but if you want to make up your mind now, then good for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Why? Because you said so? I think that you should accept that the team we will have at the start of the season will be better. We'll just have to wait and see, won't we? That is what I'm going to do, but if you want to make up your mind now, then good for you. we wont as I am a realist. I remember your rants about man on the moon and all that just accept that we really wont start the season with as good as starting 11 as just left unless you think we will buy players as good as shaw, lallana...probably morgan? we really wont and I am fine with that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 we wont as I am a realist. I remember your rants about man on the moon and all that just accept that we really wont start the season with as good as starting 11 as just left unless you think we will buy players as good as shaw, lallana...probably morgan? we really wont and I am fine with that There is nonsense on all sides of the debate, but you're right TDD. The team that starts in August will not be as strong as the one that finished in May. Just how it is frankly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 (edited) ..... Edited 6 July, 2014 by Smirking_Saint Cant be arsed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 You're not a realist, you're a pessimist. It wasn't a rant, but an analogy. I'll accept what I consider to be reasonable, not what you tell me. Shaw is probably going to be the best LB for the next decade, but isn't irreplaceable at this current time. From what I've read, Tajit is better than powder-puff shot Lallana. Morgan, granted would be more difficult to replace; if he leaves. You haven't mentioned Lambert. Next you'll be telling me that we won't get a striker as good as him. And you seem to think that we will only just replace those players that have left and totally ignore the other signings that we needed to make anyway before those players left, you know, the additional signings that will strengthen the team. Or are Fox, Sharpe and Guly irreplaceable with better players too? As I said, if you want to make up your mind with still some time to go, then fine. It might not be the intelligent appoach, but then it is yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSAINT Posted 6 July, 2014 Share Posted 6 July, 2014 Jeremy Wilson reporting Lars Bender is Wenger's midfield target http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/10949866/Arsenal-close-in-on-Lars-Bender-Alexis-Sanchez-and-Mathieu-Debuchy-in-60million-transfer-swoop.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjwills Posted 7 July, 2014 Share Posted 7 July, 2014 See Morgan has changed his banner on his Facebook page to the stripes are back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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