EastleighSoulBoy Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 It doesn't mater whether you post as dune, cheese on toast or whatever you are still the same tiresome bore. I think that Stanley was his most open incarnation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Only another 4 defeats in a row to go then... Oh no my comedic genius chum, he does that before it happens, lose at Cardiff and the finger might be on the trigger.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Oh no trousers, he does that before it happens, lose at Cardiff and the finger might be on the trigger.... even Nc would have to take our injury crisis into consideration I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 (edited) Oh no trousers, he does that before it happens, lose at Cardiff and the finger might be on the trigger.... I'm rushing down to the bookies as we speak. P.s. Splendid update to your post. I don't think anyone will notice you didn't think of that amusing refrain straight away Edited 23 December, 2013 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 I'm rushing down to the bookies as we speak. Just going by what out leader has said in the past, it's not looking good for MP at the moment based on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 even Nc would have to take our injury crisis into consideration I think. Cold, ruthless, does everything in order to progress........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Cold, ruthless, does everything in order to progress........ except get us a decent reserve keeper last summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 so happy clappers are the negative ones and you who believe we are big ,and believe we should be doing better is not a clapper!! Cant work that one out. Yes the clappers are delusional as to our size and the goals that have been set by Cortese with such expenditure, the only comeback is Everton but they had a better squad to start with, got superb loans that we should have gone for and obviously a better manager as it stands. The table does not lie and neither do results, Cortese will not be happy but he is naive, our first XI is top 8-10 but our squad is far far lower than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Just going by what out leader has said in the past, it's not looking good for MP at the moment based on that. Ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Yes the clappers are delusional as to our size and the goals that have been set by Cortese with such expenditure, the only comeback is Everton but they had a better squad to start with, got superb loans that we should have gone for and obviously a better manager as it stands. The table does not lie and neither do results, Cortese will not be happy but he is naive, our first XI is top 8-10 but our squad is far far lower than that. According to some of the clappers it was good enough for 6th before we signed Lovren, Wanyama and Osvaldo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Ok. So are you suggesting Cortese is a liar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 So are you suggesting Cortese is a liar? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 According to some of the clappers it was good enough for 6th before we signed Lovren, Wanyama and Osvaldo. The clappers use their heart over head and football knowledge of others sides and squads, the top 7/8 clubs will never be caught really,a few up and down years but they basically remain, they always have done and always will, Cortese was selling fools gold or he is completely naive if he thinks you can go on a consistent European tour on good young players (if they are good they will leave) and spending a couple of million. Sad news but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Am I alone in thinking Cork was quite poor? Gave the ball away a lot, including for their second goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Cold, ruthless, does everything in order to progress........ The one thing you can say about Cortese is that he isn't prone to knee-jerk decisions, everything is thought out and pre-planned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Am I alone in thinking Cork was quite poor? Gave the ball away a lot, including for their second goal. No you're not. He had a bad 10 minute spell before their second goal. Gaston was good I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 The one thing you can say about Cortese is that he isn't prone to knee-jerk decisions, everything is thought out and pre-planned. Indeed. Like I said, given his claim that he didn't wait for 5 defeats in a row to happen before sacking a manger when defending Adkins dismissal you have to wonder if 4 defeats in 6 has made him preplan something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Am I alone in thinking Cork was quite poor? Gave the ball away a lot, including for their second goal. I agree. He seemed to win the ball and lose it in equal measures. Some of his passing was woeful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Tony Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 It's been highlighted by a few of us already, but we are still way, way off getting to the 'next level', and for anyone who can't see that it was made painfully obvious yesterday. Until we sign another 4/5 players like Lovren, Wanyama etc. it will be nearly impossible to break into the top 6/7. The transfer window has suddenly become a lot more important than it was a month ago Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 (edited) It's been highlighted by a few of us already, but we are still way, way off getting to the 'next level', and for anyone who can't see that it was made painfully obvious yesterday. Until we sign another 4/5 players like Lovren, Wanyama etc. it will be nearly impossible to break into the top 6/7. The transfer window has suddenly become a lot more important than it was a month ago[/ N/t Edited 23 December, 2013 by Turkish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 It's been highlighted by a few of us already, but we are still way, way off getting to the 'next level', and for anyone who can't see that it was made painfully obvious yesterday. Until we sign another 4/5 players like Lovren, Wanyama etc. it will be nearly impossible to break into the top 6/7. The transfer window has suddenly become a lot more important than it was a month ago Yep, as a few of the 'trolls' have long said, our first XI will give anyone a good game, but beneath that there really isn't much. You need 18-20 players good enough to be first XI to compete for a top 6 spot over a season. For us to even have a chance of a finish In the top 6 at the moment, which some said was good enough last season,you'd need all XI players to stay fit and inform for the entire season, never going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captainchris Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 It's been highlighted by a few of us already, but we are still way, way off getting to the 'next level', and for anyone who can't see that it was made painfully obvious yesterday. Until we sign another 4/5 players like Lovren, Wanyama etc. it will be nearly impossible to break into the top 6/7. The transfer window has suddenly become a lot more important than it was a month ago Yes but Poch is saying we won't be buying as we don't need anyone new? Seriously concerned that Poch continually picks players who plainly are a million miles away the standard required. Persistent personnel choice aberrations by him are basic errors. In addition these positions were well know to all fans as weaknesses that should have been strengthened and werent at the start of the season which is a glaring miscalculation..... After seeIng the team sheet yesterday, to a man, fans in our group predicted axactly what the outcome would be including a jos own goal ! We even had the debacle of our own fans betting on Totenham to win once the team sheet was announced. The 'Team' has a long way to go to be top six and so does Poch it would appear.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Yes but Poch is saying we won't be buying as we don't need anyone new? Seriously concerned that Poch continually picks players who plainly are a million miles away the standard required. Persistent personnel choice aberrations by him are basic errors. In addition these positions were well know to all fans as weaknesses that should have been strengthened and werent at the start of the season which is a glaring miscalculation..... After seeIng the team sheet yesterday, to a man, fans in our group predicted axactly what the outcome would be including a jos own goal ! We even had the debacle of our own fans betting on Totenham to win once the team sheet was announced. The 'Team' has a long way to go to be top six and so does Poch it would appear.... Fck me turning on him after a defeat. Yes we had a ****e defence but cannot all be levelled at MP. Problems is fans can't handle defeats and think we are world beaters and need a scapegoat. If we dominate Cardiff and get a result will it mean he is a good manager again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 I agree. He seemed to win the ball and lose it in equal measures. Some of his passing was woeful. I'm not a big Cork fan, Wanyama is superior which is why he's in the starters when fit. Morgan doesn't get forward in the same way when Cork is playing mind you don't think he's really fit either and with the left side of our defence yesterday the DM has to be a defender rather than an assistant attacker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 So we were without 5 of our first choice back 6 (if you're including Wanyama). We've now got 4 games in 10 days with these players. Sorry to drag this up again but does show, we really don't have anywhere near the depth to play our first team in the cups. Imagine yesterday's team with Lovren and Lallana injured, away at Everton... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 So we were without 5 of our first choice back 6 (if you're including Wanyama). We've now got 4 games in 10 days with these players. Sorry to drag this up again but does show, we really don't have anywhere near the depth to play our first team in the cups. Imagine yesterday's team with Lovren and Lallana injured, away at Everton... Much easier to win a squad with an overall weak squad (circa 6 games), than finish in the top 6 with an overall weak squad (38 games). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Much easier to win a squad with an overall weak squad (circa 6 games), than finish in the top 6 with an overall weak squad (38 games). That would involve resting key players in the League so they are fit for cup games. Not a strategy I think Cortese would approve of. The League has to be a priority and at the moment we don't have the depth to even maintain a challenge in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 That would involve resting key players in the League so they are fit for cup games. Not a strategy I think Cortese would approve of. The League has to be a priority and at the moment we don't have the depth to even maintain a challenge in that.[/QUOTE] Exactly, so why not try and win a cup that does not require the depth of squad that a challenge for the top 6 does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 That would involve resting key players in the League so they are fit for cup games. Not a strategy I think Cortese would approve of. The League has to be a priority and at the moment we don't have the depth to even maintain a challenge in that. Exactly, so why not try and win a cup that does not require the depth of squad that a challenge for the top 6 does? Because playing our reserves in the League will probably get us relegated and we will need a decent League finish to attract better players. I doubt Wanyama, Lovren and Osvaldo were our first choice transfer targets in summer. I suspect there were others who weren't interested in a team 14th in the League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpbury Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 After a brief burst of rationalism from Saint86 (born in 86? (maybe saw us get to the final in 2003?) or first supporting in 86?), this thread has gone back to normal. As a stream viewer (sorry dp), my view of the game wasn't that great. However, even I can see the defensive (nb with an 's'in adjectival form only) deficiencies in the 2nd string back four, as S86, and indeed Bruce Hornsby, said, that's just the way it is. Personally, I did see Gaston put effort in (wahey!), but he was so easily shoved up the ball many times. I was so pleased when we scored! We've just got to suck it up with the second team. Maybe we just bite the bullet of mid/lower table and strengthen effectively in Summer, rather than panic buy/integrate in Jan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Really? Do you think the "Don" will see it that way, after all the 5th season (2014-2015) was supposed to be our assured European footballing year, maybe he is bedding in Fox for the journey. Cortese may not see it as success, but I do. Staying in the Premiership is the be all and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Because playing our reserves in the League will probably get us relegated and we will need a decent League finish to attract better players. I doubt Wanyama, Lovren and Osvaldo were our first choice transfer targets in summer. I suspect there were others who weren't interested in a team 14th in the League. Here we go again, challenging for a cup = relegation. How on earth did we manage to finishing 8th and reach the FA cup final under Strachan with less resources and a worse team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Here we go again, challenging for a cup = relegation. How on earth did we manage to finishing 8th and reach the FA cup final under Strachan with less resources and a worse team? Ah, the Lord of the Strawmen has returned! Between the 3rd round win over Spurs and the end of the season, we managed relegation form in the League in 2003. It was our form between October and December which kept us up (we may have finished 8th but we were closer to 18th than 5th). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Here we go again, challenging for a cup = relegation. How on earth did we manage to finishing 8th and reach the FA cup final under Strachan with less resources and a worse team? James Beattie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Ah, the Lord of the Strawmen has returned! Between the 3rd round win over Spurs and the end of the season, we managed relegation form in the League in 2003. It was our form between October and December which kept us up (we may have finished 8th but we were closer to 18th than 5th). So it isn't a strawmans argument to claim that we'd be relegated if we challenge for a cup? Why didn't that happen in 2003? Why didn't hit happen to Swansea last season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Here we go again, challenging for a cup = relegation. How on earth did we manage to finishing 8th and reach the FA cup final under Strachan with less resources and a worse team? Because most teams in the league back then were equally bad or worse and we had perhaps the easiest draws ever in the cup that year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Ah, the Lord of the Strawmen has returned! Between the 3rd round win over Spurs and the end of the season, we managed relegation form in the League in 2003. It was our form between October and December which kept us up (we may have finished 8th but we were closer to 18th than 5th). 20 points in 17 games from Jan 2003, so would equate to mid 40 points in a whole season was not relegation form. Not sure you can accuse others of strawman arguments of you are coming out with that nonsense. And how many times are you going to equate cup runs with relegation? Getting tiresome Mr Gummidge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Because most teams in the league back then were equally bad or worse and we had perhaps the easiest draws ever in the cup that year? Check the team sheet for the cup final then compare it with the team that played against Millwall in the 4th round. Very strong line up v Millwall and only 3 players different to the team that beat Millwall in the 4th round replay. Even the 3 replacements were premier league players who had many games under their belts. And your first point is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 (edited) Because most teams in the league back then were equally bad or worse and we had perhaps the easiest draws ever in the cup that year? Terrible league that was, with the Arsenal invincibles into their second season, overtaken by a obviously terrible Man United team. Beckham, Ruud, Keane. Pub standard at best. Those teams and the whole division much worse than the breathtaking talent in the league these days. I mean, it was, like ages ago and stuff. Edited 23 December, 2013 by CB Fry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Because playing our reserves in the League will probably get us relegated and we will need a decent League finish to attract better players. I doubt Wanyama, Lovren and Osvaldo were our first choice transfer targets in summer. I suspect there were others who weren't interested in a team 14th in the League. SOrry, since when did playing a strong team in the cups mean having to play a side full of reserves every week? Absolute nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 20 points in 17 games from Jan 2003, so would equate to mid 40 points in a whole season was not relegation form. Not sure you can accuse others of strawman arguments of you are coming out with that nonsense. And how many times are you going to equate cup runs with relegation? Getting tiresome Mr Gummidge. I'm guessing you're including the win over Spurs on New Years Day, before the FA Cup started. After the 3rd round game, when the fixtures started to pile up we managed 17 points from 16 games. Less than 41 points extrapolated over 38 games. West Ham were relegated with 42 points. Just to clear this up: My argument - We can't play the same team in every league and cup match. Playing a weakened side in the League could get us relegated. The Turkish/Fry Strawman - Everyone who wins a cup gets relegated. Wigan FFS! FFS! Wigan Wigan FFS! FFS! FFS! etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Terrible league that was, with the Arsenal invincibles into their second season, overtaken by a obviously terrible Man United team. Pub standard at best. Those teams and the whole division much worse than the breathtaking talent in the league these days. I mean, it was, like ages ago and stuff. As I said, most teams. No billions in Man C, a very weak Spurs, Chelsea just beginning to gain pace. And if we finish 8th, than truely the fact must be that most teams were equally bad or worse since the league is more than 15 teams...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 SOrry, since when did playing a strong team in the cups mean having to play a side full of reserves every week? Absolute nonsense. So which League games do we play a weakened side in? The game before? After? Both? Or do we just play our strongest 11 in every game and replace them as they get injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 I'm guessing you're including the win over Spurs on New Years Day, before the FA Cup started. After the 3rd round game, when the fixtures started to pile up we managed 17 points from 16 games. Less than 41 points extrapolated over 38 games. West Ham were relegated with 42 points. Just to clear this up: My argument - We can't play the same team in every league and cup match. Playing a weakened side in the League could get us relegated. The Turkish/Fry Strawman - Everyone who wins a cup gets relegated. Wigan FFS! FFS! Wigan Wigan FFS! FFS! FFS! etc. We wouldn't play a weakened side in every league game. You do know to get to a cup final is only an extra 5 games a season don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Check the team sheet for the cup final then compare it with the team that played against Millwall in the 4th round. Very strong line up v Millwall and only 3 players different to the team that beat Millwall in the 4th round replay. Even the 3 replacements were premier league players who had many games under their belts. And your first point is laughable. So if we finish 8th then most teams are BETTER than us...?? And talking about lineups we can do in january when the fa cup is played perhaps since it´s not the same competition that has been discussed? Not one single person on this fourm has said that we would be relegated if we played our strongest team in the league cup. What has been said is that it is obvious (and for very good reasons) that the league cup is not a priority for the club. Does that mean we go out and lose on purpose, of course not. But the club has decided that first priority is PL and I for one support that 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 So if we finish 8th then most teams are BETTER than us...?? And talking about lineups we can do in january when the fa cup is played perhaps since it´s not the same competition that has been discussed? Not one single person on this fourm has said that we would be relegated if we played our strongest team in the league cup. What has been said is that it is obvious (and for very good reasons) that the league cup is not a priority for the club. Does that mean we go out and lose on purpose, of course not. But the club has decided that first priority is PL and I for one support that 100%. With the chance of european football now gone from our league position I do wonder if we might make a bit of an effort in the Cup this season. Burnley is a bum draw though and we'd have to play our strongest available side I think (not our full first team but some won't be fit by then) Can't see us having any new players by Sat 4th Jan so if we put out our strongest available XI it might indicate that we're going for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 We wouldn't play a weakened side in every league game. You do know to get to a cup final is only an extra 5 games a season don't you? Creative, but at no point did I say every League game. Even 5 games with the reserves is too many with such a tight and competitive League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 If anybody here suggests this years League is stronger than the Premiership of 10 years ago then they are mad, far better League then, every team had a couple of amazing players, the Premiership had its biggest pull then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Creative, but at no point did I say every League game. Even 5 games with the reserves is too many with such a tight and competitive League. So a professional footballer isn't capable of playing 43 games a season over 9 months? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 So a professional footballer isn't capable of playing 43 games a season over 9 months? Correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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