Saints viewed as open for business

[Wes Tender]

yes, the players cost nothing in terms of a fee

why is that so hard to grasp?

 

 

Thanks for clarifying that on behalf of Rory. I did realise that we did not pay a fee for them, although if we are being pedantic about it, whoever buys Lallana will have to pay a fee to Bournemouth. But Rory's assertion that the players cost nothing is factually incorrect, as we did spend time and money on their development over several years. Why is that concept hard to grasp?

[Batman]

Thanks for clarifying that on behalf of Rory. I did realise that we did not pay a fee for them, although if we are being pedantic about it, whoever buys Lallana will have to pay a fee to Bournemouth. But Rory's assertion that the players cost nothing is factually incorrect, as we did spend time and money on their development over several years. Why is that concept hard to grasp?

 

but the point was (in the article) that they cost nothing in terms of a fee.

ALL players have additional money spent on them

[doddisalegend]

Starting to think Cortese left primarily because talks led him to believe sales were possible. He'd have wanted to say 'no way, no-one for sale, if they want CL football we'll get it here'. I'm sure of that.

 

Nothing bad has happened yet, but the messages coming out of the club are unsure at best, and more likely just showing ambition has been severely knocked back. Seems odd with Liebherr though. If she wants to carry on what her father helped build then why be less ambitious?[/QUOTE]

 

[Sour Mash]

Just seen an interesting snippet on twitter from Adam Blackmore of Solent - that Cortese wanted to sack MP in December and had to be talked out of it by senior players. Not sure what to read in to that.

[Wes Tender]

a) It's jack sh it to do with the FD's statement and everything to do with the fact that Liverpool and Man U want Shaw and Lallana.

 

b) What "ridiculously low amounts" are these then? Funny how Captain "I believe nothing in the papers, me" seems so happy to swallow whole whatever finger in the air monopoly money a newspaper prints. You have no idea whatsoever on who has bid what.

Firstly, put me firmly in the camp of the dinlos for generally appreciating the article, with the few reservations I mentioned.

 

I note that in your opinion, which you are entitled to express, that you feel that the media frenzy about the offers for Shaw, Lallana and others, has nothing at all to do with the statement issued by our FD that the financial situation at the club was a matter for concern. That rather flies in the face of the articles written by the journos that mention our financial situation as a reason why Southampton need to sell our star players to balance then books then, doesn't it?

 

Although you appear to have missed it, I did mention that clubs will covet our star players and wish to buy them, so it is not anything surprising that offers have come in for those two players and others.

 

Any player is worth only what somebody is prepared to pay for them. When several minted clubs are after those players, then the laws of supply and demand dictate that the price will rise. As already mentioned, their value will also almost certainly be higher after the World Cup. If we have no need to sell them, indeed if we have a positive desire to keep them, then it also follows that it would require a very inflated price to secure them. The cost of replacing them is also a factor that we will consider.

 

But I note that you believe that I am not entitled to pass comment on the figures reported in the media as to whether in my opinion the sums are acceptable or not. And I thought that the essence of a forum was to exchange opinions about this sort of thing.

[doddisalegend]

Just seen an interesting snippet on twitter from Adam Blackmore of Solent - that Cortese wanted to sack MP in December and had to be talked out of it by senior players. Not sure what to read in to that.

 

Really?? wow that would have been a massive blow to NCs reputation..........

[Wes Tender]

but the point was (in the article) that they cost nothing in terms of a fee.

ALL players have additional money spent on them

 

Again, I'm grateful to you for clarifying what Rory intended to mean but did not say.

[FloridaMarlin]

Let's see how open for business Liverpool are when Real Madrid come a-calling for Suarez.

 

No doubt, any offer for Suarez will be an insult to their status as a top four PL club, who love nothing more than to wave their willies around and almost claim it as a divine right that they can prise any player they want away from a lesser club.

 

Let's see how they view it if Real have worked on Suarez's agent (and the player) and he is determined to go.

 

Since Jean-Marc Bosman won his case, it's pretty much impossible for clubs to now keep hold of players who want to go.

 

When faced with a player who is determined to go, all a club can really do is make sure they get as much money as possible for him.

[Window Cleaner]

Just seen an interesting snippet on twitter from Adam Blackmore of Solent - that Cortese wanted to sack MP in December and had to be talked out of it by senior players. Not sure what to read in to that.

 

 

It's not particularly surprising, bloke was alwqays wavinbg theaxe over underachievers. Remember commenting it on it at the time, said it was highly probable because the results were bad and we were sinking like a lead fish.

[alpine_saint]

17m ?????

 

Liverpool really are a bunch of arrogant w*nkers.

 

We really are going to miss NC this summer...

[Sour Mash]

We really are going to miss NC this summer...

Agreed. Imagine if this was the case

 

"Sorry, held off as long as I could, but my natural impatience is getting the better of me...

 

SFC is supposed to be a year-long professionally-run operation in one of the most celebrated and quality leagues of the best-likes spectator sport in the world. But come June, almost f**k-all is going on.

 

We have no date for the kit release, though I am guessing the club has been negotiating with Addidas for f**king months. I remember even when we were back at the Dell a couple of times the next seasons kit was paraded round the field in the last couple of home games, and the likes of Chelsea and Manyoo can give previews at the beginning of the summer.

 

We have no indicators of in-bound transfer activity, though we managed the time to tell 8 players "thanks but f**k off"

 

Oh, we did manage to set the ST price, but then thats money....

 

Does every manager in every department just p*ss off for a month after the last game, like a crappy B&B shutting down for the winter ? IMO, the summer is the busiest time for some of the people at the club.

 

Rant over, Sorry. "

[alpine_saint]

Agreed. Imagine if this was the case

 

"Sorry, held off as long as I could, but my natural impatience is getting the better of me...

 

SFC is supposed to be a year-long professionally-run operation in one of the most celebrated and quality leagues of the best-likes spectator sport in the world. But come June, almost f**k-all is going on.

 

We have no date for the kit release, though I am guessing the club has been negotiating with Addidas for f**king months. I remember even when we were back at the Dell a couple of times the next seasons kit was paraded round the field in the last couple of home games, and the likes of Chelsea and Manyoo can give previews at the beginning of the summer.

 

We have no indicators of in-bound transfer activity, though we managed the time to tell 8 players "thanks but f**k off"

 

Oh, we did manage to set the ST price, but then thats money....

 

Does every manager in every department just p*ss off for a month after the last game, like a crappy B&B shutting down for the winter ? IMO, the summer is the busiest time for some of the people at the club.

 

Rant over, Sorry. "

 

Yaaaawwwwwnn......

 

Kruger and co have done the same thing already. At least NC had a kit sorted out and did the business when he came back. And we already know the short shrift he gave transfer enquiries. We just get corporate doublespeak from Kruger.

Edited 15 May, 2014 by alpine_saint

[Sour Mash]

Yaaaawwwwwnn......

You've to find that irony just a little bit amusing surely?

[alpine_saint]

You've to find that irony just a little bit amusing surely?

 

Nope, but the pathetic petty brownie-points scoring tickles me.

Edited 15 May, 2014 by alpine_saint

[aintforever]

Face it, none of us have any idea wether Kruger is a harder bastard to deal with than Cortese or not.

[Baird of the land]

I do believe Cortese would be extremely hard nosed about these bids & in terms of fighting to convince Potchettino that the better place to be is Saints. We'll soon see if the new regime has any strength in rejecting these bids and competing to retain our manager. If we show weakness it will be like blood in the water to sharks.

[CB Fry]

Firstly, put me firmly in the camp of the dinlos for generally appreciating the article, with the few reservations I mentioned.

 

I note that in your opinion, which you are entitled to express, that you feel that the media frenzy about the offers for Shaw, Lallana and others, has nothing at all to do with the statement issued by our FD that the financial situation at the club was a matter for concern. That rather flies in the face of the articles written by the journos that mention our financial situation as a reason why Southampton need to sell our star players to balance then books then, doesn't it?

 

Although you appear to have missed it, I did mention that clubs will covet our star players and wish to buy them, so it is not anything surprising that offers have come in for those two players and others.

 

Any player is worth only what somebody is prepared to pay for them. When several minted clubs are after those players, then the laws of supply and demand dictate that the price will rise. As already mentioned, their value will also almost certainly be higher after the World Cup. If we have no need to sell them, indeed if we have a positive desire to keep them, then it also follows that it would require a very inflated price to secure them. The cost of replacing them is also a factor that we will consider.

 

But I note that you believe that I am not entitled to pass comment on the figures reported in the media as to whether in my opinion the sums are acceptable or not. And I thought that the essence of a forum was to exchange opinions about this sort of thing.

 

So journalists writing up some comments from our FD is the reason Liverpool want to buy Adam Lallana? Right-o.

 

And our FD has not said anything about needing to sell to balance the books. As a keen scholar of official club statements you could dig one out to prove otherwise.

 

Or are you, gosh, believing journalists when it suits you, yet again? Funny, ain't it.

[Hurricane163]

A good article. The key part is the last paragraph. Indeed whether players are sold or not will be the indicator as to whether the club is looking towards a future higher place in the league.

[thefuriousb]

Whilst it may be "great" that Cortese dismissed enquires away with such style and pinache when clubs came a calling, it is also the case that this approach would not have been endearing to clubs when we enquired about the availabliity of our targets.

[doddisalegend]

Just seen an interesting snippet on twitter from Adam Blackmore of Solent - that Cortese wanted to sack MP in December and had to be talked out of it by senior players. Not sure what to read in to that.

 

I do believe Cortese would be extremely hard nosed about these bids & in terms of fighting to convince Potchettino that the better place to be is Saints. We'll soon see if the new regime has any strength in rejecting these bids and competing to retain our manager. If we show weakness it will be like blood in the water to sharks.

 

Or if the above is true and NC was still here Mopo might be getting the boot right now for failing to get into Europe..............

[benjii]

Cortese may have dismissed the bids. As a consequence we may have had little money to spend on incoming transfers without borrowing. In turn, I doubt we would have done any better next season as the squad (in terms of genuine quality) would have still been too small.

 

If we accept one or two bids but sign four or five good players we may well do better next season.

 

I say, chill out.

[Saint Mikey]

I won't be satisfied until I hear stories of Krueger whipping out a Zippo in front of a player and burning the offer. He has to up his game and go one better than Cortese...

[Mr X]

if katherine has "made it clear the club must pay its own way" that surely = She won't be providing any future investment, so where do we go from that?

[doddisalegend]

I won't be satisfied until I hear stories of Krueger whipping out a Zippo in front of a player and burning the offer. He has to up his game and go one better than Cortese...

 

What something like this......."So you want to leave Adam"

 

[Window Cleaner]

if katherine has "made it clear the club must pay its own way" that surely = She won't be providing any future investment, so where do we go from that?

 

 

Probably running out of disposable money:uhoh:

[Wes Tender]

So journalists writing up some comments from our FD is the reason Liverpool want to buy Adam Lallana? Right-o.

 

And our FD has not said anything about needing to sell to balance the books. As a keen scholar of official club statements you could dig one out to prove otherwise.

 

Or are you, gosh, believing journalists when it suits you, yet again? Funny, ain't it.

 

I've explained it in as simple terms as I can manage. If it is still too complicated for you to understand, then I'm afraid that I really can't be bothered to make the effort to explain it again just for your benefit.

[hutch]

if katherine has "made it clear the club must pay its own way" that surely = She won't be providing any future investment, so where do we go from that?

If it was me, I'd probably have a look at that ninety million quid from the premier league.

[CB Fry]

I've explained it in as simple terms as I can manage. If it is still too complicated for you to understand, then I'm afraid that I really can't be bothered to make the effort to explain it again just for your benefit.

 

Where has anyone from SFC said "we need to sell to balance the books"?

 

You like to pompously demand evidence from other posters all the time, so come on then. Show me.

 

Secondly, it's you that don't understand, so I will explain it nice. and. slow.

 

Liverpool would be publicly bidding for Adam Lallana even if Atilla the sodding Hun was our chairman.

[Wes Tender]

Where has anyone from SFC said "we need to sell to balance the books"?

 

You like to pompously demand evidence from other posters all the time, so come on then. Show me.

 

Secondly, it's you that don't understand, so I will explain it nice. and. slow.

 

Liverpool would be publicly bidding for Adam Lallana even if Atilla the sodding Hun was our chairman.

 

Have I ever said that anybody from the club stated that they need to balance the books? No, I haven't.

 

So I'll just pompously demand that you show me where I said that, just so as not to disappoint you.

 

What your feeble brain probably misread and misunderstood, was me saying this:-

 

that rather flies in the face of the articles written by the journos that mention our financial situation as a reason why Southampton need to sell our star players to balance then books then, doesn't it?

 

Did that penetrate your cranium? As for the other bit, show me where I have ever said that Liverpool, Chelsea, Man United, Arsenal, Bayern Munich, Real Madrid or anybody else would be prevented from bidding for any of our players because of our chairman. You must be thinking of somebody else. Do keep up Fry.

 

As usual, you're probably being deliberately thick. just. to. be. obtuse; in WUM mode.

[Wes Tender]

P.S Fry. That is the last I have to say to you on the matter.

[jamesfp1]

Burn

[CB Fry]

The reason why the vultures circled around the club and why these offers have streamed in for half our squad and our manager has little to do with us being seen as open for business. It is purely because our financial director naively and rather stupidly put it in the public domain that the financial situation was a cause for concern.

 

We're getting offers for our players "purely because" our financial director put in the public domain about our financial situation.

 

Not Adam Lallana being in the PFA team of the year, then? Not MP being a highly effective manager? Not Shaw being a sensational young player? "Purely because" of a few words from a financial director.

 

As ever, you are utterly full of shi t.

[CB Fry]

had we not released that statement, we would not have had the ridiculously low amounts offered for them.

 

And, any evidence on this then?

 

What ridiculous offer, for who, from who and when?

 

Whenever you like.

[Cheeky Monkey]

For those who don't buy it:

 

Response of south coast club to transfer bids will speak volumes about their ambition, writes Rory Smith

 

It is a story that sums up Nicola Cortese’s approach to transfer dealings. A couple of years ago, in his pomp as Southampton executive chairman, the Italian-born Swiss called one of the club’s bright young things into his office. An offer had arrived for his services from one of the Barclays Premier League’s big beasts. It was a generous one, but not sufficiently so to tempt Cortese to do business.

 

When the teenager appeared, Cortese showed him the piece of paper on which the offer was written. He did not ask him for an opinion, or give him the chance to state if he would like the club to enter into negotiations. He simply tore it up in front of him. “That,” he told him, “is what I think of that.”

 

Cortese, who left his post at the turn of the year, is the sort of character who divides opinion. Many feel that he was the ultimate architect of Southampton’s remarkable rise from the depths of the third tier to the top half of the Barclays Premier League. Others, particularly at St Mary’s, feel that life is entirely more palatable without him around.

 

What is not in question, though, is that Cortese was a fearsome opponent when it came to transfers. Few of his fellow executives in the Premier League relished the prospect of dealing with him.

It would be fascinating to know how different this week might have been had Cortese still been in charge on the south coast. The season had been over for just a few minutes when a delegation from Manchester United — by chance Southampton’s guests on the final day of the campaign — submitted, in person, a £27 million offer for Luke Shaw, only hours before he was confirmed as a member of Roy Hodgson’s World Cup squad.

 

Less than a day later, Liverpool came calling, this time for Adam Lallana, the club captain and the long-term standard-bearer for what they call “the Southampton way”. That offer of £17 million, or thereabouts, arrived remotely. Both are under consideration. Nothing has been torn up; not yet.

 

Doubtless that will serve to encourage Tottenham Hotspur, too, when they make their long-anticipated move to extricate Mauricio Pochettino, the manager, from Southampton. Ralph Krueger, Cortese’s successor, and Katharina Liebherr, the club’s owner, have done what they can to persuade the Argentinian to stay, and a new contract offer is on the table, but the most effective defence against Spurs’s predations may be one put in place by Cortese, who had a clause written into Pochettino’s deal that means the manager will have to pay, personally, £2 million if he leaves for another club.

 

The presence of Cortese, of course, would not have stopped these offers coming in; he would not have acted as an impenetrable bulwark against the circling vultures. It is hard to escape the impression, though, that those teams who have long coveted Southampton’s most precious assets feel altogether more comfortable making their intentions known than they might have done six or seven months ago.

That is regrettable, of course. The work Southampton have done over the past five years is, perhaps, the most remarkable story in English football. They are an advert for how things should be done, investing in their youth infrastructure, bringing through their own players, building sustainably.

 

Pochettino has instilled an attractive, expansive, modern ethos into the way they play. There is a restrained culture among the players that Calum Chambers, another off the production line, describes as “self-policing”.

As soon as anyone looks as if the praise is going to their heads, the rest of the squad is quick to drag them back down to earth.

 

They are reaping the rewards for all of that: an eighth-placed finish in the Barclays Premier League. Rickie Lambert, like Lallana and Shaw, is in the England squad and Jay Rodriguez might well have been, had he not been sidelined by injury. Morgan Schneiderlin is on the standby list for France.

 

All of that comes at a price. Glittering jewels attract the magpies. Not many can resist them. Krueger, upon his appointment, described how the club — forever looking to seek the extra revenues that might make them more competitive still — were considering franchising out their youth development expertise. They would give other clubs, other teams in other sports, the benefit of their wisdom at growing their own talent. It was, he said, an intelligent way of monetising their greatest asset. Indeed it is. It is just that football has long had a more straightforward way of achieving the same end: clubs who produce their talent eventually sell it to those who buy it in.

 

Southampton do not have to sell. But Liebherr, while she remains, as far as anyone can tell, committed to the club, has made it clear that they must pay their own way. If that is the case, there comes a point when they have to succumb. Not far off £50 million for two players who cost nothing is simply good business.

 

The coming days and weeks, though, will be instructive. If the aim is simply for consolidation in the Premier League, £50 million for two players — at the height of their value — is too good to turn down. If the plan is as it was, to crack the glass ceiling separating the top six from the rest, they must channel their inner Cortese. They must resist. Which path they choose will say much about where Southampton’s journey will take them next.

 

Top post

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[redder freak]

If I were on the Board (in my fantasy football world!), I would want to wait until after the World Cup before making any serious squad changes. If we're going to sell players, then we need to have a succession plan in place to improve on what we've got. The World Cup will be a shop window with everyone watching to decide who to sell and buy, depending on individual performances. You also have to consider the psychological effect on the team of damaging it and changing its balance. Take advice from the manager on that. Please, no knee-jerk reactions of taking the money and running. There's plenty of time at the moment. Play the poker game. Maybe that's what they're doing.

[Turkish]

I'm sure the cortese lovers will be filling each other up with jizz over that article. The player who Cortese tore the bid up for was chamberlain, it was talked about at the time funny how arsenal were so frightened of dealing with him that they still managed to sign him, why hasn't that been mentioned? His fearsome imagine didn't put them off.

 

And the fact there were no bids to rip up last summer wasnt because everyone was cowering from this tyrant who was impossible to deal with it was for one simple reason, our players are much more desirable now than then. This time last year did anyone seriously think Lallana would be an England regular and one of the most rated players in the premier league, Shaw off to the World Cup and Rodriguez have had a call up?

 

Still keep believing it was because everyone was scared of dealing with cortese

[Turkish]

Yaaaawwwwwnn......

 

Kruger and co have done the same thing already. At least NC had a kit sorted out and did the business when he came back. And we already know the short shrift he gave transfer enquiries. We just get corporate doublespeak from Kruger.

 

He ran us like a seaside b&b FFS

[Wade Garrett]

I reckon that article was written by Cortese. Total pile of sh*te.

[cellone]

Not far off £50 million for two players who cost nothing is simply good business.

 

Since when have they been free?

[CB Fry]

I'm sure the cortese lovers will be filling each other up with jizz over that article. The player who Cortese tore the bid up for was chamberlain, it was talked about at the time funny how arsenal were so frightened of dealing with him that they still managed to sign him, why hasn't that been mentioned? His fearsome imagine didn't put them off.

 

And the fact there were no bids to rip up last summer wasnt because everyone was cowering from this tyrant who was impossible to deal with it was for one simple reason, our players are much more desirable now than then. This time last year did anyone seriously think Lallana would be an England regular and one of the most rated players in the premier league, Shaw off to the World Cup and Rodriguez have had a call up?

 

Still keep believing it was because everyone was scared of dealing with cortese

 

Last summer Cortese was swatting away a barrage of multi million pound bids for our players like King Kong swatting away bi - planes.

 

Okay, more like Diddy Kong.

[Charlie Wayman]

Don't particularly like the idea, though I'm not particularly concerned that it would let the cat out of the bag and create new competitors. Far easier to transfer form than substance which is the real secret sauce.

 

It rather assumes that we know why the Academy has been successful whereas it could all be just good fortune and luck. Cat in a bag? Or, Cat in a box? Open enough oysters and you'll likely find a pearl. I'm all for marketing bulls.h.it for the highest price you can get. BBB has been a successful maxim for more years than I care to remember

[DuncanRG]

I'm sure the cortese lovers will be filling each other up with jizz over that article. The player who Cortese tore the bid up for was chamberlain, it was talked about at the time funny how arsenal were so frightened of dealing with him that they still managed to sign him, why hasn't that been mentioned? His fearsome imagine didn't put them off.

 

And the fact there were no bids to rip up last summer wasnt because everyone was cowering from this tyrant who was impossible to deal with it was for one simple reason, our players are much more desirable now than then. This time last year did anyone seriously think Lallana would be an England regular and one of the most rated players in the premier league, Shaw off to the World Cup and Rodriguez have had a call up?

 

Still keep believing it was because everyone was scared of dealing with cortese

 

Big clubs were looking at Shaw and Schneiderlin while Cortese was here. Others were almost certainly subject to bids, albeit smaller ones than we're talking about now.

 

I think we all agree that Cortese got us a great deal on a player who wanted to go. If he had considered that first bid Chamberlain might have gone for £6 or £7m, who knows.

 

I reckon that article was written by Cortese. Total pile of sh*te.

 

I take it you don't read Rory Smith often. Try some of his other pieces.

[CB Fry]

Big clubs were looking at Shaw and Schneiderlin while Cortese was here. Others were almost certainly subject to bids, albeit smaller ones than we're talking about now.

 

I think we all agree that Cortese got us a great deal on a player who wanted to go. If he had considered that first bid Chamberlain might have gone for £6 or £7m, who knows.

 

 

 

I take it you don't read Rory Smith often. Try some of his other pieces.

 

Cortese didn't take the first bid for Oxo? Wow. That's some simply breathtaking negotiation skills. I wonder if any other chairmen have ever been bold enough to do that?

 

The single most important factor in us achieving a huge fee for him was the fact we were loaded.

[brmbrm]

Maybe I am naive, but don't people normally start with a low offer then negotiate upwards, or is football the opposite of that? Or is the start price always the finish price? "Ridiculously low amounts"? maybe the offers might be increased. maybe.