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Rickie, Adam and J-Rod in England squad

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Saint_clark

Saint_clark

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Given the injury to Welbeck who would have been a starter and Roy's comparison to Rodriguez; you'd expect him to start in place of Welbeck. That is unless Roy has watched training and realised Rodriquez can actually control a football and is nothing like Welbeck.

 

It did really annoy me that Hodgson pretty much said that Rodriguez is a back up to Welbeck, when he's a lot better than him.

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edprice1984

edprice1984

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JWP is going to be a massive massive player. Certainly think he will be replacing Gerrard/Lampard after Brazil. Best delivery of a dead ball in the country, works hard, tracks and tackles - one element he could add is the Gerrard lung busting box bursting but if half the team don't pass I suppose there is no point.

 

I can honestly see Clyne, Shaw, JWP and Lallana as regulars in the England Squad very soon - plus all the others coming up through the ranks....just wow!

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Mr_Red

Mr_Red

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Latest quote from Hodgson:

"From an England perspective I'm still very happy to consider Ashley Cole as a potential English left-back but as you know, and have known for some time, the competition for that spot is particularly fierce because Baines is also playing so well."On top of that we have Arsenal's Kieran Gibbs and Luke Shaw from Southampton, two younger players but who I think can definitely put these more senior ones under some pressure.

"I would definitely not be concerned, if there were no Ashley Cole or Leighton Baines, about Gibbs or Shaw playing."

 

Just how many saints could be playing for England in brazil?! Sweepstake time? Still a long season ahead, I'd guess at 2. Not naming them though.

 

In other news, still surprised at the amount of abuse welbeck gets. Think he does an ok job for England, we aren't blessed with a lot of world class talent. he's loads better than Heskey, that's a lazy comparison if ever there was one.

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hutch

hutch

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Wise move to keep Rickie sidelined. He's had back trouble previously, and it's over compensating for minor muscle niggles that can lead to more serious muscle injuries elsewhere.

 

Anyway, I think Rickie's in Roy's "I don't really need to see him in an England shirt any more to make my mind up" category, and his Brazilian destiny will be determined by his form in the League for the rest of the season.

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SNSUN

SNSUN

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Wise move to keep Rickie sidelined. He's had back trouble previously, and it's over compensating for minor muscle niggles that can lead to more serious muscle injuries elsewhere.

 

Anyway, I think Rickie's in Roy's "I don't really need to see him in an England shirt any more to make my mind up" category, and his Brazilian destiny will be determined by his form in the League for the rest of the season.

 

I think this is as important to Saints fans than anything else. When JRod, Rickie and Adam were picked to play for England, my colleague's first quote was "that's bad, what if they get injured?" I see it as a positive thing - all the England lads with a will to go to Brazil, and I include JWP, Shaw and even Clyne in that, will all be playing hell for leather for the rest of the season to try to force themselves on the plane. Better performances on the pitch should mean better results, and would stop us from "doing a WBA" and capitulating our league position in the New Year. (Add to that the other players from other countries that wish to go to Brazil too.)

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

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So just to confirm, all that stuff spouted on here from about 6 months months ago and previous to that about Roy Hodgson and the FA ignoring Saints players and only selecting players from the big clubs was a load of bol*ocks then?

 

It was the pressure of us being 3rd in the League, plus there being noone else as everyone else was injured - so Rickie HAD to be given a chance and did well. Therefore Hodgson opening his eyes to other Saints players. Something like that anyway ;)

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Verbal Kint

Verbal Kint

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The sooner English football gets rid of the obsession with 'pacy wide man' the better.

 

Yeah. That Ryan Giggs was rubbish. And Ronaldo when he was at United. And that Bale chap at spurs just got lucky when he was scoring hattricks against Inter Milan. And Theo Walcott has never taken the **** out of Barcelona before. And Arjen Robben has done nothing at Bayern Munich has he. And Ribery who isn't favourite to win the Ballon D'Or...

 

I'm glad football learnt from all these failures and acknowledged that there is only one way to play football successfully

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Turkish

Turkish

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Yeah. That Ryan Giggs was rubbish. And Ronaldo when he was at United. And that Bale chap at spurs just got lucky when he was scoring hattricks against Inter Milan. And Theo Walcott has never taken the **** out of Barcelona before. And Arjen Robben has done nothing at Bayern Munich has he. And Ribery who isn't favourite to win the Ballon D'Or...

 

I'm glad football learnt from all these failures and acknowledged that there is only one way to play football successfully

 

Football has changed since Giggs prime when it was 4-4-2, would you say he was a pacy wide man now? You wouldnt' describe Bale or Ronaldo as a "pacy wide man" in the traditional winger sense, both of them tend to roam wherever they want to in free roles now. Theo is on record as saying he'd rather play up front than on out wide. I wouldn't say Ribery or Robben, great players they are, are renowned for their pace, would you?

 

Indeed, the club you support doesn't play with any pacy wingers, maybe our style is behind the times too??

 

So other than being inaccurate about every player you've mentioned and dismissing your own clubs formation and tactics your post was excellent.

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Tom28

Tom28

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I reckon JR will start and AL will come on as a sub.

 

If that happens then it can only be because Roy wants to see AL from the start against Germany. AL is the third best midfielder/attacking midfielder in the country at the moment behind only Ozil and Ramsey in my opinion.

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

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If that happens then it can only be because Roy wants to see AL from the start against Germany. AL is the third best midfielder/attacking midfielder in the country at the moment behind only Ozil and Ramsey in my opinion.

 

I think Barkley will get a start, he has been around the last few squads also.

 

Although he should start centrally, I bet Lallana is played out wide and won't have the same freedom that he does for us.

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saint si

saint si

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I wouldn't say Ribery or Robben, great players they are, are renowned for their pace, would you?.

 

Really? I would have said that is precisely what Robben is renowned for. And Pep thinks so too...

 

http://www.goal.com/en/news/15/germany/2013/08/24/4210972/guardiola-lauds-decisive-ribery-and-robben-pace

 

Not disputing your overall point though. Out-and-out wingers are less and less part of the modern game.

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Turkish

Turkish

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Really? I would have said that is precisely what Robben is renowned for. And Pep thinks so too...

 

http://www.goal.com/en/news/15/germany/2013/08/24/4210972/guardiola-lauds-decisive-ribery-and-robben-pace

 

Not disputing your overall point though. Out-and-out wingers are less and less part of the modern game.

 

Would you now. I disagree, they aren't slow by any means, in fact they are fairly quick, but they aren't players like Aaron Lennon, Theo Walcott and so on whose main attritube and what you associate them with is pace. THey are very clever and skillful players who have an end product so it's their craft and guile that make them the players they are as well as being quick, they dont fit the tag of the "pacy wideman" which was the orginal point i was making and the type of player that is so often demanded on here and England teams seem to love. A 1990's type wideman in a 4-4-2 who will sprint to the byline and get crosses into the mixer for the big lump of a centre forward, pace but little else. Inital thoughts on Zaha from what i've seen so far is that he is another one like this, maybe he'll come good but i've seen nothing to suggest that he has anywhere near the attributes of Ribery and Robben. None of the top teams play with these sort of player anymore.

Edited by Turkish
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Minty

Minty

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I'm with Turks. Another way to look at it would be to ask what skills a player still has if you made them all the same pace?

 

Could Theo have scored the goal Lallana scored last week for example?

 

Equalise their pace and see what you're left with.

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Verbal Kint

Verbal Kint

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Football has changed since Giggs prime when it was 4-4-2, would you say he was a pacy wide man now? You wouldnt' describe Bale or Ronaldo as a "pacy wide man" in the traditional winger sense, both of them tend to roam wherever they want to in free roles now. Theo is on record as saying he'd rather play up front than on out wide. I wouldn't say Ribery or Robben, great players they are, are renowned for their pace, would you?

 

Indeed, the club you support doesn't play with any pacy wingers, maybe our style is behind the times too??

 

So other than being inaccurate about every player you've mentioned and dismissing your own clubs formation and tactics your post was excellent.

 

I haven't been inaccurate about any of them. I don't agree about robben and Ribery. They are pacy wingers. The reason Giggs has changed is because he doesn't have any pace these days

 

All those players had great success playing as 'pacy wide men'. The fact some of them now play slightly different roles doesn't change that.

 

I'm not "dismissing" my club's formation and tactics, I'm simply pointing out there are different ways to be successful. Mourinho's early success at Chelsea was founded on duff and robben getting past defenders and getting crosses into drogba. Alex Ferguson had twenty years of success playing with wingers. Bayern, despite what you say, also DO play with wingers who like to go past players.

 

You're simply wrong to think there is only one way. Football is cyclical and in a few years time you might see a new style of play emerging

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

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Posted (edited)
Both will start tonight according to BBC

 

1344:

FOOTBALL

Southampton duo Jay Rodriguez and Adam Lallana will start for England against Chile at Wembley later, according to the Daily Mirror's John Cross.

 

James Milner, Jack Wilshere and Frank Lampard are also set to start in midfield for the friendly. There is no news yet on who will start in goal or whether Ashley Cole or Leighton Baines start at left-back.

 

The BBC are reporting what John Cross has said here...

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/england-v-chile-southampton-duo-2794649

Edited by Matthew Le God
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shurlock

shurlock

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Would you now. I disagree, they aren't slow by any means, in fact they are fairly quick, but they aren't players like Aaron Lennon, Theo Walcott and so on whose main attritube and what you associate them with is pace. THey are very clever and skillful players who have an end product so it's their craft and guile that make them the players they are as well as being quick, they dont fit the tag of the "pacy wideman" which was the orginal point i was making and the type of player that is so often demanded on here and England teams seem to love. A 1990's type wideman in a 4-4-2 who will sprint to the byline and get crosses into the mixer for the big lump of a centre forward, pace but little else. Inital thoughts on Zaha from what i've seen so far is that he is another one like this, maybe he'll come good but i've seen nothing to suggest that he has anywhere near the attributes of Ribery and Robben. None of the top teams play with these sort of player anymore.

 

So your earth shattering conclusion is that it's better to have pace and skill than just pace?

 

Wow...I think you're on to something big here.

Edited by shurlock
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Turkish

Turkish

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I haven't been inaccurate about any of them. I don't agree about robben and Ribery. They are pacy wingers. The reason Giggs has changed is because he doesn't have any pace these days

 

All those players had great success playing as 'pacy wide men'. The fact some of them now play slightly different roles doesn't change that.

 

I'm not "dismissing" my club's formation and tactics, I'm simply pointing out there are different ways to be successful. Mourinho's early success at Chelsea was founded on duff and robben getting past defenders and getting crosses into drogba. Alex Ferguson had twenty years of success playing with wingers. Bayern, despite what you say, also DO play with wingers who like to go past players.

 

You're simply wrong to think there is only one way. Football is cyclical and in a few years time you might see a new style of play emerging

 

I'm not wrong at all. Robben and Ribery are good player not because they are quick, they are good players because as well as being quick they can dribble, shoot, cross, track back, cut inside, go outside. They are quality players AND they have pace. Bale and Ronaldo arent wingers, they both drift all over the place. The fact is that the top teams dont play with "pacy widemen" anymore. They may have wide players that are quick but they can do the lot like Robben and Ribery can, or drift like Ronaldo and Bale do. Like you said Chelseas EARLY success was based around wingers crossing into Drogba, 10 years ago. WHo are their pacy widemen now? WHat happened to Moses ad Malouda? They use Hazard, Mata and Oscar, are they pacy widemen? What about Man City, are Nasri and Silva conisdered pacy wingers?

 

And i'm fully aware football is cyclinical, five years ago we were told that the future of football would be tall, muscular players who were athletes, then Barcelona became the best team in the world playing with smaller, nimble players who were skillfull with great touch, vision and movement and all of a sudden everyone wanted to play like that, 10 years ago 4-4-2 was all the rage, managers were lamblasted for daring to only play one striker especially at home, then the Spanish and Germans started playing between the lines showing it up for an outdated system and it was decided that one up top and 3 attacking midfielders was actually the best way to go.

 

You may not like it but right now the pacy wideman like, a Micheal Antonio type, that you seem to be championing is a thing of the past, it doesn't mean pace isn't important but people have started to realise over the last 5 years or so that ability to actually control, pass and move with the football is far more effective than just pace.

Edited by Turkish
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SNSUN

SNSUN

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It's good to hear the rumours about them both starting. For me, Lallana is a must for England to take to Brazil because he offers something different. Of the two of them, it's him who I'm hoping shines more, although of course I hope both do well. I can't see JRod going to Brazil though - as a Welbeck replacement (if that's really what Woy is seeking) I think Lallana would do the better job, as he's shown playing on the left in our rise through the divisions.

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