Window Cleaner Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 So why haven't the Manager and Goal keeping coach realised this before then. ?? Perhaps they're in the 'give the boy time' brigade. Doubt if he'll get any more after today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I can see us losing every game whilst he's between the sticks. Draws with Man City & Newcastle don't count then ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintbletch Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 In our 3 homes games since he has been in we've conceded 7 goals from 9 shots on target. I think that stat tells us all we need to know about his ability. Interesting stat Turkish. I was actually going to research the same stat myself as it was my sense that he just doesn't move towards the ball. He seems frozen when the ball is heading towards him. Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Draws with Man City & Newcastle don't count then ? ah right, I meant future games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 One thing IS for sure Cortese does not like booing..... Maybe he could put himself in goal at Cardiff then, probably wouldn't do much worse... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He's like the Ali Dia of goalkeeping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 (edited) He's like the Ali Dia of goalkeeping. we didn't pay nigh on 3 million quid for Ali Dia. Whatever possessed us to do that, 20 games in League 2 and then wham 3 million quid. No international caps, nothing. Think they lost most of them as well. Edited 22 December, 2013 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pangy Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I believe he should have had the first. Cathing practice. And he just stays on his line. His decision making/ starting position seems poor. I thought this when I saw it,I am not a keeper so I may be wrong but I am 99% sure Boruc would of come out and caught it. He very rarely comes off his line and if he does he is slow to it,I think his general reactions are too slow for the prem.as long as he is in goal we are at risk of conceding a few.if we dont sign a keeper in Jan I will be more shocked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
channonball Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I'd rather have Ali Dia in goal than that clown. Not good enough for Eastleigh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I thought this when I saw it,I am not a keeper so I may be wrong but I am 99% sure Boruc would of come out and caught it. He very rarely comes off his line and if he does he is slow to it,I think his general reactions are too slow for the prem.as long as he is in goal we are at risk of conceding a few.if we dont sign a keeper in Jan I will be more shocked I've looked up his record at Gillingham, conceeded loads of goals there as well, scores like 4-3 to Accrington, 5-4 Hereford, 3-3 against Bournemouth,4-3 Crewe, he was rubbish then and still is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringwood Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He makes them nervous, they don't trust him and it makes them do silly things. Look at their second goal, Gazzaniga is about a week late in going down for it because it really is a simple save for a real keeper, it hits Jos and goes in. F*cker should never have got as far as Jos. First goal Boruc would have come out and claimed and the third goal is just a comedy attempt at a stop by Gazzaniga. Our defence just cannot compensate for this clown. spot on, the look after the third when the ball came through and Lovren expected Gazza to be there and he wasn't told me everything, Lovren said nothing just shook his head, he must look at Gazza nad Jos and wonder why he signed, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Woeful. The root cause of our form IMO. Thanks I was struggling to find just the right word but you found it for me - 'woeful' sums the situation up nicely. It's rotten luck to have both your 1st and 2nd choice keepers simultaneously injured of course, but the risk of that happening is a significant one that needs to be guarded against. Therefore if we see the 3rd keeper as a kind of last resort 'insurance policy' then this particular 'policy' of ours looks unlikely to ever pay out. I see the apologists are out in force again, but unless we expect other teams to go easy on us out of a sense of sympathy for our plight then the simple truth is that it matters not a jot that he's only our 3rd choice keeper. Neither do I care very much that he's only 21 years old, what evidence is there that he has improved one iota over the last 12 months? It seems to me he's gone backwards if anything. No, if you're not good enough then you'll be found out at this level. Indeed, the Premier League has a way of mercilessly exposing any weakness in a squad - the final proof of that statement being todays woeful performance from this player ... and others I might add. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 why did this thread not appear after we drew with Man City,not sure if any club has 3 super star goalkeepers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stockbridge_saint Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I was sitting next to Boruc in the Itchen hospitality and I glared at him when Gazza let in the 2nd goal and he looked back at me and shrugged. Fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 why did this thread not appear after we drew with Man City' date='not sure if any club has 3 super star goalkeepers[/quote'] That is the only home game he's played in where the opposition haven't scored with every shot they had that was on target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 why did this thread not appear after we drew with Man City' date='not sure if any club has 3 super star goalkeepers[/quote'] Precisely, has anybody seen Mason Springthorpe play for Everton ? Or Oliver Davies for Swansea ? Admittedy the Spuds have Lloris, Gomes, and Freidel ( aged 42 ), and Norwich have Carlo Nash ( though I'm not sure how good he is likely to be at 40 ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 That is the only home game he's played in where the opposition haven't scored with every shot they had that was on target. i just do not think it is his fault, he needed to be out on loan learning his trade,the best keepers are in there 30's and have played hundreds of games, he had no chance to do anything about the last 2 goals today. Blaming a goalkeeper is an easy way out, to cover up the cracks elsewhere. Today we were out run/muscled in midfield by a side with lots of experience but the easy option is to blame the keeper who should not be in that position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 OK, he was poor again but look what he had in front of him. Jos was poor as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Let him learn elsewhere, he is a disgustingly poor keeper who's sent our season into a tail-spin singledhandedly. If you get the wrong toy for Christmas it'll be Gazzaniga's fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 22 December, 2013 Author Share Posted 22 December, 2013 why did this thread not appear after we drew with Man City' date='not sure if any club has 3 super star goalkeepers[/quote'] Discussions about him have been rife since he came back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Discussions about him have been rife since he came back i just do not think it is his fault, he needed to be out on loan learning his trade,the best keepers are in there 30's and have played hundreds of games, he had no chance to do anything about the last 2 goals today. Blaming a goalkeeper is an easy way out, to cover up the cracks elsewhere. Today we were out run/muscled in midfield by a side with lots of experience but the easy option is to blame the keeper who should not be in that position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 (edited) Discussions about him have been rife since he came back Indeed they have, we could easily have lost against City and Newcastle, Chambers saved his bacon at Toon and City squandered chances that they shouldn't have. I would actually like someone to explain to me why we paid nigh on 3 million £ for a useless lump with just 20 League 2 games to his credit. He was poor last season, he's poor this. If he had been seen as a realistic back up to Boruc he'd have been our Number 2 and played in the LC at least, he isn't and wasn't. Edited 22 December, 2013 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I´m confused that he doesn´t seem to be able to throw his body to the side on the ground, when he tries to save on the ground at any side it´s like he´s falling to a side with his legs under him rather than trying to push off and throw his body down.... (sorry for bad english) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 i just do not think it is his fault' date=' he needed to be out on loan learning his trade,the best keepers are in there 30's and have played hundreds of games, he had no chance to do anything about the last 2 goals today. Blaming a goalkeeper is an easy way out, to cover up the cracks elsewhere. Today we were out run/muscled in midfield by a side with lots of experience but the easy option is to blame the keeper who should not be in that position[/quote'] We've conceded 7 goals from 9 shots on target in the 3 homes games he's played. You can have the best defenders in the world ahead of you but if they don't trust you and you can't make saves then you have a problem. Of course not all the goals were his fault and Fox was poor and Hoolivled were shocking too but that stat tells a story. I do agree he should not be that position and needs to go out on loan but we are where we are and he simply isn't good enough at the moment and to be blunt has done little to suggest he ever will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 We've conceded 7 goals from 9 shots on target in the 3 homes games he's played. You can have the best defenders in the world ahead of you but if they don't trust you and you can't make saves then you have a problem. Of course not all the goals were his fault and Fox was poor and Hoolivled were shocking too but that stat tells a story. I do agree he should not be that position and needs to go out on loan but we are where we are and he simply isn't good enough at the moment and to be blunt has done little to suggest he ever will be. and our other options until January are ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 and our other options until January are ? And that's our biggest problem isn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaSaint Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I´m confused that he doesn´t seem to be able to throw his body to the side on the ground, when he tries to save on the ground at any side it´s like he´s falling to a side with his legs under him rather than trying to push off and throw his body down.... (sorry for bad english) I know what you're saying. To me it's all down to poor reading. He doesn't time his advance (if he makes one at all) and ends up trying to dive from a standing position. The right way is to time your advance so that you can convert your forward momentum into sideways momentum (i.e., the dive). Doing it that way extends your reach by 6-12", but I don't think anyone's telling him this stuff. Not that they should really have to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 i just do not think it is his fault' date=' he needed to be out on loan learning his trade,the best keepers are in there 30's and have played hundreds of games, he had no chance to do anything about the last 2 goals today. Blaming a goalkeeper is an easy way out, to cover up the cracks elsewhere. Today we were out run/muscled in midfield by a side with lots of experience but the easy option is to blame the keeper who should not be in that position[/quote'] I don't like picking on certain players, but the stats don't lie. He doesn't make saves, and 90% of shots go in. That kind of means we'll concede goals in every single game. That's not good enough to be honest. He's a pretty abysmal keeper, with a lack of basic attributes. We're going to have to grit our teeth for a bit, but he's to blame for our defensive record going up the ****ter - probably not his fault personally as he can't help that he's crap and totally out of his depth at this level, but the stats don't lie. It's no coincidence that we once again look horrendous at the back with him in the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crab Lungs Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 i just do not think it is his fault' date=' he needed to be out on loan learning his trade,the best keepers are in there 30's and have played hundreds of games, he had no chance to do anything about the last 2 goals today. Blaming a goalkeeper is an easy way out, to cover up the cracks elsewhere. Today we were out run/muscled in midfield by a side with lots of experience but the easy option is to blame the keeper who should not be in that position[/quote'] I don't think it matters about "learning your trade" when the base skillset you have is so low. He might become "horrendous" in future seasons, as opposed to "'kin terrible", if that's what you mean? For me, if you're not very good to start with, a few seasons down the line the chances are you're still not going to be very good. Crikey, especially if you're already THAT slow at such a young age... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graffito Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He's nowhere near ready for the PL. His decision making is poor. I trust that's down to lack of confidence and not lack of bravery. Much more experienced players let us down today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I don't think it matters about "learning your trade" when the base skillset you have is so low. He might become "horrendous" in future seasons, as opposed to "'kin terrible", if that's what you mean? For me, if you're not very good to start with, a few seasons down the line the chances are you're still not going to be very good. Crikey, especially if you're already THAT slow at such a young age... It makes you wonder what anybody ever saw in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint77 Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Worse than that probably the worst keeper in 45 years watching. Saints Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I don't like picking on certain players, but the stats don't lie. He doesn't make saves, and 90% of shots go in. That kind of means we'll concede goals in every single game. That's not good enough to be honest. He's a pretty abysmal keeper, with a lack of basic attributes. We're going to have to grit our teeth for a bit, but he's to blame for our defensive record going up the ****ter - probably not his fault personally as he can't help that he's crap and totally out of his depth at this level, but the stats don't lie. It's no coincidence that we once again look horrendous at the back with him in the side. and what other club could lose top 2 keepers and still perform to the same standard, i am not saying he is any good but feel it is entirely wrong to blame him.Also our defensive record has gone to pot since Jos returned, the Newcastle goal was down to his miss kick, and Victor stopped protecting the back 4 with real muscle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manji Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Let him learn elsewhere, he is a disgustingly poor keeper who's sent our season into a tail-spin singledhandedly. Ridiculously infantile comment. You're the type of guy whose too stupid to look at the bigger picture (injuries,tough games etc) that you need an easy scapegoat to rationalise whats going on. Thick as two short planks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 I know what you're saying. To me it's all down to poor reading. He doesn't time his advance (if he makes one at all) and ends up trying to dive from a standing position. The right way is to time your advance so that you can convert your forward momentum into sideways momentum (i.e., the dive). Doing it that way extends your reach by 6-12", but I don't think anyone's telling him this stuff. Not that they should really have to. Shouldn't to be taught that. Should have the natural ability to do that. Something, that sadly, he lacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Has he actually ever made a save? Anything on target appears to just go in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Ridiculously infantile comment. You're the type of guy whose too stupid to look at the bigger picture (injuries,tough games etc) that you need an easy scapegoat to rationalise whats going on. Thick as two short planks. Hmm, you may very well have a point but perhaps you could have put it a little less unpleasantly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Alert Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 We have given him time here now, given him games to prove himself and he has been worse than poor. First goal like it or not he should be catching that. It was in his 6 yard box ffs catch it! We really do need someone in January, I am not expecting a world beater to come he and sit on the bench, but is cover that is at least adequate too much to ask? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 and what other club could lose top 2 keepers and still perform to the same standard' date=' i am not saying he is any good but feel it is entirely wrong to blame him.Also our defensive record has gone to pot since Jos returned, the Newcastle goal was down to his miss kick, and Victor stopped protecting the back 4 with real muscle[/quote'] Yoshida and Lovern played against villa. They scored 3 that night, also from every shot they had on target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW11_Saint Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He is simply not up to it. Whether he ever will be is uncertain, but we can't continue to gamble with him in the first team. V short term I would give Cody Cropper a go. He can't be any worse surely? I seriously think we need to throw some money down in Jan on a decent keeper (poss Begovic if he'd come). All three of our current choices are flawed. We have gone too long without a truly top notch keeper. Time to act Mr. Cortese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cambsaint Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He had a very poor game; but does this vicious criticism -and I use the word vicious meaningfully, really do anything other than undermine what little confidence he has left. Remember that he's probably our best option until we can buy in Jan or Boruc back from injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He had a very poor game; but does this vicious criticism -and I use the word vicious meaningfully, really do anything other than undermine what little confidence he has left. Remember that he's probably our best option until we can buy in Jan or Boruc back from injury. Here is the place to criticise. Here and on pubs. At the ground getting on players backs during games is not and something I've never understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shirleysfc Posted 22 December, 2013 Share Posted 22 December, 2013 Here is the place to criticise. Here and on pubs. At the ground getting on players backs during games is not and something I've never understood. He's getting a load of abuse on Twitter as well, that will help with his confidence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 22 December, 2013 Author Share Posted 22 December, 2013 He's getting a load of abuse on Twitter as well, that will help with his confidence Best not go on twitter really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Yoshida and Lovern played against villa. They scored 3 that night, also from every shot they had on target. thing is when you look at the goals conceded other than spuds first one i am struggling to think of one that he should have saved, still nothing has changed in 54 years of support if saints concede goals it is the keepers fault and the other 10,we defend from the front routine, are being let down by the keeper. imo individual defensive errors are leaving him exposed at the moment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Worse than that probably the worst keeper in 45 years watching. Saints Worse than Dave McLaren ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Perhaps they're in the 'give the boy time' brigade. Doubt if he'll get any more after today. nothing to do with him being Argentine, d'you think ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 Worse than Dave McLaren ? Thanks for mentioning him, I had only just this week stopped having nightmares about him! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 23 December, 2013 Share Posted 23 December, 2013 nothing to do with him being Argentine, d'you think ? Doubt it - a ridiculous post. MP laughed off suggestions in the past that Gazza could go and play for Argentina (initially made by NA); he's under no illusions about his quality and where he is in his development. Gazza is simply next in line - its not like Cropper has covered himself in glory in youth/development games, being prone to errors. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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