buctootim Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Trials are going on to see if unmanned commercial flights are technically feasible - which its seems very likely they will be, if not right now then very soon. Would you pay to fly BA to New York in what would effectively be an unmanned drone? Personally I wouldn't have a problem with it, although only after a few accident free years when any bugs had been ironed out. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22511395 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dellboypete Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Is this anything to do with the Air India thread below? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Trials are going on to see if unmanned commercial flights are technically feasible - which its seems very likely they will be, if not right now then very soon. Would you pay to fly BA to New York in what would effectively be an unmanned drone? Personally I wouldn't have a problem with it, although only after a few accident free years when any bugs had been ironed out. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22511395 No they wont. We aren't ready for even a single pilot commercial aircraft yet, let a lone a pilotless aircraft. A small demonstration aircraft with a pilot on board doing the take off and landing isn't even close to being pilotless. There are a thousand and one things a pilotless aircraft couldn't do. Having pilots on the ground instead of the aircraft would be more feasible but if the data link between the ground and the cockpit was lost that would be a serious issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 This is Ryanair, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 13 May, 2013 Author Share Posted 13 May, 2013 No they wont. We aren't ready for even a single pilot commercial aircraft yet, let a lone a pilotless aircraft. I said its nearly technically possible, which it is. Remotely operated unmanned drones take off, carry out spy missions, launch weapons and then land again routinely in Afghanisatian and elsewhere. I didnt say commercial operations are about to start, which is a whole different ball game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Sorry I thought you were implying commercial flights will soon be pilotless. Unmanned drone missions in war zones are one thing. Nobody really gives a crap if they crash because nobody is on board but they do crash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 :lol: I bet the 747 glider passengers were glad pilots (and a flight engineer) were on board. My mate says he wouldn't want to have to do it with only two pilots, especially as he wasn't on the flight deck when it happened. I hope they will put ash detectors and lightning avoiders on them, never mind crosswind limits of 15 knots. Autopilots aren't certified to deal with severe turbulence and running out of fuel. There is no autopilot on a current airliner that can do a take off. I can see the news now, maiden pilotless flight cancelled due lack of passengers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 There are many things a computer couldn't do. - Recognise a flock of birds in the vicinity of the airport and delay departure until they had been scared off. - Correctly use a weather radar. Pilots can look at radar reflections and tell the difference between a violent CB and just patches of heavy rain. Military radar can frequently cause interference and appear as a large red stripe on the screen. - Hear unusual noises. - Smell unusual smells. - Land on anything other than a CATIIIb certified runway. Even if you are flying between major airports with this capability, it would rule out a lot of airports in case of an emergency diversion. - Take off -Taxi - Recognise and deal with turbulence. Even only light or moderate levels, a pilot will often change altitude if possible for the comfort of everyone on board. A computer will just sit there fat dumb and happy. It wont warn other pilots, it wont warn the cabin crew or passengers. That's just off the top of my head, I'm sure I could come up with a lot more if I thought about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Can't even get the batteries right on the B787, generators often fail, APUs fail to start, the pilot's unions will kill this one. What price getting insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerBadger Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 This is Ryanair, right? You have to pay an extra £5 and book in advance if you want a real pilot (£15 if you book on the day). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Stand Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 :lol: I bet the 747 glider passengers were glad pilots (and a flight engineer) were on board. My mate says he wouldn't want to have to do it with only two pilots, especially as he wasn't on the flight deck when it happened. I hope they will put ash detectors and lightning avoiders on them, never mind crosswind limits of 15 knots. Autopilots aren't certified to deal with severe turbulence and running out of fuel. There is no autopilot on a current airliner that can do a take off. I can see the news now, maiden pilotless flight cancelled due lack of passengers. You are correct Dave except that I had only popped to the loo, you make it sound as though I had nothing to do with it!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Is that why the 744's have a loo on the flight deck? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Now and then whilst taking people around a certain tourist attraction I mention the Pilot, by name, and his excellent crew that saved that flight and how dangerous volcanic ash can be. Slightly off topic but I bet that a tremendous amount of pilots are very scathing about these idiots. http://dtinews.vn/en/news/017004/29073/vietnam-airlines-captain-to-face-fine-for-allowing-model-to-pose-in-cockpit.html The idiot in the pic is the first officer and I wonder if it was the captain taking the photo? Anyway no pilot was in control.Doesn't matter if the auto pilot was on as they can be disconnected by accident. I would have thought that they would have lost their licences for ever but they only got fined a small amount. The captain Nguyen Ngoc Nhu Y was fined $333 and the co-pilot Nguyen Xuan Hai $143 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I am assuming a pilot (but not perhaps an additional co-pilot) will still be on board for emergencies. Computers and radio links frequently land planes and take control 500ft after take-off already (got this from an air-traffic controller), and of course we have auto-piloting during the main part of the flight. Cannot see pilots being done away with altogether. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 i like them driverless trains on the DLR or whatever. I always go right up front + pretend to be driving choo-choo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Now and then whilst taking people around a certain tourist attraction I mention the Pilot, by name, and his excellent crew that saved that flight and how dangerous volcanic ash can be. Slightly off topic but I bet that a tremendous amount of pilots are very scathing about these idiots. http://dtinews.vn/en/news/017004/29073/vietnam-airlines-captain-to-face-fine-for-allowing-model-to-pose-in-cockpit.html The idiot in the pic is the first officer and I wonder if it was the captain taking the photo? Anyway no pilot was in control.Doesn't matter if the auto pilot was on as they can be disconnected by accident. I would have thought that they would have lost their licences for ever but they only got fined a small amount. The captain Nguyen Ngoc Nhu Y was fined $333 and the co-pilot Nguyen Xuan Hai $143 Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.... Arrrgggggggghhhhhhhhhh..... You bstd. I'm flying on a Vietnam Airlines A321 next month. Just ruined my entire trip. Damn, now to find another overnight train... Or maybe buy a Motorbike and stick a big wooden sailing boat on the back of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.... Arrrgggggggghhhhhhhhhh..... You bstd. I'm flying on a Vietnam Airlines A321 next month. Just ruined my entire trip. Damn, now to find another overnight train... Or maybe buy a Motorbike and stick a big wooden sailing boat on the back of it Perhaps the young lady can keep you entertained and keep your mind on other things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skintsaint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 so a pilotless airplanes would need someone on the ground to kinda control it and an emergency pilot on the plane? Seems a bit pointless really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 so a pilotless airplanes would need someone on the ground to kinda control it and an emergency pilot on the plane? Seems a bit pointless really. Safer for the driver? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wurzel Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 I have seen men flying remote controlled model aircraft safely without incident, so no reason why a scaled up version shouldn't work ok. I think the flaw in the plan is the ability of the controller to keep up with the plane as he runs after it as it approaches maximum transmission/reception range, vainly pointing his aerial in the direction of the plane and hitting the buttons harder and harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Safer for the driver? Would you get a on a plane which had that kind of design philosophy? Would be rather unnerving for the passengers thinking the pilot wasn't onboard because it is considered too dangerous. I can't take anything like this seriously whilst we still have train and tube drivers (The latter of which get paid a lot more than an newly recruited airline pilot.) A train which runs in one direction, along a fixed track at a fixed altitude. All there is to control is the speed and if there is a problem you can just stop. If a vehicle this simple still has a driver (main down to unions) then pilotless commercial airlines are decades away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Working in the automotive component industry as I do, I can tell you the absolute f**king minefield there is to go through to get acceptance for safety critical electronic systems, such as steer-by-wire. The civil aviation industry is even worse. For me, pilotless air travel is either so far off the scope that we need not worry in our lifetimes, or wont happen ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericofarabia Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 No way can this happen!! 1/ Who would be doing The Captain Speaking chat before take off and landing to the passengers 2/ Who would the Hosties (and Stewards) fancy 3/ Who would Air Traffic Controllers berate for the a/c not doing as instructed :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 No way can this happen!! 1/ Who would be doing The Captain Speaking chat before take off and landing to the passengers 2/ Who would the Hosties (and Stewards) fancy 3/ Who would Air Traffic Controllers berate for the a/c not doing as instructed :-) I think they should replace all ATC operators with Computers. Make all those lazy overpaid numpties redundant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericofarabia Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Aimed at anything in particular ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simples Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 The Captains message will be done by the onboard computer and will go something along the lines of; "Welcome aboard this maiden flight of a pilotless aircraft. We are now on the runway and about to take-off. Please enjoy the flight, nothing can go wrong, go wrong, go wrong, go wrong.....". Seriously, I hope this doesn't happen as I'll need a new job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 (edited) You are correct Dave except that I had only popped to the loo, you make it sound as though I had nothing to do with it!!!! Probably the fastest you've ever moved. Glad it wasn't me. Edited 14 May, 2013 by derry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokyo-Saint Posted 14 May, 2013 Share Posted 14 May, 2013 Blue screen of death at 30,000 ft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egbb saint Posted 15 May, 2013 Share Posted 15 May, 2013 I think they should replace all ATC operators with Computers. Make all those lazy overpaid numpties redundant. That IS closer than you think. By the end of the decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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