Fulham 1 Saints 1 - Post Match Reactions & MotM

[Roger]

'Mate' you must be talking about a different game - we were poor!!! No.... very poor! We would not have scored had it not been for the pen...Our preparation is miles off and our attention and sharpness early on in games is lacking almost every game....

We were not 'up for it' from the time we got off the bus!

We were not closing down - Fulham were, we were not working hard, we were not making runs and making things happen. If we want to be the team we aspire to we have a hell of a long way to go......

The reality is, we were poor - dress it up how you like - without the pen we would have lost. I think the back room staff and manager need to take a very hard look at themselves with regard to preparing for games as we are increasingly arriving flat with no energy and no confidence with no closing down. It's almost as though the team have bought a ticket to come and watch the match early and not take part.

Much more energy and hard work is needed win games of football at this level. Nigel take note - positive talking alone is not enough.......

 

No way. I'm critical of saints but today I was pleased with performance. Thought we showed character and passed the ball well.

[Roger]

Hmmm having looked through the entire thread I can't quite see what some posers are looking for when they watch Saints. Perhaps it's their position in the ground that leads them to say we were poor or no-one passed forward. Having the benefit of TV and a recording to re-watch I'd say just as I did immediately after the game: we played pretty well, moved the ball around well, found players open with most of our passes and were solid in defence. We have a disturbingly poor keeper and are toothless in the last 25 yards though. A decent keeper and someone like Defoe on point and we'd have probably run out winners by at least a couple.

 

Agree.

[Window Cleaner]

No way. I'm critical of saints but today I was pleased with performance. Thought we showed character and passed the ball well.

 

And so we did,

[KelvinsRightGlove]

Think we bossed the large majority of the game.

 

First half we looked a bit shaky at the back. All their chances came from us doing something silly with the ball.

 

Yoshi looked absolutely shockingly bad first half, constantly just just hoofed the ball out of play, or played a pass straight to the oppo.

 

Davis had a shocker again for the goal, didn't have much else to do.

 

2nd half was much better. Gaston moving in to the middle caused them all sorts of trouble. Fulham were playing like thugs doubling up on him, and just kicking him over.

 

Punch just always took too many touches, it's like he has to beat his man twice. So frustrating.

 

All in all a good point. Good battling away second half, never gave up.

[Roger]

Think we bossed the large majority of the game.

 

First half we looked a bit shaky at the back. All their chances came from us doing something silly with the ball.

 

Yoshi looked absolutely shockingly bad first half, constantly just just hoofed the ball out of play, or played a pass straight to the oppo.

 

Davis had a shocker again for the goal, didn't have much else to do.

 

2nd half was much better. Gaston moving in to the middle caused them all sorts of trouble. Fulham were playing like thugs doubling up on him, and just kicking him over.

 

Punch just always took too many touches, it's like he has to beat his man twice. So frustrating.

 

All in all a good point. Good battling away second half, never gave up.

 

Punch had 2 men on him and did very well considering.

[KelvinsRightGlove]

Punch had 2 men on him and did very well considering.

 

Yeah maybe I'm being a tad harsh, I don't think he played poor. Just a bit infuriating at times.

 

Cannot believe how assured and resolute Shaw looks at Left-back. He looks the real deal at the minute.

[Window Cleaner]

Yeah maybe I'm being a tad harsh, I don't think he played poor. Just a bit infuriating at times.

 

Cannot believe how assured and resolute Shaw looks at Left-back. He looks the real deal at the minute.

 

Shaw isn't the finished article, way out of position for their goal and slow to get back. After that he seemed to be intent on making amends all by himself and produced some long,mazy forward runs but Fulham managed to shepherd him down a blind alley each time. Good prospect, still think he'll be replaced (for the time being) in January though.

Edited 27 December, 2012 by Window Cleaner

[OldNick]

I don't live in the past, if having given great service was a selection criteria then I'd guess we'd still be playing MLT, Channon and Paine. These 2 players are our weak links at present, they need replacing.

 

I would accept the keeper being changed for the better, but RL!!! You should be careful what you wish for.

I remember a couple of seasons back someone giving RL constant stuff about being lazy and useless, at that stage he had scored 20 goals. Football is about opinions but sometimes they are well stupid

[OldNick]

Some excellent points......KD could have walked to the cross and kicked it away but chose to stand where he was and dive towards it. As usual he needs coaching and explaining to......You have to use your head quickly in this game as a pro. Think...you don't need to always use your hands - it's not a rule of the game!

that is pretty funny, I recall the kid in the playgrounds who would swing his foot at the ball to kick it away. If KD or any keeper had tried to kick at that cross there would be pages on it on here lol.

It was an error, how Fulham got into the position to put the ball across was a vbit worrying

[Window Cleaner]

It was an error, how Fulham got into the position to put the ball across was a vbit worrying

 

 

Cork lost the ball where he shouldn't have and Shaw was way too far forward. Davis should still have cut the cross out though.

 

As for RL, are ay big hunks still scoring goals in the PL ?

[Appy]

Cork lost the ball where he shouldn't have and Shaw was way too far forward. Davis should still have cut the cross out though.

 

As for RL, are ay big hunks still scoring goals in the PL ?

 

He has 7 which isn't bad, but I agree that we need someone more mobile up there, too early to get rid of Lambert entirely though.

[LGTL]

The initial error from the goal was from Shaw. He followed berbatov I think right into the middle of the pitch, with Morgan covering for him half heatedly. Shaw then decided to jog back into position rather than sprint, resulting in them being able to double up on him and hence they got in behind. He also needs to learn how to wrap his foot around a clearance rather then smashing it into touch each time.

[svetigpung]

good to get something from an auful game.

 

Sooooo relieved to see Sidwells volley just edge wide in the last minutes. Thought that screamer was in the top corner. Phew!

 

Shaw ... what a prospect. So confident going forward. Love seeing him and Clyne getting down the flanks at every opportunity.

[Leicestersaint]

These are the games we should be winning.

[Window Cleaner]

These are the games we should be winning.

 

and we would be if we had a keeper worthy of the name. You just cannot overcome that handicap on a continual basis. No matter what the 10 outfield players do we're only ever as good as our goalkeeper. Keepers have cost us a shedload by not making simple

saves in an adequate fashion.It was a priority last summer, we didn't get it right because we were over loyal.

[Chez]

strange game to analyse. We were woeful at times, but also showed outstanding workrate and effort to get the ball down and play. First and foremost Adkins decision to play 4-5-1 cost us the first goal and perhaps the match. Leaving fullbacks exposed cost us so many goals early season so why on earth we returned to that formation is beyond me. We looked lost and offered littler threat with Lambert flicking on to no one.

 

Ramirez didn't track back, does he ever? Shaw left 2 on 1, an easy crossing situation arises, Davis spills it and Berbatov can't miss. Time after time we got raped down the wings and we could so easily have been two or three behind.

 

Thankfully Fulham didn't take their chances and in the second half we took control. Once we went 4-4-2 we started to cause Fulham problems and in the end we were desperately unlucky not to get a win. The conditions made it difficult to play football, but boy did we try and we got our deserves in the end. I thought the effort the players put in was fantastic. Pucheon had a strange game, nit much cam off for him but he gave everything as did most of them.

 

Davis 5 not a great deal to do. Spilled the cross of course. Distribution and selection good.

Clyne 6 some good some bad. Would like to see him try to get to the byeline every now and then

Yoshida 7 once again some very poor passes, but also not given an option by our midfield on many occasions. First half he allowed Berbatov to stroll around, but got a bit tighter second. Tough conditions for a centre back so pretty decent game. Made some very good choices when I thought he should have dived in to a tackle, but had he he would have given a pen away.

Fonte 7 "kick Berbatov". I thought he was far too nice first half, but in the second he started to bully a bit more.

Shaw 7 some great runs in the first half. Made some mistakes - mis-controlling the ball when trying to bring it down rather than hoofing it anywhere. Conditions had a lot to do with that, but thankfully he got away it. Left exposed by formation.

Morgan 6 poor first half saw him chasing shadows, excellent second. Totally dominated the middle.

Cork 6 worked very hard indeed but didn't make himself available enough in the first half

Puncheon 6 depending how you saw the game you might give him anything from a 2 to an 8. Not much came off, but he was our only real threat. Near the end he absolutely bawled out Clyne for failing to play the right pass. He should really have focused on closing the ball down instead of moaning at him, but the passion shown shows exactly how much the game meant to him and I've not seen that before. He's a proper team player now.

Davis 5 saw noting of the ball in the first half. Did quite well when moved to the left as part of a 4-4-2, but I think Adkins got it wrong and it didn't help him

Ramirez 5 a bit like Puncheon in that he tried everything he could to play, but too many mistakes for me. Wasted out wide. When we got him the middle we looked much more balanced. He really is a class act and his touch in the wet was first class, but we need a goal out of him. It will come good.

Lambert 7 stranded on his own in the first half made him look poor and slow, but Adkins was at fault not Lambert. In the second he led the line well and caused plenty of problems. He doesn't look quite as sharp as he has done, but this idea that he has been found out is ********. He just needs someone alongside him. Get Ramirez back playing off him immediately.

 

Rodriguez should have got him on as soon as we went 4-4-2. Did well to get up to the pace of the game and conditions to help push us on.

Guly perhaps should have come on a little earlier

Edited 27 December, 2012 by Chez

[Chez]

The initial error from the goal was from Shaw. He followed berbatov I think right into the middle of the pitch, with Morgan covering for him half heatedly. Shaw then decided to jog back into position rather than sprint, resulting in them being able to double up on him and hence they got in behind. He also needs to learn how to wrap his foot around a clearance rather then smashing it into touch each time.

 

 

Lots of errors, but Ramirez didn't track back leaving Shaw exposed. The formation led to this. Adkins' fault in my opinion.

[Olallana]

Just gotta say it´s a bit funny that in the first games of the season when Fox was exposed it was his fault, not that Lallana didn´t track back from the midfield position.

But now when Shaw gets exposed it is because Ramirez doesn´t track back, from that same midfield position.

 

With that said, I DO NOT blame Shaw for it, but in the same way I did not blame it entirely on Fox either in the first games.....just shows that all players dont get measured by the same stick....

[Chez]

Just gotta say it´s a bit funny that in the first games of the season when Fox was exposed it was his fault, not that Lallana didn´t track back from the midfield position.

But now when Shaw gets exposed it is because Ramirez doesn´t track back, from that same midfield position.

 

With that said, I DO NOT blame Shaw for it, but in the same way I did not blame it entirely on Fox either in the first games.....just shows that all players dont get measured by the same stick....

 

teh difference between the two is that Fox failed to do anything when it was 1 on 1 either

[Give it to Ron]

strange game to analyse. We were woeful at times, but also showed outstanding workrate and effort to get the ball down and play. First and foremost Adkins decision to play 4-5-1 cost us the first goal and perhaps the match. Leaving fullbacks exposed cost us so many goals early season so why on earth we returned to that formation is beyond me. We looked lost and offered littler threat with Lambert flicking on to no one.

 

Ramirez didn't track back, does he ever? Shaw left 2 on 1, an easy crossing situation arises, Davis spills it and Berbatov can't miss. Time after time we got raped down the wings and we could so easily have been two or three behind.

 

Thankfully Fulham didn't take their chances and in the second half we took control. Once we went 4-4-2 we started to cause Fulham problems and in the end we were desperately unlucky not to get a win. The conditions made it difficult to play football, but boy did we try and we got our deserves in the end. I thought the effort the players put in was fantastic. Pucheon had a strange game, nit much cam off for him but he gave everything as did most of them.

 

Davis 5 not a great deal to do. Spilled the cross of course. Distribution and selection good.

Clyne 6 some good some bad. Would like to see him try to get to the byeline every now and then

Yoshida 7 once again some very poor passes, but also not given an option by our midfield on many occasions. First half he allowed Berbatov to stroll around, but got a bit tighter second. Tough conditions for a centre back so pretty decent game. Made some very good choices when I thought he should have dived in to a tackle, but had he he would have given a pen away.

Fonte 7 "kick Berbatov". I thought he was far too nice first half, but in the second he started to bully a bit more.

Shaw 7 some great runs in the first half. Made some mistakes - mis-controlling the ball when trying to bring it down rather than hoofing it anywhere. Conditions had a lot to do with that, but thankfully he got away it. Left exposed by formation.

Morgan 6 poor first half saw him chasing shadows, excellent second. Totally dominated the middle.

Cork 6 worked very hard indeed but didn't make himself available enough in the first half

Puncheon 6 depending how you saw the game you might give him anything from a 2 to an 8. Not much came off, but he was our only real threat. Near the end he absolutely bawled out Clyne for failing to play the right pass. He should really have focused on closing the ball down instead of moaning at him, but the passion shown shows exactly how much the game meant to him and I've not seen that before. He's a proper team player now.

Davis 5 saw noting of the ball in the first half. Did quite well when moved to the left as part of a 4-4-2, but I think Adkins got it wrong and it didn't help him

Ramirez 5 a bit like Puncheon in that he tried everything he could to play, but too many mistakes for me. Wasted out wide. When we got him the middle we looked much more balanced. He really is a class act and his touch in the wet was first class, but we need a goal out of him. It will come good.

Lambert 7 stranded on his own in the first half made him look poor and slow, but Adkins was at fault not Lambert. In the second he led the line well and caused plenty of problems. He doesn't look quite as sharp as he has done, but this idea that he has been found out is ********. He just needs someone alongside him. Get Ramirez back playing off him immediately.

 

Rodriguez should have got him on as soon as we went 4-4-2. Did well to get up to the pace of the game and conditions to help push us on.

Guly perhaps should have come on a little earlier

 

+1 Chez good write up totally agree - first 25 minutes were down to stupid tactics and why the sub was left until 79 mins beats me.

[Window Cleaner]

Guly 5 votes for what 4 minutes on the pitch. If he played 90 he'd be MOTM every week. The number voting for Cork surprises me, industrious but not much end product,few interceptions and even less tackles. Still people used to tell me Brian Howard, Brian Stock and err Ryan whatis name from Plymouth were the bees bollix.

[BILLY]

and we would be if we had a keeper worthy of the name. You just cannot overcome that handicap on a continual basis. No matter what the 10 outfield players do we're only ever as good as our goalkeeper. Keepers have cost us a shedload by not making simple

saves in an adequate fashion.It was a priority last summer, we didn't get it right because we were over loyal.

 

I never want to see Kelvin Davis is a Saints Shirt again after that mistake he made yesterday against Fulham. He is a liabiity. He cost us the win.

[Window Cleaner]

I never want to see Kelvin Davis is a Saints Shirt again after that mistake he made yesterday against Fulham. He is a liabiity. He cost us the win.

 

But you will, Gazza has been consigned to the sin bin and Boruc won't play unless we're desperate. Davis will be in goal on Saturday, Kenwyne Jones will bundle into him after about 2 minutes and then he'll be like a 5 year old girl dropping shots everywhere.

[solentstars]

I never want to see Kelvin Davis is a Saints Shirt again after that mistake he made yesterday against Fulham. He is a liabiity. He cost us the win.

 

Yes like gazza who cost us points I thought davis he played well despite the mistake and was more comanding of the goalkeeprs we have at the moment from someone who went to the game.

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[solentstars]

The initial error from the goal was from Shaw. He followed berbatov I think right into the middle of the pitch, with Morgan covering for him half heatedly. Shaw then decided to jog back into position rather than sprint, resulting in them being able to double up on him and hence they got in behind. He also needs to learn how to wrap his foot around a clearance rather then smashing it into touch each time.

 

Spot on

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

[Window Cleaner]

Yes like gazza who cost us points I thought davis he played well despite the mistake and was more comanding of the goalkeeprs we have at the moment from someone who went to the game.

 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

 

But playing well with the odd clanger per match is not acceptable. We are in the best league in the world with many of the worlds best players. If you palm a ball out in front of Berbatov or Van Persie they're going to put it into the net instinctively

Those guys are on what 100/150K a week, they don't get that for missing keeper's gifts. At least make them work for their money.

[Chez]

I never want to see Kelvin Davis is a Saints Shirt again after that mistake he made yesterday against Fulham. He is a liabiity. He cost us the win.

 

not exactly sure another keeper would have dealt with it any better. De Gea spilled one yesterday in exactly the same manner. Davis is an improvement on Gazza.

[Window Cleaner]

not exactly sure another keeper would have dealt with it any better. De Gea spilled one yesterday in exactly the same manner. Davis is an improvement on Gazza.

 

Davis didn't spill it, he just failed to cut out an easy (looking) cross because he didn't read the trajectory correctly and was short.

This is his problem, reading ball trajectories and velocities. He's probably so used to the old balls that no matter how he tries he can't get to grips with these new types.He just got a hand sort of half on it but not enough to cut it out or turn it away. Gazza might have got there, him being bigger and quicker to drop down, he'd have probably have f*cked up on something else though.

Edited 27 December, 2012 by Window Cleaner

[sfc4prem]

All our keepers are **** poor.

[melmacian_saint]

The problem with most of our fans is that they want us to play like a Champions League challenger and be that high up the table, yet they also want to adulate players who are your run-of-the-mill Football League heroes and expect loyalty to make it all work fine at 100% of times.

 

Que noble IMO, but it is just NOT possible. The world is changing faster, and so is football. There's a reason why MLT was unique. There was and can only ever be one. And he's been gone for a while now.

 

Our fanbase desperately needs to adjust its ambition levels or we will be falling in delusion very shortly (if some haven't already). That's a title I want our neighbours to keep for eternity.

[Window Cleaner]

All our keepers are **** poor.

 

Indeed they are, still sort of convinced we should have persisted with Boruc myself but whether that would have made any much difference I just could not say. Many among us like to point out jus how well Swansea and Norwich did last season but both of those managers made sure that they had a decent keeper, Norwich already had the excellent Ruddy and Swansea got Vorm. Idem West Ham this season.

[up and away]

No way. I'm critical of saints but today I was pleased with performance. Thought we showed character and passed the ball well.

 

It was not a perfect performance but more than enough there to be pleased with. A decent performance there would have marked us towards a top half side, something very difficult to do after all we have come through. Fulham are a decent side who had their moments of the play as well, we just can't be expected to dominate these sides completely. But we did manage to fight back enough to stem the tide and even went on to dominate large periods of play ourselves.

 

Our attack was pretty toothless but we have seen that before when you use the extra man in midfield rather than along side of Ricky. I don't believe the extra man along side of Ricky would have paid for itself after what we had already seen it would do to the midfield, so happy to carry along as it was and see if we could get lucky. Bit of extra pressure towards the end and they broke giving us that bit of luck.

 

 

I want to see a lone striker with sufficient pace / skill about him such he can get sufficient along side of him to form a potent threat at pace. Ricky does not do that and I would like that to be given a full go before we give up on it with days like yesterday being a good place to start. There are many times Ricky should start a game, just not always in my book. Any team that gives Ricky space is asking for trouble and that includes ManU and ManC, deny him that space by closer or an extra marker and your return drops off alarmingly.

[david in sweden]

I read there was "shadowed criticism " from NA ...surrounding Davis' actions regarding the Fulham goal.

It could hardly have been worse than those catastrophic errors that Gazzaniga made in his last few games, but I do think that it was a bit hard on KD.

I found a good, edited video clip (on the Fulham home page) showing several minutes of the game and a camera angle from the corner flag close to where the winger's centre was made.

 

KD looks well-positioned when the ball is kicked, but *** it moves away from him in flight .. leaving him clutching at the air and he just get his fingertips to it and palms it away - direct to Berbatov.

Easy to blame the keeper, but I can see that one or two of our defenders might have been there quicker to clear the ball before it got to the six yard box.

Goalies will always " get blamed" for conceding goals, but I think this one was a bit harsh.

 

*** (have noted lots of criticism from players - in all teams - about how the " new style" ball moves in the air) after being kicked.

[dubai_phil]

I read there was "shadowed criticism " from NA ...surrounding Davis' actions regarding the Fulham goal.

It could hardly have been worse than those catastrophic errors that Gazzaniga made in his last few games, but I do think that it was a bit hard on KD.

I found a good, edited video clip (on the Fulham home page) showing several minutes of the game and a camera angle from the corner flag close to where the winger's centre was made.

 

KD looks well-positioned when the ball is kicked, but *** it moves away from him in flight .. leaving him clutching at the air and he just get his fingertips to it and palms it away - direct to Berbatov.

Easy to blame the keeper, but I can see that one or two of our defenders might have been there quicker to clear the ball before it got to the six yard box.

Goalies will always " get blamed" for conceding goals, but I think this one was a bit harsh.

 

*** (have noted lots of criticism from players - in all teams - about how the " new style" ball moves in the air) after being kicked.

 

From seeing it live and the multiple replays, the issue we had is that KD seemed to go down a fraction early. He seemed to have time to take a step away from goal to push off and get closer to the ball. He seemed to be going down and that committed him to saving at full stretch, when (if) the ball moved he was screwed.

 

It reminded me of the old Pub football days when your keeper would dive to turn a routine save into a showy save - and miss it.

[BILLY]

But you will, Gazza has been consigned to the sin bin and Boruc won't play unless we're desperate. Davis will be in goal on Saturday, Kenwyne Jones will bundle into him after about 2 minutes and then he'll be like a 5 year old girl dropping shots everywhere.

 

Exactly

[OldNick]

over the weekend, De gea, Guzan from Villa and probably the greatest goalie in the world made mistakes that cost goals, let alone Robert green who many on here were creaming themselves about. KD is no doubt very upset with himself for making the mistake, he misjudged the cross (although David from Sweden made an interesting point) and cost us. Please point me in the direction of a keeper who does all things well, and error free who would join us?

[Graffito]

over the weekend, De gea, Guzan from Villa and probably the greatest goalie in the world made mistakes that cost goals, let alone Robert green who many on here were creaming themselves about. KD is no doubt very upset with himself for making the mistake, he misjudged the cross (although David from Sweden made an interesting point) and cost us. Please point me in the direction of a keeper who does all things well, and error free who would join us?

 

My immediate reaction on the day was keeper error but watching the other matches on the box I noticed errors by those other keepers. I put some of itndownntomthe wet conditions.

[melmacian_saint]

What really surprises me is that when PG made the mistake against Norwich, people said that Kelvin would get slated by everyone for doing something like that. In fact, some people even questioned why most of our fans were that protective of a young keeper who had jumped from a League Two play-off challenger to a PL newbie in a defensive crisis.

 

 

Well a few weeks later we clearly see that this is not the case, and Kelvin is being covered by many for a bad mistake (no matter what division) while Gazzaniga was described as being a comedy show and immediately linked to Bart Bialkowski's worse times.

 

When will we learn that Matt Le Tissier's case was an exception rather than the rule and realize that loyalty, while noble and something to wish for (and certainly not to be ignored), does not move a team forward on its own?? Especially considering most fans' expectations, it's just delusional!

[OldNick]

What really surprises me is that when PG made the mistake against Norwich, people said that Kelvin would get slated by everyone for doing something like that. In fact, some people even questioned why most of our fans were that protective of a young keeper who had jumped from a League Two play-off challenger to a PL newbie in a defensive crisis.

 

 

Well a few weeks later we clearly see that this is not the case, and Kelvin is being covered by many for a bad mistake (no matter what division) while Gazzaniga was described as being a comedy show and immediately linked to Bart Bialkowski's worse times.

 

i have only seen Gazza 'live' in one game and that was Norwich. In the 2nd half he was shot and was like a rabbit in the headlights. KD should have done better against Fulhams goal but his past performances show he is a capable keeper. Whether he is good enough still time will tell, but I worry that Gazza is not yet good enough.