Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Fair play, they went to the Nou Camp and did it. who would have thought at the start of the season that Barca or the other Madrid side would not top La Liga? maybe not as competitive, though technically better, La Liga might (?) be easier to win than the EPL, it gives any team prepared to play as well as the so called 'big clubs' a shot at actually doing it. so when the likes of the 'usual suspects' pour scorn on our ambition we should point out what happened today, a team of decent players actually seeing the season out on top. A great manager, a group of hard working and hungry players, a few very good ones playing a system that the others failed to compete with. sound familiar? all we need to do is convince the manage and the players that it 'could' happen if they want it to. Think Cortese believed that, not so sure the current lot do though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wiggles31 Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Fair play to them to win it. Sadly the PL has 5 stand out clubs whereas La Liga has 2 stand out clubs and now Athletico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 To be fair, At.Madrid are a pretty big club over there. It's a great story to see someone else win it though, but they do have some tremendous players in that side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 (edited) Fair play to them to win it. Sadly the PL has 5 stand out clubs whereas La Liga has 2 stand out clubs and now Athletico. Yep, accept that, but I guess you could argue that the two sides there are as far away from the rest until today, as our top five are away from us. Edited 17 May, 2014 by Noodles34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 To be fair, At.Madrid are a pretty big club over there. It's a great story to see someone else win it though, but they do have some tremendous players in that side. And so do we... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nta786 Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 We could if we wanted to, no doubt about that. One thing I'll comment about Athletico is their scouting team- no matter who they lose, they'll have a replacement just as good. We would need some solid spending though. Imagine how good we would be if Gaston and Osvaldo worked out- again, no doubt we'd be higher. but I suppose that is part of football, sometimes transfers work out, sometimes they don't. Though in Athletico's case, a lot of them turn our great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nta786 Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 We could if we wanted to, no doubt about that. One thing I'll comment about Athletico is their scouting team- no matter who they lose, they'll have a replacement just as good. We would need some solid spending though. Imagine how good we would be if Gaston and Osvaldo worked out- again, no doubt we'd be higher. but I suppose that is part of football, sometimes transfers work out, sometimes they don't. Though in Athletico's case, a lot of them turn our great! Though if I'm honest, Ath Madrid are just was Dortmund were last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didcot Saint Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Nick, I really think we can go higher than most people think. The board need to be brave and back MoPo and keep our brilliant squad together. This is a make or break time for our club mate. I really hope we can push on and shove the thoughts of the so called big clubs and the **** stirring journalists out there and show them we won't be bullied in selling our best players, and can give them a run for their money. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monk Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Atleti fall into the category of clubs such as Villareal, Valencia and Deportivo. They have been very fortunate on 'stumbling' across a decent crop of players and building around them. There will always be a third team that challenges the top two like Valencia previously did. Unfortunately, Atleti will not kick on after 2016 season and that's the opinion of myself and a friend attending University in Madrid who has adopted them as his home team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Nick, I really think we can go higher than most people think. The board need to be brave and back MoPo and keep our brilliant squad together. This is a make or break time for our club mate. I really hope we can push on and shove the thoughts of the so called big clubs and the **** stirring journalists out there and show them we won't be bullied in selling our best players, and can give them a run for their money. Good post. Hey Martin yep, agree, not sure the board so though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
igsey Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 The best thing about Athletico drawing with Barca is that it means Real finish in third! They are the team that try to buy trophies if ever I've seen one, never mind Man City or Chelsea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Atleti fall into the category of clubs such as Villareal, Valencia and Deportivo. They have been very fortunate on 'stumbling' across a decent crop of players and building around them. There will always be a third team that challenges the top two like Valencia previously did. Unfortunately, Atleti will not kick on after 2016 season and that's the opinion of myself and a friend attending University in Madrid who has adopted them as his home team. Yes, previously being 10 years ago. They will undoubtedly suffer in the way we have, lose their manager, Costa is already half way to the Kings Rd, but, and it's a big but, they actually did it before that happens, we will lose everything before we even give ourselves a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 The best thing about Athletico drawing with Barca is that it means Real finish in third! They are the team that try to buy trophies if ever I've seen one, never mind Man City or Chelsea. Funded by the govt. too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 17 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 17 May, 2014 It's great when clubs like Dortmund and Athletico overrun the hierarchy, all we need is someone to do it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monk Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Yes, previously being 10 years ago. They will undoubtedly suffer in the way we have, lose their manager, Costa is already half way to the Kings Rd, but, and it's a big but, they actually did it before that happens, we will lose everything before we even give ourselves a chance. Very valid point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Yup, great scouting and a decent youth setup too. Diego Costa... as horrible as he is, £800,000? Wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Oh, whilst on the subject... yes, it'd be a wonderful story and with the players at our disposal and if we add 4-5 decent, proven players to the squad we'd have a chance to upset the establishment. Maybe not yet, but a couple of years down the line. However, that won't happen. We're headed in another direction now. But yes, the players we have here are THAT good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didcot Saint Posted 17 May, 2014 Share Posted 17 May, 2014 Hey Martin yep, agree, not sure the board so though? No mate, that's the problem. NC was a hard nose but he would have made sure we kept progressing. However, would hate us to be financially screwed again like Leeds or Poopey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 It's great when clubs like Dortmund and Athletico overrun the hierarchy, all we need is someone to do it here. Dortmund have a 80,000 seater stadium and have won the league eight times as well as plenty of domestic and European trophies too. Athletico have won the league, errr, ten times in their history. They are the "hierarchy". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Good thread. When the usual suspects porn scorn on a provincial English club with one trophy to their name breaking into the big clubs in England we can point them to the fact that a club based in the capital of Spain with a 55,000 stadium that have won La Liga 10 time. The copa del Rey 10 times, the UEFA cup twice, the cup winners cup and are about to play in their second European cup/champions league final have just won the spanish league again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Can we be Athletico? won't they be a bit upset? Plus away games will be a bit of **** to get to....think I'd rather stay as saints Ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 There's certainly inspiration to be taken. They have a knack of unearthing stars and are in a constant state of replacing the ones they sell, the most impressive thing is that they have managed to re-invest wisely and use it as a foundation to progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monk Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 The English equivalent of Atletico is/was Spurs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 If we can be athletico,so can loads others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 There's no H in Atletico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Boy Saint Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 The fact that they have achieved it in a league where Real Madrid and Barcelona alone get something like 55% of the TV money shows that it is possible with the right players and work ethic. Didn't Simeone and MP play under the same Argentine manager who is held in high esteem for his management style, a style that seems to have rubbed off on the 2 of them. If we can keep everyone here and add well then there should be no reason why we can't upset the Applecart or at least ruffle a few more feathers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericb Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Good thread. When the usual suspects porn scorn on a provincial English club with one trophy to their name breaking into the big clubs in England we can point them to the fact that a club based in the capital of Spain with a 55,000 stadium that have won La Liga 10 time. The copa del Rey 10 times, the UEFA cup twice, the cup winners cup and are about to play in their second European cup/champions league final have just won the spanish league again. Yup these small clubs are such an inspiration for us, i can't believe the press don't think the same! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammysaint Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Our project that involes academy prospects playing in the 1st team is more similar to Barca, however we lack the fan base and historic and special Catalan backing they have. I really feel should we keep our star players and manager this year and brought in a few free transfers and loans, we could do a Everton and finish top 6, all Everton did really was keep all there best players bar 1 sold him brought just as good and allowed them to pay high wages for a top quality striker and wide player who they got on loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 We can be anyone we want to be....provided we can find a 30 goal a season striker....same as everyone else. We create all the chances we need, we don't put enough of them away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmacian_saint Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Atletico, despite having been through rough times, are the 3rd biggest club in Spain and certainly the only besides Real and Barça to have a solid nationwide fan base. So the comparison is misleading and extremely wrong. The question should be: can we be Deportivo, or at least be Wolfsburg? That of course, can happen. But it takes time, luck (transitional periods of bigger teams, perfectly complimentary team with great synergies) and even then it may not happen. We can push forward, but the Atletico level of success, I'd argue, takes decades to build for a club which is starting off from almost 0 trophies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo71 Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 I'll have a pint of whatever the poster is on ( I thought I was on the Stoke forum for a minute) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eelpie Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 I thought Athletico were trying to be us ... ... many years ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 18 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Good thread. When the usual suspects porn scorn on a provincial English club with one trophy to their name breaking into the big clubs in England we can point them to the fact that a club based in the capital of Spain with a 55,000 stadium that have won La Liga 10 time. The copa del Rey 10 times, the UEFA cup twice, the cup winners cup and are about to play in their second European cup/champions league final have just won the spanish league again. A little bit misleading, since 1996 until 2009 they have own nothing (significant anyway), until Flores took over and subsequently Simione. A lot changed in 20 years, especially finances. To compete with Barca and Real over the last 20, is like us trying to compete with Utd and Chelsea and now City. Back in 96 we had more chance of winning the league than now, as they did. But now they have done it again in today's climate, a bit different to the times you are quoting . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 A little bit misleading, since 1996 until 2009 they have own nothing (significant anyway), until Flores took over and subsequently Simione. A lot changed in 20 years, especially finances. To compete with Barca and Real over the last 20, is like us trying to compete with Utd and Chelsea and now City. Back in 96 we had more chance of winning the league than now, as they did. But now they have done it again in today's climate, a bit different to the times you are quoting . It's not like us trying to compete with Chelsea/City, it's like Spurs or Everton trying to. We really have no similarity to a team that has decades of high level success behind it. It's far more misleading to suggest we are even remotely comparable to Atletico Madrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint George Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Nope, it's the Green Bay Packers for us, and that came from the top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 18 May, 2014 Share Posted 18 May, 2014 Nope, it's the Green Bay Packers for us, and that came from the top Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 18 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 18 May, 2014 It's not like us trying to compete with Chelsea/City, it's like Spurs or Everton trying to. We really have no similarity to a team that has decades of high level success behind it. It's far more misleading to suggest we are even remotely comparable to Atletico Madrid. No its relative in that we have more clubs competing here than in Spain. They won the Europa League twice recently because it's easier to qualify there than here. Sorry but what decades of success have they had by the way? Not until the last few years, before that, as I pointed out, it's not relative to the modern financial game otherwise you would be saying the likes of PNE and I don't know, Villa should have to right to compete at the top. My point being more about how a hard working team that gets a good group of players together (including some very good ones) at the right time, under a very good manager implementing a system that works against the bigger clubs in particular can succeed, especially when the manager is backed. do I think that will happen here, no, probably not but it is possible, and Atletico have proved it, or did you back them to win La Liga this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 19 May, 2014 Share Posted 19 May, 2014 Atletico, despite having been through rough times, are the 3rd biggest club in Spain and certainly the only besides Real and Barça to have a solid nationwide fan base. So the comparison is misleading and extremely wrong. The question should be: can we be Deportivo, or at least be Wolfsburg? That of course, can happen. But it takes time, luck (transitional periods of bigger teams, perfectly complimentary team with great synergies) and even then it may not happen. We can push forward, but the Atletico level of success, I'd argue, takes decades to build for a club which is starting off from almost 0 trophies. Atletico were 100 to 1 third favourites to win the league, I'm not sure what our odds were but would imagine smaller so backs up your comparison argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 19 May, 2014 Share Posted 19 May, 2014 A little bit misleading, since 1996 until 2009 they have own nothing (significant anyway), until Flores took over and subsequently Simione. A lot changed in 20 years, especially finances. To compete with Barca and Real over the last 20, is like us trying to compete with Utd and Chelsea and now City. Back in 96 we had more chance of winning the league than now, as they did. But now they have done it again in today's climate, a bit different to the times you are quoting . They've won 23 major trophies in their history. We've won 1. They are based in the nations capital and have a nationwide fan base. We are based on the coast and have a local fan base. They have one of the biggest stadiums in Spain, we have the biggest stadium in Hampshire. They are historically a big club in Spain. We are historically a middle sized club in England. The only comparison you can draw is they play in stripes and we used to. We are far, far more like celta Vigo than Atheltico Madrid. As others have said they are more like spurs or Everton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 19 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 19 May, 2014 They've won 23 major trophies in their history. We've won 1. They are based in the nations capital and have a nationwide fan base. We are based on the coast and have a local fan base. They have one of the biggest stadiums in Spain, we have the biggest stadium in Hampshire. They are historically a big club in Spain. We are historically a middle sized club in England. The only comparison you can draw is they play in stripes and we used to. We are far, far more like celta Vigo than Atheltico Madrid. As others have said they are more like spurs or Everton. Well there is no much point in hoping we do well then, because people like you just write us off anyway. i guess the Atletico Turkish was saying much the same in August last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 19 May, 2014 Share Posted 19 May, 2014 Well there is no much point in hoping we do well then, because people like you just write us off anyway. i guess the Atletico Turkish was saying much the same in August last year. It's not "writing us off" to say we're not comparable to Atletico Madrid. For all the pretty factual reasons listed above - stadium, capital city, major trophies won throughout their history - we aren't comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 19 May, 2014 Share Posted 19 May, 2014 Sorry but what decades of success have they had by the way? Not until the last few years, before that, as I pointed out, it's not relative to the modern financial game otherwise you would be saying the likes of PNE and I don't know, Villa should have to right to compete at the top. "What decades of success have they had by the way"?? Well, from a cursory look at Wikipedia shows them winning at least one major trophy - League, Cup, European trophies, every single decade for the last sixty odd years 2010s/2000s/1990s/80s/70s/60s/50 and so on. Most decades it is significantly more than one, with plenty of runners up spots on top. Looks like they had a spell in the second division in the 2000s but so have the current English Champions. If that isn't decades of success, I really don't know what is. You comparing that to Preston is even more ludicrous as your comparison to Saints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 19 May, 2014 Share Posted 19 May, 2014 (edited) Didn't realise football was played in the past. Learn something new everyday on the mongboard. History only matters if it affects size which in turn only matters if it affects purchasing power. The rest is irrelevant and a fetishised trip down memory lane. Given AM's considerable financial difficulties, the impact of its history and size on the ability to recruit and retain the best players is far from straightforward. Simples. Edited 19 May, 2014 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theyin Posted 20 May, 2014 Share Posted 20 May, 2014 In answer to the OP .... No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted 20 May, 2014 Share Posted 20 May, 2014 They have generally been at the head of the chasing pack in la liga for a number of years, so IMHO the comparison is difficult to make with Saints. And in the last few years they have won the intertoto cup, cops del rey, Europa cup and supercup! Whereas we rest players for fa cup games. I agree with crab lungs above-add 5 really good players, keep the squad together and there is a chance in the future, but highly unlikely now. Nice thought though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 20 May, 2014 Share Posted 20 May, 2014 Well there is no much point in hoping we do well then, because people like you just write us off anyway. i guess the Atletico Turkish was saying much the same in August last year. People like me aren't writing anything off, simply pointing out that we have little in common with Athletico and they they are the 3rd most successful side and biggest side in Spain so it's shouldn't come as too much of a shock when they challenge for the title. As for athletico Turkish, he'd be delighted with their recent history. 3rd place finish last season and champions league football, prior to that copa del Rey wins, 2 x Europa cup wins, you know, that competition we were told was beneath us and we didn't want to be in. Funny how that was an important part in the development of a team we should model ourselves on . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 21 May, 2014 Author Share Posted 21 May, 2014 People like me aren't writing anything off, simply pointing out that we have little in common with Athletico and they they are the 3rd most successful side and biggest side in Spain so it's shouldn't come as too much of a shock when they challenge for the title. As for athletico Turkish, he'd be delighted with their recent history. 3rd place finish last season and champions league football, prior to that copa del Rey wins, 2 x Europa cup wins, you know, that competition we were told was beneath us and we didn't want to be in. Funny how that was an important part in the development of a team we should model ourselves on . I think it shocked a lot of people, a bit like Liverpool this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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