Who are better than us?

[Roger]

Definately:

Man utd

Man city

Spurs

Chelsea

 

Possibly

Arsenal

Liverpool

Everton?

 

5th or 6th finish?

[SNSUN]

Swap Arsenal to the Definitely category, and probably even Liverpool, move Swansea into the Possibly category, and you're about there.

[Batman]

arsenal and liverpool are better. no possibly about it

[Saint_clark]

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. We have no idea how good we really are until we get a decent way into the season. Right now all I would say is we're better than Hull, Cardiff, Palace, Stoke, Hammers, Sunderland, Villa and Newcastle.

Everyone else (yes, including Swansea and Fulham) are either on par or ahead for the time being.

[Sour Mash]

I think Liverpool will do well this year, Rodgers is slowly pulling together his sort of side. They'll finish above us this season.

[hypochondriac]

It's not about being better in a one off game. It's about the consistency to grind out results and win when we should.

[DuncanRG]

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. We have no idea how good we really are until we get a decent way into the season.

 

This, one hundred percent. We are miles off Arsenal and Liverpool.

[Batman]

It's not about being better in a one off game. It's about the consistency to grind out results and win when we should.

 

west ham will do alright this season too

read a rumour that Ba will go there on loan for the season if chelsea get another striker

[Saint Garrett]

I think there are a few teams which you can group together...this is how I see it. Think there will be a few changes between now and the end of the season, and a few surprises either way.

 

Man Utd

Chelsea

Man City

 

Arsenal

Spurs

Liverpool

 

Everton

Swansea

Newcastle

Southampton

West Ham

Norwich

WBA

 

Aston Villa

Sunderland

Stoke

Fulham

Cardiff

Palace

Hull

[Pastor Patrón]

Op is entirely correct.

[Barry Sanchez]

Cheslea

Man City

Man Utd

Everton (with Baines and Fellani) possibilty without

Arsenal

Liverpool

Spurs

 

Possibles

Swansea

Sunderland (if they click)

 

We're ok and doing alright but for Europe we need strength in depth, no doubt about it.

[Sour Mash]

I think there are a few teams which you can group together...this is how I see it. Think there will be a few changes between now and the end of the season, and a few surprises either way.

 

Man Utd

Chelsea

Man City

 

Arsenal

Spurs

Liverpool

 

Everton

Swansea

Newcastle

Southampton

West Ham

Norwich

WBA

 

Aston Villa

Sunderland

Stoke

Fulham

Cardiff

Palace

Hull

I wouldn't have Villa or Fulham at the same level as Palace and Hull.

[hypochondriac]

west ham will do alright this season too

read a rumour that Ba will go there on loan for the season if chelsea get another striker

 

Yes they will but in the long term their way will end up being a lot more expensive than ours.

[Saint Garrett]

I wouldn't have Villa or Fulham at the same level as Palace and Hull.

 

Well you could break it up a bit more, Palace, Hull, Cardiff and Stoke I would say are a bit adrift of others. Difficult to say. You could probably put Fulham Villa and Sunderland up with our group but then It makes relegation more definite for the 3 promotion sides. I do think at the moment, they are a way off as none seem to have much firepower.

[Doctoroncall]

Based on last season thirteen other teams.

 

The main concern now is consistency. Utd, City and Chelsea are way ahead. We could give Arsenal, Spurs, Liverpool, Everton and Swansea a good run but at least half of them would be more consistent, so 7/8th place is doable. Anything above that would be dream land. Happy with top half finsh this year.

[Barry Sanchez]

Key thing for us IMO, is say we come 8th-12th, and manage to keep all our players. What would we need to sign? Another top CB yes, but beyond that it's just a case of keeping the team together, seeing young players gain experience and improve together. That's a huge advantage and the only way for a club to really improve I think.

 

 

A utility full back is needed more but only slightly.

[dinger]

Far to early to be making these kind of calls, but what the hey...

 

Man Utd, Man City, Chelsea, Spurs will almost certainly make up the top 4 IMO, and are far stronger than us.

 

Liverpool are going to be a much improved team and will get a decent start. Arsenal need to do something in the market soon as they have only gone backwards so far.

 

I see Saints in a group with Everton, Villa, Swansea, WBA, possibly Sunderland and Norwich too (those are the two I find hardest to predict), nipping at the heels of the Europa places. As adriansfc says, there'll be a lot of luck involved in that mini-league.

 

Can't see much from the promoted sides, Stoke will go backwards under Hughes, I want to say West Ham will have a poor season, but that's not a confident prediction.

[Batman]

in reality. as people have said.

United, city and chelsea are certs to be top 3.

Spurs have bought very well and look very strong all over the pitch

arsenal. god knows. they always manage to get into the top 4, but spurs look very strong

liverpool will only be better than last season.

 

the bottom 6?

hull

cardiff

palace

stoke

fulham

WBA for me

 

 

the rest is a bit of a lottery

[Naboo_thats_who]

For me there are 5 mini leagues of 5.

 

6th or 7th potentially up for grabs

 

Man Utd

Chelsea

Man City

Spurs

Arsenal

 

Liverpool

Everton

Swansea

WBA

Southampton

 

West Ham

Norwich

Aston Villa

Fulham

Newcastle

 

Stoke

Sunderland

Cardiff

Palace

Hull

[DuncanRG]

For me there are 5 mini leagues of 5.

 

6th or 7th potentially up for grabs

 

Man Utd

Chelsea

Man City

Spurs

Arsenal

 

Liverpool

Everton

Swansea

WBA

Southampton

 

West Ham

Norwich

Aston Villa

Fulham

Newcastle

 

Stoke

Sunderland

Cardiff

Palace

Hull

 

I think this is largely right, though there will be some movement between these groups. Expect West Ham to finish above West Brom this season.

[Saint Garrett]

Think WBA may be the shock down the bottom this year. Don't think they'll be relegated but don't think they'll be top half like last year. Liverpool might well sneak in the top 4 as well this year. Good side with a good balance.

[SaintBobby]

I'd say we're maybe 8th best after the top six and Everton - although I doubt Everton will be as strong as last season.

 

To be honest, a league which excluded the top six would be bloody exciting. Perhaps the "bottom 14" should run a subset mini-league, only counting 26 games and disregarding the 12 matches against the top six.

[Saint_clark]

I'd say we're maybe 8th best after the top six and Everton - although I doubt Everton will be as strong as last season.

 

To be honest, a league which excluded the top six would be bloody exciting. Perhaps the "bottom 14" should run a subset mini-league, only counting 26 games and disregarding the 12 matches against the top six.

 

Shouldn't be too hard to figure out come the end of the season.

[Lighthouse]

I really don't know about Arsenal. One of these days they really are going to get caught with their pants down if they don't start bringing in some decent players. When Southampton sign 3 players they really should have gone for, you know they have some problems. I'm sure some smart arse will be along shortly to tell us there is no way we will ever finish above Arsenal but look at Leeds United about a decade ago. 5th, 4th, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 15th. Newcastle a couple of years later 4th, 3rd, 5th, 14th. I'm not saying they are going to drop that massively and suddenly but they have already gone from Championship contenders to just clinging on to 4th place.

 

Also I wouldn't have as down as 'better' than West Ham at the moment either. They are a decent side and we will need a decent season to finish above them.

[Saint Garrett]

I really don't know about Arsenal. One of these days they really are going to get caught with their pants down if they don't start bringing in some decent players. When Southampton sign 3 players they really should have gone for, you know they have some problems. I'm sure some smart arse will be along shortly to tell us there is no way we will ever finish above Arsenal but look at Leeds United about a decade ago. 5th, 4th, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 15th. Newcastle a couple of years later 4th, 3rd, 5th, 14th. I'm not saying they are going to drop that massively and suddenly but they have already gone from Championship contenders to just clinging on to 4th place.

 

Also I wouldn't have as down as 'better' than West Ham at the moment either. They are a decent side and we will need a decent season to finish above them.

 

I do agree with Arsenal stuff. I can really see them finishing below Man City, Chelsea, Man Utd, Spurs, and Liverpool, wouldn't be surprised if they finish around 8th. No doubt they'll grind out 4th again though they do need to spend.

[Lighthouse]

While 7th or 8th would be great, it's just 5th that gets Europe right? I mean, that's insanely unlikely, so I really hope we give everything in the cups. Silverware would be a huge boost for the club anyway. We can beat anyone on our day, so why not. Seen so many similar or smaller clubs get to league cup finals, yet we never seem to get anywhere in it.

 

Depends on the cups I think. The Europa League places go to

 

5th place

League cup winner

FA cup winner

 

If the LC winner is already in Europe by some other means, the EL place goes to 6th in the league. If the FA Cup winner is already in Europe, the runner up gets the EL place (like we did in 2003). If both FA Cup finalists are in Europe already, the EL place goes to 7th in the League.

[SaintBobby]

While 7th or 8th would be great, it's just 5th that gets Europe right? I mean, that's insanely unlikely, so I really hope we give everything in the cups. Silverware would be a huge boost for the club anyway. We can beat anyone on our day, so why not. Seen so many similar or smaller clubs get to league cup finals, yet we never seem to get anywhere in it.

 

7th gets a Europa league slot if (a) both FA Cup finalists are top 6 teams AND (b) the League Cup winners are a top 6 team.

 

6th gets Europa league slot if just one of (a) and (b) is true.

 

Only 5th is guaranteed though.

 

I'd say most years, you'd be very unlucky to come 6th and not make the Europa League. And it's probably about 50-50 to make it from 7th place?

[SaintBobby]

Shouldn't be too hard to figure out come the end of the season.

 

I'm nerdy enough to keep a tally as the seaon goes on :-)

[mcbendy]

For me there are 5 mini leagues of 5.

 

 

Last time I checked there were only 20 teams in the Prem...

[S-Clarke]

You can't really say yet, give everyone time to settle (including us) and we can judge it then.

[Mallagroth]

In answer to your original question, I reckon Barcelona are probably just about ahead of us, messi is very overrated and not a patch on Gaston. Maybe also Real, although i'm sure we'd beat them every time over two games, after all they've only got that donkey Ronaldo pulling the strings.

 

[kpturner]

I think the OP is getting a bit carried away with our "P1 W1 D0 L0" record this season. Far too early to declare us better than the likes of Arsenal

[OttawaSaint]

Great enthusiasm but I think a few will be disappointed if they think we will finish top 6. I can see us in the lower half for a while and then edging bit by bit into the top 10 by season's end. Each to their own of course.

[Lighthouse]

Great enthusiasm but I think a few will be disappointed if they think we will finish top 6. I can see us in the lower half for a while and then edging bit by bit into the top 10 by season's end. Each to their own of course.

 

Without checking, I think we were about 4 points off the top half last season. I'd be pretty bummed if we spent £40m to scrape an extra 4 points. Top 6 should definitely be the aim although I think 7th-9th is probably more likely where we will end up.

 

We're already 3 points better off on last season's results.

[CB Fry]

Great enthusiasm but I think a few will be disappointed if they think we will finish top 6. I can see us in the lower half for a while and then edging bit by bit into the top 10 by season's end. Each to their own of course.

 

I think the other way. Fifth in November, finishing 9/10/11.

 

West Brom style season from last year. Or Strachan post FA Cup.

[hutch]

I liked Villa last year, and like what I see even more this year. Getting through last season will make Lambert an even better manager. They've already gone past WBA going the other way, IMO, and will finish top half this season, with us Everton and Maybe Norwich in the top half also-rans slots.

[Saint]

Definately:

Man utd

Man city

Spurs

Chelsea

 

Possibly

Arsenal

Liverpool

Everton?

 

5th or 6th finish?

 

Sit down and behave.

[ericb]

Personally i think Newcastle are going to have a very, very tough season. They've not really improved in terms of players in. Look like losing Cabaye and have a lunatic as a DOF.

 

There's always one "too good/too big" to go down team there abouts each season and Newcastle strike me as having all of the signs of being that team.

[Killers Knee]

We also made a Premier League 1st on Saturday, first club in Premier League era to start three players 18 yrs or younger.

[NickG]

At the moment think four clubs are out of reach from the rest of us.

 

Manchester x2, Chelsea & spurs - can't see anyway those teams will be outside 5.

 

Arsenal could have a problem. Think they are very likely to be in the top group and miles ahead of the rest, but if pressure builds, no signings, fans revolt etc they could fall out of top group into the catchables. If Wenger isnt the man to keep them there they may react too slowly. Unlikely but wouldnt be stunned.

 

Liverpool are at the moment, IMHO, still in a catchable group.

 

The rest are all catchable, not just for us but for decent squads who perform well.

 

Our young team may make us inconsistent but can't see many clubs with better first 13 or so (maybe none outside teams I listed)

[The9]

The bookies have us as 7th favourite to finish in the top 10 (actually 3rd favourite, they're not offering odds on Man C, Man U or Chelsea), but only joint 9th in title winning odds. I would suggest this is because LOTS of Saints fans have had a punt on us coming top half, shortening our odds, but hardly anyone is daft enough to think we're going to win it, giving a more accurate representation of our actual odds.

[The9]

Oh, and Arsenal have lost ONE MATCH and have an injury crisis. They were dire for most of August/September a season or two ago and still finished top 4.

 

Still have to laugh at the stupidity of them bidding for Cabaye the day Newcastle played one of their title rivals though, could it really not have waited until today so he could have played at the Etihad ?

[The9]

I liked Villa last year, and like what I see even more this year. Getting through last season will make Lambert an even better manager. They've already gone past WBA going the other way, IMO, and will finish top half this season, with us Everton and Maybe Norwich in the top half also-rans slots.

 

I still have a lot of doubts on Villa. I was convinced they were going down last year but their run in was against all of the teams in the bottom 6 - they won them, but that just means they're just about better than the worst sides most of the time. The Arsenal result was mostly down to Arsenal's incompetence and injury crisis.

 

Still, we'll see, they've added a bit more experience to the kids who were out of their depth for 90% of last season now.

[Pat from Poole]

I suspect there will be less than 10 points between 8th and 16th at the end of the season; there's no way of knowing what injuries we'll get and what random refereeing decisions could impact on us. And also whether any Cup runs may impact on League results (though Cups seem almost irrelevant these days).

 

My hunch would be about 10th for Saints.

[Tamesaint]

Think WBA may be the shock down the bottom this year. Don't think they'll be relegated but don't think they'll be top half like last year. Liverpool might well sneak in the top 4 as well this year. Good side with a good balance.

 

I think that most people who went to the Hawthorns on Saturday would agree with this. They were shocking.

 

You can get 20/1 on them to be bottom at Christmas ... and that may turn out to be a good bet.

[Chez]

I still have a lot of doubts on Villa. I was convinced they were going down last year but their run in was against all of the teams in the bottom 6 - they won them, but that just means they're just about better than the worst sides most of the time. The Arsenal result was mostly down to Arsenal's incompetence and injury crisis.

 

Still, we'll see, they've added a bit more experience to the kids who were out of their depth for 90% of last season now.

 

Once Agbonlahore got it together, and with three up front, Villa looked a real threat going forward. This took the pressure off their back four, which without Vlaar was mistake ridden. Delph looked a quality player at their place. They just needed a decent player along side him. I also thought Baker looked a real prospect at the back. He's only young and will improve. Keep Vlaar fit and they should do fine. They seem to have carried over the end of season form. I wonder if Newcastle have done the same as they looked doomed at the end of last season and not much progress has been made this summer. WBA without Lukaka AND Fortune are a very different side.

Edited 20 August, 2013 by Chez

[The9]

Once Agbonlahore got it together, and with three up front, Villa looked a real threat going forward. This took the pressure off their back four, which without Vlaar was mistake ridden. Delph looked a quality player at their place. They just needed a decent player along side him. I also thought Baker looked a real prospect at the back. He's only young and will improve. Keep Vlaar fit and they should do fine. They seem to have carried over the end of season form. I wonder if Newcastle have done the same as they looked doomed at the end of last season and not much progress has been made this summer. WBA without Lukaka AND Fortune are a very different side.

 

They looked good going forward last season, but they were still terrible overall. Hell, we looked good going forward the season we went down too... There are probably at least 3 worse sides though. Stoke fans will long for Pulis by Xmas. I don't think West Brom will go down, they're too solid defensively and just need to get Vydra up to speed.