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Malaysia Airlines plane missing

melmacian_saint

By melmacian_saint,
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derry

derry

Posted
Posted (edited)

This is a unique situation that in my opinion probably could not have happened in Europe or North America. It has never happened before unless the BSA Lancastrians or Amelia Erheart is considered but that was before modern radar. We may never find it but if it went the way it was supposed, Malaysian and Indonesian radar have a lot of questions to answer. But they won't!!!

Edited by derry
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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted
I've given this thread a relatively wide berth in recent days after scatter-gun accusations of attention-seeking started doing the rounds, preferring instead to follow the story elsewhere.

 

A lot of faith was placed in the "never done before" Inmarsat doppler analysis. Can I ask whether people still have faith in these findings, given that they've turned up nowt so far?

 

Err the Doppler analysis only decided between North and South, absolutely nothing else. I understand that the rest was just basic trig and fuel consumption analysis. Still think they're looking in the wrong place myself. The Jindalee system can in theory pick up a Cessna at 3000 km and so in the position that the search is being based on the aircraft should have shown up on that system.

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted
humourous Hussien (The malaysians Comical Ali)

 

intimated at todays press confernce that the had a fair bit of sensitive data that they are with holding

 

Yes Mike, It must be really valuable data. So they now know where it is.

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buctootim

buctootim

Posted
Posted

 

:rolleyes: There is so much wrong with that - but just this is enough.

 

iPhone 5 - Technical Specifications

 

Size and Weight

 

Height: 4.87 inches (123.8 mm)

Width: 2.31 inches (58.6 mm)

Depth: 0.30 inch (7.6 mm)

Weight: 3.95 ounces (112 grams)

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ChudSaint

ChudSaint

Posted
Posted
:rolleyes: There is so much wrong with that - but just this is enough.

 

iPhone 5 - Technical Specifications

 

Size and Weight

 

Height: 4.87 inches (123.8 mm)

Width: 2.31 inches (58.6 mm)

Depth: 0.30 inch (7.6 mm)

Weight: 3.95 ounces (112 grams)

 

And how do you hide it in your ass?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
You don't want to include the case pap. An Ipad is difficult enough.

 

:D

 

I commend Tim on not visiting many porn sites though. No man who'd ever seen extreme toying would consider an iPhone implausible.

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buctootim

buctootim

Posted
Posted (edited)
Journo seems pretty convinced with follow up...

 

http://jimstonefreelance.com/phillipwood.html

 

 

I think you're right - he's used CAPITALS and bold . Thats why I always give St Richmond's posts so much credence.

 

'Journo' Jim Stone is a conspiracist nutter. He thinks the Japanese nuclear plant wasn't damaged by the Tsunami but by an Israeli nuclear bomb.

http://www.wired.com/2012/01/jim-stone-fukushima/ Every other natural disaster was a 'false flag' as well.

Edited by buctootim
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Viking Warrior

Viking Warrior

Posted
Posted

The Malaysians should have been more careful with their initial comments when the MH370 went missing .

They are now reported as saying the following is the correct version of the last known conversation

 

Malaysian authorities have issued a new version of the last communication between air traffic control and the cockpit of the missing flight MH370.

 

The last words spoken were "Good night Malaysian three seven zero" - and not "all right, good night" as reported.

 

You would have thought they would have got the final words correct from the outset . Or better still not to have released any info about the last communications . Instead they opened up a can of worms re what dud or did not happen .

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Verbal

Verbal

Posted
Posted
I think you're right - he's used CAPITALS and bold . Thats why I always give St Richmond's posts so much credence.

 

'Journo' Jim Stone is a conspiracist nutter. He thinks the Japanese nuclear plant wasn't damaged by the Tsunami but by an Israeli nuclear bomb.

http://www.wired.com/2012/01/jim-stone-fukushima/ Every other natural disaster was a 'false flag' as well.

 

You underestimate this guy. He's clever:

 

Hackers don't have my log ins, only the NSA or other high level gov types would because I am too good with passwords (they are typically un hackable ones like N532r689$^// and with hackers they won't fix it right when they think I am going to log on, they will leave it up. It got fixed without me doing anything, I never knew about it until someone told me. That would be a back stab by an intelligence agency, WHY WOULD THIS STORY BE THAT IMPORTANT IF IT WAS B.S.? They don't just pull that type of stunt out of the blue.

 

He never did close the bracket. Spooky.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
Journo seems pretty convinced with follow up...

 

http://jimstonefreelance.com/phillipwood.html

 

That's my 3 for the day so outta here, enjoy reading your thoughts though..

 

Thanks for this. I had a read.

 

Mr Stone places too much of his argument on the exif format being uneditable without some form of detection. His grounds are largely that as it's machine code, it should be ungettable. Hex editors have been around for decades, so binary data is not unchangeable - you just need to know where it is. exif can be a pain in the arse; the information can be placed all over the file - and in Jim Stone's defence, very few image editors will re-save that image without doing something to the metadata, and he covers this in his edits.

 

Can't help feeling he'd have been better off doing some analysis on first time iPhone shots ( and the respective positions of metadata ) and using those to push his case.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted

Good article here by Matthias Chang, former advisor to Mahathir Mohamed, originally published on Saturday.

 

The trillion dollar question to the US and its intelligence services. ( there are actually quite a few questions here ).

 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearance-of-malaysian-airlines-flight-mh-370-the-trillion-question-to-the-u-s-and-its-intelligence-services/5375780

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Viking Warrior

Viking Warrior

Posted
Posted

Sorry Pap

 

I dont buy into Mathias Changs ideology re MH370.

 

he has an anti american agenda amongst other agendas

 

just look at some of the articles and books he has written such as

 

Future Fastforward: The Zionist Anglo-American Empire Meltdown

 

Hes upset a fair few folk with some of his rantings, even the malaysians jailed him

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
Sorry Pap

 

I dont buy into Mathias Changs ideology re MH370.

 

he has an anti american agenda amongst other agendas

 

just look at some of the articles and books he has written such as

 

Future Fastforward: The Zionist Anglo-American Empire Meltdown

 

Hes upset a fair few folk with some of his rantings, even the malaysians jailed him

 

Cheers for the recommendation. Looks like a well-reviewed book.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Future-Fastforward-Zionist-Anglo-American-Meltdown/product-reviews/0978573315/ref=cm_cr_dp_see_all_btm?ie=UTF8&showViewpoints=1&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted
Good article here by Matthias Chang, former advisor to Mahathir Mohamed, originally published on Saturday.

 

The trillion dollar question to the US and its intelligence services. ( there are actually quite a few questions here ).

 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearance-of-malaysian-airlines-flight-mh-370-the-trillion-question-to-the-u-s-and-its-intelligence-services/5375780

 

 

Good article ?? It's total ******.

 

I mean "was the plane weaponised", must be one of these blokes who goes around with tin foil on his head.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
Good article ?? It's total ******.

 

I mean "was the plane weaponised", must be one of these blokes who goes around with tin foil on his head.

 

Given the fact that many intelligence agencies were worried that MH370 might have been used as a flying missile, fair enough question. Much fairer than your response, anyway :)

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Minty

Minty

Posted
Posted (edited)
"Governments are misleading us"

 

"... is what it feels like."

 

Changes the whole context.

 

I understand the anxiety and doubt, because whilst there are few hard facts, it is human nature to speculate. It is important to remain open-minded, whatever natural feeling we have on it, but above all else, I don't think it is helpful in the slightest to start shifting blame around for what are perceived delays or distractions.

 

Step 1 - find the plane.

 

Step 2 - find out what happened.

 

Step 3 - review the search and investigation itself to see what could've been done better.

 

Starting with step 3 as so many seem to want to do, helps no one IMO.

Edited by Minty
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CHAPEL END CHARLIE

CHAPEL END CHARLIE

Posted
Posted
The Malaysians should have been more careful with their initial comments when the MH370 went missing . They are now reported as saying the following is the correct version of the last known conversation Malaysian authorities have issued a new version of the last communication between air traffic control and the cockpit of the missing flight MH370. The last words spoken were "Good night Malaysian three seven zero" - and not "all right, good night" as reported. You would have thought they would have got the final words correct from the outset . Or better still not to have released any info about the last communications . Instead they opened up a can of worms re what dud or did not happen .
Agree. Whatever they did you can bet that the Malaysian authorities would have come in for criticism because no one can answer the one question that really needs answering - IE what happened to this aircraft. However they have handled the situation very poorly, as this story illustrates. I saw on TV last night the possibility raised that MH370 might have been subject to a 'cyber attack' - a theory that proposes that the aircraft's navigational/ flight control systems were hacked into from on-board, or even from the ground perhaps. A interesting idea this but I don't see how this explains the lack of communication or the fact that the aircrew would have had a (more than one) compass available to them to navigate from in the last resort. This event remains today quite as mysterious as it was on day one.
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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
"... is what it feels like."

 

Changes the whole context.

 

I understand the anxiety and doubt, because whilst there are few hard facts, it is human nature to speculate. It is important to remain open-minded, whatever natural feeling we have on it, but above all else, I don't think it is helpful in the slightest to start shifting blame around for what are perceived delays or distractions.

 

Step 1 - find the plane.

 

Step 2 - find out what happened.

 

Step 3 - review the search and investigation itself to see what could've been done better.

 

Starting with step 3 as so many seem to want to do, helps no one IMO.

 

I'd say watch the whole video instead of relying on either of us for context, but FWIW, she says it twice - once at the start of the video with the qualification you mention, and once at the end without it.

 

The problem with your three step solution is that everything is contingent on the first happening. There hasn't been any evidence of that so far. Both the UN and Pentagon have claimed that they didn't even detect an explosion.

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/pentagon-data-suggests-jet-didnt-explode-new-york-times-n48186

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/rest-of-world/Flight-MH370-No-explosion-or-crash-detected-UN-N-watchdog-says/articleshow/32233725.cms

 

Where does your thinking go if the plane is not found?

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Minty

Minty

Posted
Posted
Where does your thinking go if the plane is not found?

 

I don't know yet. I wasn't covering every eventuality, just focusing on what I think the current thinking should be... finding the aircraft. I don't know when might be an appropriate time to go beyond that, and would look to the likes of the AAIB and others to guide when search actions perhaps should be scaled back, but I would suggest it will be some time yet.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted

Another interesting piece, casting doubt on the assertion that the plane must have taken the southern arc.

 

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/03/31/mh370_search_inmarsat_data_we_re_right_where_we_were_three_weeks_ago.html

 

Even the confident assertion by the Malaysian prime minister that the northern route had been ruled out seems, on closer inspection, to be a fairly rickety claim. What Inmarsat actually said in its analysis was that if one assumed that the plane maintained a steady speed, then a straight-ahead course on the southern arc more nearly matched the ping data than a similar course to the north. But we already know that before it disappeared the plane was changing speeds and flying a zigzag course.

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted
Another interesting piece, casting doubt on the assertion that the plane must have taken the southern arc.

 

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/03/31/mh370_search_inmarsat_data_we_re_right_where_we_were_three_weeks_ago.html

 

The Malaysians are something else. For God's sake the incompetent arrogant ****s couldn't even report the final sign off with KL control correctly. They must think the whole world is stupid. The latest nonsense is we are forensically investigating who made the call. Any pilot will tell you, they can instantly recognise colleagues and friends/acquaintances when they transmit. For God's sake just ask a few mates/colleagues who have flown with them to listen to the transmissions, they will soon identify which pilot made the transmission. Forensically my arse.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
The Malaysians are something else. For God's sake the incompetent arrogant ****s couldn't even report the final sign off with KL control correctly. They must think the whole world is stupid. The latest nonsense is we are forensically investigating who made the call. Any pilot will tell you, they can instantly recognise colleagues and friends/acquaintances when they transmit. For God's sake just ask a few mates/colleagues who have flown with them to listen to the transmissions, they will soon identify which pilot made the transmission. Forensically my arse.

 

The original transcript came via Chinese sources; the Malaysians distanced themselves from its accuracy when it was leaked.

 

http://www.examiner.com/article/flight-mh370-transcript-leaked-final-54-minutes-of-flight-mh370-communication

 

That said, I think they were irresponsible when they declared that the plane had taken the southern track. The certainty was based on a lot of assumptions; they took the happy path and some serious questions will be asked if the plane is found somewhere else.

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Minty

Minty

Posted
Posted
That said, I think they were irresponsible when they declared that the plane had taken the southern track. The certainty was based on a lot of assumptions; they took the happy path and some serious questions will be asked if the plane is found somewhere else.

 

The information came from Inmarsat and was backed up by the AAIB. I don't think that's irresponsible.

 

As I said earlier, I think it's way too early for some of these judgements to be made.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
The information came from Inmarsat and was backed up by the AAIB. I don't think that's irresponsible.

 

As I said earlier, I think it's way too early for some of these judgements to be made.

 

It was irresponsible to completely rule out the northern arc on the assumption that the plane was maintaining a consistent speed. Further, they used this assumption to reach the conclusion that there were no survivors.

 

If it's too early for judgements to be made, then that's one hell of a premature judgement call.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted
It was irresponsible to completely rule out the northern arc on the assumption that the plane was maintaining a consistent speed. Further, they used this assumption to reach the conclusion that there were no survivors.

 

If it's too early for judgements to be made, then that's one hell of a premature judgement call.

 

 

It's nothing to do with the aircraft's speed really. The Inmarsat satellite in question moves about very slightly rather than be completely geostationary. Comparison of these movements and Doppler effects from the "pings" correspond more to moving south rather than north. When compared to other aircraft moving south they are similar, when compared to other aircraft moving north they are at variance. Thus the aircraft must have been moving south, that's all you can tell from the Doppler comparisons. What I might feel inclined to question is the arc that they've established because that is based on basic trigonometry and would only be correct if the aircraft maintained a constant speed and course. Think they're looking far too far south myself, mind you the 20000 million tons of junk in the Indian Ocean really doesn't help.

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Minty

Minty

Posted
Posted
It was irresponsible to completely rule out the northern arc on the assumption that the plane was maintaining a consistent speed. Further, they used this assumption to reach the conclusion that there were no survivors.

 

If it's too early for judgements to be made, then that's one hell of a premature judgement call.

 

So take that up with the AAIB. That's my point. The Malaysians are clearly getting a lot of advice and information, and I'm not for one minute saying they're doing a fantastic job, but I would not be so quick to condemn. Given the reputation of the AAIB, I think most countries would've acted similarly given such information.

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pap

pap

Posted
Posted
It's nothing to do with the aircraft's speed really. The Inmarsat satellite in question moves about very slightly rather than be completely geostationary. Comparison of these movements and Doppler effects from the "pings" correspond more to moving south rather than north. When compared to other aircraft moving south they are similar, when compared to other aircraft moving north they are at variance. Thus the aircraft must have been moving south, that's all you can tell from the Doppler comparisons. What I might feel inclined to question is the arc that they've established because that is based on basic trigonometry and would only be correct if the aircraft maintained a constant speed and course. Think they're looking far too far south myself, mind you the 20000 million tons of junk in the Indian Ocean really doesn't help.

 

Posted this quote earlier:-

 

Even the confident assertion by the Malaysian prime minister that the northern route had been ruled out seems, on closer inspection, to be a fairly rickety claim. What Inmarsat actually said in its analysis was that if one assumed that the plane maintained a steady speed, then a straight-ahead course on the southern arc more nearly matched the ping data than a similar course to the north. But we already know that before it disappeared the plane was changing speeds and flying a zigzag course.

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buctootim

buctootim

Posted
Posted

The mystery of flight 370 actually puts a mirror up to us and our beliefs. Many people rail against intrusive government and the nanny state - yet when some natural disaster, like floods, happens or a man made one like this - there is lots of outrage and feeling the government should have known more, done more, protected us more.

 

I sometimes think we've all become like the unthinking blimps carried around a spaceship in the film Wall-E. Wanting to never to have to face bad events or be self reliant.

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Window Cleaner

Window Cleaner

Posted
Posted (edited)
Being inquisitive, is it possible that the plane turned right from its origional flight path and is somewhere in the south china, banda seas or even in the pacific

 

 

No because Thai military radar tracked an (unknown) aircraft from MH370s last known position heading SW. In theory they tracked it until it disappeared from their screens until 02.40 local time, ie they watched it pass over for over an hour. It is well possible that the Thai have some sort of OTH radar network that they don't want to own up about. Malaysian military radar also tracked an unknown and unidentified aircraft along a similar heading up until about 02.14 local time. So unless there were 2 unidentified aircraft swanning about in that zone on that night the plane didn't go out over the Pacific or China sea

Edited by Window Cleaner
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