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Victor Wanyama - Officially Signed

patred44

By patred44,
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Olallana

Olallana

Posted
Posted

I dont really get all this "if he doesn´t wanna play for the club then f*ck him" statements...

 

Let´s not kid ourself and think that foreign players will think "yes it´s always been my dream to play for Southampton" when we approach them. We dont have that kind of history that foreign players will feel that way. If we were Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal or clubs in that bracket we might, but were not them.

I dont even think we will find many players in England that would feel that by the way.

 

If we want to attract good foreign players we will have to give them a good bid first to make them somewhat interested and then we can talk about "the project" and the ambitions but it´s a normal first reaction that players will think that we are not their first choice. I am sure we will be able to attract good players but it will rarely be a case when we can offer something and the player straight away will accept it. Football players as everyone else have the right to negotiate their wages, it´s up to the clubs to decide if they think it´s worth it.

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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

^ Because it's a risk, he's had some good European games but that's a handful, week in week out he's playing against league 1/2 standard players.

 

Also Arsenal don't spend money and I don't think any of the other top 4/5 need that sort of player at the moment.

 

I don't have a problem with players pushing for as much as they can (even though the amounts they earn is obscene), but seriously...a million pounds for a couple of days of haggling is crazy

 

Especially considering Saints have probably done most of the work.

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hutch

hutch

Posted
Posted

Unfortunately these days it seems that you don't just buy a player, you buy his agent as well. They come as a package, and the agent will be hanging around the club for as long as the player is on our books.

 

If these reports are true then this package probably doesn't suit Saints philosophy, so best to move on. No doubt the agent will find somebody willing to pay what he's asking.

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Saint_John

Saint_John

Posted
Posted

Imo the 10%/12.5%/15% is just to STALL any deal until later in the window. The Agent will probably reduce it later to the normal of 5% later.

 

What if the Agent has been told by another Club that there is a chance that Reina/Suarez to Spain; Fellaini to Arsenal or Bale to Spain etc. etc. MIGHT happen and the selling club would be interested in his services. ("Keep us informed ....").

 

If we satisfied the Agents demands now I bet "another issue" would arise tomorrow, for example "Clauses in contracts about speaking to other CL Clubs in 12 months for £10m" etc.

 

I think something similar happened last summer with Gaston but no one came in later in the window to beat our offer. The difference this summer is that someone north of the border has been "leaking" information to put everything in the press.

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Cabrone

Cabrone

Posted
Posted

If what we read is to be believed we want him, Celtic want the money, the player 'appears' to be OK with wages so the only block is the agent.

 

If no other clubs come in for him then NC can afford to wait, look around for alternatives and squeeze the greedy agent till he bursts.

 

It's about time clubs took a stand on greedy agents. It's the fans that ultimately pay.

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Professor

Professor

Posted
Posted
I dont really get all this "if he doesn´t wanna play for the club then f*ck him" statements...

 

Let´s not kid ourself and think that foreign players will think "yes it´s always been my dream to play for Southampton" when we approach them. We dont have that kind of history that foreign players will feel that way. If we were Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal or clubs in that bracket we might, but were not them.

I dont even think we will find many players in England that would feel that by the way.

 

If we want to attract good foreign players we will have to give them a good bid first to make them somewhat interested and then we can talk about "the project" and the ambitions but it´s a normal first reaction that players will think that we are not their first choice. I am sure we will be able to attract good players but it will rarely be a case when we can offer something and the player straight away will accept it. Football players as everyone else have the right to negotiate their wages, it´s up to the clubs to decide if they think it´s worth it.

 

I don't think this is quite what people are saying. Of course no club can recruit players who are fans of the club and every player wants to earn what he thinks he's worth. The point is motivation, as that can provide the extra effort on the pitch that can make the difference in performance. Other players sign saying they can see the club's ambition and want to contribute to it, obviously after they have agreed the right wages, but in Wanyama's case we haven't heard anything about wanting to play in the Premier League for football reasons. Instead, all we've heard about is money.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted

The revelations keep coming... :)

 

image_normal.jpgAlex Goring Crook ‏@alex_crook

#epl insiders tell me Cortese is 1 of the hardest chairmen to negotiate with but he comes into his own in situations like this #saintsfc

 

image_normal.jpgAlex Goring Crook ‏@alex_crook

Cortese made #afc pay top dollar for Chamberlain, then a League 1 player, persuaded Ramirez to come and will not be held to ranson by agents

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speed demon

speed demon

Posted
Posted

Exactly this.

 

I think people are missing the point slightly about the greedy agent thing.

 

We've offered a good sum which has been agreed and I'd assume we would offer a decent package with that.

 

The player doesn't want to come here thats pretty obvious to me and the agent thing is just a stalling tactic

to allow any other clubs (hopefully higher profile than us) to come in and do the deal.

 

He would of course be happy to join a lower profile club like us or Cardiff if a) his agent gets a big fat chunk of cash

and b) whoever is paying the player the most in the first place but if Arsenal came in tomorrow with a £12 mil bid but stated

quite clearly that they are not paying £1 mil agent fees, what stance do you think VW and his agent would take?

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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
I dont really get all this "if he doesn´t wanna play for the club then f*ck him" statements...

 

Let´s not kid ourself and think that foreign players will think "yes it´s always been my dream to play for Southampton" when we approach them. We dont have that kind of history that foreign players will feel that way. If we were Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal or clubs in that bracket we might, but were not them.

I dont even think we will find many players in England that would feel that by the way.

 

If we want to attract good foreign players we will have to give them a good bid first to make them somewhat interested and then we can talk about "the project" and the ambitions but it´s a normal first reaction that players will think that we are not their first choice. I am sure we will be able to attract good players but it will rarely be a case when we can offer something and the player straight away will accept it. Football players as everyone else have the right to negotiate their wages, it´s up to the clubs to decide if they think it´s worth it.

 

Maybe we shouldn't be looking to sign good foreign players, and instead look to sign good domestic players.

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

Posted
Posted (edited)
Maybe we shouldn't be looking to sign good foreign players, and instead look to sign good domestic players.

 

There aren't many, and the ones that exist are hugely overpriced and the affordable ones completely unproven.

 

Lets remember we would be signing Wanyama with CL experience for less than Henderson and Allen cost Liverpool, less than Andy Carroll, Gareth Barry, Wilfried Zaha who has only played in the Championship and approx 8m less than Wigan want for James McCarthy who would be well pushed to get into our team!

Edited by Saint Charlie
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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11700/8791621/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

Much more detailed quotes here. Sounds like a right t055er his agent.

 

Interesting that the final offer from us was made 2 weeks ago. Says a lot to me - we have put our marker down and are not moving and Wanyama's plans might not be going quite to plan. Interesting that there is so much in the news now from him and his party. NOt surprised that there is nothing from Cortese. I know that some of it will be from journalists digging up a story, but seems that the agents are going to have to work pretty hard to get their exorbitant fee. To a certain extent, I hope the young lad's career isn't adversely affected by the greed of his representatives.

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11700/8791621/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

Much more detailed quotes here. Sounds like a right t055er his agent.

Reading that makes me think this now wont be happening for us. Hard to go on after those quotes, but looks likes he's definitely not going back to Celtic. He's potentially digging himself a bit of a hole here and playing a dangerous game with his career.
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Turkish

Turkish

Posted
Posted

Is it usual for the buying club to pay all the agent fees? I always assumed that the total figure of the transfer was the figure quoted with a percentage of the total fee going to the agent, hence why so many deals are "undisclosed" these days. If this is the case and i'm only going by what i thought would be the case, is the agent demanding more than the usual percentage that he would get? If so then the agent is trying to screw over Celtic as well, they clearly want to cash in as they've said he can go for the right offer. they aren't going to be too happy if he isn't sold this summer as his value is only going to decrease with just a year left on his contract.

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

Posted
Posted
Is it usual for the buying club to pay all the agent fees? I always assumed that the total figure of the transfer was the figure quoted with a percentage of the total fee going to the agent, hence why so many deals are "undisclosed" these days. If this is the case and i'm only going by what i thought would be the case, is the agent demanding more than the usual percentage that he would get? If so then the agent is trying to screw over Celtic as well, they clearly want to cash in as they've said he can go for the right offer. they aren't going to be too happy if he isn't sold this summer as his value is only going to decrease with just a year left on his contract.

 

Yes, his quotes indicate that Celtic's preference is also to sell to us because our offer is highest which makes sense. Thats probably why we won't panick until another club offers what we have. No sense in Celtic accepting an offer that is lower than ours.

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JoeShmoe

JoeShmoe

Posted
Posted
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11700/8791621/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

Much more detailed quotes here. Sounds like a right t055er his agent.

 

That reads to me as if they are saying to Celtic accept a lower fee so we can make our million on the deal, what a bunch of tossers, just hope no other club in this country accepts these demands as it just continues to set a dreadful precedent

 

NC, as usual, is bang on with this one

 

Deals off as far as i can see. Time to move on as im sure the club have

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Sour Mash

Sour Mash

Posted
Posted
Yes, his quotes indicate that Celtic's preference is also to sell to us because our offer is highest which makes sense. Thats probably why we won't panick until another club offers what we have. No sense in Celtic accepting an offer that is lower than ours.
Yep, as things currently stand, Cardiff would need to meet our £12m fee to Celtic, the £1m+ to the agent, plus whatever wages Wanyama is after. That'll make lots of clubs think twice.
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tajjuk

tajjuk

Posted
Posted

I love the quote from the agent that says -

 

Added to this is the fact that by Celtic refusing him permission to join Queens Park Rangers last summer, Victor lost more than £1m in potential salary earnings - yet he just kept his mouth shut and continued to be a model professional. Many other players may not have adopted this attitude, in the circumstances

 

Ignoring the fact he would now be in the championship. :lol:

 

Basically very much an agent who thinks he can hold clubs for ransom and clear that he doesn't particularly care about the players career just how much money there is to be made.

 

Have to applaud Cortese's stance on this, seems like if this all happened two weeks ago the leaked information is probably them posturing to get more deals on the table because their little games to get us to pay more hasn't worked.

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Colinjb

Colinjb

Posted
Posted
Nobody at Celtic can question his attitude and he is hopeful he can leave on good terms with the club. He loves the club and its fans, he's played his heart out for the jersey....but he didn't quite expect that it may end like this

 

And whose fault is that Ivan Modia?

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PokingFun

PokingFun

Posted
Posted

It is interesting that the agent says the player has lost £1m in salary earnings after QPR failed with a bid in the summer.

 

That suggests his wage demands are going to be at least £20k per week more than he earns at Celtic. Add to that the fact that his stock has risen somewhat in the last 12 months due to CL performances and also the Premier League now has the increased TV rights deal and you probably get a salary request in excess of £40k per week from the player even without the agents taking a bigger than average cut. This seems a lot of money to me for a defensive midfield player that the top 4 have clearly not seen as being good enough for them. Also, I'm guessing it would put him quite a bit above Morgan and others who do similar roles and there is no guarantee he is a better player so maybe the club are considering harmony within the squad when negotiating which is probably a good thing at this stage of the clubs development.

 

I suspect this latest press report released by the agent is a tactic to get other clubs to offer more than we have to both the player and the agent (or to get us to up our offer by indicating other interest). In their eyes, a quick deal is not really in their interests so they will keep their options open until later in the window and hope they snare a better deal or if that doesn't happen that our deal remains on the table. A dangerous game for them but I suspect Celtic will be forced to sell regardless if the lad is in the last year or so of his contract so maybe not such a big gamble for them as we think.

 

I suspect this one has a fair way to run yet.

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buctootim

buctootim

Posted
Posted

To some extent we've made a rod for own backs. Until a year ago no-one would be expecting mega money from Saints. Now we have set the precedent of paying one £12m player £70,000pw why shouldn't another £12m player in Wanyama expect the same deal.

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Nigel=God-Poyet=Sod

Nigel=God-Poyet=Sod

Posted
Posted

I think he is a great player but after this whole episode over the transfer and agent fees, I say let him stay at Celtic. If we are willing to pay £12M for a central midfielder then that is great news. There are plenty out there with greater pedigree than Victor available for similar amounts and I'm sure Cortese is exploring those avenues. Money can be spent elsewhere on somebody with a greater desire to play PL football rather than demanding huge agent fees.

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Dig Dig

Dig Dig

Posted
Posted
To some extent we've made a rod for own backs. Until a year ago no-one would be expecting mega money from Saints. Now we have set the precedent of paying one £12m player £70,000pw why shouldn't another £12m player in Wanyama expect the same deal.

 

So we shouldn't ever pay good money and good wages on players we want or else face being fleeced by agents?

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Barry Sanchez

Barry Sanchez

Posted
Posted

In terms of grunt where players will want to go

 

United

Liverpool

Chelsea

Arsenal

Spurs

The rest

 

Where money talks

City

Chelsea

United

Liverpool

Spurs

Arsenal

 

Current success over the last 10 years

 

United

Chelsea

City

Liverpool

Arsenal

The rest

 

 

 

In short we dont feature, we will have to pay far more money to secure the players to attain a European position hence us ever getting there is ********. We cant spend more money than the above and the above are more attractive for these types of players, so we have to do it in house, the chances of us finding 7/8 players to do that in a single team are the same as Fergie did with the fledgings in the early 90's, the issue with that is we dont have Fergie and we are not United.

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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

Posted
Posted
So pleased we have Cortese in charge. £1,000,000 for the agents alone? What a **** take. I hope we move on, these agents deserve diddly squat.

 

Nixon was saying it's way more than just £1m as well. Ridiculous.

 

And BS. I thought you went on and on and on about how Ramirez is only here for the money? Doesn't that fit in with 'money talks'?

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Barry Sanchez

Barry Sanchez

Posted
Posted
Nixon was saying it's way more than just £1m as well. Ridiculous.

 

And BS. I thought you went on and on and on about how Ramirez is only here for the money? Doesn't that fit in with 'money talks'?

 

Well yes it does, you are making my point for me, we have a vastly overpaid player who does not want to be here as he would rather be somewhere else but came solely for the money.

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DuncanRG

DuncanRG

Posted
Posted

Hard to know what's really going on, but if all this agent stuff has some truth to it then I'm glad we're talking about Wanyama instead of, say, a top centre forward. Great as Wanyama is, and as much as he'd improve our team, he's not essential and we can afford to miss out. No reason to cave if those are the demands.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11700/8791621/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

 

Much more detailed quotes here. Sounds like a right t055er his agent.

 

Burning bridges at both ends. Good luck with that Mr Modia....

 

Wouldn't surprise me if Celtic now called his agent's bluff and refused all other offers (apart from any 'silly' offers over and above ours of course)

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
What I don't understand is why he is in Kenya. He is still contracted to Celtic so should surely be back in Scotland and in pre season training with them again.

 

This. It doesn't quite add up. They've got their first competitive game in exactly 3 weeks (Champions League qualifier). Why are (some of) their players still on holiday?

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

Posted
Posted
This. It doesn't quite add up. They've got their first competitive game in exactly 3 weeks (Champions League qualifier). Why are (some of) their players still on holiday?

 

Its normal. He was playing some Kenyan Intls so will be later back, just like Clyne, JWP, Gaston and Maya will be for us.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
Its normal. He was playing some Kenyan Intls so will be later back

 

Fair enough, although there's only been 2 Kenya internationals since the end of the season (5th and 12th June). So, with the last game of the Scottish PL season being 19th May I still think it's slightly odd that he's still on 'holiday' 3 weeks before the start of their season. Anyway, I'm sure Celtic know what they're doing.

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