The sensible thread...

[Rational Rich]

We've seen it with countless players, managers, chairman etc. One minute they're heroes, next they're villains... everything seems to be black or white, and so many seem to lack the emotional maturity to consider alternatives, or look at longer term outcomes. The funny thing is we dare to say the same about the Skates on the nutjob thread, and mock their hero to villain to hero status changes for players and managers, but look at us... 'Knee-jerk' doesn't even cover it, we need a new word or phrase to describe it.

 

You should know by now that there are no grey areas on the internet and no room for nuances or reason - it is a purely binary world, where opinion is stated as FACT and that is that.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

 

84 of 108...

[jasonb]

Cortese.

 

Does that help ?

 

To what end Alpine? Serious question. I have seen this alluded to here quite a lot but no actual substance.

 

In your opinion why would he be deliberately trying to wreck things for us?

[ratio_decidendi]

I agree with the OP on this one: if Lambert wants to go to Liverpool, then it might be in the board's interest to let him go. As a footballer, he has his age against him and I cannot see him performing in the future nearly half as well as he has done recently. I suppose it is possible to keep him on the bench, but when Liverpool are throwing bags of money at you then the board might want to take advantage. From a business perspective, if the value gained from selling him exceeds the value gained from keeping him then it's a no-brainer - let Lambert loose. Especially so if he is "intent" on departing to his dream club.

 

Emotionally it is, I guess, a bit of a roller coaster for the fans. But running a football club is not about appeasing the supporters insofar as it doesn't detriment the club financially. A lot of fans are accusing the board of naivety and so on, but without little firm evidence to back up that charge. At the moment, as has so often been said on this forum, no players have been sold yet. In fact, the board have reasserted their strong position and promised European football and European talent. I suggest that we at least give them the benefit of the doubt for now.

 

We should not let emotions run high and react badly to what are, at the moment, nothing but conjecture and gossip regurgitated by the press. I choose to believe only what has been officially released by the club via their own channels because ultimately they want exactly what we want - the best for Southampton. The papers, on the other hand, do not, and should be treated with scepticism. Trust the board and what they are doing.

 

I think this post has gone on for a bit, but I just wanted to say a few things in response to many of the totally irrational posts on this board. It is, you could say, my sensible post for the sensible thread.

 

EDIT: I've just seen someone compare what's happening to the club as rape, and I cannot help but be worried if this kind of thing is tolerated on SaintsWeb?

[Mallagroth]

This absolutely. The time to judge is at the end of the summer, but that requires some emotional maturity. Apologies if that offends anyone but it's true, and also underlines why most fans should not be anywhere near football club boards...

 

Yes but this is the problem and why you can't be angry at the fans feeling terrified. We are emotionally invested and at the moment we are being tortured and watching that which we care about have strips torn off. Not saying it's the boards fault but that is exactly what the media is doing for whatever reason, constructed or speculative. We have had a season of feeling like we actually can hold our heads high for once in the football world and through either lack of ambition or action/good PR combat, we are now feeling like mugs as the thing we care about is buggered without the people with the power to do so defending it if there is no truth to the asset stripping suggestion. It would be so very easy for the board or players to stop this absolute **** storm that is being generated in the press, but they are not, and this is the horrifying fact we are trying to come to terms with.

Edited 30 May, 2014 by Mallagroth

[Mallagroth]

I agree with the OP on this one: if Lambert wants to go to Liverpool, then it might be in the board's interest to let him go. As a footballer, he has his age against him and I cannot see him performing in the future nearly half as well as he has done recently. I suppose it is possible to keep him on the bench, but when Liverpool are throwing bags of money at you then the board might want to take advantage. From a business perspective, if the value gained from selling him exceeds the value gained from keeping him then it's a no-brainer - let Lambert loose. Especially so if he is "intent" on departing to his dream club.

 

Emotionally it is, I guess, a bit of a roller coaster for the fans. But running a football club is not about appeasing the supporters insofar as it doesn't detriment the club financially. A lot of fans are accusing the board of naivety and so on, but without little firm evidence to back up that charge. At the moment, as has so often been said on this forum, no players have been sold yet. In fact, the board have reasserted their strong position and promised European football and European talent. I suggest that we at least give them the benefit of the doubt for now.

 

We should not let emotions run high and react badly to what are, at the moment, nothing but conjecture and gossip regurgitated by the press. I choose to believe only what has been officially released by the club via their own channels because ultimately they want exactly what we want - the best for Southampton. The papers, on the other hand, do not, and should be treated with scepticism. Trust the board and what they are doing.

 

I think this post has gone on for a bit, but I just wanted to say a few things in response to many of the totally irrational posts on this board. It is, you could say, my sensible post for the sensible thread.

 

EDIT: I've just seen someone compare what's happening to the club as rape, and I cannot help but be worried if this kind of thing is tolerated on SaintsWeb?

 

To be fair he never actually said that, i wanted to say something similar but was worried it might offend and censored myself.

Also it is horrifying how trivialised rape is in media (not meant to be a joke or sarcastic, it is genuinely very disturbing.)

[Convict Colony]

I agree with the OP on this one: if Lambert wants to go to Liverpool, then it might be in the board's interest to let him go. As a footballer, he has his age against him and I cannot see him performing in the future nearly half as well as he has done recently. I suppose it is possible to keep him on the bench, but when Liverpool are throwing bags of money at you then the board might want to take advantage. From a business perspective, if the value gained from selling him exceeds the value gained from keeping him then it's a no-brainer - let Lambert loose. Especially so if he is "intent" on departing to his dream club.

 

Emotionally it is, I guess, a bit of a roller coaster for the fans. But running a football club is not about appeasing the supporters insofar as it doesn't detriment the club financially. A lot of fans are accusing the board of naivety and so on, but without little firm evidence to back up that charge. At the moment, as has so often been said on this forum, no players have been sold yet. In fact, the board have reasserted their strong position and promised European football and European talent. I suggest that we at least give them the benefit of the doubt for now.

 

We should not let emotions run high and react badly to what are, at the moment, nothing but conjecture and gossip regurgitated by the press. I choose to believe only what has been officially released by the club via their own channels because ultimately they want exactly what we want - the best for Southampton. The papers, on the other hand, do not, and should be treated with scepticism. Trust the board and what they are doing.

 

I think this post has gone on for a bit, but I just wanted to say a few things in response to many of the totally irrational posts on this board. It is, you could say, my sensible post for the sensible thread.

 

EDIT: I've just seen someone compare what's happening to the club as rape, and I cannot help but be worried if this kind of thing is tolerated on SaintsWeb?

 

Good reasoned post mate, to be fair I can't wait to check the papers everyday as there is always something about us in here, so far Mopo to spurs is the only one they've got right thus far.

[supersonic]

Seen and heard several people saying the manager leaving, key players leaving (Lambert, lallana, shaw etc) will deter managers, I personally think it'll have the opposite effect. If the aforementioned players do leave, it'll be for big money, and the squad will nee reinforcements. What manager wouldn't want the opportunity to manage a side that has money to spend (supposedly) and needs to buy players.

 

perfect opportunity for them to build their team from day one.

[Horley CTFC Saint]

Seen and heard several people saying the manager leaving, key players leaving (Lambert, lallana, shaw etc) will deter managers, I personally think it'll have the opposite effect. If the aforementioned players do leave, it'll be for big money, and the squad will nee reinforcements. What manager wouldn't want the opportunity to manage a side that has money to spend (supposedly) and needs to buy players.

 

perfect opportunity for them to build their team from day one.

Mind you, I think there have been four confirmed bids (2xL for Lala,1xMU for Shaw and 1xL for SRL) and all have been turned down so there could be a long way to go before we can say there is a player exodus and money for a new manager to spend

[Minty]

Yes but this is the problem and why you can't be angry at the fans feeling terrified. We are emotionally invested and at the moment we are being tortured and watching that which we care about have strips torn off. Not saying it's the boards fault but that is exactly what the media is doing for whatever reason, constructed or speculative. We have had a season of feeling like we actually can hold our heads high for once in the football world and through either lack of ambition or action/good PR combat, we are now feeling like mugs as the thing we care about is buggered without the people with the power to do so defending it if there is no truth to the asset stripping suggestion. It would be so very easy for the board or players to stop this absolute **** storm that is being generated in the press, but they are not, and this is the horrifying fact we are trying to come to terms with.

I understand the anxiety, but even if I am anxious about what might happen about something, I am still able to control my reaction to it. I can express my concerns in a reasonable manner, and not let my emotions rule. Plus, I'm not sure it is that 'easy' for the board to stop the media - they will twist things whichever way they want to, no matter what the board come out and say, and as we're currently seeing, even if the board do come out and say something, they are being judged on every word even before something concrete has happened.

 

We can't control the media, but we can control our reaction to the media. We can also learn to recognise that when our emotions are heightened, we do not respond rationally. Hence my comment about emotional maturity. What you're asking is not that the Board come out and counter the media, but that they come out and help fans control their own emotions by saying something that they want to hear... that's not their place.

[surrey1saint]

Don't panic!

Edited 30 May, 2014 by surrey1saint
in error

[pap]

Strange times at SaintsWeb towers, so I'm glad this thread exists.

 

Now I say all this as someone that is thoroughly miserable after a Saints loss, elated after a big win and also, someone who spends far too much time on here. I don't understand the hysteria, certainly not in the context of my lifelong position as Saints supporter, and I'm a mere 39.

 

Take the Lambert situation as an example. Considering the situation without emotion, that could be a good move for all concerned as long as the fee is right. We can spend the money on the next bright young thing ( whether that's transfers or training costs ), Rickie gets to complete his dream and we remember one of our legends at the peak of his powers. That's not going to wreck our future prospects, nor will it ever remove the transformative effect we've had on Lambert's career. This is a bloke that, come what may, will always say good things about the club. He is an advertisement for why you should play for Saints. Any lower league player we fancy is going to look at Lambert's success and consider Southampton favourably. There are huge positives to be taken from the move, this kind of thing happens all the time - so I don't understand the focus on the negative.

 

Maybe it's just a case of "you can only play what's in front of you" for the doom-merchant crowd. Relatively speaking, this is a period of turmoil for the club - but it's nowhere serious as what we've seen before, and we've never been in a better spot to secure decent replacements for those that move on.

 

Sorry. Can't get angry about it.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Strange times at SaintsWeb towers, so I'm glad this thread exists.

 

Now I say all this as someone that is thoroughly miserable after a Saints loss, elated after a big win and also, someone who spends far too much time on here. I don't understand the hysteria, certainly not in the context of my lifelong position as Saints supporter, and I'm a mere 39.

 

Take the Lambert situation as an example. Considering the situation without emotion, that could be a good move for all concerned as long as the fee is right. We can spend the money on the next bright young thing ( whether that's transfers or training costs ), Rickie gets to complete his dream and we remember one of our legends at the peak of his powers. That's not going to wreck our future prospects, nor will it ever remove the transformative effect we've had on Lambert's career. This is a bloke that, come what may, will always say good things about the club. He is an advertisement for why you should play for Saints. Any lower league player we fancy is going to look at Lambert's success and consider Southampton favourably. There are huge positives to be taken from the move, this kind of thing happens all the time - so I don't understand the focus on the negative.

 

Maybe it's just a case of "you can only play what's in front of you" for the doom-merchant crowd. Relatively speaking, this is a period of turmoil for the club - but it's nowhere serious as what we've seen before, and we've never been in a better spot to secure decent replacements for those that move on.

 

Sorry. Can't get angry about it.

 

Nice post sir.

[Giordano]

I understand the anxiety, but even if I am anxious about what might happen about something, I am still able to control my reaction to it. I can express my concerns in a reasonable manner, and not let my emotions rule. Plus, I'm not sure it is that 'easy' for the board to stop the media - they will twist things whichever way they want to, no matter what the board come out and say, and as we're currently seeing, even if the board do come out and say something, they are being judged on every word even before something concrete has happened.

 

We can't control the media, but we can control our reaction to the media. We can also learn to recognise that when our emotions are heightened, we do not respond rationally. Hence my comment about emotional maturity. What you're asking is not that the Board come out and counter the media, but that they come out and help fans control their own emotions by saying something that they want to hear... that's not their place.

 

Well said as ever Minty. We all have our personal views on this as saints are so very close to all our hearts but a lot of what's being said is simply unfair nonsense and the result of leaping like lemmings into negative conclusions from the scarcest of real "facts". It is only human nature to react as so many have done ~ but its disturbing nevertheless that its turning into a lynch mob mentality : all this vitriolic lashing out at RK KL and LR is scarily unsaintly.

 

The outpourings of written anger by many posters here is fair enough- its a saints web forum thingy so i guess that is one of its raison d'etre's - for fans to sound off on one when they feel like - but there's not so much of this on the Saints List I have to say- perhaps a more emotionally mature set of contributors?

 

I don't share the pent up hatred and nastiness towards the new Board. I know I know its because for the first time ever it looked like we could crack the glass ceiling into the top table of football with all our great talents all in one generation all at the same time - and some people fear that this is - or was - our once in a lifetime chance to do it - and now we are resigned to being that little Southampton FC that know their place in the pecking order of football. I know I know. But people - we had 4 kids playing England under 19's JWP is England captain out in Toulon... the system for producing the new young players is in place. There will be more. Losing iconic players is gut wrenching. But at least we have had iconic players! Be grateful.

[Dig Dig]

Strange times at SaintsWeb towers, so I'm glad this thread exists.

 

Now I say all this as someone that is thoroughly miserable after a Saints loss, elated after a big win and also, someone who spends far too much time on here. I don't understand the hysteria, certainly not in the context of my lifelong position as Saints supporter, and I'm a mere 39.

 

Take the Lambert situation as an example. Considering the situation without emotion, that could be a good move for all concerned as long as the fee is right. We can spend the money on the next bright young thing ( whether that's transfers or training costs ), Rickie gets to complete his dream and we remember one of our legends at the peak of his powers. That's not going to wreck our future prospects, nor will it ever remove the transformative effect we've had on Lambert's career. This is a bloke that, come what may, will always say good things about the club. He is an advertisement for why you should play for Saints. Any lower league player we fancy is going to look at Lambert's success and consider Southampton favourably. There are huge positives to be taken from the move, this kind of thing happens all the time - so I don't understand the focus on the negative.

 

Maybe it's just a case of "you can only play what's in front of you" for the doom-merchant crowd. Relatively speaking, this is a period of turmoil for the club - but it's nowhere serious as what we've seen before, and we've never been in a better spot to secure decent replacements for those that move on.

 

Sorry. Can't get angry about it.

 

Each to their own though, I don't understand 1) why it's surprising that people are concerned about what seems to be happening and 2) why people are so bothered about how people are reacting to it.

 

If people decide to roll things up into high level perspectives, comparing now to 2008 or even just reverting to the classic "I'll support the team whatever", it takes something away from why we all follow our club... To watch us prosper and hopefully achieve something. Just because fans stick with clubs through the bad times, it doesn't mean we shouldn't question the decision makers at the club when things clearly don't add up.

[Dalek2003]

It is hard at the moment, but I don't think the board can show their true hand until we have a manager in place. Therefore I predict selling some key players before we act strongly to bring in some class players. We will be OK for August and the optimism will be there for the start of the season !

[ashleyb5443]

PLEASE CAN I ASK THAT NO-ONE POST ON THIS WHO IS BADMOUTHING THE BOARD ETC. YOU ARE NOT WELCOME.

 

So, the rest of the board have lost their minds with the fact they can't accept that Pochettino would want to leave, that any players would want to leave, or that any other clubs would have the temerity to bid for our players.

 

Anyway, I wanted a sanctuary away from the madhouse of the mong board for reasoned discussion about the situation/any replacements that we feel would be good.

 

For me, IF Lambert is sold for a decent amount, the board should not stand in his way. He should get his dream move. We will replace him with someone new, and I also would not be surprised to see Osvaldo back, cap in hand next season.

 

I find it funny how everyone is saying Lambert is a legend and good on you but when MoPo leaves after taking us from possibly getting relegated in our first year to highest finish in 2nd and he's a cu4t?

 

Good luck to both of them. If you were in your job and a better company came along offering you more money would you not move?

 

We still need to remember, we have an excellent your system. MoPo didn't create that and he hasn't taken it with him, it's improving all the time.

 

REMEMBER WHERE WE WERE 5 YEARS AGO!!!

 

Seems to be like some off the fans on here have recently jumped on the bandwagon of our success. I also see all my friends posting the same bull**** on Facebook, I think I see the same type of person at 1/2 games a season (United and Chelsea).

 

People have said the Board are destroying our club......wasn't it destroyed and they made it what it is? There's a reason you / we are not in their position and that is we don't have a clue. It's not all quite the same as championship manager.

 

Lets be honest, Lambert has looked slow and off the pace this year. How many goals did we score since Jay got injured. I can't see him doing a lot for Liverpool, a plan B yes with likes of Suarez running off him. If he wants to move, let him. Same with the others, if they really think it's a better opportunity then go.

 

Did someone mention that we've got the world cup starting in a few weeks.

[pap]

Each to their own though, I don't understand 1) why it's surprising that people are concerned about what seems to be happening and 2) why people are so bothered about how people are reacting to it.

 

If people decide to roll things up into high level perspectives, comparing now to 2008 or even just reverting to the classic "I'll support the team whatever", it takes something away from why we all follow our club... To watch us prosper and hopefully achieve something. Just because fans stick with clubs through the bad times, it doesn't mean we shouldn't question the decision makers at the club when things clearly don't add up.

 

The "working out" on these two recent blows is clear for all to see.

 

Poch paid himself out of his own contract to the tune of 2 mil. Bugger all the board could do to stop that.

 

As for SRL, we bought him to get out of L1, and that we've achieved. The man was written off by many as "not good enough" every time we got promoted and when called up to the England squad. It is to his eternal credit that he keeps proving people wrong, but we all know that his best years will soon be behind him. FWIW, I don't think he'd have considered anyone apart from Liverpool.

 

It adds up to me right now.

[Dig Dig]

The "working out" on these two recent blows is clear for all to see.

 

Poch paid himself out of his own contract to the tune of 2 mil. Bugger all the board could do to stop that.

 

As for SRL, we bought him to get out of L1, and that we've achieved. The man was written off by many as "not good enough" every time we got promoted and when called up to the England squad. It is to his eternal credit that he keeps proving people wrong, but we all know that his best years will soon be behind him. FWIW, I don't think he'd have considered anyone apart from Liverpool.

 

It adds up to me right now.

 

I personally have always thought Lambert is absolute class and it's been a pleasure to watch him lead our line over the years. If we take everything in isolation you can argue the rationale behind it and conclude that it's not so bad in the grand scheme of things. Even when you look alone at the Lambert deal, there is reason for concern. 4M for our Rickie Lambert? He's priceless to us IMO.

 

So far, poch and the coaching team have left and Lambert is going. Others will leave too.

 

We are currently managerless, coachless and unable to resolve contracts for players who aren't as in demand as the obvious lot.

 

Perhaps the stars will re-align over the summer but I very much doubt it.

[JonnyLove]

Always the optimist that I am, I don't have an issue currently with what is going on.

 

1) We need a new manager - the last one was clearly not as committed as he would of lead us to believe and so what.

2) Players will be sold and players will be brought.

 

With point 1. As long as it is no one from a lower English league club (other than Eddie Howe (he plays good football and does seem to over acheive with the players at his disposal)), and as long as it is no one who has managed in the premier league before (I.E an ex premier league club manager not in a current premier league club) Other than Rafel Benitez, then I will be happy with what the board have done.

 

Going on from this the names who have been linked (outside of what I have eluded to above (Steve McClaren for example)) then I don't think we have an issue and personally I feel we will do ok at the very least we will be there or there abouts to 8th again next year.

 

Then there are the players. Ok we are going to loose some, some because they want to go and some because we want to get rid of them but lets look at it this way. Look at our squad and say we lose: RL(£5m), AL(£20m). LW(£30m), DL(£15m), MS(£15m), JR(£15m), With a combined income of £100m Even if we reinvest £60m of that on players that's some serious cash to be able to build on the rest of the current core squad and youngsters coming through.

 

So if players leave and now with the manager gone I don't have an issue. But It is all dependant on who is the replacement.

 

So That means the correct Manager and then give them the budget to build on the squad that is left with some real quality.

[Ohio Saint]

Congrats on a thread that has so far worked out largely as planned!

 

I can't say that I am not very worried. More worried than most closed seasons.

 

However, The departures so far, NC, MP and SRL have all had an air of inevitability about them, albeit the SRL one was one hell of a surprise which was dictated by the fact that the only club that SRL would have moved for made the bid.

I don't feel that there was much the board could have done about the departures thus far. As has been said many times already, the time to panic will be at the start of the season. Nothing new there. I panic at the start of every season! Until then, we just have to wait and see what the board does with matters that ARE totally under their control before we pass judgement.

[pap]

I personally have always thought Lambert is absolute class and it's been a pleasure to watch him lead our line over the years. If we take everything in isolation you can argue the rationale behind it and conclude that it's not so bad in the grand scheme of things. Even when you look alone at the Lambert deal, there is reason for concern. 4M for our Rickie Lambert? He's priceless to us IMO.

 

So far, poch and the coaching team have left and Lambert is going. Others will leave too.

 

We are currently managerless, coachless and unable to resolve contracts for players who aren't as in demand as the obvious lot.

 

Perhaps the stars will re-align over the summer but I very much doubt it.

 

The best description I ever heard of Rickie is that "he is basically our front", and I'd have a hard time disagreeing with that assessment. Whenever he or Lallana were absent under Adkins, I really used to fear for us, in any game. Since coming to the Prem, he's got even better, but priceless to us? Not sure.

 

First, until we've got a new bloke in, we don't know how the team is going to line up and play next year. To your point, that probably means we shouldn't be flogging Rickie until someone comes in. However, let's not kid ourselves. If we didn't replace Rickie this year, we'd need to at some point and when that time arrives, there are not many clubs that'll offer that sort of money for a man of his age.

 

This is just bringing the plan forward a little.

[pezza]

Maybe I am just consoling my disappointment here but when I reflect back on the season we played some of the best I have ever seen at Southampton and I was very proud to go to games especially away and support a team that was also admired by most other fans as well.

But when I reflect back I cannot recall, and I am happy to be corrected, MoPo making those amazing tactical changes and substitutions when things were not going right and I am wondering whether he did not have a plan B or it was the restrictions of the squad.

We always started games fantastically well but did not always finish well and lost and drew a few games that we really should have won.

Maybe a new manager will have that ability, I do like the look of Yakun.