Defoe arried off... Ricky Call up??

[Saint_Jonny]

Sturridge out as well

[Monk]

Hooper and Rickie surely to be called up.

[Saint Garrett]

If Ricky doesn't get called up with Defoe and Sturridge out, then he never will lets be honest. There aren't that many English strikers anyway - let alone any that score goals.

 

Top English goalscorers

 

Walcott

Lambert

Defoe

Le Fondre

Crouch

 

then some other possibles..

Carroll

Hooper

Graham

Holt

Any Chelsea/Liverpool/Man Utd reserves...

[Restark19]

Hooper and Rickie surely to be called up.

 

don't reckon Roy will replace both Sturridge and Defoe, reckon it'll be one player called up if any, probably Carroll possibly Hooper unlikely to be SRL

Edited 4 February, 2013 by Restark19

[tajjuk]

Hooper and Rickie surely to be called up.

 

How many other English strikers are left?

 

Le Fondre - scored 10 goals

Bent - not playing, not scoring

Carroll - only just returned form injury poor golsscoring record at West Ham

Crouch - only 5 league goals

 

 

???

[Dr. Kucho]

There is no doubt Rickie is good enough to play for England. However Hodgson wants to start playing a new formation and Rickie has to fit in that new formation.

 

If Rickie doesn't get a call up we know the new formation is one designed to score very few goals.

[MOSaint]

There were a few quotes from RL in the Sun's match report for the game talking about his disappointment at not getting a call up, and he says nobody from the England set up has contacted him and nobody is watching him.

[Chez]

selfishly I hope he doesn't get called up. I don't want him getting injured or tired.

[Highfield Saint]

How old is Rickie now ? 31 ? He is too old for the England team TBH Im sick and tired of older players getting in the squad anyways.

 

There is Rooney, Welbeck, Walcott, Carroll and probably Sturridge.

 

The fact that Woy will go witha maximum of 2 strikers means itll be two out of three (walcott, Rooney, welbeck)

 

 

Actually Lambert and Defoe are both 30.

[Bearsy]

If I was England Manager this would be my pecking order for strikers:

 

1) Rooney

2) Defoe

3) Lambert

4) Welbeck

5) Walcott

6) Sturridge

 

I've literally never seen Hooper play tho, he might be good. Also I may be bias!

[Guan 2.0]

Can Hodgson please hurry up and name the replacements so we know whether to a) Blame him for leaving rickie out, accusing him of having a big club bias, or b) Selecting him, and blame him for 'turning SRL's head' next time he fails to score.

 

Chop chop! This sewious business woy (MEGALOLZ). We now have to come up with a 'hilarious' forum nickname. I nominate 'Woy Hedgehog' as the offical designation, as he will be a ***** many times over.

[lordswoodsaints]

England will always be sh!t whilst they persist in picking players that can't even hit form with their parent clubs but regular as clockwork get picked for our national team.......if you not in the club you can't get in.

[Crab Lungs]

It should be Le Fondre, Lambert, Rooney and Defoe (if all fit). Possibly Sturridge, but on performances/goals, it's got to be those four.

 

Then again, it never will be so I've just about given up on England.

[Window Cleaner]

It should be Le Fondre, Lambert, Rooney and Defoe (if all fit). Possibly Sturridge, but on performances/goals, it's got to be those four.

 

Then again, it never will be so I've just about given up on England.

 

 

Take away the penalties and work it out again. Gerrard and Lampard take England's penalties I think. Lambert is 8+3 don't know how that compares with the other hotshots.

[Dr Who?]

Do not think it will ever happen for him now

[tajjuk]

There were a few quotes from RL in the Sun's match report for the game talking about his disappointment at not getting a call up, and he says nobody from the England set up has contacted him and nobody is watching him.

 

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/12016/8469324?

[Saint Mikey]

I think there are plenty of good English strikers, just clubs prefer to sign foreign players. Even ones that don't exactly live up to their fees. English strikers, especially from small clubs and lower leagues aren't fashionable, but many do well. Bet Charlie Austin could score at this level too. JRod would have more if playing up front every week, Holt did ok, Lambert has been great, Le Fondre doing well. Yet having a nutter like Ballotelli scoring 11 a season on huge money is better, or splashing out on Borini. Be fascinating to see any of those strikers playing regularly for a top side getting plenty of chances. Same way Andy Cole wasn't brilliant but put him in a good side creating loads of chances and he scored a hatful.

 

Seems a long time ago there were countless English strikers scoring 20+. 20 wasn't even something to shout about, now it'll have you worth millions. Shearer, Sutton, Ferdinand, Fowler, Wright, Sheringham, Dublin, Le Tissier, those were the days. Not getting excited about the Welbecks and Sturridges of this world getting a couple of goals for big clubs.

 

I agree with you on your first point, and it is what is fundamentally wrong with English football. I'm hoping (maybe naively) that a combination of the Homegrown Player rule and FFP will curtail the influx of foreign players after a few years. Allowing our younger players a chance to develop in the game. It's going to take a while though...

 

Also to be fair to the clubs. English players just cost a lot more. How much would Charlie Austin cost? £5/6m? A gamble for someone who's soared up the leagues and not played at the top level. Borini has and done well in Italy, so 'appears' less of a risk. Two completely different players, I know. Also, Balotelli was a bargain compared to Carroll. Look at the fees paid for Henderson & Downing. You could even argue the £12m we got for Chamberlain was ludicrious for a Lge 1 player. Until there are a lot more quality English players, they are going to cost a fortune and we are going to be stuck in this vicious circle.

Edited 5 February, 2013 by Saint Mikey

[Saint Garrett]

Half the problem is that English academies seem to focus too much of being big, strong and quick - and turning these players into footballers, rather than finding a kid with superb footballing talent, and bulking them up. Maybe something to do with youngsters playing on pitches too big, so the bigger lads shine in that department. But then this is a whole different debate...!

[DrZuess1979 the 2nd]

Half the problem is that English academies seem to focus too much of being big, strong and quick - and turning these players into footballers, rather than finding a kid with superb footballing talent, and bulking them up. Maybe something to do with youngsters playing on pitches too big, so the bigger lads shine in that department. But then this is a whole different debate...!

 

 

THIS ^^^

 

Just think if Messi had been born here !!!

[saints-cris]

THIS ^^^

 

Just think if Messi had been born here !!!

 

Think of the countless players in the English game who were 'let go' because they were 'too small'. Hasn't stopped Xavi/Iniesta

[tajjuk]

Think of the countless players in the English game who were 'let go' because they were 'too small'. Hasn't stopped Xavi/Iniesta

 

IIRC Ashley Young was turned away for being too small by Watford and then picked up later. While some academies in England have been going down the big/strong/quick route not all have, look at ours with all of it's short blonde clones.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2066333/Ashley-Young-worked-hard-to-Manchester-United--Martin-Samuel.html#axzz2K1Cy9gaN

[Saint Garrett]

IIRC Ashley Young was turned away for being too small by Watford and then picked up later. While some academies in England have been going down the big/strong/quick route not all have, look at ours with all of it's short blonde clones.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2066333/Ashley-Young-worked-hard-to-Manchester-United--Martin-Samuel.html#axzz2K1Cy9gaN

But we seem to be the anomaly in that though. Don't get me wrong, pace and power give you headstart, but its these players who seem to be given the biggest opportunities in our country. Some teams have been built solely on it, and a lot of them being african players. Portsmouth for one?

[tajjuk]

But we seem to be the anomaly in that though. Don't get me wrong, pace and power give you headstart, but its these players who seem to be given the biggest opportunities in our country. Some teams have been built solely on it, and a lot of them being african players. Portsmouth for one?

 

True, although I'm sure Messi, Ineiesta and Xavi amongst other are changing attitudes about it, but it will take a while for it to ahppen in this country. Considerig the type of football and attrocious pitches you can't really blame lower league clubs for looking for physical monsters. In the premier league though Stoke aside some of the young players coming through like say Wilshere aren't massive.

 

I suppose having Le Tiss as one of our greatest players sets the blueprint for us, whilst not that small, he was hardly the most physical of players. Technique first and then if they have pace or power that's a bonus.

[saints-cris]

It's much more about the smaller type of players these days though, that's why Wilshire is so highly rated as he's the nearest we have to a Xavi/Iniesta. All about speed over 5-10 yards now and great technique, not being able to bully people. Yaya Toure is near perfect really. Sissoko of Newcastle looks a terror too, he roasted A.Cole on saturday!

[Saint Garrett]

Stoke and West Ham have shown that you can compete playing ugly football with physical 'monsters'. Not so long ago the Championship was dominated by big bruisers but it's not been like that for a few years now. Hopefully Stoke and West Ham can change the way they play, although can't see it happening under their current management.

[Saint Garrett]

It's much more about the smaller type of players these days though, that's why Wilshire is so highly rated as he's the nearest we have to a Xavi/Iniesta. All about speed over 5-10 yards now and great technique, not being able to bully people. Yaya Toure is near perfect really. Sissoko of Newcastle looks a terror too, he roasted A.Cole on saturday!

 

Sissoko is absolute class though. He was always very very highly rated in France - I thought one of the 'big boys' would come in for him but he never got that move and then has ended up as part of the french revolution at the Toon. He'd be a great fit for Arsenal or Man Utd IMO.

[saints-cris]

Sissoko is absolute class though. He was always very very highly rated in France - I thought one of the 'big boys' would come in for him but he never got that move and then has ended up as part of the french revolution at the Toon. He'd be a great fit for Arsenal or Man Utd IMO.

 

He looks the biz. People can knock Newcatle for going all French, but he seems an absoloute steal.

[Window Cleaner]

He looks the biz. People can knock Newcatle for going all French, but he seems an absoloute steal.

 

Newcastle already had him signed up for the summer apparently on a free but they just accelerated the move a bit for a fee of 3 million euros. His trouble is that he's inconsistent, right now everything is new and shiny, wait a while and he'll more than likely put in a dire performance or three. This is what puts top level recruitment off, they want the same performance game in game out for their 20 million.

[The9]

Probably Carroll. That's how ****ing silly the situation is! When Platini managed that great French side he stated that he picked players on form not on age. At the time this methodology was mooted to get Jimmy Case in the England side, but that never happened either!...

 

That "great French side" of 1988-1992, when they won nothing, failed to qualify for a World Cup and got knocked out in the group stage of Euro '92 ? It's not really a selling point is it ?

 

As far as Lambert goes, he's too old, too slow and too unfashionable to play for England. Carroll is a donkey on the ball but comparable in the air and with much more pace and agility, plus he's got 10 years over Rickie to improve. Michael Owen scored a header the other week, is he an option ? Lambert's biggest problem is he's not a great lone striker in an era when no-one plays 2 up top, Saints have built their whole attack plan around him which England couldn't, and he is probably better in the hole with someone else doing his running, which would be Rooney's job for England.

[The9]

Stoke and West Ham have shown that you can compete playing ugly football with physical 'monsters'. Not so long ago the Championship was dominated by big bruisers but it's not been like that for a few years now. Hopefully Stoke and West Ham can change the way they play, although can't see it happening under their current management.

 

Probably worth noting that aside from their effectiveness from set pieces, Stoke play a lot of exciting attacking wing-based football, West Ham still hoof a bit and are all about second ball percentages but can play it when needed, and Newcastle had the highest percentage of long balls to short passes in the Prem this season last time I checked around Xmas.

[The9]

Its a complete fallacy that he is too old. The England squad at the moment is being prepared for the World Cup which is next year. This is not "buikding for the future". He is not too old for the 2014 WC. 2016 Euros different, but surely even England are not using the WC as preparation for the Euros.

 

Given the outright unlikelihood of winning a World Cup held in Brazil, stupider things have happened than using a World Cup to prepare for the Euros.

[tajjuk]

Probably worth noting that aside from their effectiveness from set pieces, Stoke play a lot of exciting attacking wing-based football, West Ham still hoof a bit and are all about second ball percentages but can play it when needed, and Newcastle had the highest percentage of long balls to short passes in the Prem this season last time I checked around Xmas.

 

Stoke compete because of their excellent defensive organisation and in particular their two centre backs and goalkeeper. Shawcross, Huth and Begovic would improve most sides in the league. Their attacking play is predictable and they score a lot their goals through set pieces, particularly at home where their shrunken pitch turns average free-kick positions and throw in into more dangerous options.

 

It's notable that Stoke and West Ham have the lowest amount of away goals at 8 and 7. Stoke are also third lowest scorers in the league. If the allied their defensive strength with a more cultured and varied attacking style they would push up the league. They have done excellently in establishing themselves in the Premier League, but in a 4 years they have had a net spend of over £80 million and league finishes have actually seen them go backwards.

[The9]

Stoke compete because of their excellent defensive organisation and in particular their two centre backs and goalkeeper. Shawcross, Huth and Begovic would improve most sides in the league. Their attacking play is predictable and they score a lot their goals through set pieces, particularly at home where their shrunken pitch turns average free-kick positions and throw in into more dangerous options.

 

It's notable that Stoke and West Ham have the lowest amount of away goals at 8 and 7. Stoke are also third lowest scorers in the league. If the allied their defensive strength with a more cultured and varied attacking style they would push up the league. They have done excellently in establishing themselves in the Premier League, but in a 4 years they have had a net spend of over £80 million and league finishes have actually seen them go backwards.

 

The thing with attacking wing based football is that completion percentages are not that high for crosses. It doesn't mean they're not good to watch a lot of the time, you can't beat a nippy dribbler beating his man, and I'd rather see it than Saints parked ten yards into the opposition half mostly standing still playing 10 yard passes sideways for a couple of minutes as no-one attempts to create space or get in behind...

[Saint Garrett]

I don't know, it's pretty dull when a team only has one way of playing. Get it wide and boot it in the box, or boot it from keeper to CF. I think we have it about right as we can mix it when we want to.

[The9]

I don't know, it's pretty dull when a team only has one way of playing. Get it wide and boot it in the box, or boot it from keeper to CF. I think we have it about right as we can mix it when we want to.

 

I think that's a fair point, my point being Stoke and West Ham can also get it down when they want - Andy Carroll aside.

[Thedelldays]

Well. Be a big indication when we play west ham at home

 

I'm sure if we win, nickg will be all over it reminding me

 

If we don't win. One in the eye for us being better than half the teams above us be default

[Saint Garrett]

I guarentee if we stay up we'll finish above WHU next year. Because they'll be back at square one, especially if they don't end up signing Carroll. They'll be back to having Cole as their no1 striker until they buy someone else, an aging midfield, a poor defence and an old keeper.

 

I fully agree with adrian. Ok if you look at it at the end of the season and WHU finish above us, you could probably say they were better than us over the season...or as I would argue - more efficient.

 

We're building gradually and if we can keep this side together we will be comfortable next season. With our players having another year experience, the only one who will really be on the decline is Rickie and maybe Fonte, who may not even be in the side by then.

[Thedelldays]

All fair points. All well and good saying how much better we will be than west ham

 

We have won 1 in 9... Which will soon be 1 in 11 after the next two. Keep giving away leads and hovering dangerously above the relegation zone

 

Lets walk before we can go on about how much better we are than team a fair few places above us

[Saint Garrett]

All fair points. All well and good saying how much better we will be than west ham

 

We have won 1 in 9... Which will soon be 1 in 11 after the next two. Keep giving away leads and hovering dangerously above the relegation zone

 

Lets walk before we can go on about how much better we are than team a fair few places above us

 

Agree but it's not just about now is it. We clearly have a long term plan, and the foundations have been put into place for us to achieve that. We're at the start of it now and hence why we struggled at the start of the year. Time will tell but we have some superb young players here who I'm loving watching on a regular basis.

[Thedelldays]

Well. We need to do far better than 1 win in 9 (or 11)

 

Or we will be relegated

[Saint Garrett]

Well. We need to do far better than 1 win in 9 (or 11)

 

Or we will be relegated

 

That has included Man Utd, Everton, Chelsea, Arsenal, Stoke away, Yes we should have probably won a couple more but it's in our own hands and the remaining fixtures are easier than those we've just had IMO.

[Scummer]

Well. We need to do far better than 1 win in 9 (or 11)

 

Or we will be relegated

 

After 16 games (9 matches ago) we were 16th in the table, level on points with the 17th and 18th placed teams.

 

Today we are still 16th, but we've opened up a 3 point gap on the relegation zone.

 

That would indicate that our current form has been plenty good enough to avoid relegation.

[tajjuk]

The thing with attacking wing based football is that completion percentages are not that high for crosses. It doesn't mean they're not good to watch a lot of the time, you can't beat a nippy dribbler beating his man, and I'd rather see it than Saints parked ten yards into the opposition half mostly standing still playing 10 yard passes sideways for a couple of minutes as no-one attempts to create space or get in behind...

 

Not sure I mentioned any crossing precentages?

 

Nothing wrong with wing play and crossing the ball but that's not necessarily what Stoke do, they play back to front more often than not and look for the second ball. Not saying that's how they play all the time but I would say it's their plan A. It will always score them some goals but it's become less effective for them in reent years as most teams are fully prepared for it and can counter it. It's their defence that keeps them mid table, excellent positioning, tackling, marking and work rate thoughout the team along with two top quality centre backs and a class keeper.

 

Take their defence and swap it with ours they would easily be bottom, in the long run that style of football rarely works and Stoke have gone backwards in the last few years depsite decent investment.

 

All fair points. All well and good saying how much better we will be than west ham

 

We have won 1 in 9... Which will soon be 1 in 11 after the next two. Keep giving away leads and hovering dangerously above the relegation zone

 

Lets walk before we can go on about how much better we are than team a fair few places above us

 

A very 'glass half empty' view considering the teams we played. However you are correct West ham are currently better than us, we'll see by how much at the end of the season. The points though about long term sustainability are valid though, Allardyce keeps teams in the Premier league, he hasn't progressd many past that and eventually he gets moved on. Signing Joe Cole pretty much sums up where West Ham are going.

[Thedelldays]

hasnt allardyce got plenty of eurpean football under his belt...something we are all dreaming of with our top 6 targets...?

[NickG]

Well. We need to do far better than 1 win in 9 (or 11)

 

Or we will be relegated

 

Why?

 

That period that worries you has seen us pull away from on rivals.

 

They need to catch us.

 

Its likely if we continue same form we will be safe

[david in sweden]

Defoe looked in real trouble being carried off.... he wont report for England duty!!

Chance for Ricky to be called up for friendly?

 

 

shouldn't think so.....and then only if another 3 players get injured first......and then he'd only get on the bench......Houghton probably thinks were still in the Championship....