What was fan violence like in the 80s at the dell?

[stanthemanfairoak]

sorry sir...forgot t'mention the polygon/beehive boys with their loafers and feather cuts!!

 

lol

[paris]

Thanks TijuanaTim ,very well summed up .....

[Miltonaggro]

From a purely historic point Southampton and the Dell was very much part of the whole scene and were intrinsically linked. Nothing could be taken for granted. The town was a haven of nightlife and rival gangs from all over the place that would band together under, in front of and to the left of the 'chocolate boxes' on the Milton starting with the 'boot boys' in about 1967, then skinheads, suedeheads, smoothies and onto the post-punk 'casuals' which still exist in numbers these days.

 

I could do this more detailed, however, off the top of my head it was kinda like this in catagories.

 

Names/origins of some of the crews: The two most ominous were the massive Wimpson (aka Hatchet Men) and the small, yet extremely tasty Market Diner from St Marys. Weston, Portswood, Pylands, Sholing, Thornhill/Hightown, Shirley Warren and the Flower Roads all had their fair share of wrong 'uns. Along with that they'd be small bands from outlying areas like Hedge End, Eastleigh and even my 'frontline' manor out in the Western Wards of Fareham (Swanwick, Sarisbury, Titchfield Common) apologies to anyone over looked.

 

Names: Some of those that were to regarded cautiously had names like Killer, Bootsie, Charlie, Dougal, Malc, Jessie, Vic, Hoss, Gilo and Psycho...sorry cannot be any more specific than that.

 

Music: Firstly reggae, followed immediately by Stax and Tamla Motown. Later Philly and Northern. Jazz-Funk, Club then Acid and all the modern stuff.

 

Clobber: Funny enough it was stuff like army boots and believe or not crash helmets with Saints or SFC that were the first noticable things on the Milton. '68ish it was all Doc Marten's, Ben Sherman's, braces, hoiked up 501s, Harringtons, Sheepskin coats and cropped hair. Directly followed by Fred Perry's, Sta-prest, Tonics, bomber jackets, monkey boots, brogues and pork pie hats. As 72 came, hair was longer and the same 'lads' togged up in Rupert checks, wedge soled shoes, penny collars and leather coats with really baggy jeans. Everyone went their own ways until the 'Fred Perry' rudeboy revival in the late 70s which preceded the tidal wave of the casual movement with it's Trim Trabs, Lois jeans, ST, L&S, Pringle, Barbour coats, wedge cuts and mullets. Now we all know as it has progressed to the present time you can add Armani, SI, C.P. Company and a host of other designer...yet funny enough almost every 'retro' style/design is still kosher...well maybe except the 72 look?

 

Obvious Dangers: (Early days) Number One and over all others was always Man Utd's huge army of raggamuffins from all over the nation, Chelsea - sneaky lot, West Ham - diverse, older and very naughty, Leeds - bullies. (Later on) Millwall, Everton.

 

Be careful ofs: Spurs and pompee.

 

Over-rated: Liverpool, Arsenal, Geordies and most Midlanders.

 

Significant events (and surprises): (only home, so no Bristol, Oxford, Spurs, Ipswich, Marsielles, Limerick, Hamburg, Highbury, Bradford, Forest, pompee etc away jaunts)

Spurs and Arsenal being on their toes in the Milton.

70-71 Home to Chelsea - fans not with their colours, individuals being 'jumped', Hoss being acid-attacked.

Biggest away following I ever saw Saints 2 Man U 5, the Dell was over-run

Saints v West Ham pre-xmas 1971, the Milton was truly 'taken'

Stoke's surpise presence on a Tuesday night in Aug 72

War on relegation Saturday .v. United again in 74.

When we stuffed 4 past pompee in the 70s

One amazingly crazy pre-season game with a small, mental Hearts lot.

Millwall 1977 and again 1978

Leeds 1979

Brum 1985

Everton 1985

pompee 1988 urgh

 

As I said it's 'off the top of the head stuff' and absolutely not a glorification reflection...just a memory of bygone stuff. Anyone remember any of these observations as well?

 

Nice work Tim, thanks for that. my first match was 1977 as a nipper so you must have a few years on me, but I clearly remember the tail end of the 70s culture at the Dell, which had a very different feeling to the early 80s. One abiding later memory is the Brighton away match in 1986 when thousands of Saints turned up and were given a corner and one whole side (uncovered terrace) at the Goldstone Ground - for some reason all the old faces were there, and the Brighton fans and the local constabularly had no idea how to deal with it. The key thing is that all of this was 30-40 years ago, so social history...

[1960saint]

Early seventies was no picnic on the football terrace like it is now,it was like standing close ,shoulder to shoulder, there was no health and safety about in those days,you would get drunks, off their face from newcastle brown ,geezers in donkey jackets and splashed bleached jeans ,dm.s , ready to start a ruck ,falling all over the place ,taking a p*ss on the terrace or in the bloke in front pockets.and this was in your Home end , when it did kick off every body scattered. surprising as there was no room to swing mouse let alone a cat .if you moved out of your space you lost it ,end off. no getting a steward to sort it .no cctv ,not like the nanny state you got now.

Another thing you use to get when walking about at football matches was ' Barging ' this is where two guys would shoulder barge each other while walking towards each other, often resulting in a stand off ,a head butt or a punch up .saying that it was a blokes weekend off work, a way to to let off steam ,ah yes .the good old days

[I.O.W SAINT]

Who was the saints fan who used to stand in the Archers in the late 70"s with the 20 hole DM's and had a bulge in his face,he used to bloody scare me. Was he hard?

[yorkie]

Who was the saints fan who used to stand in the Archers in the late 70"s with the 20 hole DM's and had a bulge in his face,he used to bloody scare me. Was he hard?

 

Was it his nose?

[Marino]

I remember the home game v Brum in 85 when they secured the point/s which saved them from relegation.

Mark Dennis was their LB and led the Brum celebrations which prompted their fans to invade the

pitch and try and run thru the stands. Luckily the OB and dogs were there in numbers.

[TijuanaTim]

Yeah that is correct sir, potential carnage, one thing though that game was in May 1983. Psycho Dennis became a Saint by November that year and turned out to be one of our greatest ever signings. Mark dressed and behaved like most of the (ex-Warrens) 'Wagon' lads.

 

Which beggars another catagory :- Haunts/Battles (only Town as many outlying areas had fortresses like the Shield, Star etc)

1970 and on Haymarket, Gattis, The Southerner and The Park Inn

1972 and on The Warrens, Spa Tavern, Lord Louis

1978, The Alex, Cricketers

80's, Painted Wagon basically

....after that who knows, it was scattered plus I'd come here to LA

 

Anyone wanna do a 'club' section?

 

I remember the home game v Brum in 85 when they secured the point/s which saved them from relegation.

Mark Dennis was their LB and led the Brum celebrations which prompted their fans to invade the

pitch and try and run thru the stands. Luckily the OB and dogs were there in numbers.

[chi saint]

Throughout the decades Southampton and football violence have been synonymous. Southampton has long held a fearsome reputation and long been regarded one of the most violent and notorious firms in football violence history. This reputation was largely formed in the seventies, The Milton Road end, along with the Shed at Chelsea, the chicken run at West Ham and the Stretford End at Manchester United remain the only ends that have never been taken by an opposing firm.

 

Into the 80s and the causal movement and as firms became more organised so Saints came into their own. Such was our reputation that sick of being battered everytime we met them, bitter enemies Millwall and Portsmouth joined forces to attack us in a 1985 cup game, whilst both clubs had sinister elements in their ranks even as a combined mob they were no match for the Saints and the firms were chased through Southampton back to St Denys, tails between their legs and teeth in the pits of their stomachs.

 

In 1984 chelsea were another club to tey their luck against our firm. They were Routed. time and spin from Chelsea goes that it was Chelsea that had the upper hand that day, but anyone there will tell you the sight of 250 chelsea fans runnning theough school fields and breaking into Springfield school to escape the baying, snarling mob of Saints was something to behold.

 

In the late 80s Nottingham Forest were another firm to try their luck with their notorious leader Paul Scarrott, at the time the self titled toughest hooligan in England leading them into battle. As was standard procedure by then Forest were destroyed in a crushing victory for the Saints in what became known as the Battle of Bedford Place, whcih afterwards resembled a scene from Braveheart and eye witnesses saying members of the public, including a 75 year old man and a pregnant women, as well as the Forest Executivr Crew, were running for thier lives. rumour has it Scarott was so traumatised at the vicious beating inflicted on he and His mob that day he never recovered and hit the booze to blank out the Memory. Sadly Scarott died several years later, the wounds still raw. RIP.

 

Pick up any hooligan book though and you will rarely see a mention of Southampton, for two reasons. Like all great war historians firm authors only like to record victories and few can claim such a feat when they meet the Saints. Another reason is such was our reputation it became known that taking a firm to Southampton was a suicide mission and something only the crazy would do, hence violence at the Dell receded to virtually non existing by the late 80s, simply due to the fear other clubs firms felt as soon as they uttered our name.

 

It's difficult to believe that as a city and club we could have gone from being the most terrifying away day in England to a stadium with dancing dogs and fancy dress. Some might call that progress but I wouldn't be so quick to agree. I for one am proud of my Southampton brothers at the reputation we had in a very different time and era.

 

 

I am assuming this is a wind up....are you writing a fictional novel, in the vein of 50 Shades of Grey based on the obvious vicarious pleasure in relation of the actions of others. Albeit those actions are, from reading others posts, somewhat romanticised with the passage of time. As for your final quote "gone from being the most terrifying away day in England" I assume you are referring to some of the night spots as such as Fridays or Barberella's?

 

I don't wish to cast doubt on your 'experiences' but certainly whilst i'm a proud Sotonian, this exposition doesn't resemble the days you cite.

[The Kraken]

I am assuming this is a wind up....

Which part gave it away?

[Foxy]

I remember going to a game with my uncle as an 11- or 12- year old and standing on the Milton Rd end for a game against Arsenal. Some away fans were standing next to us and when their team scored they leapt up in the air, only for the chap standing on the other side of them to calmly splat his pie into on of said Gooners' grinning face.

 

Chicken and mushroom, it looked like. Does that count?

[Turkish]

Which part gave it away?

 

Some of it is true Krackers, Chelsea headhunters did break into Springfield school in 1984, Pompey did turn up at an FA cup game against Millwall at the Dell in 1985 and Paul Scarrott was Forest top boy in the late 80s, liked a drink and is dead. I just put a pompeyesque spin on the events.

[TijuanaTim]

An entertaining read, however, sometimes 'much truth in jest'. agin, not glorifying incidents, just relaying some the way it was remembered. This thread is titled around the Dell, so is limited. Most of the notoriety of Southampton was gained away from the Polygon and Dell areas on the road, most notably.

 

69 Oxford Cup

70 Spurs away

71 Palace away

72 & 73 Ipswich

Xmas 73 the advent of Coombsie's commandos at Bramell Lane

76 Bradford Cup

76 Marseille

77-78 Bristol Rovers Cup

79 Leeds away LC

Then from 80 onwards all over the shop Highbury 84, WHL 86, Everon valley, Hamburg, QPR, Luton and a scary one in Limerick of all places, where a lad known to most on here uttered those immortal words to a sizable mob of Irish geezers hungry for Anglo blood "You'd better #^({ off now while you got the chance, we're professionals at this!!" Still cannot believe to this day that all concerned got out of there untarnished....in that case 'words spoke louder than actions', thank goodness.

Add to that Tottenham's Sammy with our top boy at the Central station, the Warren's last stand, a failed surprise ambush at the Wagon by pompee wannabes, the infamous Fareham station meeting with 'Newtown' guys, the Tabby Cat incident.

 

Always maintain that pompee and other clubs used to spend more time talking about and photographing it. The last thing anyone I ever knew, would take to a game was a camera FFS

 

 

Some of it is true Krackers, Chelsea headhunters did break into Springfield school in 1984, Pompey did turn up at an FA cup game against Millwall at the Dell in 1985 and Paul Scarrott was Forest top boy in the late 80s, liked a drink and is dead. I just put a pompeyesque spin on the events.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

The Warrens on a match day was quite something , i do remember before one match in there seeing a small axe laying on a shelf and it wasn't for show i can tell you , the owner/s sitting nearby would not hesitate to use it .....

 

My younger brother went to St. Georges with the owner of the axe. Is V still around?

[EastleighSoulBoy]

When did Saints mob start using the Archers?The first time i remember seeing one was against Sunderland in 1977/

 

There were many who would leave the Milton to get into the Archers when the big doors were opened, some 10 to 15 minutes before the game ended. The

police grew wise to this so those same lads just went in the Archers from the start. This practice started somewhere about 74 with some lads from Eastleigh and Portswood.

[Toomer]

Anyone remeber The Battle of Watts Park in the early 70s Wimpson & Weston v The Market Dinner & Co and there was the time when the Wimpson boys and a few others went Over to Totton to have a meet with Cottage Cafe Greasers.

[TijuanaTim]

Anyone remeber The Battle of Watts Park in the early 70s Wimpson & Weston v The Market Dinner & Co and there was the time when the Wimpson boys and a few others went Over to Totton to have a meet with Cottage Cafe Greasers.

 

That rumble, relegation, the Mecca closing and Scullards, kind of marked a spell of calm in town for a good while.

[70's Mike]

From a purely historic point Southampton and the Dell was very much part of the whole scene and were intrinsically linked. Nothing could be taken for granted. The town was a haven of nightlife and rival gangs from all over the place that would band together under, in front of and to the left of the 'chocolate boxes' on the Milton starting with the 'boot boys' in about 1967, then skinheads, suedeheads, smoothies and onto the post-punk 'casuals' which still exist in numbers these days.

 

I could do this more detailed, however, off the top of my head it was kinda like this in catagories.

 

Names/origins of some of the crews: The two most ominous were the massive Wimpson (aka Hatchet Men) and the small, yet extremely tasty Market Diner from St Marys. Weston, Portswood, Pylands, Sholing, Thornhill/Hightown, Shirley Warren and the Flower Roads all had their fair share of wrong 'uns. Along with that they'd be small bands from outlying areas like Hedge End, Eastleigh and even my 'frontline' manor out in the Western Wards of Fareham (Swanwick, Sarisbury, Titchfield Common) apologies to anyone over looked.

 

Names: Some of those that were to regarded cautiously had names like Killer, Bootsie, Charlie, Dougal, Malc, Jessie, Vic, Hoss, Gilo and Psycho...sorry cannot be any more specific than that.

 

Music: Firstly reggae, followed immediately by Stax and Tamla Motown. Later Philly and Northern. Jazz-Funk, Club then Acid and all the modern stuff.

 

Clobber: Funny enough it was stuff like army boots and believe or not crash helmets with Saints or SFC that were the first noticable things on the Milton. '68ish it was all Doc Marten's, Ben Sherman's, braces, hoiked up 501s, Harringtons, Sheepskin coats and cropped hair. Directly followed by Fred Perry's, Sta-prest, Tonics, bomber jackets, monkey boots, brogues and pork pie hats. As 72 came, hair was longer and the same 'lads' togged up in Rupert checks, wedge soled shoes, penny collars and leather coats with really baggy jeans. Everyone went their own ways until the 'Fred Perry' rudeboy revival in the late 70s which preceded the tidal wave of the casual movement with it's Trim Trabs, Lois jeans, ST, L&S, Pringle, Barbour coats, wedge cuts and mullets. Now we all know as it has progressed to the present time you can add Armani, SI, C.P. Company and a host of other designer...yet funny enough almost every 'retro' style/design is still kosher...well maybe except the 72 look?

 

Obvious Dangers: (Early days) Number One and over all others was always Man Utd's huge army of raggamuffins from all over the nation, Chelsea - sneaky lot, West Ham - diverse, older and very naughty, Leeds - bullies. (Later on) Millwall, Everton.

 

Be careful ofs: Spurs and pompee.

 

Over-rated: Liverpool, Arsenal, Geordies and most Midlanders.

 

Significant events (and surprises): (only home, so no Bristol, Oxford, Spurs, Ipswich, Marsielles, Limerick, Hamburg, Highbury, Bradford, Forest, pompee etc away jaunts)

Spurs and Arsenal being on their toes in the Milton.

70-71 Home to Chelsea - fans not with their colours, individuals being 'jumped', Hoss being acid-attacked.

Biggest away following I ever saw Saints 2 Man U 5, the Dell was over-run

Saints v West Ham pre-xmas 1971, the Milton was truly 'taken'

Stoke's surpise presence on a Tuesday night in Aug 72

War on relegation Saturday .v. United again in 74.

When we stuffed 4 past pompee in the 70s

One amazingly crazy pre-season game with a small, mental Hearts lot.

Millwall 1977 and again 1978

Leeds 1979

Brum 1985

Everton 1985

pompee 1988 urgh

 

As I said it's 'off the top of the head stuff' and absolutely not a glorification reflection...just a memory of bygone stuff. Anyone remember any of these observations as well?

 

About right Tim

 

hard thing to explain was Wimpson and Market Diner at each other in the Park's during the Summer but united on the terraces

[70's Mike]

Sorry sir...forgot t'mention the Polygon/Beehive boys with their loafers and feather cuts!!

 

duncan will be upset

[70's Mike]

Yeah that is correct sir, potential carnage, one thing though that game was in May 1983. Psycho Dennis became a Saint by November that year and turned out to be one of our greatest ever signings. Mark dressed and behaved like most of the (ex-Warrens) 'Wagon' lads.

 

Which beggars another catagory :- Haunts/Battles (only Town as many outlying areas had fortresses like the Shield, Star etc)

1970 and on Haymarket, Gattis, The Southerner and The Park Inn

1972 and on The Warrens, Spa Tavern, Lord Louis

1978, The Alex, Cricketers

80's, Painted Wagon basically

....after that who knows, it was scattered plus I'd come here to LA

 

Anyone wanna do a 'club' section?

 

forgot Scullards Tim

[TijuanaTim]

forgot Scullards Tim

 

Hello Mike sir....Scullards is mentioned in the very last post my friend, right above your first. I was in there with Dave Parsons the day before that crazy Diner/Wimpson...all hell broke loose, I think the Scullards closed up immediately after that even though the two were un-related.

[70's Mike]

Hello Mike sir....Scullards is mentioned in the very last post my friend, right above your first. I was in there with Dave Parsons the day before that crazy Diner/Wimpson...all hell broke loose, I think the Scullards closed up immediately after that even though the two were un-related.

 

stand corrected, i also remember having a few in the Park Inn in Pound Tree Road then into the bookies. History frowns on a lot that went on but within that time I made some great friends and what always sticks out for me was some of them could actually play football to a good standard.

I was in town with wife a few weeks back and it becomes harder to remember exactly where these places of my youth were and when they disappeared

[adrian lord]

It is telling that the OP asked about the 80s but got a thread back about the 70s! 80s hooliganism was a lot of show and no go.

[BallBoy]

I can't believe I actually lived through the 70's and 80's and never even knew about any of this. Must have been watching football or something!

[Kind of Red]

Dave Parsons, I recall the day of the F.A.Cup final, in the morning I went down to the Painted Wagon where the coaches were leaving from. I saw some girls who I recognized, so I asked them what they were waiting for, they said they had tickets for Dave Parsons coach! Five pounds for the bus ride and a Cup Final ticket. I quickly found another coach, I think they were still waiting when arrived back at 7:30! I remember there being something in the Echo about it, never saw him again after that.

[rednrednredandwhite]

Can't believe Dave would do that ;-)

[Gemmel]

Some of it is true Krackers, Chelsea headhunters did break into Springfield school in 1984, Pompey did turn up at an FA cup game against Millwall at the Dell in 1985 and Paul Scarrott was Forest top boy in the late 80s, liked a drink and is dead. I just put a pompeyesque spin on the events.

 

I assumed the first part of your original post was cut and pasted

 

As for Chelsea and springhill. The police decided that for that match they would keep the Saints fans in and get Chelsea down to the train station and out of town.

This was a first and they ended up outside the Milton waiting for Saints fans who were locked it. Saints fans then kicked the old wooden doors of the Milton down to get at them. It was my first ever bloodbath As 12 year old kid, it was exciting, scary etc...... seriously messy.

 

Chelsea did then go on to smash up springhill and also the convent (Classy eh) up the road. They were then banned from the Dell for the following season.... Which was great as my old man was away on business and I sold his season ticket to a Chelsea fan for 40 quid...... Big money in those days for a 13 year old.....We won one nil if I remember correctly :)

[Wade Garrett]

I play golf with someone who was involved with that Wimpson/Market Diner altercation. He instructed his mate to get a gun out of his car as he thought his Market Diner nemesis was more than adequately tooled up.

 

I have no reason to doubt him, as his name is revered by the Saints hooligans of the day.

 

Not a bad golfer either.

[70's Mike]

I play golf with someone who was involved with that Wimpson/Market Diner altercation. He instructed his mate to get a gun out of his car as he thought his Market Diner nemesis was more than adequately tooled up.

 

I have no reason to doubt him, as his name is revered by the Saints hooligans of the day.

 

Not a bad golfer either.

 

Starting pistol i believe

[Guided Missile]

Starting pistol i believe

Bored out and shooting ball bearings. Killed the next door neighbours cat while testing it, I seem to recall...

[PinkScarf]

The fact is the Girls have been out on the Town tonight ... forget the past - it has a context but in 2013 tribalism is live and well in the Fair City of Southampton. Met a few lads tonight who still have an issue with wet Spam.

 

No-one has forgotten the two drunken gobby individuals outside the Chapel goading Southampton Fans last season.

 

This season if there is a repeat of the same - they will be seriously sorted out - drink or no drink.

[Turkish]

They even name airport gates after us .We are known  everywhere 

 

 

[The Kraken]

Strolling around the terminal unchallenged, I can only imagine.

[Turkish]

53 minutes ago, The Kraken said:

Strolling around the terminal unchallenged, I can only imagine.

Done two of Europes major cities this week, been guests of some of those countries top firms strolled around unchallenged mugged off the mugs buried the bulbs, popped the balloon heads. DEF rule supreme 

[Sarisbury Saint]

Explain to a thicko like me ?

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Sarisbury Saint said:

Explain to a thicko like me ?

It’s probably for the best you don’t know all the details. However the Dell Elite Force or DEF as they are know were formed on the pubs and terraces round the Dell and by some of the toughest men in Europe. The DEF are widely considered to be the most notorious group of football hooligans this country has ever seen. They moved away from the large scale disorder common place in the 80s and 90s to being more like the SAS of football hooligans, striking suddenly, viciously in small groups often without warning. Few other clubs could live with the DEF, once I recall reading a hooligan forum discussing a recent routing a firm had taken at the hands of the DEF and when asked how they did it, the reply was “you brought builders, accountants and scaffolders, we brought professional hooligans” 

Edited 30 November, 2023 by Turkish

[sad saints fan]

I missed this discussion when it originated all those years ago but I think some of you will be sorry to hear that Steve Jewett one of the original Wimpson and later on Portswood boys recently passed away . I was at his funeral at Stoneham East chapel and that was completely full with well over 100 people listening to the service outside .

The wake was held at the muni golf course and there were some right old hard nuts from the late 60's and 70's there . 

[TheAlehouseBrawlers]

43 minutes ago, sad saints fan said:

I missed this discussion when it originated all those years ago but I think some of you will be sorry to hear that Steve Jewett one of the original Wimpson and later on Portswood boys recently passed away . I was at his funeral at Stoneham East chapel and that was completely full with well over 100 people listening to the service outside .

The wake was held at the muni golf course and there were some right old hard nuts from the late 60's and 70's there . 

You beat me to it, was going to mention that after reading the ‘starter pistol’ post earlier but had run out of posts. A few years older than me but heard plenty of tales over the years. Good to hear he had a good send off and very appropriate his wake was up the Muni where he spent many hours with his docker mates.

[Turkish]

10 minutes ago, TheAlehouseBrawlers said:

You beat me to it, was going to mention that after reading the ‘starter pistol’ post earlier but had run out of posts. A few years older than me but heard plenty of tales over the years. Good to hear he had a good send off and very appropriate his wake was up the Muni where he spent many hours with his docker mates.

Was/is royalty amongst certain sections. One of the original faces around town. Sad times when these characters pass on

[Breeny]

This thread bought back many memories from half a century and half a world away !

Especially Haymarket , Warrens pubs 

Battle in Watts Park - I was a Market Diner Skin .. Ipswich away .. I recall a pre season friendly at Brighton where we took thousands .. all singing along the beachfront. 
 no one mentioned  the skin girls of the era . They were formidable led by Pat Lovelock who I dated at one stage until she beat me up ! I remember her kicking in a big male  skinhead Palace fan outside Selhurst Park ! 

Edited 1 December, 2023 by Breeny

[Yorkshire Saint]

10 hours ago, Turkish said:

It’s probably for the best you don’t know all the details. However the Dell Elite Force or DEF as they are know were formed on the pubs and terraces round the Dell and by some of the toughest men in Europe. The DEF are widely considered to be the most notorious group of football hooligans this country has ever seen. They moved away from the large scale disorder common place in the 80s and 90s to being more like the SAS of football hooligans, striking suddenly, viciously in small groups often without warning. Few other clubs could live with the DEF, once I recall reading a hooligan forum discussing a recent routing a firm had taken at the hands of the DEF and when asked how they did it, the reply was “you brought builders, accountants and scaffolders, we brought professional hooligans” 

Not noticed this thread before and have enjoyed reading it through. 

I think the North Yorkshire Air has got to you a bit though Turkish, either that or your civil service although I genuinely find your posts enjoyable to read regardless of what is fact and what is fiction. Thankyou for bubbling this back up. 

 

[64saint]

Like others, really enjoyed the old memories on this thread. Seems like only yesterday when standing under the chocolate boxes at the Milton road in the 70s as a young teenager.  Was it Dougal who always appeared 10 minutes before kick off wearing his crash helmet and we knew that any opposition fans standing under the Toomers would be then asked ' politely' !!!!! by him and his mates if they would care to vacate their position on the terrace 😂😂

Edited 1 December, 2023 by 64saint

[Turkish]

3 hours ago, Yorkshire Saint said:

Not noticed this thread before and have enjoyed reading it through. 

I think the North Yorkshire Air has got to you a bit though Turkish, either that or your civil service although I genuinely find your posts enjoyable to read regardless of what is fact and what is fiction. Thankyou for bubbling this back up. 

 

I think we need to be more like Pompey, they are the masters of spin and myth. However whilst Pompey spent the 70s-00s taking photos of themselves to put on social media in the 10-20s we were there doing it, prove me wrong.

[Sarisbury Saint]

20 hours ago, Turkish said:

It’s probably for the best you don’t know all the details. However the Dell Elite Force or DEF as they are know were formed on the pubs and terraces round the Dell and by some of the toughest men in Europe. The DEF are widely considered to be the most notorious group of football hooligans this country has ever seen. They moved away from the large scale disorder common place in the 80s and 90s to being more like the SAS of football hooligans, striking suddenly, viciously in small groups often without warning. Few other clubs could live with the DEF, once I recall reading a hooligan forum discussing a recent routing a firm had taken at the hands of the DEF and when asked how they did it, the reply was “you brought builders, accountants and scaffolders, we brought professional hooligans” 

Where the fuck have I been for the last 45 years of following Saints 😮.

First I’ve ever heard of this.

I always thought we were the ugly inside crew 🫤

[Yorkshire Saint]

7 hours ago, Turkish said:

I think we need to be more like Pompey, they are the masters of spin and myth. However whilst Pompey spent the 70s-00s taking photos of themselves to put on social media in the 10-20s we were there doing it, prove me wrong.

🤣 I think I still have some contacts in the infamous 657 ... although im sure they have a Facebook page somewhere 🙄 with 6 likes or follows.

[Turkish]

1 hour ago, Yorkshire Saint said:

🤣 I think I still have some contacts in the infamous 657 ... although im sure they have a Facebook page somewhere 🙄 with 6 likes or follows.

Pass my regards on to them, I would struggle to recognise any of them as I’ve only ever seen the backs of their heads if millwall are the champions of hide and seek the 657 could our pace Usain Bolt. 

[manji]

1 hour ago, Sarisbury Saint said:

Where the fuck have I been for the last 45 years of following Saints 😮.

First I’ve ever heard of this.

I always thought we were the ugly inside crew 🫤

The Warrens initially although there was a good Skinhead contingent when I was a kid led by a fella named Bootsy if I remember rightly. Again the Ugly / Inside was from the older lads who sat upstairs in The Painted Wagon and the younger Casuals who sat downstairs. The Wagon was often subjected to unscheduled attacks by the 6.57. Once when they were on their way back from some game down west, another time when they just hired transit vans. Of course the legendary assault on the Cowherds where all our lot assembled on Sunday lunchtimes.

 

Edited 1 December, 2023 by manji

[Turkish]

20 minutes ago, manji said:

The Warrens initially although there was a good Skinhead contingent when I was a kid led by a fella named Bootsy if I remember rightly. Again the Ugly / Inside was from the older lads who sat upstairs in The Painted Wagon and the younger Casuals who sat downstairs. The Wagon was often subjected to unscheduled attacks by the 6.57. Once when they were on their way back from some game down west, another time when they just hired transit vans. Of course the legendary assault on the Cowherds where all our lot assembled on Sunday lunchtimes.

 

Bank holiday Monday on the common when we absolutely battered them, remember two skate running towards me and i pulled a mental bin lid off a bin and smashed one of them round the head whilst kicking the other in the bollocks, gave a third a clothes line move before an elbow to the ribs as another came from the side, heard one say on the floor these geezers like John Claude Van Damme, I said no, I’m the one and only Turkish as I pissed on his head turn round his mates and said “who wants it next?” No one volunteered. But you won’t find that in their books 

Edited 1 December, 2023 by Turkish

[Yorkshire Saint]

2 hours ago, Turkish said:

Pass my regards on to them, I would struggle to recognise any of them as I’ve only ever seen the backs of their heads if millwall are the champions of hide and seek the 657 could our pace Usain Bolt. 

I wont. They are c***s

I am with you brother. 

Edited 1 December, 2023 by Yorkshire Saint

[Turkish]

16 hours ago, Sarisbury Saint said:

Where the fuck have I been for the last 45 years of following Saints 😮.

First I’ve ever heard of this.

I always thought we were the ugly inside crew 🫤

You don’t slip under the old bills radar by gobbing off about what you’ve done. No other firm is going to admit to being battered every week by a small group of lads from Southampton.