dubai_phil Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Surely the fairest way of doing it is to work out how many away tickets we're likely to sell over the whole season, and subsidise every ticket by a fixed amount. That way, every travelling fan benefits, even if it's only a few quid. Man United have decided they'll subsidise every away ticket by £4, if you do every away game that's £76 saved over the course of the season. Not a massive amount when you're still spending plenty but every little helps. I'm not sure elasticity of demand really comes into it when every club is receiving this cash, whether their away support needs boosting or not. It's a good start to a debate. Perhaps also the Fund could be used (next year) to cover the cost of Away Season Tickets or an Away Fans Membership Club. The TO are supposed to be tracking the numbers bought, regulars get the Club Membership and then they are given a larger discount for taking a family member or registered friend with them. Extra discount in the shops or on Coach Travel, or even a Saints Fans Group Railcard Membership so fans can be members and get reduced train fares. There must be hundreds of ideas that could be done by sticking a dozen stakeholders in a room and brainstorming it properly. Personally as all the Aussie Dubai Thai & Russkies Saints groups have to treat every match as an away game I think the club should pay 50% of our flight costs back or charter a private jet for us to go to Liverpool or Geordie Land next year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Turkish, wouldn't it be better to get your knickers in a twist about the fact that each club was only given £200k...? Why? And why are you aiming it at me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 It's not a tricky one at all is it? Sunderland away today (many having booked for the original date), Sunderland away in the league early kick off, Hull away on a Tuesday night, Barnsley away earlier in the cup, Everton away on the 28th Dec. If our away support is that amazing, why don't we take our full allocation at so many away games? Yes, but for a 5 quid discount on a match ticket or a free coach how many EXTRA fans would actually go? If one fan had been to say 6 Away Games and the club gave them a free ticket & coach to go to Hull would or even COULD they actually go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Could this be linked to the Financial Fair Play initiative that Cortese voted against? A bit of a tit-for-tat response, as in "you've told me how I should run my business so I'm going to spend this as I see fit" in retaliation... Petty? Yes. Amusing? Slightly. You think it's amusing that away games will be more expensive for Saints fans than other clubs? Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsdinho Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Surely any kickers getting in a twist should be directed at the fact that each club is only given £200k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Pretty unlikely don't you think? Yes, on the face of it... but as I said, I'm just putting out a theory for others to debate. That is the point of this thread isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 I suppose it is an Interpretation of the rules - maybe we should be moaning that other clubs have given the money to there fans rather than improving the away ends? How is YOUR club spending the £200,000 it's been given by the Premier League to improve away fans' experiences? Does giving free coach travel improve the experience? Perhaps having better facilities does? Maybe we are right and others wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Assuming 19 games with 2,250 sold for each, that's 42,750 tickets. About £4.50 off every league away ticket for the season. That's the approach Man Utd and Liverpool have taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Yes, on the face of it... but as I said, I'm just putting out a theory for others to debate. That is the point of this thread isn't it? Yes and I've answered you, its pretty unlikely they we were the only club to misunderstand what it was for. And if there was any doubt we could have looked st what the others were doing, t was reported a month ago in the link above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 That's the approach Man Utd and Liverpool have taken. Arsenal away for 21 quid! It is probably something that should be enacted proportionally so that the more expensive away games have the bigger discount. (£7 pounds off Man Utd/Chelsea away and £2 off Arsenal away for instance) to be totally fair. This would be dependent on away prices being clear from the start of the season though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Yes, but for a 5 quid discount on a match ticket or a free coach how many EXTRA fans would actually go? If one fan had been to say 6 Away Games and the club gave them a free ticket & coach to go to Hull would or even COULD they actually go? Why not cut the price of Chelsea tickets in half and take the whole allocation rather than just a little corner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Yes and I've answered you, its pretty unlikely they we were the only club to misunderstand what it was for. And if there was any doubt we could have looked st what the others were doing, t was reported a month ago in the link above. It is unlikely, but not impossible. It would be good to hear from the club more... as much as I agree with the fact that what the club have done is not very good from the point of view of our away fans, it does strike me as a bit strange for the club to have done something which would clearly attract criticism in light of what other clubs have done... it would be pretty silly to make a conscious choice to do something so different to the other clubs. What benefit is there to the club of doing such a thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRM Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Why not cut the price of Chelsea tickets in half and take the whole allocation rather than just a little corner. exactly - we could have had 3000 allocation for Chelsea, we have only taken the smaller allocation of 1500, so our support can't be that great can it? we could have used the fund to get a better following up there. Chelsea chartered a train for Man United away on a Monday night and charged £10 return for it, this was particularly interesting as being a night game for TV fans usually would not have been able to get back same day by public transport, so the deal made a real difference, club and fans benefiting each other. Stoke have said they will go above the 200k and add more cash themselves as they see the value in taking a big following to support the team - free coaches for every away game, not saying i want that, but just an example. Norwich halved the price of tickets for Man City away from £35 to £17.50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 I can see the case for the defence starting to build here, 'well if its every season then perhaps we'll look after our own fans next year'.......... Sounds remarkably like the "it'll be stripes next season" argument... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orchardsaint Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Yes, but for a 5 quid discount on a match ticket or a free coach how many EXTRA fans would actually go? If one fan had been to say 6 Away Games and the club gave them a free ticket & coach to go to Hull would or even COULD they actually go? i said this earlier on. if you are going to go to the hull, sunderland, newcastle games, you are going anyway. a couple of quid off a ticket will not make a huge difference. the only real thing making any significant choice to be had, is if they rearrange the time of kick off, or the actual date of the match, and as we all know, this is not something the club can help out with at all. there is an arguement for a small brain stomring session with the fans, but yet again, who ever is in the room at the time, will come up with some ideas, good bad and ridiculous, and whatever is put forward, you will have a large amount of people slagging off the ideas as not reasonable. let the club make up it's mind what it is doing and judge it in hindsight, when we have the power to see if it was the right option. as yet, NC doesn't seem to be making too many crap decisions. strange ones at the time, but with the power of hindsight, he just gets better and better in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Why not cut the price of Chelsea tickets in half and take the whole allocation rather than just a little corner. Because that would necessitate the club 1) doing something to benefit its own fans and 2) lead them to have to spend time and effort selling 1500 more tickets than they would if they just took the lowest allocation possible, which now seems to be an actual policy on the club's part given the consistently low allocations taken and refusal to publish allocations. It does sound like a typical Cortese "what's directly in it for us in the short term?" response to a situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 i said this earlier on. if you are going to go to the hull, sunderland, newcastle games, you are going anyway. a couple of quid off a ticket will not make a huge difference. the only real thing making any significant choice to be had, is if they rearrange the time of kick off, or the actual date of the match, and as we all know, this is not something the club can help out with at all. there is an arguement for a small brain stomring session with the fans, but yet again, who ever is in the room at the time, will come up with some ideas, good bad and ridiculous, and whatever is put forward, you will have a large amount of people slagging off the ideas as not reasonable. let the club make up it's mind what it is doing and judge it in hindsight, when we have the power to see if it was the right option. as yet, NC doesn't seem to be making too many crap decisions. strange ones at the time, but with the power of hindsight, he just gets better and better in my eyes. I don't need to judge it in hindsight, every other club so far has spent the money, as intended, on reducing the cost of going to one or more away matches for their own fans. Saints have chosen to upgrade a part of their own stadium which can't even be used by Saints fans with the money. It is clearly not an appropriate use of the funds, and also, as usual, they are the only club to ignore the accepted wisdom and spirit of something in pursuit of the quick buck. What's there to wait for to judge it in hindsight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 You think it's amusing that away games will be more expensive for Saints fans than other clubs? Nice. Yep, that's exactly why I think Cortese's petty response (if that's what it is) is "slightly amusing". Well spotted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Duplo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 exactly - we could have had 3000 allocation for Chelsea, we have only taken the smaller allocation of 1500, so our support can't be that great can it? we could have used the fund to get a better following up there. I see the club propaganda is getting to some. We'd fill 3000 at Chelsea easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 I suppose it is an Interpretation of the rules - maybe we should be moaning that other clubs have given the money to there fans rather than improving the away ends? How is YOUR club spending the £200,000 it's been given by the Premier League to improve away fans' experiences? Does giving free coach travel improve the experience? Perhaps having better facilities does? Maybe we are right and others wrong? No, Glasgow_Saint. The SWF rules are that only the majority can be right. People acting in the minority can't be right, surely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 6 November, 2013 Author Share Posted 6 November, 2013 I see the club propaganda is getting to some. We'd fill 3000 at Chelsea easily. Not at £47/50 a pop and on TV, we wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 PMSL - this is probs how it went down NC: Hi mopo Mopo: Hi Nic NC: we have been given 200k for the away fans Mopo: ok NC: any ideas? Mopo: no NC: ok I will do some painting in the away end Mopo: ok boss NC: see ya later Mopo: ok boss PMSL + YOLO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 PMSL - this is probs how it went down NC: Hi mopo Mopo: Hi Nic NC: we have been given 200k for the away fans Mopo: ok NC: any ideas? Mopo: no NC: ok I will do some painting in the away end Mopo: ok boss NC: see ya later Mopo: ok boss PMSL + YOLO Please stop this indirect lack of respect to our own away fans please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Not exactly surprising - trouser the 200K then allocate it to what would have been spent anyway. I expect Cortese's line of thought is that the fact that our club is 200K richer should make our most loyal away fans very happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRM Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Not at £47/50 a pop and on TV, we wouldn't. for purely arguments sake, we use 70k of the fund and make it £25 for saints fans at Chelsea, we then fill half the Shed end rather than a small corner - gives the team better support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 It is unlikely, but not impossible. It would be good to hear from the club more... as much as I agree with the fact that what the club have done is not very good from the point of view of our away fans, it does strike me as a bit strange for the club to have done something which would clearly attract criticism in light of what other clubs have done... it would be pretty silly to make a conscious choice to do something so different to the other clubs. What benefit is there to the club of doing such a thing? The benefit is that they don't need to spend their own money on doing something they needed to pay for anyway in the away end, thus saving £200k, and don't give a monkey's what anyone else says about them, plus few people are openly critical for as long as we're winning matches - see Turkish's tongue in cheek "no-one shall criticise, we didn't have a club 4 years ago" response. Previous examples of doing things contrary to accepted wisdom have included settling court cases at the last minute out of court, the photographer ban, the local paper ban, sticking the chairman on the programme cover, ignoring the need to print the Customer Charter on the website, two publicised cases of refusing people with valid tickets entry on very spurious grounds, the ongoing war of words with various popular ex-players, and one that actually seems to have worked out - Cortese's narky attitude to transfer dealings and agents). Do Saints sound like a club that's bothered what people think where there's money to be made? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Not at £47/50 a pop and on TV, we wouldn't. Maybe not in that case, but the bigger picture is that we haven't had the opportunity to fill many larger allocations as the club generally just doesn't take them up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Previous examples of doing things contrary to accepted wisdom have included settling court cases at the last minute out of court, the photographer ban, the local paper ban, sticking the chairman on the programme cover, ignoring the need to print the Customer Charter on the website, two publicised cases of refusing people with valid tickets entry on very spurious grounds, the ongoing war of words with various popular ex-players, and one that actually seems to have worked out - Cortese's narky attitude to transfer dealings and agents). You missed off: "sacking managers at their peak" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 You missed off: "sacking managers at their peak" Sacking them at their peak would be accepted wisdom. Sacking them when they had no opportunity of proving themselves at a higher level wouldn't be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Sacking them at their peak would be accepted wisdom. Sacking them when they had no opportunity of proving themselves at a higher level wouldn't be. But most chairman wait until their manager is on the slide before sacking them rather than at their peak, as most can't see when their manager has reached a peak until after the event. Cortese seems to have mastered the art of pre-empting management failure (so far) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orchardsaint Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 You missed off: "sacking managers at their peak" which looks like a damn good decision now though doesn't it? the king is dead, long live the king. deal with it,move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 which looks like a damn good decision now though doesn't it? the king is dead, long live the king. deal with it,move on. Yes, that was the point of my slightly tongue-in-cheek attempt to add balance to the list of 'bad' stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 The benefit is that they don't need to spend their own money on doing something they needed to pay for anyway in the away end, thus saving £200k... Fair comment. Would be good to hear an official response (accepting that it'll be spun to some degree), but with something like this, where we can be compared directly to the other clubs, it seems a bit silly to invite criticism so easily. Even if we are a club that isn't bothered what others think of it, to wilfully act as we have done seems a bit silly to me. But hey, I work in two business where we DO care about customers, so I guess I'm not cut out to run Saints. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrew123 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Tricky one this. Elasticity of demand. Seems the only Away games that we don't sell out are the early KO long distance televised matches. Most threads on Away matches I have seen have shown that we have mainly taken up all the tickets we have been allocated, so Saints fans will travel unlike many other teams these days. Would a free coach trip or a 10 quid discount REALLY make an impact on the number of fans heading up to say Sunderland for a lunchtime KO? After the threads about the Skate Bubble Game think the opinion on here was that most do not like the restrictions on Club Travel . I can see that Nicola has obviously met with Rupert and decided that by bringing our Match Day catering back up to a world class standard would make many thousands extra Away fans choose to come to SMS over other grounds (thus making sure we sold out every week and didn't have moans about Stadium expansion). In reality I agree with Steve, this may be in the "rules" (ie blame the PL for not being more specific) but I am not sure it is in the SPIRIT. So I think it is wrong, period. But if we sell out MOST of our away allocations it is difficult to see how best to use the money FAIRLY. It does seem daft to me that Clubs charge fans extortionate prices at many grounds, pay a fee to the PL who then have to give that money back as a subsidy to fans on the price of extortionate tickets. I guess someone has a nicely paid job managing/dreaming up that Merry Go Round. As it stands there is no way I would go to Sunderland away. If the club did put on a free coach journey and slash tickets by a tenner then I would absolutely go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 But most chairman wait until their manager is on the slide before sacking them rather than at their peak, as most can't see when their manager has reached a peak until after the event. Cortese seems to have mastered the art of pre-empting management failure (so far) We'd be top now with Adkins. Prove me wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 As it stands there is no way I would go to Sunderland away. If the club did put on a free coach journey and slash tickets by a tenner then I would absolutely go. As it stands I'm "probably" going (and probably Hull too), if they knocked off a few quid from the ticket price or arranged some kind of deal with SW and/or East Coast Trains (they have one with bluestar buses, after all) that would also confirm my attendance. I might even put up with a bloody organised coach if it was cheap enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rshephard3 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 So actually you've commented on something you know nothing about, don't care about and have no understanding of. Other than that your point was completely valid and well made. Made me chuckle on an otherwise boring day at work. I was interested to hear that Newcastle were contacting other clubs and suggesting a mutual ticket discount to subsidise to a level of £20 an adult ticket and getting the same deal in return when their fans take to the road for the away game. Seemed an excellent idea and one which a lot of clubs had agreed to. As yet I don't believe SFC have responded to Newcastles suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 We'd be top now with Adkins. Prove me wrong. I can't. Which means we both agree that, in sacking Adkins, Cortese acted "contrary to accepted wisdom"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Bob Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 It's a real shame. With all the good that's happening with the team at the moment, the fans are still apparently regarded as a necessary evil by Mr Cortese. Whilst his achievements are beyond question, his apparent contempt for the fans is saddening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 The best news is we have another 400k to spend over the next couple of years. I bet away fans are excited to hear what they will get next year. Maybe we could subsidise their food and travel? Maybe we can pay the stewards in the away end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whelk Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Suggestions: give it to the best photo for the cringey #marching in. reward some idiot more hastags on the away seats to show we are so leading edge. ......or how about use it to develop a mobile app given it is 2013 and all us out and about (away) fans can enjoy SaintsPlayer on the move Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 I can't. Which means we both agree that, in sacking Adkins, Cortese acted "contrary to accepted wisdom"... My brain is now broken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 The best news is we have another 400k to spend over the next couple of years. I bet away fans are excited to hear what they will get next year. Maybe we could subsidise their food and travel? Maybe we can pay the stewards in the away end. 200k to pay off home fans so they don't bother to go to matches and inconvenience the stewards and away fans? All away fans upgraded to corporate hospitality suites? Maybe they could put it towards building that train station that's logistically impossible, or they could rent a train for away fans to get to St Mary's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 It's a real shame. With all the good that's happening with the team at the moment, the fans are still apparently regarded as a necessary evil by Mr Cortese. Whilst his achievements are beyond question, his apparent contempt for the fans is saddening. I'll go for (still) "annoying", but agreed. and bloody hell, I left "changing the kit to something most people dislike in an attempt to increase sales" off the "accepted wisdom" list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpweySaint Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Wont get into the wrongs and rights of what we've done but I would like to weigh in on the whole "it wouldn't make a difference if we dropped prices" issue. For me, personally, it would. I find that between travel and tickets football is a very expensive pass time for those on a student budget! It would be great to see the club give a little back to our fans to show appreciation for our following (ok im a optimist!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints foreva Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 for purely arguments sake, we use 70k of the fund and make it £25 for saints fans at Chelsea, we then fill half the Shed end rather than a small corner - gives the team better support pfft what would that benefit, a mere 5000 people for one day? Over 50K away fans will enjoy the enhanced wall painting at SMS this year alone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 pfft what would that benefit, a mere 5000 people for one day? Over 50K away fans will enjoy the enhanced wall painting at SMS this year alone! About 20K also enjoyed walking past the funfair on family fun day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 6 November, 2013 Share Posted 6 November, 2013 V.good point hypo! Cortese is the most altruistic man I know. When did a premier league chairman ever give so much to so many? Saint Nic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now