Nigel Adkins - Sacked

[colehillsaint]

 

Say what you like about Cortese but he's not stupid. He knows that this kind of change at this stage of the season is extremely risky, and that it would create a furore among the fan base and in the media. He wouldn't have done it unless, after very careful consideration, he was convinced that it was the right thing to do.

 

Don't be so gullible. It's not about being ****ing stupid. Napoleon wasn't stupid, but he stomped around Europe kicking asses until he thought he was infallible, and could conquer Russia in the winter. Even the second bloke to try it wasn't stupid. It's about over confidence, arrogance and not listening to good counsel. This may well be Nicola's "Russian front" Steve Wigley moment. I hope not, but it bloody looks like it.

[Clifford Nelson]

I met the decision with incredulity, but let's not forget that a football club is not a democracy. A chairman and/or board is backing it's judgement after having invested money in the enterprise. The biggest failures are the ones following their feelings, sadly to say, however nice it is that the chairman is blue/red/striped/whatever through and through. NC is the custodian of a considerable investment, and he is the one who will have to demonstrate results to the actual investor. He has decided to make a choice, we've better get used to it, because in the world of club and football management life is incredibly tough, with no place for softies.

 

Whilst I was delighted to see Pardew depart since I couldn't see a future in punting for Ricky's head, which I also didn't enjoy watching, I am thoroughly sad to see such a nice and genuine chap as Adkins lose his job. But then there is the analyst in me thinking about that the turnaround in our fortunes this season was NA's long chat with NC, leading to a number of games with an unchanged side after endless tinkering. Now we are back to tinkering and the once bold moves towards putting Ramirez in the middle of the park in a modern and flexible formation have drifted back into 4-4-2 and variations of it with Ramirez on the left or on the bench. I have felt the lack of certainty, and maybe the chairman has as well, although I think this decision was made a long time ago although not possible to realise until now. In the cold light of day it matters little. Only results do.

 

Let's not pretend that we've got a choice, since we are not going to campaign relentlessly as in the Branfoot days. Let's move on after the anger has left and support the new chap and the team. Demonstrations and protests on Monday night will contribute nothing. It really needs to be the king is dead, so long live the king.

[CanadaSaint]

Don't be so gullible. It's not about being ****ing stupid. Napoleon wasn't stupid, but he stomped around Europe kicking asses until he thought he was infallible, and could conquer Russia in the winter. Even the second bloke to try it wasn't stupid. It's about over confidence, arrogance and not listening to good counsel. This may well be Nicola's "Russian front" Steve Wigley moment. I hope not, but it bloody looks like it.

 

I'm not being gullible, I'm trying to be open-minded.

 

And if you have to go back 200 years to support your point, perhaps you need to try that as well.

 

I have significant reservations about today's events but I offered a potential explanation for them - one of several. I can't see Cortese making this highly risky move unless he was privy to information or perspective that nobody on this forum has.

 

Anyway, Napoleon didn't have the internet.

[OldNick]

The new manager is coming in before a very difficult run of games coming up. That brave timing for him to join us. I doubt NA would get us many points out of the next 4 games and so assume NC weighed up that the next 4 games gives the new man time to assess us. After the next 4 games he then must perform to get us to safety.

[dubai_phil]

I met the decision with incredulity, but let's not forget that a football club is not a democracy. A chairman and/or board is backing it's judgement after having invested money in the enterprise. The biggest failures are the ones following their feelings, sadly to say, however nice it is that the chairman is blue/red/striped/whatever through and through. NC is the custodian of a considerable investment, and he is the one who will have to demonstrate results to the actual investor. He has decided to make a choice, we've better get used to it, because in the world of club and football management life is incredibly tough, with no place for softies.

 

Whilst I was delighted to see Pardew depart since I couldn't see a future in punting for Ricky's head, which I also didn't enjoy watching, I am thoroughly sad to see such a nice and genuine chap as Adkins lose his job. But then there is the analyst in me thinking about that the turnaround in our fortunes this season was NA's long chat with NC, leading to a number of games with an unchanged side after endless tinkering. Now we are back to tinkering and the once bold moves towards putting Ramirez in the middle of the park in a modern and flexible formation have drifted back into 4-4-2 and variations of it with Ramirez on the left or on the bench. I have felt the lack of certainty, and maybe the chairman has as well, although I think this decision was made a long time ago although not possible to realise until now. In the cold light of day it matters little. Only results do.

 

Let's not pretend that we've got a choice, since we are not going to campaign relentlessly as in the Branfoot days. Let's move on after the anger has left and support the new chap and the team. Demonstrations and protests on Monday night will contribute nothing. It really needs to be the king is dead, so long live the king.

 

The new manager is coming in before a very difficult run of games coming up. That brave timing for him to join us. I doubt NA would get us many points out of the next 4 games and so assume NC weighed up that the next 4 games gives the new man time to assess us. After the next 4 games he then must perform to get us to safety.

 

Both very good posts

[buctootim]

I have significant reservations about today's events but I offered a potential explanation for them - one of several. I can't see Cortese making this highly risky move unless he was privy to information or perspective that nobody on this forum has.

 

I thought that about Blair and the WMD, until I saw the dossier and heard the enquiry. Colehillsaint is right I fear. This is just a stupid, stupid move, one so high risk that its wrecklessly negligent.

Edited 18 January, 2013 by buctootim

[TopGun]

We must support the new manager who may well be a success. I guess it's an irony that Cortese was forced to act now with only two weeks of the January transfer window left. He must have been hoping that Nigel would lose a couple of games and make it easier to replace him with MP. That's a moral victory at least for Nigel.

[CanadaSaint]

The new manager is coming in before a very difficult run of games coming up. That brave timing for him to join us. I doubt NA would get us many points out of the next 4 games and so assume NC weighed up that the next 4 games gives the new man time to assess us. After the next 4 games he then must perform to get us to safety.

According to the Beeb, Pochettino's "been researching the team for weeks", so he should be sufficiently familiar with us to allow some interesting decisions.At the risk of inviting incoming misiles, let's see if S. Davis and Guly start.

[CanadaSaint]

I thought that about Blair and the WMD, until I saw the dossier and heard the enquiry. Colehillsaint is right I fear. This is just a stupid, stupid move, one so high risk that its wrecklessly negligent.

 

You missed the bit about trying to be open-minded, didn't you?

[offix]

From a BBC article: "As the news began to leak out of St Mary's on Friday morning, it became clear the man who led the club from the lower reaches of League One to the Premier League in less than two years had not been told. "

 

IF that is true, and NA was not told first, that is really cowardly of Cortese

[colehillsaint]

I'm not being gullible, I'm trying to be open-minded.

 

And if you have to go back 200 years to support your point, perhaps you need to try that as well.

 

I have significant reservations about today's events but I offered a potential explanation for them - one of several. I can't see Cortese making this highly risky move unless he was privy to information or perspective that nobody on this forum has.

 

Anyway, Napoleon didn't have the internet.

 

Don't trust football chairman full stop. There are countless examples of them loosing the plot. Rather than Napoleon, chosen for the sheer size of his calamity, try Mr Rupert Lowe who looked anything but stupid circa 2004. Within a couple of years he had completely lost it. It can't have even stacked up for him on a personal financial level in the end, but he couldn't let it go, and listen to good counsel. Football just does that to a certain type of man. I hope I'm wrong but this just looks like history repeating itself, and what harm am I doing speculating about it on a fans forum.

[doddisalegend]

Which raises the question what was his expectations and if they were realistic? Surely surviving was the expectation?

If Cortese honestly thought with the squad we had just before the season started we were a top 8 finish certainty then he is more crazy then we think....

 

Sadly I think that is the exactly the case....

[S-Clarke]

Sadly I think that is the exactly the case....

 

He is a complete mentalist tbf.

[up and away]

The following have voted yes to the sacking:

 

ByTheGolacs, choccyboxkid, Dalek2003, Guided Missile, JustinR, manina-pub, manji, ozzmeister, Painswick Saint, Pete Pots, Rorymac, StBaz, Window Cleaner

 

I rest my case, m'lud!

 

I expect I would have found some way to keep way of keeping Adkin's in the job because he really is that nice a guy. But that gives me or you no rights to look at this sacking as short sighted. From the moment we gained promotion at the end of last season Adkin's wanted these players to get their chance in the Premier. All very nice sentiments but changing the goal keeper alone could have been enough now to have ensured our safety for this season. We had so little Premier experience in both management and playing, it's not surprising these things cost us so much. We have turned things around such we now have a chance, but others are turning things round.We have been playing some good football and against Arsenal I thought we were exemplary. That does not forgive capitulation against Liverpool where I thought we were going for a job interview rather that a game, hearing the same mantra from players and staff alike. Cortese must have been keeping his eyes open from the new year and before and has decided to go for an Argentinian with no Premier experience. little English but a good knowledge of La Liga. I don't like the sound of this one bit and would be reassured to be back on the bus but I don't know near enough what will be required to get us through to the end of this season. The trouble is that the players and management equally admitted to being in the same boat.

 

I am not going to criticise Cortese as the panto villain just because he is making decisions to keep us up. It won't make it any easier for Reading fans to feel that much better at the end of the season if they get relegated with McDermott. Should we go down as well after taking the alternative route then I feel this should be fully opened up but unsure of any cast iron result.

[pangy]

Nigel has done a fantastic job on these guys and he would of installed the belief that we can hold our own in this league,they will surely want to carry on the good work he has done by continuing the form we have been replicating.

Unless this guy comes in and f***s it all up by going 4-3-3 again and dropping Lambert I cant see how we will change that much,we have a great team spirit and the players play for each other you can see that.

[PercyR]

The new manager is coming in before a very difficult run of games coming up. That brave timing for him to join us. I doubt NA would get us many points out of the next 4 games and so assume NC weighed up that the next 4 games gives the new man time to assess us. After the next 4 games he then must perform to get us to safety.

 

In fact, I would wager a bet that this managerial change was fixed for after the Chelsea away game because NC thought that we would lose that game which would have then made the change look more palatable when it felt, for most fans, like a victory coming back from 2 - 0 down at half time and on the back of improving results makes this change look ridiculous and ill-timed.

[OldNick]

May I also say that when I mentioned about how fans were happy for KD to be cast aside after all he had done, There were posts saying you can't be sentimental etc etc those same people are now up in arms. Football has become is distasteful industry,I don't think it was ever different

[CanadaSaint]

Don't trust football chairman full stop. There are countless examples of them loosing the plot. Rather than Napoleon, chosen for the sheer size of his calamity, try Mr Rupert Lowe who looked anything but stupid circa 2004. Within a couple of years he had completely lost it. It can't have even stacked up for him on a personal financial level in the end, but he couldn't let it go, and listen to good counsel. Football just does that to a certain type of man. I hope I'm wrong but this just looks like history repeating itself, and what harm am I doing speculating about it on a fans forum.

 

No harm at all - that's what these things are for.

 

FWIW I share your reservations but I'm willing to entertain the possibility that there are some significant things beyond our sight and hearing. That doesn't make me "gullible", just open-minded. And there's no harm in that, either.

[OldNick]

I expect I would have found some way to keep way of keeping Adkin's in the job because he really is that nice a guy. But that gives me or you no rights to look at this sacking as short sighted. From the moment we gained promotion at the end of last season Adkin's wanted these players to get their chance in the Premier. All very nice sentiments but changing the goal keeper alone could have been enough now to have ensured our safety for this season. We had so little Premier experience in both management and playing, it's not surprising these things cost us so much. We have turned things around such we now have a chance, but others are turning things round.We have been playing some good football and against Arsenal I thought we were exemplary. That does not forgive capitulation against Liverpool where I thought we were going for a job interview rather that a game, hearing the same mantra from players and staff alike. Cortese must have been keeping his eyes open from the new year and before and has decided to go for an Argentinian with no Premier experience. little English but a good knowledge of La Liga. I don't like the sound of this one bit and would be reassured to be back on the bus but I don't know near enough what will be required to get us through to the end of this season. The trouble is that the players and management equally admitted to being in the same boat.

 

I am not going to criticise Cortese as the panto villain just because he is making decisions to keep us up. It won't make it any easier for Reading fans to feel that much better at the end of the season if they get relegated with McDermott. Should we go down as well after taking the alternative route then I feel this should be fully opened up but unsure of any cast iron result.

I would have voted yes a few months back.

[hypochondriac]

May I also say that when I mentioned about how fans were happy for KD to be cast aside after all he had done, There were posts saying you can't be sentimental etc etc those same people are now up in arms. Football has become is distasteful industry,I don't think it was ever different

 

COmpletely different. Davis had proven himself incompetent in the Premiership. Adkins was making a lot of progress.

[OldNick]

COmpletely different. Davis had proven himself incompetent in the Premiership. Adkins was making a lot of progress.

Both have not been incompetent in this league but both have had bad days. Please do not give the impression that NA is some super manager, yes in the lower leagues but the PL? It will be interesting to see what PL club sacks their manager to take NA on,

[Saint Martini]

I'm absolutely shocked by the sacking and don't get the timing at all. But I do believe Pochettino is a good manager and he's achievedvery good results at Espanyol before he had to sell his better players.

 

Cortese is ruthless and perhaps this is a good thing in a the sentimental business that football is. He evaluates results without emotion and I guess he expected us to be further after all the investment this summer.

 

I decided not to vote in the poll because I can't possibly make an informed decision. My gut decision would be NO because I felt we were getting good results recently but at the same time we weren't getting enough wins.

 

In the end NC made a a similar decision before when he appointed Adkins and that proved to be an allright decison. All that's left is getting behind the team and hoping Pochettino can continue whereAdlins left things.

[Weston Saint]

I am so disappointed that Adkins had to go. I liked him as a person and a football manager. It has all come as a bit of a shock

 

However, Cortese looks to have appointed an exciting replacement, if you listen to comments from Spain.

 

He appears exactly what Cortese is looking for. His style is fast pressing football playing out from the back. Adkins bought into that plan and whilst I have no doubt he would have kept us in the Premier, Coretese obviously thought that next step in the vision/business plan might need a new face.

 

I had hoped Cortese would hold his nerve but that appears not in his character. The man is obsessive. Let's hope he has made the right decision for Southampton FC. Failure is no longer an option although I doubt it was ever an option in Cortese's book!

[itchen]

I expect I would have found some way to keep way of keeping Adkin's in the job because he really is that nice a guy. But that gives me or you no rights to look at this sacking as short sighted. From the moment we gained promotion at the end of last season Adkin's wanted these players to get their chance in the Premier. All very nice sentiments but changing the goal keeper alone could have been enough now to have ensured our safety for this season. We had so little Premier experience in both management and playing, it's not surprising these things cost us so much. We have turned things around such we now have a chance, but others are turning things round.We have been playing some good football and against Arsenal I thought we were exemplary. That does not forgive capitulation against Liverpool where I thought we were going for a job interview rather that a game, hearing the same mantra from players and staff alike. Cortese must have been keeping his eyes open from the new year and before and has decided to go for an Argentinian with no Premier experience. little English but a good knowledge of La Liga. I don't like the sound of this one bit and would be reassured to be back on the bus but I don't know near enough what will be required to get us through to the end of this season. The trouble is that the players and management equally admitted to being in the same boat.

 

I am not going to criticise Cortese as the panto villain just because he is making decisions to keep us up. It won't make it any easier for Reading fans to feel that much better at the end of the season if they get relegated with McDermott. Should we go down as well after taking the alternative route then I feel this should be fully opened up but unsure of any cast iron result.

 

Yep. My original reaction was anger and disgust and I'm still annoyed at the way Nigel has been treated. But that's the way with football. I assume he's had a decent payoff and will pick up another job fairly quickly. Apart from a token protest which I'm sure will happen Monday, we need to get behind the new man. If he gets a couple of decent results that will help. After all, who's still holding a candle for Pardew?

[dubai_phil]

Nigel has done a fantastic job on these guys and he would of installed the belief that we can hold our own in this league,they will surely want to carry on the good work he has done by continuing the form we have been replicating.

Unless this guy comes in and f***s it all up by going 4-3-3 again and dropping Lambert I cant see how we will change that much,we have a great team spirit and the players play for each other you can see that.

 

I think you have hit the problem on the head.

 

Us fans are happy to stay up. Instilling "the belief that we can hold our own in this league" is NOT in the plan.

 

The 45/50k Stadium and CL football IS the plan, not holding our own.

 

Still. NC has nailed his colours to the mast. He will go down as the worst CEO in footballing history or he will take us to the CL

 

I have no doubt in my mind after today's events that NC truly believes he can achieve the latter and that this (to him) is simply a step on that path

 

I think 99% of Saints fans think he needs men in white coats.

 

Probably most people outside Eastern Hampshire dream of it happening

 

 

 

 

Just after they dream of Megan Fox/George Clooney or whoever

[offix]

From a BBC article: "As the news began to leak out of St Mary's on Friday morning, it became clear the man who led the club from the lower reaches of League One to the Premier League in less than two years had not been told. "

 

IF that is true, and NA was not told first, that is really cowardly of Cortese

[dubai_phil]

I am so disappointed that Adkins had to go. I liked him as a person and a football manager. It has all come as a bit of a shock

 

However, Cortese looks to have appointed an exciting replacement, if you listen to comments from Spain.

 

He appears exactly what Cortese is looking for. His style is fast pressing football playing out from the back. Adkins bought into that plan and whilst I have no doubt he would have kept us in the Premier, Coretese obviously thought that next step in the vision/business plan might need a new face.

 

I had hoped Cortese would hold his nerve but that appears not in his character. The man is obsessive. Let's hope he has made the right decision for Southampton FC. Failure is no longer an option although I doubt it was ever an option in Cortese's book!

 

Well put WS

[kpturner]

"The man in the glass"

[DT]

Can someone please change thread title to read 'official'? Looks a bit tin pot.

[Dark Munster]

Excellent manager by all accounts. Cortese is investing in our future. Adkins - best manager we've had for a long time, but we are a team on the up and there is little room for sentiment in the Premiership. Let's wish them both well and coyr !!!

 

Apart from his last club, who sacked him after he took them to the foot of the table.

[OldNick]

Can someone please change thread title to read 'official'? Looks a bit tin pot.

well spotted DT

[channonball]

Paul Walsh, great to get the opinion of a skate.

[docker-p]

What really p1sses me off about Cortese is for a supposed tough guy he doesn't have the balls to turn up to the press conference and explain his actions. If you have anything about you at all, when you make difficult or unpopular decisions you face up and explain yourself, not hide away. Just when you think you can't have less respect for a man he surprises you.

[doddisalegend]

Apart from his last club, who sacked him after he took them to the foot of the table.

 

Beeb article suggests it wasn't that black and white http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21084201

[Ohio Saint]

Can someone please change thread title to read 'official'? Looks a bit tin pot.

 

haha!! The title is so shocking and dumbfounding I don't think anyone else has actually read all of it!! I think I got as far as Adkins SACKED.....Then my head hit the floor.

[kpturner]

Apart from his last club, who sacked him after he took them to the foot of the table.

Allegedly because they were skint and sold all his best players.

[Dig Dig]

Apart from his last club, who sacked him after he took them to the foot of the table.

 

Only half a select story there. They were in the bottom 3 when he took over there and he guided them to a 10 placed finish, followed by a top 6 finish the next season (winning La Liga manager of the year) before struggling at the start if this season having sold their best players due to financial troubles.

 

Don't get me wrong, I would rather have Adkins here ut lets not start kicking MP based in carefully selected "facts"

[hypochondriac]

Can someone please change thread title to read 'official'? Looks a bit tin pot.

 

Matches this decision then.

[kpturner]

What really p1sses me off about Cortese is for a supposed tough guy he doesn't have the balls to turn up to the press conference and explain his actions. If you have anything about you at all, when you make difficult or unpopular decisions you face up and explain yourself, not hide away. Just when you think you can't have less respect for a man he surprises you.

Do you really think it would have been a good idea to turn up to the press conference and upstage the new guy? What would be the point in that? It would have turned into a jizzfest about Adkins. MP would not have needed his interpreter because he'd have had no questions to answer.

[buctootim]

Allegedly because they were skint and sold all his best players.

 

How come Espanyol have bounced right back since he left then?

[Norm]

From a BBC article: "As the news began to leak out of St Mary's on Friday morning, it became clear the man who led the club from the lower reaches of League One to the Premier League in less than two years had not been told. "

 

IF that is true, and NA was not told first, that is really cowardly of Cortese

 

But Window Cleaner assures us he WAS told before it was know by the media!

[buctootim]

Do you really think it would have been a good idea to turn up to the press conference and upstage the new guy? What would be the point in that? It would have turned into a jizzfest about Adkins. MP would not have needed his interpreter because he'd have had no questions to answer.

 

 

 

Its really not hard. You have a press conference with Cortese explaining his actions. Deal with the sacking. Then Cortese leaves and new manager tasks to press.

[S-Clarke]

How come Espanyol have bounced right back since he left then?

 

Sometimes a change just freshens things up. I don't know the ins and outs of Espanyol, but I know that time and time again that one bad season doesn't make you a bad manager, and one bad season doesn't make you a bad player. You see it countless times. Player A is awful at Club A. Gets a move to Club B, and he's great again. Manager is **** at Club B, gets a move to Club A and turns it around. He's obviously shown promise in the past, but himself and the club drifted apart that season and the relationship soured. That's all I can gauge from it. I don't know a great deal about this guy if I'm honest.

[Ohio Saint]

Beeb article suggests it wasn't that black and white http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21084201

 

Bloody hell. As the information starts coming in, it is looking again like Cortese might be a couple of years ahead of the rest of us. This is encouraging, and an insight maybe into how the last 5 year plan was so easily surpassed.

[alpine_saint]

Just read on Facebook that NA was escorted off the premises in tears.

 

NC is a bastard.

[Norm]

Just read on Facebook that NA was escorted off the premises in tears.

 

NC is a bastard.

 

 

Where on FB?

[up and away]

May I also say that when I mentioned about how fans were happy for KD to be cast aside after all he had done, There were posts saying you can't be sentimental etc etc those same people are now up in arms. Football has become is distasteful industry,I don't think it was ever differen

tCompletely different. Davis had proven himself incompetent in the Premiership. Adkins was making a lot of progress.

 

But if the only reason you go into the season unprepared is because of the goal keeping position is because it's the managers decision. The fault lies with the manager not the player.

 

Weston Saint

 

 

I am so disappointed that Adkins had to go. I liked him as a person and a football manager. It has all come as a bit of a shockHowever, Cortese looks to have appointed an exciting replacement, if you listen to comments from Spain.He appears exactly what Cortese is looking for. His style is fast pressing football playing out from the back. Adkins bought into that plan and whilst I have no doubt he would have kept us in the Premier, Coretese obviously thought that next step in the vision/business plan might need a new face.I had hoped Cortese would hold his nerve but that appears not in his character. The man is obsessive. Let's hope he has made the right decision for Southampton FC. Failure is no longer an option although I doubt it was ever an option in Cortese's book!

You only have to cast your mind back to Ramos at Spurs to look at what appears at first sight a carbon copy. Ramos could not even wash a tea cup at spurs and the nightmare kept on growing. One thing the new guy should have is a line to pull in new talent that sort our problems in the short term, but its more that possible it could make things worse. The other thing we must not stop is the style of football the Cork etc enthuse, equally critical.

[Thedelldays]

Just read on Facebook that NA was escorted off the premises in tears.

 

NC is a bastard.

you believe that? a grown man being escorted away from the stadium...?

 

the new signing let slip that he was told adkins was going....NA knew he was going

[Glasgow_Saint]

Just heard that Guly sacked Adkins

[kpturner]

How come Espanyol have bounced right back since he left then?

If you think about it, his start to the season with Espanyol was very similar to our start under Adkins. The difference is that MP got sacked (or left by mutual consent) and Adkins didn't. They picked up, just the same as we have.