Golden Balls Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Should I pay? I got a ticket at West Quay retail park for parking 15 minutes too long. £40 if I pay within 2 weeks, £70 if I take longer. Then various other late charges the longer I leave it. According to advice from a google search and a couple of friends I should just ignore it. Does that really work? Apparently it's essentially an invoice as it's not issued by the council or police. Therefore I they did decide to go to court it's civil not criminal. Seems pretty unlikely they'll even do that and but ether just send through threatening and intimidating letters. Any advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Only if it is council run, otherwise it is just an invoice and you don'e have to pay it. Loads of decent info on this kind of stuff on dedicated forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Balls Posted 3 February, 2014 Author Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Just seen something that said if I send them a cheque for the amount it would have cost me to park there for that time, that they'll usually accept that and forget about it. Would cost me about 60p. I just have to be clear that I'm not admitting to the "offence". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUS Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Just seen something that said if I send them a cheque for the amount it would have cost me to park there for that time, that they'll usually accept that and forget about it. Would cost me about 60p. I just have to be clear that I'm not admitting to the "offence". Do NOT do this ... the whole premise for the "invoice" being unenforceable is that they cannot prove who was driving/parking the vehicle, only that the vehicle itself was there. If you do this, you are basically saying "Hiya, yeah it was me that parked there". Just ignore it, ignore any follow up letters and I can assure you they will not both trying to take civil action in court. Totally not worth their time. The numerous people who do pay these "fines" offset those who don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COMEONYOUREDS Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Should I pay? I got a ticket at West Quay retail park for parking 15 minutes too long. £40 if I pay within 2 weeks, £70 if I take longer. Then various other late charges the longer I leave it. According to advice from a google search and a couple of friends I should just ignore it. Does that really work? Apparently it's essentially an invoice as it's not issued by the council or police. Therefore I they did decide to go to court it's civil not criminal. Seems pretty unlikely they'll even do that and but ether just send through threatening and intimidating letters. Any advice? write a polite letter telling them to f*** off or ignore it, they will either respond telling you its cancelled or eventually leave you alone, there's nothing they can do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu0x Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 If you want to go down the non compliance route, then ignore it. Don't send them a cheque, don't tell them to do one. The idea is to make it not worth their time and money to chase you. If you respond, they will always then respond back, you are creating a dialogue that you don't want any part of so it's a self defeating strategy. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 If you want to go down the non compliance route, then ignore it. Don't send them a cheque, don't tell them to do one. The idea is to make it not worth their time and money to chase you. If you respond, they will always then respond back, you are creating a dialogue that you don't want any part of so it's a self defeating strategy. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk Exactly. Until you respond they dont even know they have the correct address Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 I did this. I got a ticket for parking on Town Quay a few years back. It was from some firm and they kept sending me threatening letters. Just ignore them. Do NOT phone them or even speak to them Do not acknowledge that YOU were the one that parked the car. Just dont get into any dialogue with them at all They kept sending threatening letters with court summons etc. it went away From what I gather, the only have to pay the council and/or the police with regards to parking fines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsdinho Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 If you want to go down the non compliance route, then ignore it. Don't send them a cheque, don't tell them to do one. The idea is to make it not worth their time and money to chase you. If you respond, they will always then respond back, you are creating a dialogue that you don't want any part of so it's a self defeating strategy. Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk This. Deny everything.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGZrdh0fJyU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Yeah don't even speak with them, ignore them like BS on a Cortese thread or Alps after a defeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Balls Posted 3 February, 2014 Author Share Posted 3 February, 2014 I'll ignore it then. Apparently after 84 days they will start with the court action. Doesn't seem right that it's so easy to not pay and they rely on intimidating people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Agree with all the above, ignore it they can only enforce it through civil action and it is an extremly rare event for them to do so. It might just be worth researching the record of the firm who run the car park to see if they do have a record of litigation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecuk268 Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 I believe that the law has recently changed in so far as, if the driver is not identified, the legal owner becomes liable. This applies to speed cameras as well as car parks. They may say in their letters that failing to pay will affect your credit rating. This is only true if they get a CCJ and you still don't pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php? Try this forum, I got of a speeding charge with their help. Even had people drafting letters on there and got some great advise. I believe they do parking as well as speeding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holepuncture Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Technically, the TV license is unenforceable too, so long as you leave a small sticker on your door 'revoking all implied access' or something to that legalese. Once you have this sign, no license inspector can come in, ever, unless you open the door and offer them a right of access, which would be silly. A similar thing applies to your water bills, there is legislation in place meaning a water company cannot ever turn off water to a domestic property. Debt collection companies will be writing to you for the rest if your days however, but nothing more than that. Ive even seen claims that: no offiicer of the court can forcably remove a mortgage holder/defaulter from their property, and that if anyone in the property peacefully resists any approach from a court appointed officer, then it cannot proceed due to some evictions legislation from the 70's. Any resistance from the peaceful resistance by court officer amounts to tresspass, harrassment etc and is then technically in contempt of court! Again, it is a civil matter not criminal, no idea how this kind of action really plays out in reality, though I find it very interesting. I certainly wouldnt pay for that parking ticket! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essruu Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Ignore it. I've had 2 at Fleet Services and 1 from Homebase in Bath. Do not acknowledge, do not reply. You'll get further letters, maybe photos of your vehicle, threats of debt collectors, court summons, credit blacklists, etc. - but they eventually dry up and go away. They rely upon people bottling it and paying up. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toomer Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Many years ago I got a parking ticket sent in a cheque but forgot to sign it they sent it back asking me to sign ignored the letter and did not hear another thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Invoice them for storing their ticket. Say you have a sign up in your car saying any unauthorised parking or tickets on your windscreen has a flat fee of £60 then a further £30 per day for storage or the ticket until collection is made. This is basically what they are doing with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu0x Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Technically, the TV license is unenforceable too, so long as you leave a small sticker on your door 'revoking all implied access' or something to that legalese. Once you have this sign, no license inspector can come in, ever, unless you open the door and offer them a right of access, which would be silly. Utter nonsense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Well you say that but.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocknrollman no2 Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 This happened to my wife,in the same place about a year ago. As it was on private land,she didnt pay the fine,despite warnings.Eventually the parking company said pay half and we will call it quits,although she didnt even do this.Apparantly it costs far too much to take it to court,so they never bother. Nothing ever happened.So my advice is ignore it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ant Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Utter nonsense Not at all. TV Licence inspectors have no right to enter your property without a police warrant, for which they would have to gather evidence of you watching live broadcasts without a licence. Quite a complex matter in itself. If you write to TV Licensing informing them that you wish to revoke their implied right of access, inspectors will not be allowed to set foot any further than where your property meets the street. As for the parking invoice (it's not a 'fine' unless a criminal matter, as mentioned above) - ignoring it is absolutely the best course of action. Not sure if West Quay does, but many private car parks use Parking Eye technology (it'll be on the invoice if they do). They're absolute shysters and do not go through with the implied court action in 99.9% of cases. When they do, they invariably lose. It's my understanding that the DVLA sells registered driver details to these companies (and made circa £10m last year doing so). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 3 February, 2014 Share Posted 3 February, 2014 Well you say that but.... I love 2:23. He neatly closes the gate despite there being no wall or fence to the tip of a house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Balls Posted 4 February, 2014 Author Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Not at all. TV Licence inspectors have no right to enter your property without a police warrant, for which they would have to gather evidence of you watching live broadcasts without a licence. Quite a complex matter in itself. If you write to TV Licensing informing them that you wish to revoke their implied right of access, inspectors will not be allowed to set foot any further than where your property meets the street. As for the parking invoice (it's not a 'fine' unless a criminal matter, as mentioned above) - ignoring it is absolutely the best course of action. Not sure if West Quay does, but many private car parks use Parking Eye technology (it'll be on the invoice if they do). They're absolute shysters and do not go through with the implied court action in 99.9% of cases. When they do, they invariably lose. It's my understanding that the DVLA sells registered driver details to these companies (and made circa £10m last year doing so). West Quay retail park do not use parking eye. They're a company called 'Britannia Parking'. However I have been done by Parking Eye before. Was picking someone up from a hotel in Bournemouth and as I didn't register my car at reception I got a fine. Annoyingly I had a company car at the time so £100 came straight out of my wages. I challenged it explaining I was there for no more than 2 minutes and just pulled up to pick someone up. Amazingly they refunded me without even responding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Since the 1 October 2012. Ticketing companies no longer have to prove who was driving the car. It simply comes down to the owner to state who was driving. If the registered owner does not declare who was driving then they commit the offence. But you could just give the name and address of someone who lives abroad (or made up). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essruu Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Since the 1 October 2012. Ticketing companies no longer have to prove who was driving the car. It simply comes down to the owner to state who was driving. If the registered owner does not declare who was driving then they commit the offence. All three of my 'invoices' were from after 1 Oct 2012, and each threat included the 'new regulations'. It just helps them scare more people into paying up because they think the law is now fully supportive of the parking bandits. I've just ignored every single letter and entered into no correspondence at all. The letters dry up - they're probably too busy writing to the pussies who pay up after one or two threatening letters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Then the police would probably take you down the lines of allowing a person to drive your vehicle with no licence or insurance. How could they prove that? They'd need to demonstrate the person they cant find has no insurance - even then Im not sure its even an offence for you to lend a car, its the drivers responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 You are correct in that most of these operators do not follow through. But if they did then you will end up having to pay as it falls downs to the registered keepers responsibility even if they were not driving. Isn't there some condition that the 'fine' has to be commensurate with the cost/damage that they have incurred? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 I got two tickets a minute a part in Pisa, I was driving down this street following other cars as I thought it was the flow of traffic. (Never driven before in italy and only had the hire car for about an hour,) I had not realised that only permit holders can go down that street I queried the validity of the ticket when I got the tickets some three months later, i got a threat from the italian courts but never responded have not heard a word since, that was three years ago Mind you I did have ahorses head in my bed when I got home last year Maybe this is the reason NC left saints. Non payment of a road traffic fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 The thing is , I would like to go back to italy for a hoilday Im worried they will arrest me as soon as I step into the terminal building on which ever airport I went to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 The thing is , I would like to go back to italy for a hoilday Im worried they will arrest me as soon as I step into the terminal building on which ever airport I went to Only if you get caught smoking in the loo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 You are correct in that most of these operators do not follow through. But if they did then you will end up having to pay as it falls downs to the registered keepers responsibility even if they were not driving. Not true. The " who was driving" question is irrelevant. The amount claimed is almost certainly unenforceable regardless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Super Saint Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Not true. The " who was driving" question is irrelevant. The amount claimed is almost certainly unenforceable regardless. I'd even go so far as to question the post! Do they send recorded delivery or 'signed for'? Nope, not a chance as that will increase their costs. Ignore the letters, throw them away after having had a good laugh at them. In the incredibly unlikely event that they ever take anyone to court, deny receiving any letters at all. Proof of postage is not proof of delivery so blame it all on the postie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu0x Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 Not at all. TV Licence inspectors have no right to enter your property without a police warrant, for which they would have to gather evidence of you watching live broadcasts without a licence. Quite a complex matter in itself. If you write to TV Licensing informing them that you wish to revoke their implied right of access, inspectors will not be allowed to set foot any further than where your property meets the street. Firstly, there is no implied right of access in the first place, it doesn't matter what you write in a letter, so there's no point revoking it. This is armchair lawyer guff. Secondly, warrants are issued by the courts, not the police. If they are serious they will probably attend with a warrant in the first place. The important point is, it likely won't have a power of entry attached, because the courts don't like to issue a power of entry warrant until entry has been refused or frustrated. So if you tell them they can't come in, and (again) they were serious enough in the first place, they will just go back to court and get a power of entry attached. And this time they'll probably come back with the old bill. The point is (and ironically enough bringing us back on topic) TV Licensing essentially use the same tactics that the private parking firms do - they issue vaguely legal and vaguely threatening missives in the hope that you'll comply. It's a question of least effort for most reward. It is a perfectly viable tactic when dealing with them to make it as time consuming as possible to chase you, on the likelihood that they will give up. But, the difference with private parking companies is that TV Licensing *do* have a legal basis of claim. So they can, if they want to enough, make good on their words, and go and get a warrant and force entry to your house. Will they? Probably not, unless you've been really naughty. But it's not because of some gabble about revoking an implied right of access. I have sworn out my fair share of warrants in my time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 These things are an occupational hazard to me, Ive had loads of them. Ignore, just bin them. As tempting as it is to start a row with them if you reply they will think they have 'hooked one' and will keep on a bit longer. If, and its a huge if. they did actually take you to court they would have to prove that you parking there has cost them what they are trying to claim. Not a hope in hell. Each letter comes from the next desk along the office, it never sees a solicitor as that would cost money. The lettes will go something like YOu owe us You owe us, but we will reduce it a bit of you pay now You haven't paid You still haven't paid, were telling our 'solicitor' I'm a solicitor, pay up Pay up or else OK, we'll drop the court action if you just pay us half? ... ****s. Sadly a lot of people are taken in by the threat of debt collectors etc and just pay up, when in reality there is nothing they can legally do. I'm amazed they are allowed to function as its pure extortion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 4 February, 2014 Share Posted 4 February, 2014 I have reported parking "debt collectors" to the OFT and Trading Standards before. They are interested in malpractice and there's OFT guidance on the conduct of debt collectors. I threatened to sue one for harassment ( I still might if I get the time). They sent me a really stupid letter in response. As others have said, they send out mass- produced letters in the hope that people are intimidated into paying up. A debt collector has no legal status over and above any other person. It's a self- appointed moniker. It's ****ish work for ****s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 5 February, 2014 Share Posted 5 February, 2014 Firstly, there is no implied right of access in the first place, it doesn't matter what you write in a letter, so there's no point revoking it. This is armchair lawyer guff. Secondly, warrants are issued by the courts, not the police. If they are serious they will probably attend with a warrant in the first place. The important point is, it likely won't have a power of entry attached, because the courts don't like to issue a power of entry warrant until entry has been refused or frustrated. So if you tell them they can't come in, and (again) they were serious enough in the first place, they will just go back to court and get a power of entry attached. And this time they'll probably come back with the old bill. The point is (and ironically enough bringing us back on topic) TV Licensing essentially use the same tactics that the private parking firms do - they issue vaguely legal and vaguely threatening missives in the hope that you'll comply. It's a question of least effort for most reward. It is a perfectly viable tactic when dealing with them to make it as time consuming as possible to chase you, on the likelihood that they will give up. But, the difference with private parking companies is that TV Licensing *do* have a legal basis of claim. So they can, if they want to enough, make good on their words, and go and get a warrant and force entry to your house. Will they? Probably not, unless you've been really naughty. But it's not because of some gabble about revoking an implied right of access. I have sworn out my fair share of warrants in my time... This. All this FOTL rubbish and 'notes on doors' is utter bollux, IF the court decides to pursue. Other than that though, put ticket in bin and have a nice day! Sent from my HTC One S using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu0x Posted 5 February, 2014 Share Posted 5 February, 2014 This. All this FOTL rubbish and 'notes on doors' is utter bollux It still bemuses me that people still think it works. I had the 'pleasure' of witnessing some cretin in full freeman-on-the-land mode in court just before Christmas. He was still jabbering about inalienable rights and legal personages when the cuffs went on. He got a 'free upgrade' from a couple of minor unpaid fines to a couple of nights in custody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 How did you get on ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 Turns out we were all wrong and he is currently doing a 5 stretch at hmp Winchester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cat Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 So the upshot of this is we can park outside West Quay all day, every day for free? Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 I only ask, as I have just recieved a ticket for parking at McDonalds at Hedge end of all places. The annoying thing is I was actually in the bloody restaurant, my manager and I have a catch up every now and then so we popped in for a coffee. I did phone the restaurant to have a bit of a moan but typically what sounded like a 15 yr old 'manager' picked up and wasnt particularly helpful. Its how do deal with it next, a large part of me wants to just pay up and make it go away but the other half of me thinks no, I was actually using the service provided !! Its slightly more complicated, the notice went of to Lex Autolease who are now sending it through to myself. Just wondered how GB got on and whether he just paid up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 Although not in Southampton, I has something similar happen to myself. I dropped a naighbours son of at a service station using a slip road, and later returned through the slip road and exited onto the motorway after filling up, it appears it clocked me coming in and not exiting until I hit the motorway 8 hours later, the limit being two hours. This is through a company called parking eye, demanding 100 pounds. No number to talk directly and no real appeal process has made me very angry, I'll refuse to pay and just bin the letters and hope it 'all goes away' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manuel Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 I wouldn't bin the letters though, keep hold just in case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjwills Posted 24 February, 2014 Share Posted 24 February, 2014 Best advice is to look at Martin Lewis website as there is a lot of advice on there on how to fight these people especially Parking eye demands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodles34 Posted 26 February, 2014 Share Posted 26 February, 2014 The thing is , I would like to go back to italy for a hoilday Im worried they will arrest me as soon as I step into the terminal building on which ever airport I went to i had the same thing in Portugal years ago, didnt pay etc. and finally went back, expecting to be arrested on arrival leaving the wife and kids at the airport. But it was fine, though i reckon if you got pulled over by the local police it might pop up then, but not on your passport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyinthesky Posted 1 March, 2014 Share Posted 1 March, 2014 Although not in Southampton, I has something similar happen to myself. I dropped a naighbours son of at a service station using a slip road, and later returned through the slip road and exited onto the motorway after filling up, it appears it clocked me coming in and not exiting until I hit the motorway 8 hours later, the limit being two hours. This is through a company called parking eye, demanding 100 pounds. No number to talk directly and no real appeal process has made me very angry, I'll refuse to pay and just bin the letters and hope it 'all goes away' Same thing happened to me at Rownhams Service Station a couple of year ago. Used the slip road on the east side to access the M27 and four hours later came back on the west side slip. Cameras clocked me four hours apart although I was actually on the Service Station property for approx. 2 mins Felt I ought to explain/complain but on advice from posters on here at the time ignored the two letters and it all went away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Man Do Posted 1 March, 2014 Share Posted 1 March, 2014 Don't know if this is helpful to any one else but this site was pretty useful for me. They deal with many of the different companies such as parking eye with ideas on how to appeal and win ... Apparently. http://www.parkingcowboys.co.uk/popla/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 1 March, 2014 Share Posted 1 March, 2014 I dont think you need to do anything more than write one letter, stating that "you are in receipt of their invoice, dispute it, and decline to pay it, and that you will not enter into any further correspondence on the matter," then ignore all further correspondence from them. The mistake people make is to look at these tickets as a fine or penalty, neither of which a private company can impose. Only the police or a local authority can do so, anything dressed up to look like an official fine (Parking Charge Notice, etc..) is just a speculative invoice which you are under no legal obligation to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Balls Posted 2 March, 2014 Author Share Posted 2 March, 2014 I only ask, as I have just recieved a ticket for parking at McDonalds at Hedge end of all places. The annoying thing is I was actually in the bloody restaurant, my manager and I have a catch up every now and then so we popped in for a coffee. I did phone the restaurant to have a bit of a moan but typically what sounded like a 15 yr old 'manager' picked up and wasnt particularly helpful. Its how do deal with it next, a large part of me wants to just pay up and make it go away but the other half of me thinks no, I was actually using the service provided !! Its slightly more complicated, the notice went of to Lex Autolease who are now sending it through to myself. Just wondered how GB got on and whether he just paid up Nope. Not paid. In fact, I got a 2nd ticket from the same place the other day. Ignored both and heard nothing. If I hear anything, I'll post it on here before throwing it in the bin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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