Are we a better side without Lallana?

[Turkish]

Post #1 of this thread summed it up pretty well, I thought. Not too much grey area there.

 

Carry on though.

 

Over to Charlie and his opinon on Gulys performance on tuesday.........

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Post #1 of this thread summed it up pretty well, I thought. Not too much grey area there.

 

Carry on though.

 

Thank you!

 

I'll go back and take a gander. If it was that easy why the hell didn't he just say so? You do get some funny types on this forum ...

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

After watching us miss out on three points thanks for a stunning 30 yard injury time equaliser at the one of the hardest away grounds in the country and today play very well and keep team that had been banging in the goals down to one shot on target, it got me thinking this.

 

Now I love Lallana as much as any fan and think hes a great player, but since he's been out and Guly has provided us with some much needed tracking back and cover for the full back as well a reasonable attacking threat, we look a solid unit but also still a threat going forward. it's noticeable that in the last two games we've had little threat from the flanks, somewhere we were always vunerbale when AL is playing ...

 

Tracking back is all well and good, but unless the player doing the tracking is going to get some type of meaningful challenge in on a regular basis, all this effort seems of limited value to our defense. You are confusing perspiration, with inspiration. The record shows that the recent improvement in our defensive record predates Guly's recent return to the starting 11, and is explained by other factors. While we are on the subject, I just don't agree that Guly works as hard (or harder) than Lallana - an exceptional athlete - or that he contributes anything very praiseworthy to team performance over and above that which Adam offers - indeed I would have thought most observant fans would argue that claiming Guly is in any sense match for Lallana is just plain silly.

 

How remarkable it is that (if memory serves) a forum member who was at one time extremely critical of this player and only recently was seriously claiming on here that Guly's regular substitute appearances were in fact the result of a clause in his contract that compelled this, rather than earned on merit, should suddenly perform such a dramatic 'Volte-face' on his opinion re this player. Never mind consistency too is overrated as a virtue.

 

As for his performance v Arsenal specifically, the disastrous own goal has already been discussed at some length and I can only recall one noteworthy (late in the game) shot at the opposition goal which the keeper saved with ease. He played little active part in the Ramirez goal. Again although he does indeed cover his fair share of ground during the game (I have never agreed with those who think him lazy) I can't recall any outstanding defensive work from this player, at least not enough to justify the praise lavished on him here. Overall I rated this performance in the 5 (or 6 perhaps) out of 10 range.

 

As ever, other opinions are available.

[mitch01]

So express your disbelief all you want and keep your head in your little A* bubble.

 

Ha! Just saw this. What a bizarre thing to say.

 

Anyway, back on topic.

 

I think its also worth noting that Lallana's (generally excellent) set-piece delivery was sorely missing vs Sunderland especially, where we had plenty of corners but failed to threaten from any apart from one by de Ridder. The kind of quality he consistently provides in the final third is absolutely vital for us to make clinical use of our openings, and this might even be more vital away from home where we have less of the ball in the opposition's half. While Puncheon's form has been both surprising and impressive this season, I stick don't quite put him in the same bracket as Lallana in terms of technical ability and composure in pressure situations (although admittedly I am as guilty as anyone for writing Puncheon off before - and should be careful not to do the same again). Just another reason why I think there is almost no case for dropping our captain, regardless of the occasion.

[musesaint]

No

 

Fact

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Ironically while some of us spent yesterday afternoon at the match supporting all our players (and what a fun time we had!) I now see that some of those who have been so vociferous in their objections to my view, were far too busy posting on here to go down to St Marys and support Guly for themselves ... oh well.

 

For the absent members of his fanclub's information, I thought your man did actually manage to get a few decent crosses in - during the second half in particular - but for all the claimed "balance" he supposedly provides surely Puncheon down t'other side is the more effective a player. Nevertheless, I'd go so far as to rate this performance as high as a 6.5/10

 

PS - even littun did concede that he thought Guly had taken a "good" corner kick ...

[Turkish]

I decided to have a day off yesterday as I need to do some stuff at home, lots going on at the moment! apologies if it didn't meet your approval.

 

I'm glad Guly managed to meet the aproval of your six year old though, did you you discipline him and tell him not to Talk such nonsense? I did watch it on a stream though and like most of the players he was okay in the first half and poor in the second. As for a puncheon being more effective yesterday are you sure? Didn't 3 of the 5 goals come down the right hand side with Pucheon was no where to be seen?

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

I decided to have a day off yesterday as I need to do some stuff at home, lots going on at the moment! apologies if it didn't meet your approval.

 

I'm glad Guly managed to meet the aproval of your six year old though, did you you discipline him and tell him not to Talk such nonsense? I did watch it on a stream though and like most of the players he was okay in the first half and poor in the second. As for a puncheon being more effective yesterday are you sure? Didn't 3 of the 5 goals come down the right hand side with Pucheon was no where to be seen?

 

Your apology is both welcome and accepted.

 

I don't think that littlun is truly in need of correction re this matter because I'm a firm believer in free speech and feel that it is important to encourage this in the young. I'm also far from convinced that he is fundamentally all that wrong anyway.

Had you made the effort go yesterday then you might have gained a better appreciation of the splendid defence splitting pass that Puncheon made to Rodriquez that resulted in our goal - easily our best moment of the match.

 

I like players who track back and help us defend as a unit - this too is important. However, the primary responsibility of a wide midfield player is surely to be creative in the attacking sense ... some of them even manage to score the odd goal themselves.

Edited 6 January, 2013 by CHAPEL END CHARLIE

[Turkish]

Your apology is both welcome and accepted.

 

I don't think that littlun is truly in need of correction re this matter because I'm a firm believer in free speech and feel that it is important to encourage this in the young. I'm also far from convinced that he is fundamentally all that wrong anyway.

Had you made the effort go yesterday then you might have gained a better appreciation of the splendid defence splitting pass that Puncheon made to Rodriquez that resulted in our goal - easily our best moment of the match.

 

I like players who track back and help us defend as a unit - this too is important. However, the primary responsibility of a wide midfield player is surely to be creative in the attacking sense ... some of them even manage to score the odd goal themselves.

 

It's both isn't it? Puncheon was no where to be seen for 3 of their goals. He did put a nice pass through for Rodriguez goal, however if we are basing wide midfielders impact purely on this Guly leads Puncheon 2-1 since his recall. So how is Puncheon more effective?

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

It's both isn't it? Puncheon was no where to be seen for 3 of their goals. He did put a nice pass through for Rodriguez goal, however if we are basing wide midfielders impact purely on this Guly leads Puncheon 2-1 since his recall. So how is Puncheon more effective?

 

Naturally the ideal midfield player is both a potent attacking force and a rock solid defender - unfortunately we don't have this paragon of a midfielder as yet so we just have to make the best of it. Your premise that Guly has offered us all that much defensively (or offensively for that matter) in recent games is not one I can agree with. Citing which side yesterdays Chelsea goals happened to come from seems to me 'paper thin' evidence to prove that Guly is all that good a defender in any case.

 

The manager has seemingly decided that in Lallana's absence Guly is his preferred option on the left. Now that's his call and we can only hope he has gotten it right. I don't believe for one minute however that Guly do Prado will long retain that place once Adam overcomes his injury.

 

Football being football of course I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Guly go and score the winner at Villa and you can all have your fun at my expense then. But so manifest are Guly do Prado's limitations as a Premier League player, I fear that our fate this season may well rest upon the state of Adam Lallana's knee.

[The Kraken]

Naturally the ideal midfield player is both a potent attacking force and a rock solid defender - unfortunately we don't have this paragon of a midfielder as yet so we just have to make the best of it. Your premise that Guly has offered us all that much defensively (or offensively for that matter) in recent games is not one I can agree with. Citing which side yesterdays Chelsea goals happened to come from seems to me 'paper thin' evidence to prove that Guly is all that good a defender in any case.

 

The manager has seemingly decided that in Lallana's absence Guly is his preferred option on the left. Now that's his call and we can only hope he has gotten it right. I don't believe for one minute however that Guly do Prado will long retain that place once Adam overcomes his injury.

Football being football of course I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Guly go and score the winner at Villa and you can all have your fun at my expense then. But so manifest are Guly do Prado's limitations as a Premier League player, I fear that our fate this season may well rest upon the state of Adam Lallana's knee.

 

I don't think many others do either, so I'm not sure I see your point. As skipper I'm sure most people understand that Lallana will walk straight back into the side.

 

Given we have that injury problem; and given that we haven't been in the transfer market to bring in another winger (which I'm halfway hopeful we could still yet do); I'm not sure where such scathing of Guly comes from. Unless there's another obvious candidate to play instead of him right now?

[Turkish]

Naturally the ideal midfield player is both a potent attacking force and a rock solid defender - unfortunately we don't have this paragon of a midfielder as yet so we just have to make the best of it. Your premise that Guly has offered us all that much defensively (or offensively for that matter) in recent games is not one I can agree with. Citing which side yesterdays Chelsea goals happened to come from seems to me 'paper thin' evidence to prove that Guly is all that good a defender in any case.

 

The manager has seemingly decided that in Lallana's absence Guly is his preferred option on the left. Now that's his call and we can only hope he has gotten it right. I don't believe for one minute however that Guly do Prado will long retain that place once Adam overcomes his injury.

 

Football being football of course I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Guly go and score the winner at Villa and you can all have your fun at my expense then. But so manifest are Guly do Prado's limitations as a Premier League player, I fear that our fate this season may well rest upon the state of Adam Lallana's knee.

 

You said Puncheon was far more effective than Guly. In the 3 games since he's returned Guly has directly influenced two goals (in two draws) we've scored as well as offering support to the left flank. Puncheon has contributed one assist and (in a game we lost 5-1) as well as 3 of Chelsea's goals coming down his flank yesterday, as well as giving away a cheap free kick which led to Arsenals equaliser on NYD. So I'd like to hear how a Puncheon has been more effective, unless of of course you ment negatively?

[Thedelldays]

do you think guly was good yesterday turkish..?

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

I don't think many others do either, so I'm not sure I see your point. As skipper I'm sure most people understand that Lallana will walk straight back into the side.

 

Given we have that injury problem; and given that we haven't been in the transfer market to bring in another winger (which I'm halfway hopeful we could still yet do); I'm not sure where such scathing of Guly comes from. Unless there's another obvious candidate to play instead of him right now?

 

Well there are any number of other options for this left midfield place. Ramirez, Rodriguez, Lee, Mayuka, even Danny Fox might fill that hole and there are a series of pros and cons associated with each and any of those choices. But Nigel has decided that Guly gets the nod, so the question as to whether any of those other possible options might produce better results looks like remaining a moot one.

 

I don't see however why expressing ones doubts about a particular player should suddenly be regarded as verboten on here for some reason.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

You said Puncheon was far more effective than Guly. In the 3 games since he's returned Guly has directly influenced two goals (in two draws) we've scored as well as offering support to the left flank. Puncheon has contributed one assist and (in a game we lost 5-1) as well as 3 of Chelsea's goals coming down his flank yesterday, as well as giving away a cheap free kick which led to Arsenals equaliser on NYD. So I'd like to hear how a Puncheon has been more effective, unless of of course you ment negatively?

 

Well unlike you I was there and I'm telling you that Puncheon produced our best moment yesterday. The record shows that Puncheon has also of course scored important goals for this team this season. I also note you have failed to mention the missed open goal at Stoke in your analysis or the own goal v Arsenal for some reason. But if you really think that Guly is a better player than Puncheon then I'd be most interested to see how many forum members agree with you.

 

'Not many' I suspect.

[The Kraken]

Well there are any number of other options for this left midfield place. Ramirez, Rodriguez, Lee, Mayuka, even Danny Fox might fill that hole and there are a series of pros and cons associated with each and any of those choices. But Nigel has decided that Guly gets the nod, so the question as to whether any of those other possible options might produce better results looks like remaining a moot one.

 

I don't see however why expressing ones doubts about a particular player should suddenly be regarded as verboten on here for some reason.

 

Lets go on yesterday's game, for which you presumably wouldn't have picked Guly. From your list:

Ramirez: injured.

Rodriguez: played up front.

Lee: a striker, is he really a solution at LM when we're playing the European Champions and trying to keep it tight?

Mayuka: the SFC conundrum, God knows what's going on with him but he's certainly well out of the reckoning. Though, tbf, I don't think he's played left wing all season.

Fox: a left back, and not even on the bench (injured??)

 

I don't think many people would try to suppress you having a certain point of view. You're just being asked to justify it, rather than say "he's cr*p, and my 6 year old agrees with me". Personally I find it surprising that you question the Guly role so heavily given that he's not a first choice, and he doesn't seem to be keeping another more suitable candidate out of that position. And he'll be dropped as soon as Lallana returns. Its a bit like criticising Hooiveld for not being as good as Fonte when he came on. We know Hooiveld is not good enough, we know the club should probably go out and buy someone better, but right now its really all we've got.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Lets go on yesterday's game, for which you presumably wouldn't have picked Guly. From your list:

Ramirez: injured.

Rodriguez: played up front.

Lee: a striker, is he really a solution at LM when we're playing the European Champions and trying to keep it tight?

Mayuka: the SFC conundrum, God knows what's going on with him but he's certainly well out of the reckoning. Though, tbf, I don't think he's played left wing all season.

Fox: a left back, and not even on the bench (injured??)

 

I don't think many people would try to suppress you having a certain point of view. You're just being asked to justify it, rather than say "he's cr*p, and my 6 year old agrees with me". Personally I find it surprising that you question the Guly role so heavily given that he's not a first choice, and he doesn't seem to be keeping another more suitable candidate out of that position. And he'll be dropped as soon as Lallana returns. Its a bit like criticising Hooiveld for not being as good as Fonte when he came on. We know Hooiveld is not good enough, we know the club should probably go out and buy someone better, but right now its really all we've got.

 

As for who happened to be available for selection yesterday, I was making a general comment about the Lallana situation rather than referring to this one game in particular. Re the supposed reasonableness of attacks directed at me, the record shows does it not that one forum member has stooped so low as to accused me of "prejudice" on here - racial prejudice one can only presume. In the light of all the black players I've praised and championed on here over the years, would you say that insult was perfectly in order and within the bounds of fair comment?

[The Kraken]

As for who happened to be available for selection yesterday, I was making a general comment about the Lallana situation rather than referring to this one game in particular. Re the supposed reasonableness of attacks directed at me, the record shows does it not that one forum member has stooped so low as to accused me of "prejudice" on here - racial prejudice one can only presume. In the light of all the black players I've praised and championed on here over the years, would you say that insult was perfectly in order and within the bounds of fair comment?

 

I don't think I made that accusation nor am I aware of who did, so that's a matter for them and not me. Prejudice takes many forms so I'm not going to brandish the race card against a post I've not even seen before.

 

I was commenting on your noticeable objections to Guly in particular since Lallana has been injured, and in particular for the last game when we were bereft of certain other options. You have previously criticised Guly but have seemingly deliberately and obtusely refused to explain the reasons why you think he has been abject, and also without suggesting an alternative. Its fair enough of course to hold an opinion, you've just previously been reluctant to expand upon the reasons why, other than that your lad didn't rate him. In the summer its fairly common knowledge we were in for Matt Phillips. Tom Ince has also been regularly mentioned as an urealistic target. There is a new thread covering our reported interest in some attacking Brazilian playing in Italy. So its not as if Guly is being lined up as the answer to our season, he's a stop gap measure. That's all.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

I don't think I made that accusation nor am I aware of who did, so that's a matter for them and not me. Prejudice takes many forms so I'm not going to brandish the race card against a post I've not even seen before.

 

I was commenting on your noticeable objections to Guly in particular since Lallana has been injured, and in particular for the last game when we were bereft of certain other options. You have previously criticised Guly but have seemingly deliberately and obtusely refused to explain the reasons why you think he has been abject, and also without suggesting an alternative. Its fair enough of course to hold an opinion, you've just previously been reluctant to expand upon the reasons why, other than that your lad didn't rate him. In the summer its fairly common knowledge we were in for Matt Phillips. Tom Ince has also been regularly mentioned as an urealistic target. There is a new thread covering our reported interest in some attacking Brazilian playing in Italy. So its not as if Guly is being lined up as the answer to our season, he's a stop gap measure. That's all.

 

I would hope that any reasonable contributer to this forum would object to the race card being played irrespective if the attack was aimed at them or not. The mere fact that the Moderators have chosen to ignore this serious libel speaks volumes for just how seriously they enforce their own rules.

 

As for my alleged refusal to fully explain and debate my view about the player in question with other members. I know this is a long thread now and I dare say none of us can remember every single post in perfect clarity. But the record shows conclusively that I have gone into the detail at some length now (post#205 on this page being just one example of this) so I must reject this charge too.

 

But lets not fall out about it because in general I do enjoy your contributions on here

[Turkish]

do you think guly was good yesterday turkish..?

 

He was okay in the first half, poor in the second, as was everyone except Shaw IMO.

 

Unlike a lot on here though I seem to have that rare mongboard ability that means I can recognise what a player brings to the team and say when they've played well or badly, unlike the usual default 'Guly is sh*t and can do no right' mode some have.

[Turkish]

Well unlike you I was there and I'm telling you that Puncheon produced our best moment yesterday. The record shows that Puncheon has also of course scored important goals for this team this season. I also note you have failed to mention the missed open goal at Stoke in your analysis or the own goal v Arsenal for some reason. But if you really think that Guly is a better player than Puncheon then I'd be most interested to see how many forum members agree with you.

 

'Not many' I suspect.

 

Nice try at the 'I was there' superfan moral high ground, not that I care but it was only the fourth game I've missed since our first season in L1, good try though.

 

Although I did watch it on a stream and had the benefit of a different view than the chapel end, the benefit of replays. This was of course countered by the lack of a 6 year old football expert next to me to guide me so I'll stick with what I saw, Which was a very good pass for Our goal and little else. Not much tracking, not much cover for the midfielder playing right back, 3 goals came from his side and Cork was hung out to dry with little cover, as was proven that 3 of their four goals from open play came down th right flank, I'm sure you 6 year old would have recognised this though.

 

It's interesting you choose to compare Guly negatively with Puncheon though. Whilst we were I league one and the championship one player was willingly playing wherever asked and putting in shift whilst being abused by our fans for much of it. The other was off sulking, falling out with the owners and management and slagging the club off on twitter, he was even on record as saying he was happy to sit in the reserves, take his money and run his contract down. I don't nessasairly believe Guly is a better player, however in terms of attitude, commitment and loyalty to the cause there is only one winner.

Edited 6 January, 2013 by Turkish

[pap]

As The Kraken points out, prejudice can take many forms. At the time that term was directed at Chapel End Charlie, he was resolutely refusing to consider any opinion apart from his own and his six year old son's. Prejudiced? Possibly, but I don't think it has anything to do with race. Inflexible? Definitely.

 

All he is really trying to do is prove he is right. F*ck knows why. Maybe his 6 year old son beat him at Trivial Pursuit.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

As The Kraken points out, prejudice can take many forms. At the time that term was directed at Chapel End Charlie, he was resolutely refusing to consider any opinion apart from his own and his six year old son's. Prejudiced? Possibly, but I don't think it has anything to do with race. Inflexible? Definitely.

 

All he is really trying to do is prove he is right. F*ck knows why. Maybe his 6 year old son beat him at Trivial Pursuit.

 

Well believe or not Pulpy - I'm guessing 'not' in your case - all I ever want to do on here is express my opinion and speak the truth as I see it. I would have thought it should go without saying that all forum members are free to accept, or reject, any opinion they see posted on here as they see fit to do so. It is my belief however that when someone is attacked they are entitled to a 'right of reply'.

 

As for me being inflexible - well you may not be entirely wrong there I suppose because I'm a man of firm opinions and I'm not known to suffer fools gladly. But here we are nearly two weeks after your badly misconceived Lounge thread died a natural death, and you still just can't let it go can you?

 

I don't require the assistance of a Mod to deal with anything thrown at me on here because (as this thread proves) after all this time I'm more than capable of looking after myself without too much difficulty frankly. It is something of a shame however that others choose to resort to accusations of prejudice/racism or (as in your Apollo Thread) calling a group of incredibly brave and talented men a bunch of foul liars without being able to prove it. There's a invisible line a man should not cross.

 

PS as littlun's opinions have been so well received by you lot, I think I may make his thoughts a regular feature in future.

Edited 6 January, 2013 by CHAPEL END CHARLIE

[ottery st mary]

Guly is NOT in the same league as Puncheon..FFS

 

I stil don't trust or feel happy when Guly in side...Here we go again is how I feel..He did work harder v Arsenal...

 

But not a Premiership player in my view.

 

Puncheon is class and will get even better.. Sign him up

[solentstars]

Guly is NOT in the same league as Puncheon..FFS

 

I stil don't trust or feel happy when Guly in side...Here we go again is how I feel..He did work harder v Arsenal...

 

But not a Premiership player in my view.

 

Puncheon is class and will get even better.. Sign him up

 

That's funny lots of people said the same about puncheon when he was the hate figure.

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[ottery st mary]

That's funny lots of people said the same about puncheon when he was the hate figure.

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

 

I have always had faith in Punch......But not so comfortable with Guly in the side..

 

As a Saints fan..always happy to be proved wrong...but IMHO Guly is not up to it..

 

All about opinions solentstars.......Guly will now score a brace at Villa Park;)

[solentstars]

I have always had faith in Punch......But not so comfortable with Guly in the side..

 

As a Saints fan..always happy to be proved wrong...but IMHO Guly is not up to it..

 

All about opinions solentstars.......Guly will now score a brace at Villa Park;)

Agree I like guly and hes used in different positions which shows his versiltay. I'm more worried about the goal keeping side of the team.

 

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[pap]

Well believe or not Pulpy - I'm guessing 'not' in your case - all I ever want to do on here is express my opinion and speak the truth as I see it. I would have thought it should go without saying that all forum members are free to accept, or reject, any opinion they see posted on here as they see fit to do so. It is my belief however that when someone is attacked they are entitled to a 'right of reply'.

 

As for me being inflexible - well you may not be entirely wrong there I suppose because I'm a man of firm opinions and I'm not known to suffer fools gladly. But here we are nearly two weeks after your badly misconceived Lounge thread died a natural death, and you still just can't let it go can you?

 

I don't require the assistance of a Mod to deal with anything thrown at me on here because (as this thread proves) after all this time I'm more than capable of looking after myself without too much difficulty frankly. It is something of a shame however that others choose to resort to accusations of prejudice/racism or (as in your Apollo Thread) calling a group of incredibly brave and talented men a bunch of foul liars without being able to prove it. There's a invisible line a man should not cross.

 

PS as littlun's opinions have been so well received by you lot, I think I may make his thoughts a regular feature in future.

 

You keep mentioning my moon landings thread. I'd invite anyone reading this to view it to get a view of how you choose to debate, even when you've got a slam-dunk*.

 

* Spoiler - badly and angrily.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

You keep mentioning my moon landings thread. I'd invite anyone reading this to view it to get a view of how you choose to debate, even when you've got a slam-dunk*.

 

* Spoiler - badly and angrily.

 

Agreed.

 

It's a hoot and a object lesson in the old 'if you find yourself in a hole then stop digging' adage ...

[pap]

Agreed.

 

It's a hoot and a object lesson in the old 'if you find yourself in a hole then stop digging' adage ...

 

You know what, Charlie? I'll happily admit to that. I've often been told I don't know when to shut up. A rare moment of perception by yourself, or simply a case of every broken clock being right at least once per day?

 

Maybe that thread made me look a total cock and you a total hero. Who knows? You and I are obviously excluded from a legit opinion on the matter. If I had to give a subjective view, my bias obviously included, I'd say that you might have won the battle, but look at what you had to become to achieve that victory.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

You know what, Charlie? I'll happily admit to that. I've often been told I don't know when to shut up. A rare moment of perception by yourself, or simply a case of every broken clock being right at least once per day?

 

Maybe that thread made me look a total cock and you a total hero. Who knows? You and I are obviously excluded from a legit opinion on the matter. If I had to give a subjective view, my bias obviously included, I'd say that you might have won the battle, but look at what you had to become to achieve that victory.

 

I think that you and I are in danger of boring the forum with this old business, so I'll shut up about it now and let you have the last word - I've a feeling that's what you wanted all along.

[pap]

Don't worry about them. Most people like to see a good barney, and as The Kraken points out; the answer to the question is pretty much covered in post #1.

 

"Old business" is a laugh mate. You're the one that referenced the moon landing threads. It's the sort of thing you do, kid. Take the man, not the ball. You specifically brought that thread into question 'cos you thought it'd diminish me on this one.

 

When you accused me of making "the most unreasonable post" you'd ever seen on here, I essentially said you either didn't read many of the posts on here or were a liar. I seem to remember you losing your sh!t over the second possibility.

 

I don't think you're a liar, Charlie - but I think that this thread proves without a shadow of a doubt that you don't read the posts.

 

That's fair enough. I've done it myself, seen others do it and what tends to happen is a few short posts later, there's an embarrassed admission that they didn't read the post and everything's sorted. You compound the problem by insisting that you are right

 

Worse still, you asked time and time again for Turkish's assessment of Guly when the thread already shows several. You're indifferent to people's opinions in the first place, then sling out the insults when people rightly pull you up on your ridiculous opening justification.

 

The moon landings thread is not the only thread where a very big hole has been dug. Re-read this sh!t, and weep.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

As I've said I don't intend to discuss our 'old business' any more.

 

Re this Guly matter, despite the 'slings and arrows of outrageous provocation' (to misquote the Bard) I don't think I've lost my temper at any stage on this thread and have merely continued to argue my corner in a cool and calm manner. Again I do feel I have a right of reply when attacked. It seems this requirement placed on me to concede that Guly is a better player (a better player than I honestly believe him to be) is a somewhat 'one sided' affair as his admirers appear to be under no such obligation to concede to any points I have made in return.

 

As for my not reading every single post as carefully as I might - well you may have a point there because it is my (bad) habit to start at the latest post and work 'up' until I find something that interests me, so I am liable to miss older stuff on occasion - Mia Culpa. But it doesn't seem to me all that unreasonable to ask for a simple clarification when that could be so very easily provided.

 

Finally, is it really "ridiculous" to repeat littluns opinions on here? He is only a innocent child of course, but the outraged reaction grown men are displaying to merely seeing a 6 year olds opinion mentioned is rather overblown if you ask me.

[Turkish]

Unbeaten in 5, 4 of which have been away from home. This includes draws at Stoke and Chelsea and at home to Arsenal. We've take the total of 0 points off top 8 sides with Lallana in the side. Time to open up the debate again??

[Glasgow_Saint]

Sell him this Jan

[The Kraken]

Ramirez also only on the pitch for 15 minutes. Coincidence?

[ottery st mary]

We need the depth in the squad..

 

Lallana is a class player and together with Ramirez , Puncheon, Lambert etc will continue the improvement we are making..

 

Class player..

[Ex Lion Tamer]

Ramirez also only on the pitch for 15 minutes. Coincidence?

 

He looked good when he came on though, won several fouls which were vital for taking the pressure off

[saintbob40]

Of course not. But with cline,shaw,cork,Morgan,Adam we have the basis of something very special. Get them all on long term contracts.

[sfc4prem]

Sell Lallana, we eed him no longer. Average player at best and will never make it with us.

[for_heaven's_Saint]

Can't wait to have Lallana back in this team!

[sotonjoe]

Is it possible that Lallana's injury isn't as bad as has been made out and that Atkins is using it as an excuse for dropping Adam? In other words, perhaps he is hiding his dropping of Adam from the fans as he is afraid of making these big decisions.

 

Do you think that Adam might have handed in a transfer request because Nigel has dropped him in this way?

 

It seems odd for him to be injured for this long. I think we should be asking questions and not be taken for fools.

[Dig Dig]

Is it possible that Lallana's injury isn't as bad as has been made out and that Atkins is using it as an excuse for dropping Adam? In other words, perhaps he is hiding his dropping of Adam from the fans as he is afraid of making these big decisions.

 

Do you think that Adam might have handed in a transfer request because Nigel has dropped him in this way?

 

It seems odd for him to be injured for this long. I think we should be asking questions and not be taken for fools.

 

Terrible effort

[sotonjoe]

Terrible effort

 

Alright. It takes a lot of effort to try and sound that ****ing stupid you know. Why don't you do a bit then instead of naysaying.

[Dig Dig]

Alright. It takes a lot of effort to try and sound that ****ing stupid you know. Why don't you do a bit then instead of naysaying.

 

I talk nonsense constantly : )

[RobM]

Is it possible that Lallana's injury isn't as bad as has been made out and that Atkins is using it as an excuse for dropping Adam? In other words, perhaps he is hiding his dropping of Adam from the fans as he is afraid of making these big decisions.

 

Do you think that Adam might have handed in a transfer request because Nigel has dropped him in this way?

 

It seems odd for him to be injured for this long. I think we should be asking questions and not be taken for fools.

 

I don't think this is likely. Adkins has never been afraid to drop our most popular names if he thinks it's the right thing to do and Adam is no exception. He dropped Rickie and Gaston last night, he dropped Rickie for the Man City game... if he thinks he is doing the right thing, the opinion of fans won't come into it.

[saintbob40]

Unbeaten in 5, 4 of which have been away from home. This includes draws at Stoke and Chelsea and at home to Arsenal. We've take the total of 0 points off top 8 sides with Lallana in the side. Time to open up the debate again??

 

nothing to do with Adams absence. Everything to do with Corks return from injury and Shaw's emergence. 4w 6d 2l. As I keep saying............

[Saint Charlie]

Best result of the season gained by dropping AL, Lambrrt and Ramirez.

 

Would be a shame to see them all start vs Everton.

[for_heaven's_Saint]

Best result of the season gained by dropping AL, Lambrrt and Ramirez.

 

Would be a shame to see them all start vs Everton.

 

Yup. Definitely wouldn't want to see us bring anyone new into the team either. Would disrupt the balance.

[Saint_Donovan]

Best result of the season gained by dropping AL, Lambrrt and Ramirez.

 

Would be a shame to see them all start vs Everton.

 

Awful logic!! Lallana wasn't "Dropped" and we were getting comfortably beaten before the introduction of Lambert and Gaston