for_heaven's_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 I agree his pass yesterday probably wasn't intended for Lallana but the fact that before he got the ball he looked up to see what possible forward pass he could make when he received it shows what he adds that others do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joneth Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Can I suggest that you watch it again and you'll find that he looks up in Lallana's direction just before the ball comes to him, he then plays it first time with spin right into Adam's path so that he does not even have to break stride ! It was as intentional as it was audacious, utterly brilliant !! Agree, just watched it back again and he knows what he's doing, its a class bit of play. Also he created the space for that goal by dropping back a touch. This pulled the fb towards him and the cb got caught between tracking Lallana and Lambert. The issue with Ramirez is that give him 10 opportunities and he will create something once. The problem is what happens the 9 times he loses the ball. Without a player like him we'll pass the ball around with 65% possession and draw 0-0 but with him we look much more vulnerable defensively but more likely to score ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 As the commentator on the TV said yesterday Davis doesn't go wide or look to create attacking positions very often, so when we have the ball in midfield as we invariably do we have to check back as often as not because there's nothing better available.Lambert used to create a fair few wide options but now he just isn't getting forward anywhere near quickly enough. Once you get Gaston moving forward all of the time then you have more options even if he loses the ball on occasions. Ideally we need to be getting 60 minutes out of him in nigh on every game. Yesterday I thought he worked hard and tracked back as well as would seem to prove couple of very iffy clearances from the edges of our own box. Obviously something he's not used to doing yet but I'm sure that he'll get there given time.. This Although when he headed that ball accross our own box I had to question whether he has ever been taught how to defend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 When fit, this should be our team. ----------Boruc Clyne Fonte Lovren Shaw ---Wanyama Morgan --J rod Gaston Lallana ---------Osvaldo Totally and utterly agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintSteve Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 No mush, if you believe Ramirez meant that pass you are smoking crack. if Ramirez is your idea of "champagne football" then you are easily pleased, but football is about opinions. You rate and admire Ramirez, I dont see how but thats your opinon, I think for what he has given is a waste of money and time, 1 goal and an assist does not make him a cracking buy, he took Cork off and put on a more attacking player, it worked out but that does not make him a tactical genius, we were at home to a poor side. How on earth do you know Ramirez was not looking for Lallana.. you really are pathetic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 How on earth do you know Ramirez was not looking for Lallana.. you really are pathetic. Of course he meant it, it was obvious from where I was sitting. But if you think he's rubbish then you wouldn't give him credit for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Anyone who doesn't watch it and understand that GR looks and picked out AL is an utter tool. I thought he did and the time but when you see it on the TV it's obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katalinic Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Anyone who doesn't watch it and understand that GR looks and picked out AL is an utter tool. I thought he did and the time but when you see it on the TV it's obvious. Yep, clearly looks up and sees exactly where AL is. Great vision and execution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brussels Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 When fit, this should be our team. ----------Boruc Clyne Fonte Lovren Shaw ---Wanyama Morgan --J rod Gaston Lallana ---------Osvaldo Fully agree. My choice 100% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 When fit, this should be our team. ----------Boruc Clyne Fonte Lovren Shaw ---Wanyama Morgan --J rod Gaston Lallana ---------Osvaldo Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Anyone who doesn't watch it and understand that GR looks and picked out AL is an utter tool. I thought he did and the time but when you see it on the TV it's obvious. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 How on earth do you know Ramirez was not looking for Lallana.. you really are pathetic. Agendas!! And a childish inability to give credit when due,people like him/her are unable to admit they are wrong but we all know that they are in the majority of their posting anyway....all in all a bit sad.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 How on earth do you know Ramirez was not looking for Lallana.. you really are pathetic. He'd look even more "pathetic" if he didn't get any bites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALWAYS_SFC Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 He'd look even more "pathetic" if he didn't get any bites Maybe, but it is our duty to inform the loons of just how loony they are, we do it for the phew so it is only fair to do the same for our own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 (edited) Maybe, but it is our duty to inform the loons of just how loony they are, we do it for the phew so it is only fair to do the same for our own The difference between Pompey's "loons" and ours is that the Pompey ones don't realise how looney they sound... (That's assuming 'ours' aren't Pompey "loons" in disguise of course...) Edited 12 January, 2014 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintSteve Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 He'd look even more "pathetic" if he didn't get any bites Agreed.. but real Saints fans have been brought up to appreciate players with something different in their overall contribution to the game. Whatever his faults, Ramirez can make a pass and take 3/4 players out of the equation.. I think he's going to be top drawer, even if it means he moves on from us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Dont think anyone has ever questioned the guys ability....... Just his attitude and desire And hairstyle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Tony Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Last weekend against Burnley I thought he was good. Sure, he lost the ball a few times but made some good runs and was looking to make things happen. Most importantly, he looked more committed and was working harder, like he actually gave a **** for a change. Maybe, just maybe, it's not the end for him at Saints Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for_heaven's_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 I think the only doubt there could be is that he looked up at and then tried to pass to Lambert rather than Lallana, which would be quite hard to prove either way. The point is he made a good forward pass that few of our other players would even attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 This whole discussion about whether Gaston meant the pass for AL or not completely missed the point. And it also shows complete misunderstanding of how modern football works. Ramirez didn't even need to look to the are where he wanted to pass (and that he did just adds to his game), because much of the plays that occur on the field, even in open play have been discussed and practiced before in training during the week (and maybe even in pre-season). So, maybe he wasn't expecting AL to be there, more likely J-Rod or SRL, but still he had a look (because he had a second to do it) and his pass was great. Of course AL also deserves credit for his finish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintSteve Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 When fit, this should be our team. ----------Boruc Clyne Fonte Lovren Shaw ---Wanyama Morgan --J rod Gaston Lallana ---------Osvaldo A lot of posters on here are showing somewhat blind faith in Osvaldo.. has done little to warrant a starting place as yet.. hopefully he will integrate by start of next season but I think Osvaldo/Lambert will share the lone striker role this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazza Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 The jury's still out on Gaston for me. I don't think he's done enough to warrant a starting place. Decent option off the bench if we're looking for a goal though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 A lot of posters on here are showing somewhat blind faith in Osvaldo.. has done little to warrant a starting place as yet.. hopefully he will integrate by start of next season but I think Osvaldo/Lambert will share the lone striker role this season I haven't seen much evidence that Osvaldo can hold the ball up or bring others into play like Lambert does (who incidentally plays plenty of forward balls that if Gaston had played them people would be raving about...) I think Osvaldo would be better of used like Jrod rather than being a replacement for Lambert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 The jury's still out on Gaston for me. I don't think he's done enough to warrant a starting place. Decent option off the bench if we're looking for a goal though. Pretty much this. He provided the attacking flair we were crying out for yesterday in creating the goal but his all round play still needs to improve IMO, he's too often unnecessarily wasteful in possession or when making what should be simple passes. I don't mind it when a flair player sometimes loses the ball by trying something audacious, but Gaston loses the ball too often just trying run of the mill things, or holding on to it for too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Of course he meant it, it was obvious from where I was sitting. But if you think he's rubbish then you wouldn't give him credit for anything. Exactly. He looked up atleast twice for that pass and made it, maybe he got a bit lucky but personally I think he meant it. Him and Lallana are our real creative elements along with J Rod with his direct running (not as creative from a passing sense just a destructive sense) I also think he is starting to work harder, as I said before happy to give him 6 months and right now happy to have him in the side. Obviously some just have agendas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 That logic only applies to him and not Ramirez? Johnson plays every game for Sunderland is still looks ****e. Gaston doesn't start regularly, which is what he needs to keep improving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pimpin4rizeal Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 I ve always been one of the biggest supporters of ramirez but i dont just see it as he as somehow amazingly improved,its more a case of mp and others.seeming to be blind to what he offers, hes always been a creative player. And will always create more chances then the likes of cork davis and rodriguez, nice to see a few waking up and smelling the coffee especially our manager! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 I was really excited when we signed Ramirez. But although he has had a few moments of flair and brilliance, he has obviously - in aggregate - disappointed over his first 17 months or so. But, his recent form really is encouraging. He was very good yesterday. I also think a number of weaknesses in his game can be ironed out - e.g. he seems to just about be starting to understand that he has less time on the ball than he was used to in Italy. I'd say it wouldn't take a great deal more improvement for him to replace Steve Davis in the starting XI, at least at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Lost count of the number of times Gaston has cut inside and attempted a reverse pass and it not come off - good to see something similar work for once. Jury still out but want to see him with Osvaldo. Hopefully the return of Vic will embolden MP to go with Ramirez over Davis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Durman Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 This is the exact ramblings of someone who doesn't understand the game. When Ramirez got the ball, from I think Clyne, he could just have tapped it back to Clyne, kept possession, and shifted responsibility. Instead he tried to actually create a goalscoring chance. It worked. Many times it won't work otherwise we would score 10 + each time he plays. Luckily he keeps trying these kind of things because as today showed, it can make the difference. Hopefully in the next game when he tries something like that again the fans will cut him some slack. His role in the team is to unlock defenses and he is quite good at it (when given a chance, both my the Manager and the fans). Yes he was the difference because he found a way to unlock the defense & yes he really did try, but he also lost the ball quite a few times, which added to the squeaky bum time at the end of the game. A great talent, but he must keep hold of the ball better. The way we play it exposes us as we push so many players forward. Lambert was also guilty of losing the ball a few times at the end Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 talk about 'new signings' no doubt andy f00king carroll will cause havoc when we play them Isn't he meant to be absolutely terrible Jamie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 Isn't he meant to be absolutely terrible Jamie? yeah, he is not as good as people make out in the media but he will no doubt show lambert up (like he did at SMS last season when he came back from injury) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 People will never be happy. We play keep ball players like Cork, Davis etc who are tidy and keep possession. "We're slow and toothless". We play a playmaker, who looks to thread it through, or make something happen (aka not always the easy ball) like Gaston and he gets lambasted for losing the ball. Obviously I'm being a bit reductionist about it, but that's kind of the point. He was good yesterday, had something like a 94% pass completion rate, think he only got tackled once and made a goal. He hasn't lived up to the hype yet, true, but criticising him for yesterday is silly. Personally I hope he stays and comes good. Recent performances have been encouraging. But the jury is still out whether he can fit long term. I'm with Le Goddard above, would really like to see Gaston and Ossie given a run of games. Preferably when Big Vic is fit again, as he will give the extra protection in front of the defence - as I think we may sacrifice possession % to some extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dronskisaint Posted 12 January, 2014 Share Posted 12 January, 2014 No mush, if you believe Ramirez meant that pass you are smoking crack. if Ramirez is your idea of "champagne football" then you are easily pleased, but football is about opinions. You rate and admire Ramirez, I dont see how but thats your opinon, I think for what he has given is a waste of money and time, 1 goal and an assist does not make him a cracking buy, he took Cork off and put on a more attacking player, it worked out but that does not make him a tactical genius, we were at home to a poor side. Obviously a post from someone who doesn't go to games - not ours anyway! He tries that sort of thing regularly and when it comes off it makes the difference, he'll be a class player for us as long as we keep playing to his strengths which I understand to be the 'Southampton way' and developing the squad with players of his class - whether brought through or bought. Yesterday MP saw the need for his creativity over Cork (who aside from a couple of loose passes played very well) and it paid off..it won't every time but great to be able to call on that kind of class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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