Nationalism?

[pap]

What? CB Fry? Never!

 

As to the national unity business you could always take Italy; unified in the 1860s but still very regional and with such localism that there is the word 'campanilismo' after the bell tower of each small town. Can't remember the national holidays off-hand, but there were local ones as well (S.Ambrogio at Milan, for example). The World Cup tends to be a far better unifier mind.. I used to go to my local bar with an England flag - all very tongue in cheek - and an Italian one with a wry smile as soon as we'd been knocked out...

 

Personally I think May Day should get more prominence: apart from the capitalist rentiers amongst you we are all workers/ex-workers and May day has a long tradition. I know some people who go out at dawn to Morris dance and generally celebrate the spring. I've joined them in the past for a breakfast pint around 8, which is about as early as I can manage..

 

I don't dance but know loads of traditional tunes, and it's always the people like BS who give the most grief to people who have the temerity to do traditional dance and music.

 

Italy would be one of those newer nations I mentioned earlier. This wiki link is quite interesting. Not only does it list all of the countries that have National Days, there's normally a date and reason for the celebration. I never realised that Italy's national day celebrates the declaration of the 1946 republic.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Day

 

National Days aren't really about "look at how great we are". A huge proportion of the countries that celebrate a National Day are celebrating a specific event, usually a change of sovereignty, territory or constitutional makeup.

 

We've had the same form of government for a few hundred years (albeit with a smaller electorate the farther you go back), haven't been invaded since 1066 and almost all of our recent "achievements" have been shared with others, not something that we can independently say we've done on our tod. We don't really qualify for a National Day under the "established" rules. What specific event would we celebrate that defines us as a nation, is constitutionally relevant and is relatively recent?

[Grey Crab]

http://www.businessdictionary.com/definition/liberal.html

 

Sums it up to me, what do they do?

 

'Business Dictionary'. LOL. How many dictionaries did you have to look at before you found one that gave a definition that fitted your beliefs?

[Barry Sanchez]

'Business Dictionary'. LOL. How many dictionaries did you have to look at before you found one that gave a definition that fitted your beliefs?

 

Not many Mr Cab lol.

[norwaysaint]

I have only ever heard liberal used as an insult by right wing Americans and Barry Sanchez. It's certainly not an English thing. I guess BS and the tea party share a love of business dictionary.com

[pap]

I have only ever heard liberal used as an insult by right wing Americans and Barry Sanchez. It's certainly not an English thing. I guess BS and the tea party share a love of business dictionary.com

 

Ah, c'mon. There was at least one other person that used to do it

[PhilippineSaint]

What specific event would we celebrate that defines us as a nation, is constitutionally relevant and is relatively reces. nt?

 

When Wales actually became a country as defined by the UN about 3 or 4 years ago would be a point where England was once again stood alone against the celt's would bee a good place to start so

 

1st of August 2011it is then.

 

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/international-body-grants-wales-country-1813629

[Barry Sanchez]

Ah, c'mon. There was at least one other person that used to do it

 

So that must make me him them? Thank christ you are not the police,,

[pap]

So that must make me him them? Thank christ you are not the police,,

 

dune was a lot smarter than you, Barry old chum, but he suffered the same afflictions, god bless him.

 

He's still over on the UI, doing his thing, but to a less easily offended audience on a less populated forum. Given the amount of time he used to spend on here, and now doesn't, I'm sure he's living a rich and fulfilling life with the additional time he has on his hands.

 

I don't think he ever thought Danny Fox was a witch, though. Speaking of coppers, what was the basis of your Danny Fox = Witch deductive reasoning, Inspector Sanchez?

[Barry Sanchez]

dune was a lot smarter than you, Barry old chum, but he suffered the same afflictions, god bless him.

 

He's still over on the UI, doing his thing, but to a less easily offended audience on a less populated forum. Given the amount of time he used to spend on here, and now doesn't, I'm sure he's living a rich and fulfilling life with the additional time he has on his hands.

 

I don't think he ever thought Danny Fox was a witch, though. Speaking of coppers, what was the basis of your Danny Fox = Witch deductive reasoning, Inspector Sanchez?

 

Where is my apology for accusing me of being soemone else? The irony on you questioning me on wrong identity on another thread quite simply written as fun is galling, I can only presume your Christmas's are an absolute disco...........................

 

 

Have you been back on the Wolrd War II thread with anymore copies and pastes off wikipedia to appear involved lately:lol:

[pap]

Where is my apology for accusing me of being soemone else? The irony on you questioning me on wrong identity on another thread quite simply written as fun is galling, I can only presume your Christmas's are an absolute disco...........................

 

Have you been back on the Wolrd War II thread with anymore copies and pastes off wikipedia to appear involved lately:lol:

 

For the benefit of the forum. I sent Barry a PM in April saying that I might be wrong about him being dune and would offer a full apology if I was wrong. Only thing is, I still think he might be dune and don't really want to offer one up, only for the little tyke to say "hah, I was dune all along - and you fell for my brilliant plan". Given our relative proximity, a quick snifter should be easy enough to sort it all out.

 

The ball has been in Barry's court since then. This means that he's spent the best part of eight months needlessly begging for an apology on here when it could have been sorted in a jif.

[Barry Sanchez]

No it hasn't I offered you out for a bevy up lark lane and you bailed, you always do, I think you live in Norris green, you still won't commit as you sit on the fence to try and appear oh so clever, I suggest some more copy and pasting for you.

[anothersaintinsouthsea]

You guys SHOULD meet up soon. I think you'd actually get on really well and this messageboard antagonism could be hiding something more meaningful. Maybe get some food at the same time. Obviously with Xmas on our doorstep so you should probably wait a few weeks => Valentine's day?

[buctootim]

As an aside its really dull for the rest of us to have to read. Meet up and resolve it or of STFU would be the preferred options

[pap]

As an aside its really dull for the rest of us to have to read. Meet up and resolve it or of STFU would be the preferred options

 

Completely agree.

[sotonjoe]

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[sotonjoe]

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Barry Sanchez]

Completely agree.

In Woolton tomorrow night.

[pap]

Nah, f*ck that.

 

I'm not going out of my way, mate. I've got some Chrimbo shopping to do. Suggest pint one afternoon in town and all further correspondence to be conducted via PM.

[Barry Sanchez]

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

 

Seen it, funny but not the sort of Nationalism to what I refer, nor many people who want a day together.

[Barry Sanchez]

Nah, f*ck that.

 

I'm not going out of my way, mate. I've got some Chrimbo shopping to do. Suggest pint one afternoon in town and all further correspondence to be conducted via PM.

 

I tried that as well, you bail every time Pap, either you do or you dont, its been over a year now, Dune whom you accuse me of being is on another website, ask him?

[Fowllyd]

Seen it, funny but not the sort of Nationalism to what I refer, nor many people who want a day together.

 

It seems to me that you have the wrong word right from the off - if it's a national day of celebration you're after, then the word is surely patriotism and not nationalism. Patriotism is love of and pride in one's country (native or adopted) whereas nationalism would normally describe a movement to liberate one's country from (for example) an occupier or puppet government subservient to another country. Nationalism tends to contain within itself the risk of becoming hard-line, as many nationalist movements have done over the years. Patriotism does not seek to denigrate those of different nationality; nationalism all too often does. I'd regard patriotism as inclusive and nationalism as exclusive.

[Barry Sanchez]

It seems to me that you have the wrong word right from the off - if it's a national day of celebration you're after, then the word is surely patriotism and not nationalism. Patriotism is love of and pride in one's country (native or adopted) whereas nationalism would normally describe a movement to liberate one's country from (for example) an occupier or puppet government subservient to another country. Nationalism tends to contain within itself the risk of becoming hard-line, as many nationalist movements have done over the years. Patriotism does not seek to denigrate those of different nationality; nationalism all too often does. I'd regard patriotism as inclusive and nationalism as exclusive.

 

To a point yes it could have been worded as patriot but I feel the americans havd monopolised that word, take the nationalist word back from the hard line extremists.

[Fowllyd]

To a point yes it could have been worded as patriot but I feel the americans havd monopolised that word, take the nationalist word back from the hard line extremists.

 

You can't 'take back' the word nationalist, as it hasn't been misused in the first place. My point was simply that nationalism and patriotism are different things.

[Barry Sanchez]

You can't 'take back' the word nationalist, as it hasn't been misused in the first place. My point was simply that nationalism and patriotism are different things.

 

You can take words back but patriotism is different to Nationalism, we simply never hear that word here.