docker-p Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I think Cortese and a number of posters on here way over estimate his importance to us. If he left he would be replaced swiftly and with little trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 It was sung once I think, with plenty not joining in. True, though not many joined in to what was a poor atmosphere on the whole. Apart from Shaw, dont think any of our players got a song. People more interested in giving the latest manc chant a run-out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ant Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 While it would be remiss to dismiss this out of hand, there's too many ifs, buts and maybes to leap straight to the worst case scenario. If we're going to put stock into the report, what's a fair headline? Something along the lines of Nicola Cortese Seeks Guarantees Over Future, surely. If he receives those reassurances it becomes inconsequential for the near future. There really is a whole spectrum of possibilities between the club being flogged to a dodgy owner and continuing on its current path. Understandable to be a little jumpy, but it's hardly DEFCON 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy_D Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 So, seems to be a dispute over transfer funds being made available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docker-p Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Alex Goring Crook@alex_crook For what its worth i would expect Cortese to stay Think this is a game of brinkmanship to get investment he wants over the summer #saintsfc I think it's probably more about his rewards rather than money for team buiding, justguessing obviously. My advice to the good Liebherr people is to call his bluff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Everton and to an extent United are the clubs we were (guffaw) supposed to be emulating, the issue is to do so we need to spend an awful lot of money, it really is that obvious, without that money we wont get anywhere near it. David Moyes spent £16m net on transfers in his time at Everton. In premiership terms, that is far from an awful lot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 David Moyes spent £16m net on transfers in his time at Everton. In premiership terms, that is far from an awful lot of money. Net, all that shows he is very good in the transfer market. http://www.transferleague.co.uk/premiership-transfers/everton-transfers.html That list shows intent and really good buys, a couple of crap ones but something we need to aspire to if we want to get to European football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSAINT Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Alex Goring Crook@alex_crook For what its worth i would expect Cortese to stay Think this is a game of brinkmanship to get investment he wants over the summer #saintsfc I very much hope Mr Crook is right. I've been buzzing about this summer for Saints, and now I'm gutted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tajjuk Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Whats wrong with his buying capabilty? Mayuka Ramirez Guly..................... Lol, clasping at Straws with Guly, very hard to make him out to be a bad signing. He might not be premier league player but considering he was signed in league one he's helped us get promoted. Ramirez has also done ok. In fact you can't really question his buying quality considering we've gone from league one to staying up in the premiership. You trolling attempts are laughably funny. A plan was agreed between Marcus and Cortese from the start and presumably the family now want to change this slightly, in what way we don't know but seeing as they fund the club it;s up to them. Cortese's record speaks for itself though and has been proven right time and time again. It would be a big loss if he went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I think Cortese and a number of posters on here way over estimate his importance to us. If he left he would be replaced swiftly and with little trouble. Clueless IMO. Liebherr bought the club but Cortese has pushed it in. Anyone who can't see how important he is is mad. As soon as Cortese leaves we would have certainly lost an edge we currently have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stepgar Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 David Moyes spent £16m net on transfers in his time at Everton. In premiership terms, that is far from an awful lot of money. can you see him only spending 1 mill at Man Utd?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Shango Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 As with all these stories, the key to them is the source. Who gave the journalist the info, and what were his motivations for doing so? If you could find that out, you would be more than halfway to unravelling it. Was it a leak from Cortese for his own ends? Unlikely, as he doesn't really deal with the media. Did it come from somebody inside the club? If so, who? At what level are they? If it's a director, what's his reason for doing so? Is it malice, mischief? What's his agenda? Is it somebody from the football side? Did it come from Switzerland? Have the family leaked it for their own reasons, to undermine Cortese? The only person who can answer this is the author of the piece, and like any good journo, he won't reveal his sources. Tony Evans has said on Twitter and on 'The Game' podcast before that he speaks to Cortese. Would be very surprised if this hasn't come from NC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Alex Goring Crook @alex_crook 38m @garydear3009 would not be surprised if that happened. They considered selling a couple of years ago and NC helped talk them out of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Lol, clasping at Straws with Guly, very hard to make him out to be a bad signing. He might not be premier league player but considering he was signed in league one he's helped us get promoted. Ramirez has also done ok. In fact you can't really question his buying quality considering we've gone from league one to staying up in the premiership. You trolling attempts are laughably funny. A plan was agreed between Marcus and Cortese from the start and presumably the family now want to change this slightly, in what way we don't know but seeing as they fund the club it;s up to them. Cortese's record speaks for itself though and has been proven right time and time again. It would be a big loss if he went. We would struggle more if Mayuka or Guly went, we have now someone who can do the school run for the 1st teamers and Guly is a superb golf caddy................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint J 77 Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Anytime something good happens to saints there always seems a bad news story hot on the heels of it to. It's a pattern that I'm well used to now. Although, right now we don't really know for sure what Cortese leaving would mean to the ownership situation, I thought it was often widely believed if Cortese leaves The Liebherr family would pack up and leave with him. The BBC story seems to be suggesting otherwise though. If Cortese does go because he no longer has free rule and the family bring in someone else, will it be a good thing or not? Only time will tell I guess. Cortese has shocked and even disgusted me with some of his decisions in the past. But you can't really deny he has had big plans for us and so far he has fulfilled them. As mentioned alot the current team have bought into his vision so what will it mean to them if he goes? Maybe the family choosing to replace him is the first step in selling up as they feel the job their father set out to do is done? Whatever happens life too short to worry about it. Lets just concentrate on beating stoke and see what happens as it all unfolds in the coming weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 (edited) Interesting.... Ben Smith from the BBC (and previously of the Times) just said on twitter that Cortese is "very much" still committed to the Saints project and that the issue is "not about money, he just wants to be able to continue as he has since 2009." BBC article also has the line about Cortese having final sign off on decisions. Possibly the Liebherr's feel that at this level there should be a more democratic decision making process rather than Cortese ruling everything as he has got used to doing. He is probably saying he will leave if they try to change it....brinkmanship, although I don't doubt he would go through with it as he would feel he couldnt do his job as effectively with interference. From his point of view, after having such success, why would you want to lose any control? Ben Smith also replies to someone who said to hm that Cortese was "all for the future and very ambitious" by saying "That is exactly what it is all about." Essentially, Cortese is testing the Liebherr's ambition, and whether they match to his own. If they don't, he will leave. All IMHO of course. Edited 13 May, 2013 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He should as its fair run it as it has always run, if it aint broke dont fix it BUT he needs serious quality help with the transfers, **** of Leslie and get some real quality in there who knows football back to front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I understand from twiiter accounts from Pompey are us . that the real issue is NC doesent not want Tommy Forcast back at the club , but the trust do. Simples Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanRG Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He should as its fair run it as it has always run, if it aint broke dont fix it BUT he needs serious quality help with the transfers, **** of Leslie and get some real quality in there who knows football back to front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 98% of fans are worried that we need him as he is supposedly the gatekeeper to the Liebherr's money and support. Im not sure that's true, his current unbridled control of Saints may actually be a block to it.[/QUOTE] Why? In any case it's more than control over the purse strings. Cortese has implemented a plan which is more than just success on the field. It's included club infrastructure and philosophies away from the first team and nothing has stood still since he took over. I value this more so than just us breaking transfer records etc. Not every chief exec with access to cash will be interested in longevity of the club beyond immediate success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olallana Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He should as its fair run it as it has always run, if it aint broke dont fix it BUT he needs serious quality help with the transfers, **** of Leslie and get some real quality in there who knows football back to front. You mean like a former Argie national player that has been in the top of european football for almost 20 yrs and is already at the club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 98% of fans are worried that we need him as he is supposedly the gatekeeper to the Liebherr's money and support. Im not sure that's true, his current unbridled control of Saints may actually be a block to it.[/QUOTE] Why? In any case it's more than control over the purse strings. Cortese has implemented a plan which is more than just success on the field. It's included club infrastructure and philosophies away from the first team and nothing has stood still since he took over. I value this more so than just us breaking transfer records etc. Not every chief exec with access to cash will be interested in longevity of the club beyond immediate success. This. If he goes and another Chief Exec comes in, then that person won't have the same drive or ambition as he has. Especially not if Cortese leaves because the Liebherr's won't match his ambitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Right, so we've staggered to the end of this season, only to discover it will be more of the same next season, because the Liebherrs are pulling up the financial ladder. Thanks, Gaston.... And this attitude that NC will be easy to replace is f**king mental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I'm not sure why people view it as cortese good anyone else bad. That is not necessarily the case at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ART Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 From the Liebherr's point of view they can't be happy with the outlay of money, the failure of our purchases to do anything to improve our game. the necessity to remove Adkins and the replacement by Pochettino and his recent results leaving ud lower than when Adkins left. We are definitely changing from the clean family image club into a scruffy ramble led by a manager who can't bother to shave, (possibly not even shower) and turn up in jeans. This is not what Markus had in mind. Had we been relegated Cortesé and even the Liebherr family would no longer be about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Interesting.... Ben Smith from the BBC (and previously of the Times) just said on twitter that Cortese is "very much" still committed to the Saints project and that the issue is "not about money, he just wants to be able to continue as he has since 2009." BBC article also has the line about Cortese having final sign off on decisions. Possibly the Liebherr's feel that at this level there should be a more democratic decision making process rather than Cortese ruling everything as he has got used to doing. He is probably saying he will leave if they try to change it....brinkmanship, although I don't doubt he would go through with it as he would feel he couldnt do his job as effectively with interference. From his point of view, after having such success, why would you want to lose any control? Ben Smith also replies to someone who said to hm that Cortese was "all for the future and very ambitious" by saying "That is exactly what it is all about." Essentially, Cortese is testing the Liebherr's ambition, and whether they match to his own. If they don't, he will leave. All IMHO of course. Sounds about right pal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He should as its fair run it as it has always run, if it aint broke dont fix it BUT he needs serious quality help with the transfers, **** of Leslie and get some real quality in there who knows football back to front. You never did say why you thought boruc, clyne, cork, rodrigues and yoshida were bad signings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 From the Liebherr's point of view they can't be happy with the outlay of money, the failure of our purchases to do anything to improve our game. the necessity to remove Adkins and the replacement by Pochettino and his recent results leaving us lower than when Adkins left. We are definitely changing from the clean family image club into a scruffy ramble led by a manager who can't bother to shave, (possibly not even shower) and turn up in jeans. This is not what Markus had in mind. Had we been relegated Cortesé and even the Liebherr family would no longer be about. We're 14th, we were 15th when NA left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 98% of fans are worried that we need him as he is supposedly the gatekeeper to the Liebherr's money and support. Im not sure that's true, his current unbridled control of Saints may actually be a block to it.[/QUOTE] Why? In any case it's more than control over the purse strings. Cortese has implemented a plan which is more than just success on the field. It's included club infrastructure and philosophies away from the first team and nothing has stood still since he took over. I value this more so than just us breaking transfer records etc. Not every chief exec with access to cash will be interested in longevity of the club beyond immediate success. Because the original deal which gave him absolute control was agreed with ML. ML is now sadly dead and the deal expires next year. Its perfectly natural that the family who are now funding the club want more say over how their club is carried forward, particularly if they are being asked for another huge injection of funds. Would you give total control of your investment to a man you don't really know and don't necessarily trust? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 (edited) So, seems to be a dispute over transfer funds being made available? Yep, reckon that's it. The timing of the announcement which coincides impeccably with our safety and the certainty that we're planning for a new season in the prem, not champ speaks volumes in IMO. If true, hope Cortese isn't playing hardball by leaking things to the media. Its quite an antagonistic ploy and might not go down well with the Liebherrs. Likewise, don't think its a question of having no money to spend. Pretty sure some kind of budget/strategy which at one time was acceptable to all parties was agreed; but, perhaps, Cortese has now decided its not enough -and/or wants safeguards to ensure his autonomy. Edited 13 May, 2013 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Right, so we've staggered to the end of this season, only to discover it will be more of the same next season, because the Liebherrs are pulling up the financial ladder. Thanks, Gaston.... And this attitude that NC will be easy to replace is f**king mental. About the only time I have agreed with a sentence you have written. Plus, if Cortese leaves because the Liebherr's won't match his ambition that is in no way good news for the future, and makes it extremely unlikely that a "better" replacement will come in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett24 Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Fingers crossed he stays and he receives the backing he deserves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I'm not sure why people view it as cortese good anyone else bad. That is not necessarily the case at all. Not necessarily the case no but why would anyone be happy or even ambivalent about a change given what we have achieved in 4 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Because the original deal which gave him absolute control was agreed with ML. ML is now sadly dead and the deal expires next year. Its perfectly natural that the family who are now funding the club want more say over how their club is carried forward, particularly if they are being asked for another huge injection of funds. Would you give total control of your investment to a man you don't really know and don't necessarily trust? So much is wrong with this. 1. "The deal expires next year". What deal? 2. The family do know Cortese. 3. They must trust him a little seeing as he has probably tripled the value of their asset in 3 years. 4. Why would they want more say now, they never have done before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 You never did say why you thought boruc, clyne, cork, rodrigues and yoshida were bad signings? They were not Italian "knowledge" signings though were they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncanRG Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 From the Liebherr's point of view they can't be happy with the outlay of money, the failure of our purchases to do anything to improve our game. Do you really think we'd still be in the Premier League if we had Kelvin Davis in goal, Frazer Richardson at right back, Billy Sharp up front, Fonte and Hooiveld at centre half? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Can only assume this is a clash between Cortese wanting to push on at a faster rate next year than the rate at which the Liebherrs are prepared to release funds from Markus' trust This is probaly it! NC wants a significant amount of funds to take the next step the Trustees are relectunt to spend big, Nicola calls their bluff! Without him the club is worth a lot less! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Because the original deal which gave him absolute control was agreed with ML. ML is now sadly dead and the deal expires next year. Its perfectly natural that the family who are now funding the club want more say over how their club is carried forward, particularly if they are being asked for another huge injection of funds. Would you give total control of your investment to a man you don't really know and don't necessarily trust? Are you saying that they don't know and trust Cortese? Must have missed him at the Mali board meetings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaucho Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I posted a while ago (after Chelsea game I think) 2 rumours. One, that Cortese was going in the Summer because the family did not like the way Adkins was treated (came from a promiment supporter) and two, Ramirez was going to Fiorentina because his wife was not happy. It seems my source has been spot on twice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 You mean like a former Argie national player that has been in the top of european football for almost 20 yrs and is already at the club? He will or should only be a part of our transfer commitee, him and a Brit who knows the English game back to front, Les Reed aint that man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Great logic that leaves us concluding Everton had no chance of getting anywhere near Everton. Sorry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batman Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He will or should only be a part of our transfer commitee, him and a Brit who knows the English game back to front, Les Reed aint that man. what ever your other log in is, you are a complete muppet BTW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 They were not Italian "knowledge" signings though were they? So from that you mean cortese? Must have been Les reids signing then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Right, so we've staggered to the end of this season, only to discover it will be more of the same next season, because the Liebherrs are pulling up the financial ladder. Thanks, Gaston.... And this attitude that NC will be easy to replace is f**king mental. ALP's Funny, now that there are rumours he is going you suddenly decide the club has made more good decisions than bad and that he is irreplaceable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ART Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 He needs money for his ambitions. The family do not wish to fully meet the sums.... I honestly can't believe the Liebherr family can be happy with how money has been spent to date and the results gained. As I mentioned yesterday, based on what Pochettino has so far achieved, both here and previously, I wouldn't trust his ability to bring in decent players. His choice of squads, and players involved and leaving out others, leave big question marks on his capacity. If it were my money, I'd be asking a lot of questions, calling into question the Stooge on the board and his finger in too many pies. You can't say we're not getting results due to Fox and Gaston not being available. We aren't getting them because Pochettino's tinkering has resulted in lack of ability to score as we were doing previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 I posted a while ago (after Chelsea game I think) 2 rumours. One, that Cortese was going in the Summer because the family did not like the way Adkins was treated (came from a promiment supporter) and two, Ramirez was going to Fiorentina because his wife was not happy. It seems my source has been spot on twice! Well, if the tension between the Liebherrs and Cortese is over NAs dismissal, that at least means that there might still be transfer funds available for NC or a successor. It does seem that the family are not as far back into the background as we may have envisaged, and the most likely issue between them and NC is the waste of money on an unsettled Ramirez or the dismissal (and cost thereof) of NA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostBoys Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Peter Storrie is available - problem solved And Balram Chanrai is considering a bid and reinstalling Harry Houdini as manager - the stuff of nightmares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringwood Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 strange to have a 5 year plan for the club and then not be here to oversee it League 1 League 1 Championship Premiership ?????????? leave and do something else? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmel Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 .4. Why would they want more say now, they never have done before? My best guess (And it is only a guess) is the amount of litigation we seem to attract and the associated costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doggface Posted 13 May, 2013 Share Posted 13 May, 2013 Goring crook knows no more than me or you. His crew will only be told what tge club wants us to be told. follow the bbc on this one. would be gutted if he leaves, could be the end of our successful cycle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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