Two gone...how many to follow?

[Saint Charlie]

So, you think no more will leave then? Easy to make cheap remarks, at the end of the window we will see just how hysterical I have been because the OP tells you what I think will happen.

 

If we do lose MP, LS, RL, AL, DL & MS then I would say its been a fairly big impact and worth (sensibly) debating as this thread does. As if people want to pretend we havent already lost two of our three England players!

Edited 27 June, 2014 by Saint Charlie

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Whatever the rights and wrongs or the pluses and minuses of Shaw's transfer, the truth remains the very good side of last year is no more and a rebuilding we must go and quickly.

 

We need at least 3 forwards for example to replace Lambert, Osvaldo and Rodriguez and now a full-back.

 

I am sure Lallana and Lovren are on their way too, so RK (himself a new boy on the block) is going to have to buy a lot of players in a short period of time and then gel them into a team capable of competing in the toughest league in the world. No easy task. Money in the bank is no substitute for proven quality players who have already cut it in the Prem. I am apprehensive to say the least and Reed is yet to convince me he is the right man in an increasingly important position.

[SaintRichmond]

Well, no one can have any doubts now surely ?

 

A bit later than I thought (due to players being away at the World Cup ), but the "Exodus", "Firesale", ( call it what you will ) HAS started

 

( I exclude Ricky from this, special case, IMHO, deserves to end his career at his first love Club )

 

Although Koeman is a great appointment, I doubt if even Half the monies raised by the departures of Shaw, Lallana, Lovren, Schneiderlin etc, will be spent on like for like

 

replacements, so I don't expect them to be anywhere near the same "class"

 

 

I reckon next season will be like starting all over again in the Prem

[Saint Charlie]

Whatever the rights and wrongs or the pluses and minuses of Shaw's transfer, the truth remains the very good side of last year is no more and a rebuilding we must go and quickly.

 

We need at least 3 forwards for example to replace Lambert, Osvaldo and Rodriguez and now a full-back.

 

I am sure Lallana and Lovren are on their way too, so RK (himself a new boy on the block) is going to have to buy a lot of players in a short period of time and then gel them into a team capable of competing in the toughest league in the world. No easy task. Money in the bank is no substitute for proven quality players who have already cut it in the Prem. I am apprehensive to say the least and Reed is yet to convince me he is the right man in an increasingly important position.

 

Sums it up well but you may be called a bed wetter or asked for evidence Lallana and Lovren are leaving.

 

Going to need probably 8 or 9 players in two months. Recent examples of Sunderland and Spurs doing that last season and it didnt go well. Huge task ahead, and also the loss of three or four (if MS goes) players who qualify as homegrown which is also a consideration.

 

The Academy has to be considered a way of making money rather than a method through which to supply the first team. Barely anyone who comes from it plays over 100 games for Saints.

[Saint Charlie]

Richmond - Reed said it would be reinvested. Plus we can target far better players than a newly promoted team and also will still have a lot of very good players even after further departures.

 

We can still have a good team next season.

[Heisenberg]

What has happened to Saint Charlie

[Andy Durman]

in my opinion Shaw may well be replaced with Clyne as we saw in the last 10 mins of the final match. This way Clyne and Chambers can remain happy.

[sussexsaint]

Gone

-----

Shaw

Lambert

 

Fairly certain to go

------------------

Lovren

Schneiderlin

Lallana

 

Probables

----------

Fonte

Ramirez

Osvaldo

 

Possibles

---------

Chambers

 

 

We're in big trouble........

 

 

[SaintRichmond]

Richmond - Reed said it would be reinvested. Plus we can target far better players than a newly promoted team and also will still have a lot of very good players even after further departures.

 

We can still have a good team next season.

 

I'm sure it will be reinvested, but what I am saying is that, as Buyers, we will not replace the Quality for the same price.

 

I hope we do have a good team next season. The appointment of Koeman tends to suggest this. He HAS achieved at all but one of the Clubs he has managed

 

I think Lallana will find out he is a small fish in a big pond. Shaw ?? Shame to see him go, but Targett is not that far behind IMHO. Lovren and Schneidelin we will miss big time

 

IMHO.

 

Basically, I have come to the conclusion that if ANY player wants to leave to " better " himself, then let him, " Take the money and run " the grass is not always greener.

 

If they all want CL Football, then fine, I hope they enjoy the sitting on the bench squad rotation system

 

I only want players who WANT to play for Saints

[Minty]

Here's a question: When you get your bank statement, do you look only at the outgoings column? If you run a business, when you get your monthly management accounts, do you only look at the costs, and not the revenue?

 

Right, so why when looking at Southampton Football Club just now, is it only about the players leaving? How about we judge things later in the summer when we have made some signings and look at the overall balance of the situation?

[SaintRichmond]

Here's a question: When you get your bank statement, do you look only at the outgoings column? If you run a business, when you get your monthly management accounts, do you only look at the costs, and not the revenue?

 

Right, so why when looking at Southampton Football Club just now, is it only about the players leaving? How about we judge things later in the summer when we have made some signings and look at the overall balance of the situation?

 

Fair point, but, when you look at the "outgoings" column, you know the Quality that has gone

 

My point is, yes, you purchase "replacements", but it is only when you see the Quality of the replacement, that you can make a fair assessment of the overall situation, ie will the replacements fit in, are they value for money, will they ADD and enhance the Business ?? etc

[Minty]

My point is, yes, you purchase "replacements", but it is only when you see the Quality of the replacement, that you can make a fair assessment of the overall situation, ie will the replacements fit in, are they value for money, will they ADD and enhance the Business ?? etc

 

Indeed, hence I said "How about we judge things later in the summer when we have made some signings and look at the overall balance of the situation?"

 

What does this thread achieve just now, other than providing a sounding board for those who only like to focus on negatives?

[Saint Fan CaM]

Here's a question: When you get your bank statement, do you look only at the outgoings column? If you run a business, when you get your monthly management accounts, do you only look at the costs, and not the revenue?

 

Right, so why when looking at Southampton Football Club just now, is it only about the players leaving? How about we judge things later in the summer when we have made some signings and look at the overall balance of the situation?

 

You're right. Speculation is ruining this forum. (-;

 

The issue many have is with the failed strategy of keeping hold of our best home-grown players. Or was that actually not the strategy and we've been misguided in that belief?

Edited 27 June, 2014 by Saint Fan CaM

[egreog]

Koeman will come in with a well honed talent scout mechanism in place and no doubt have several quality European "targets" in mind. Yes it is sad when players leave for potentially better things but it would be better to move on and evaluate the situation at Christmas once RK has had a chance to put some of his plans in place. The fact is there will always be "bigger" clubs looking to plunder talent from us. The difference now is there is no need to sell, but for £30million, and the possibility of 3 top quality replacements at that price, I say. "Good Deal"

I trust the new management to deal with it.

[John D]

Here's a question: When you get your bank statement, do you look only at the outgoings column? If you run a business, when you get your monthly management accounts, do you only look at the costs, and not the revenue?

 

Right, so why when looking at Southampton Football Club just now, is it only about the players leaving? How about we judge things later in the summer when we have made some signings and look at the overall balance of the situation?

 

You are right, however at this point we have no visibility of what the overall balance will be so can only judge the outgoings. Clearly the end of the summer is the point to make a full assessment but at the moment it is all one way.

 

I am usually very positive in my views re Saints but until we see the quality and quantity of replacements it will be an interesting summer

[Mikey88]

Players are always going to leave for bigger and better clubs. Champions League finalist Dortmund lose their best players, Champions League finalist Atletico always have and still are loosing their best players. Arsenal Tottenham, Porto, Benfica all loose their best players to the big clubs.

 

But for these clubs its about continuing to unearth new young gems that can help maintain their success before in time selling these on to for big profits. That will be the key to Southampton going forward, being able to intelligently reinvest, rather than trying to hold on to our top players when insane money is being thrown about.

[Minty]

You're right. Speculation is ruining this forum. (-;

 

The issue many have is with the failed strategy of keeping hold of our best home-grown players. Or was that actually not the strategy and we've been misguided in that belief?

I accept that some people will always speculate, but all I see here is people dissecting the player departures almost for the sake of it. Even without new signings to judge, a balance in the discussion can and should be struck IMO, but I realise not everyone seems to think the same way.

 

And the issue IMO, is not the club strategy, but that people are unable to accept that even with that strategy, some will always leave, either because we are offered an amount of money that they judge, on balance, would be silly to turn down, or for other reasons. A strategy is not a black or white issue, just like every other aspect of the club, or indeed any business. Strategies need to be flexible to allow for certain circumstances. And I personally believe the strategy is more along the lines of 'We will keep our best home-grown players unless we feel it is in our best interest to sell'. And I personally think £30m is in our best interest.

[SaintRichmond]

Richmond - Reed said it would be reinvested. Plus we can target far better players than a newly promoted team and also will still have a lot of very good players even after further departures.

 

We can still have a good team next season.

 

Reed said a lot of things, one of which was that he would do things in the best interests of SFC, which, to me, was an ominous utterance

 

I said at the time, and still believe, that he meant that if a decent bid comes along, or if a current player wants to leave, then Sir Les will cash in.

 

So we have entered the Big League of being a completely mercenary Club

 

For those that think that all monies raised by means of transfers out, will be balanced by like for like transfers in, then Dream on

 

IMHO, we are selling our Diamonds, and will be replacing them with Paste by comparison

[Wrensup]

I got a question...

 

What happens when the players who replace Shaw, Lambert and Lallana (if he goes) and so on have a really good season?

Do they then get courted by the rich teams and get poached/sold off again?

So then do we get in replacements for the replacements?

 

Not forgetting the academy players breakng through, say Sam McQueen does a Shaw and cements himself in the first 11 come the end of the season oh look Liverpool/Arsenal/ManU come sniffing around and we end up having to seek him too.

 

It's annoying because it's pretty much what I'll expect every season unless we get in some seriously good players wth all the monies.

[Puddings and Monkeys]

I accept that some people will always speculate, but all I see here is people dissecting the player departures almost for the sake of it. Even without new signings to judge, a balance in the discussion can and should be struck IMO, but I realise not everyone seems to think the same way.

 

And the issue IMO, is not the club strategy, but that people are unable to accept that even with that strategy, some will always leave, either because we are offered an amount of money that they judge, on balance, would be silly to turn down, or for other reasons. A strategy is not a black or white issue, just like every other aspect of the club, or indeed any business. Strategies need to be flexible to allow for certain circumstances. And I personally believe the strategy is more along the lines of 'We will keep our best home-grown players unless we feel it is in our best interest to sell'. And I personally think £30m is in our best interest.

 

Well said (again). The strategy is to keep improving until such time as our top players don't feel the need to look elsewhere and we are making great strides in that direction, but aren't there yet. I think the debacle with the national team will help us; the top 4 clubs will not develop English players and will always go for expensive overseas imports because they have the cash to run their clubs that way. This will increasingly make clubs like Saints attractive options for home grown talent (and we are very good at producing home grown talent) as long as we continue to make progress and provide them with regular first team football and a chance of winning something and getting into Europe. We have to keep moving forward towards that position and I believe the Board have signalled their ambition to do just that. Comments about "more cash for Sir Les" are just plain bloody stupid.

[sadoldgit]

So, you think no more will leave then? Easy to make cheap remarks, at the end of the window we will see just how hysterical I have been because the OP tells you what I think will happen.

 

If we do lose MP, LS, RL, AL, DL & MS then I would say its been a fairly big impact and worth (sensibly) debating as this thread does. As if people want to pretend we havent already lost two of our three England players!

 

Fiesale? I have read some negative drivel on this forum over the years St Charlie but you take the biscuit. You seem to look for the negative spin in everything. A firesale is what you do when you sell assets to pay off creditors. Players come. Players go. At the moment the only player to have left is Lambert. Why dont you wait and see excatly who leaves and who comes in before he start any more meltdown threads. You really need to get out more. You are in danger of becoming the Suarez of the forum - prolific but barking mad.

[Saint Charlie]

You have hit most of the bingo phrases in there. Just needed a reference to being like Alpine Saint to complete the set.

 

I'm excited about the new season as always and about our team.

 

But surely player sales are as worthy a debating topic as anything else? Has been the biggest Saints talking point this summer so would be odd on a Saints forum for there not to be discussion on it.

[madruss]

There aren't many clubs who can turn down £30m for a left back. A left back, unless they're a goalscoring, assisting LB will never be a game changer. If we reinvest in two attacking players that we otherwise couldn't have afforded then we will be in a better position overall. If other clubs want to pay silly money for AL and DL then let them. We will reinvest and get stronger

[Wes Tender]

One only has to look at how we came to have a team of stars desired by many of the top clubs to remain optimistic that we can do it all again and again. Lambert was picked up from the third division for £1 million and we turned him into an England International wanted by Liverpool. Shaw followed in a long line of Academy players destined for the very top. There are other players like him on the way up now, so no reason to suspect that he is the very best that we will ever have produced. We might well have said that about Bale until Shaw and Oxlade-Chamberlain came along. We discovered gems like Schneiderlain, Clyne and Fonte and nurtured their careers as we climbed the divisions and improved them until they have been become touted as, (or have become) Internationals. Lovren likewise was another gem bought cheaply and in a short time identified as a player capable of playing for the very top teams in Europe. Cork also has advanced his reputation here when he was out of favour with Chelsea and Rodrigues also has been talked about as a future England player.

 

Even under the Lowe regime, we managed to identify players the likes of both Svenssons, Beattie and Pahars. We now find ourselves in a position of financial strength the like of which no Saints fan has ever known before. We are no longer a selling club by necessity, only by choice and only then for stupid money. Arguably, we have even upgraded our manager on Pochettino and appointed one who would have been a fantasy choice only a couple of years ago. This is a manager with a reputation at a Worldwide level, so that his name attached to a transfer enquiry for most players will add a gravitas and command a respect that Pochettino did not possess.

 

We now find ourselves in a position of strength and although we may lose one or two players seduced by the prospects of playing in the CL for mega-buck salaries, there is also the possibility that those players might yet find that they become bench-warmers and that they could have done better staying with us. I see no reason to not feel optimistic that we can unearth players who are the equal or better than those we might lose, with the silly money that we will gain from their sales. If they are not mentally focussed on our assent further up the division, let them go and replace them with players who are.

[Mowgli]

Really disappointed to lose Shaw as he is the greatest quality of those linked with other clubs. Not good for football to see a teenager go for so much but gives us a good kitty.

 

If we can replace hime with Blind, Taylor or Davies from Swansea or Kolodziejczak I think we should feel pretty pleased with the business.

 

As for Lallana and Lovren. I would like to keep them both but if they are not signed up to the vision then f*** em. There are better out there so I'm confident we could 'upgrade' in those positions as, indeed, we appear to have done with the manager.

 

I think the others will stay. Of course I look at life through rose tinted glasses and whilst that always seems to the subject of ridicule from one or two posters I can only say it makes life much more enjoyable.

[cambsaint]

Being a bit premature aren't we? The England internationals will only have met the new manager today.

I'm worried that Schneiderlin's excellent performance will make him a target for a mega-rich European club and who could blame him if he goes-still his value must over £20mill now.

Lallana may go but its obviously the Bournemouth pay-off that has prevented that. Unfortunately at his age he need a big salary and CL football now to set him up for life.

Lovren-well I'm sure we can buy a good replacement for the money if he goes.

Most worried about Schneiderlin he seems to me to be a rather unique player these days, of course we'll miss Lallana, b

[JonnyOldBoy]

MoPo was the most over-rated coach in the Prem.... I know loads of Catalans who think he was a 2 trick pony. So Koeman is a much much better proposition. I hope AL goes for 30M and I hope the other average players we spent stupid money on go too..... then Koeman could have £100M to build a magnificent side in his own mould. Shaw was never worth £30M , no where near it . Sir Rickie has earnt his bench warming days at Liverpool and AL is no where near worth £30M either so if we get it then Bravo... Its time to be very optimistic about the future of our club.... Many Dutch people think Koeman with give us one great season followed by one average season and then one dire season and leave..... so its not all done and dusted but here is hoping we are looking at a steadying ship and a great season with 5 or 6 new faces..... COYRs !!!!

[Viking Warrior]

Its always a risk when a player goes to anothe club. they may fit in they may not

 

Its a gamble for them

 

Look might benfit from working with huge world stars but then he has to establish himself within the squad and the team

I cannot see him being an automatic start in the moaners team , I think he will be used on an as and when basis and willl spend a large amount of time on the bench .

yes he will be frustrated not playing but then he has a 6 igure sum going into his bank account.

 

I hope he plays regularly for his own sake and he is able to become the next bale

Time will tell

[SaintSteve]

MoPo was the most over-rated coach in the Prem.... I know loads of Catalans who think he was a 2 trick pony. So Koeman is a much much better proposition. I hope AL goes for 30M and I hope the other average players we spent stupid money on go too..... then Koeman could have £100M to build a magnificent side in his own mould. Shaw was never worth £30M , no where near it . Sir Rickie has earnt his bench warming days at Liverpool and AL is no where near worth £30M either so if we get it then Bravo... Its time to be very optimistic about the future of our club.... Many Dutch people think Koeman with give us one great season followed by one average season and then one dire season and leave..... so its not all done and dusted but here is hoping we are looking at a steadying ship and a great season with 5 or 6 new faces..... COYRs !!!!

 

Thats why most of our players said he is a world class coach... you must know more than them.

[MarkSFC]

One only has to look at how we came to have a team of stars desired by many of the top clubs to remain optimistic that we can do it all again and again. Lambert was picked up from the third division for £1 million and we turned him into an England International wanted by Liverpool. Shaw followed in a long line of Academy players destined for the very top. There are other players like him on the way up now, so no reason to suspect that he is the very best that we will ever have produced. We might well have said that about Bale until Shaw and Oxlade-Chamberlain came along. We discovered gems like Schneiderlain, Clyne and Fonte and nurtured their careers as we climbed the divisions and improved them until they have been become touted as, (or have become) Internationals. Lovren likewise was another gem bought cheaply and in a short time identified as a player capable of playing for the very top teams in Europe. Cork also has advanced his reputation here when he was out of favour with Chelsea and Rodrigues also has been talked about as a future England player.

 

Even under the Lowe regime, we managed to identify players the likes of both Svenssons, Beattie and Pahars. We now find ourselves in a position of financial strength the like of which no Saints fan has ever known before. We are no longer a selling club by necessity, only by choice and only then for stupid money. Arguably, we have even upgraded our manager on Pochettino and appointed one who would have been a fantasy choice only a couple of years ago. This is a manager with a reputation at a Worldwide level, so that his name attached to a transfer enquiry for most players will add a gravitas and command a respect that Pochettino did not possess.

 

We now find ourselves in a position of strength and although we may lose one or two players seduced by the prospects of playing in the CL for mega-buck salaries, there is also the possibility that those players might yet find that they become bench-warmers and that they could have done better staying with us. I see no reason to not feel optimistic that we can unearth players who are the equal or better than those we might lose, with the silly money that we will gain from their sales. If they are not mentally focussed on our assent further up the division, let them go and replace them with players who are.

 

Excellent post.

[Window Cleaner]

Thats why most of our players said he is a world class coach... you must know more than them.

 

 

Billingsgate ahoy I think.

[Fan The Flames]

Before anyone starts talking about bedwetting, the facts are that this summer we have lost MP, Shaw and Lambert all of whom were hugely influential and all of whom have moved to bigger clubs.

 

So, the question is...in your opinion how many more will leave SMS in the so called firesale?

 

You asked not to be called a bedwetter then go on to say it's a fire sale. It's clearly not a fire sale, the clue 'bigger clubs' is in your first line.

[Brave Sir Robin]

In answer to OP: 1, maybe 2. And 5 to come in

[Saint Charlie]

You asked not to be called a bedwetter then go on to say it's a fire sale. It's clearly not a fire sale, the clue 'bigger clubs' is in your first line.

 

Where did I say it was, in my opinion, a firesale?

 

I used the term "so called" firesale and "firesale that often maligned media have mentioned"

 

It is correc the media have referred to us selling players as a "firesale". If its their definiton thats wrong then take it up with them.

[aintforever]

I'm guessing Lallana will go as well, but if we sell any more key player we could be in relegation trouble next year.

 

It's vital we keep Lovren and Schneiderlin.

[Saint Charlie]

Telegraph Journo John Percy just now:

 

Southampton midfielder Adam Lallana set to complete £25m move to #lfc. Talks now at an advanced stage and could even be completed today.

[ART]

Morgan's posted a photo after the last game with Spuds Hugh Lloris close and pally. The one thing I will never forgive any of our players is signing for Spuds to link up with Pochettino. The club have to ensure not one of our players sign for them. Anywhere but Spuds, preferably overseas.

 

[Bwanamakubwa]

This close season is gonna be as exciting, nerve wracking and fun as any I have witnessed.

 

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

[Tamesaint]

What has happened to Saint Charlie

 

He is very reminiscent of Bazza Sanchez. Starting consistently negative threads. Spending ages down the laundrette with his bed linen. etc etc

 

With a bit of luck he will go the same way as Bazza soon. I intend to put him on ignore.

[MarkSFC]

IF we are selling Lallana (and maybe one or two more) as annoying it is you can't really moan. If we hate a player we are very quick to want them out. It best to sell now and before everyone reports back so the group who are going to be here do not have dissenting mouths in their ears. F*** off and let us get on with improving without you!!!

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Saint Charlie]

Sky: Lallana and Shaw will just be the first Southampton departures, expect a couple more big money deals to go through in the coming weeks.

[Batman]

at this rate, we will do well to stay up

[Pancake]

at this rate, we will do well to stay up

Sleep walking towards relegation I tells ya, fugging sleeeeeeeep waaaaaaalking for farks sake!

[Saint Charlie]

Sleep walking towards relegation I tells ya, fugging sleeeeeeeep waaaaaaalking for farks sake!

 

Its mostly bedwetting. Only Lambert has officially gone.

[Charlie Wayman]

If the idea was to sign a 'Name' as new manager to deter departures and restore a sense of vision and harmony to the club then clearly it ain't worked, the wanna ways clearly do not regard Koeman as a big enough "Name" to keep them here.

 

His first step next Tuesday when players report back for training is to have a Roll call.

 

Boruc? Here Sir

Shaw? Shaw!

Louvren? Louvren!

Schneiderlin? Schneiderin!

Lallana? Lallana!

Lambert? Lambert!

Rodrigues? Rodrigues! We think he is still in re-hab boss.

Guly? WTYF is Guly when you need him

Cork? Cork! Er, we forgot to renew his contract boss....

[Minty]

If the idea was to sign a 'Name' as new manager to deter departures and restore a sense of vision and harmony to the club then clearly it ain't worked, the wanna ways clearly do not regard Koeman as a big enough "Name" to keep them here.

 

It probably has more to do with them joining 'bigger' clubs, which no one can really argue with. Koeman's arrival is more important for how he takes Southampton forward, not just for trying to keep players who were practically out of the door already.

 

I for one am just going to wait until the season starts before judging our squad and our chances.

[Charlie Wayman]

Always look on the bright side, we still have Jolly old Jos Hooiveld to cheer us up of a Saturday afternoon; at least he is one step ahead of the pack in learning Dutch, now that's what I call being 'smart'!

[JonnyOldBoy]

Me and most of Barcelona.....

[OldNick]

Its mostly bedwetting. Only Lambert has officially gone.

Lol if only

[sadoldgit]

Its mostly bedwetting. Only Lambert has officially gone.

 

You are right for once mate. it is bedwetting. Players will go and replacements will come in. Think about this, we could end up with a better squad than we had last season. I am as gutted as anybody else that we are losing these guys but no one is bigger than the club. I have seen players like Martin Chivers, Ron Davies, Mike Channon, Steve Williams, Theo Walcott and the Ox all leave and guess what, the world still turns, the sun still rises and life goes on.