Saints 0 Sunderland 1 - Post Match Reactions

[krissyboy31]

As for the officials > Webb was crap > I thought we should of had a penalty when mayuka got bundled over. AS for that female lineswoman . someone should explain to her that when the ball goes over the line you put your flag up. Not wait for webb to indicate to you which team has the throw in and the you put the flag up.

The only bit of that I agree with is the lineswoman's perception of where her line is. Thought Webb was the best Ref we've had at St Mary's this season and Mayuka (although there may have been minimal contact) took a dive.

[corky morris]

What a surprise Ottery having a go at Morgan..........................................................But Lambert can do no wrong!!!!!

 

 

Lambert was fouled many times during the game and Webb turned a blind eye.

 

He has only been sussed in that they place two players on him wherever possible.

 

Midfield player backs into him making no effort to play the ball...(squeezing and pushing Lambert off balance and not allowing him to get off the ground) the centre back who then comes over the top of Lambert.. clearing the ball.

 

Even with all this he still wins quite a few of these challenges.

 

Lambert came deeper and deeper to win the ball and build up play which is a big part of our play re Lallana , Ramirez and Lambert. WE MISS LALLANA BIG TIME....

 

Morgan not at the races and should have been subbed much earlier....injured or just shiiiite.

 

Puncheon should have pulled the trigger earlier a few times..

 

As above...JROD should have started this game....

 

COYS

[leithsaint]

Was Morgan holding back slightly due to being one booking away from missing a game? When does the yellow card tally get reset to zero, January?

 

Thought Saints were the better team up until the 30 minute mark, then the performance seemed to go a bit flat. Set pieces were fustrating, too many over hit crosses. Too many players unwilling to take the shot, at least Gaston seems to back himself and have a go.

 

Still a long way to go, 63 points still to play for!

[melmacian_saint]

How Fonte missed that header is beyond me. Completely free, a rare decent delivery, and he spooned it wide.

 

How our CB had the most clear chance of a game where we dominated the ball and the territory covered is beyond me.

 

A lot of stick was given in these 4 months to our defenders, but the truth is overall our attacking force has been far more inconsistent, especially since we started getting it right at the back.

[Barry Sanchez]

It all comes back to the point of our squad is simply not strong enough for the Premiership, thats the underlying point to inconsistent, poor and lacking performances.

The question should be why did we go into this Legaue with such a squad?

We have a lovely training pitch though.....................

[derry]

The only bit of that I agree with is the lineswoman's perception of where her line is. Thought Webb was the best Ref we've had at St Mary's this season and Mayuka (although there may have been minimal contact) took a dive.

 

Totally inconsistent. On the replay it clearly showed bodily contact pushing Mayuka, of course he went down. Webb was giving fouls all afternoon for a lot less bodily contact outside the area. If it's a foul outside the area it's a foul inside. I do feel with Webb and a few other high profile refs like Dean, Halsey, Klattenburg, if it was Van Persie,Rooney, Tevez, Torres etc they would be racing over to the penalty spot.

[OldNick]

The only bit of that I agree with is the lineswoman's perception of where her line is. Thought Webb was the best Ref we've had at St Mary's this season and Mayuka (although there may have been minimal contact) took a dive.

i wasnt at the game but from the TV shots it was a def penalty.

[Give it to Ron]

Totally inconsistent. On the replay it clearly showed bodily contact pushing Mayuka, of course he went down. Webb was giving fouls all afternoon for a lot less bodily contact outside the area. If it's a foul outside the area it's a foul inside. I do feel with Webb and a few other high profile refs like Dean, Halsey, Klattenburg, if it was Van Persie,Rooney, Tevez, Torres etc they would be racing over to the penalty spot.

 

Dont agree with that at all - Mayuka dived was hardly any contact at all it was right in front of me. I know its the done thing now to slag off referees but Webb was very very good on Saturday and got 99.9% right IMO. The number of times he let it flow with advantage and the stopping it quickly when obvious it wasn't going to be was top reffing.

Best one we have had all season by far.

[derry]

Dont agree with that at all - Mayuka dived was hardly any contact at all it was right in front of me. I know its the done thing now to slag off referees but Webb was very very good on Saturday and got 99.9% right IMO. The number of times he let it flow with advantage and the stopping it quickly when obvious it wasn't going to be was top reffing.

Best one we have had all season by far.

 

Watch the replay. With all the fouls he gave, no matter how slight the contact, you are right, but the one he didn't give was as much if not more of a foul than most of those he gave.

[Window Cleaner]

Watch the replay. With all the fouls he gave, no matter how slight the contact, you are right, but the one he didn't give was as much if not more of a foul than most of those he gave.

 

Ref was too far away to be really sure of what happened, was 50/50 and as he obviously didn't see he gave the benefit of the doubt to the defender, isn't it usually the other way round? Could have been a penalty though for some refs. Defender definitely clipped Mayuka's ankle but he made a lot of it as well.

Edited 24 December, 2012 by Window Cleaner

[Give it to Ron]

Ref was too far away to be really sure of what happened, was 50/50 and as he obviously didn't see he gave the benefit of the doubt to the defender, isn't it usually the other way round? Could have been a penalty though for some refs. Defender definitely clipped Mayuka's ankle but he made a lot of it as well.

 

That was why it wasn't given...it was him going down like he had been poleaxed that helped Webb decide there was minimal contact.

Webb's performance was the best I have seen in years but helped by both sides not able to hit a cows arse with a banjo and string together

more than a handful of passes to teammates.

[Window Cleaner]

That was why it wasn't given...it was him going down like he had been poleaxed that helped Webb decide there was minimal contact.

Webb's performance was the best I have seen in years but helped by both sides not able to hit a cows arse with a banjo and string together

more than a handful of passes to teammates.

 

Can't disagree with that.

[SaintWill71]

To have such a lack of creativity with the absence of just one player is really worrying.

[rallyboy]

we have won games recently despite shocking refs, yet I'm happy to come away from that dismal defeat and say that Webb was just head and shoulders above some of the clowns we have had to suffer.

 

Though I didn't agree with everything he did, his control of the game was all you would ask of any ref - fair, and if you were rating EVERYONE on that pitch, I suspect he would be right up in the top three performers.

 

He spotted a subtle foul early on that indicated that he knew what he was doing, he needs to go train a few of his comical colleagues - Clattenberg should try and learn from this guy.

 

Bring on the next clown.

[Window Cleaner]

To have such a lack of creativity with the absence of just one player is really worrying.

 

 

system was at fault not the personnel. We were hoofing, we do not hoof simply because we do not know how to hoof.

Diagonal passes to Lambert were just comical. Normally we get down the wings whenever possible, for some strange reason or other Adkins decided that Cork and Schneiderlin weren't to do that at all on Saturday, look at the games we've won of late they got forward down the sides from time to time to give us another dimension, Saturday they brought the ball forward to about 30 yds out and then as there was no movement in front they had to either go square, back or send in a hopeful RSH ball to a doubly marked player, usually either Ramirez or Puncheon. Now on a wet pitch like Saturday a few balls drilled in low from the sides of the penalty box would have brought far better results than the monotonous diagonal high balls for Lambert to lose out on a constant basis.

Good manager would have known that.

Edited 24 December, 2012 by Window Cleaner

[Give it to Ron]

system was at fault not the personnel. We were hoofing, we do not hoof simply because we do not know how to hoof.

Diagonal passes to Lambert were just comical. Normally we get down the wings whenever possible, for some strange reason or other Adkins decided that Cork and Schneiderlin weren't to do that at all on Saturday, look at the games we've won of late they got forward down the sides from time to time to give us another dimension, Saturday they brought the ball forward to about 30 yds out and then as there was no movement in front they had to either go square, back or send in a hopeful RSH ball to a doubly marked player, usually either Ramirez or Puncheon. Now on a wet pitch like Saturday a few balls drilled in low from the sides of the penalty box would have brought far better results than the monotonous diagonal high balls for Lambert to lose out on a constant basis.

Good manager would have known that.

 

Good post Window....JayRod had a good game against Reading, although should of scored he did well, we all of a sudden change formation and tactic to include Mayuke who hasn't started a game since when?

In post match interview he said he scored loads in training....well that's light years away from match day and against 2 decent defenders like O'Shea and Cuellar.

JayRod will be a decent player I am sure but is just lacking in confidence...leaving him on the bench after the last decent game is hardly likely to inspire him either.

Ramirez was having a nightmare yet was left on he should of been the one taken off.

Guly coming on was a good idea as the number of times the ball was played out to a deeper lying forward but we shouldn't of needed to get that far.

The 2 weeks rest didn't help us at all and we should of started the same side as finished against Reading.

[Window Cleaner]

G

 

The 2 weeks rest didn't help us at all and we should of started the same side as finished against Reading.

 

 

they rarely do, players want to play. I was kind of led to believe that the squad spent some time in a warm climate during the break. As there's been no official confirmation of that perhaps it's not true but should it be then the radical change of conditions between a mediterranean climate and Saturday's deluge might make a difference, especially to Mayuka who's all about pace and power.

[Give it to Ron]

they rarely do, players want to play. I was kind of led to believe that the squad spent some time in a warm climate during the break. As there's been no official confirmation of that perhaps it's not true but should it be then the radical change of conditions between a mediterranean climate and Saturday's deluge might make a difference, especially to Mayuka who's all about pace and power.

 

I meant it gave Adkins 2 weeks to think about it....had we just gone straight into the next game without time to think of changing the tactics or formation we would of performed far better I am sure.

To his credit he did try and change it round but the damage had been done and hard to up the tempo when playing that badly..we just got desperate.

[Window Cleaner]

I meant it gave Adkins 2 weeks to think about it....had we just gone straight into the next game without time to think of changing the tactics or formation we would of performed far better I am sure.

To his credit he did try and change it round but the damage had been done and hard to up the tempo when playing that badly..we just got desperate.

 

I sometimes get the impression that the less time he has to think and tinker the better it is. I really, really think it's time for a change. Perhap JRod is injured, that would explain him doing an interview when all the others had gone (in theory) to Malta.

[ottery st mary]

What a surprise Ottery having a go at Morgan..........................................................But Lambert can do no wrong!!!!!

 

Correct...Morgan was very poor and L ambert was ok:)

 

 

NA subbed Morgan ...but should have been sooner....

Edited 24 December, 2012 by ottery st mary

[Lazlo78]

Apologies if this has already been covered, but I find it interesting what exactly went wrong for their goal. As soon as Sunderland got possession our defense was imbalanced - Clyne and Fonte pressed high, while Yoshida and Shaw defended deep. As a result there was plenty of space to be onside behind Clyne making him look like the fool.

 

But how does the zonal marking work - in our team or in any professional team like that? Who decides how the defensive line moves, what rules are coached? Clyne and Fonte were looking towards the sideline and would just have to assume that Yoshida and Shaw were following their line. Yoshida and Shaw could see Fonte and still went deep - Shaw had to do so, as it would have made no sense to leave Yoshida alone. But why did Yoshida drop deep? My gut feeling is that he was to blame for the goal. Not looking for a scapegoat though (I rate Yoshida highly) but I want to gain an understanding of the goal.

 

Anyone in here who can explain how a zonal defense works. Or are we just a bunch of opinionated ignorants with absolutely no knowledge of how a football team works?

[up and away]

system was at fault not the personnel. We were hoofing, we do not hoof simply because we do not know how to hoof.

Diagonal passes to Lambert were just comical. Normally we get down the wings whenever possible, for some strange reason or other Adkins decided that Cork and Schneiderlin weren't to do that at all on Saturday, look at the games we've won of late they got forward down the sides from time to time to give us another dimension, Saturday they brought the ball forward to about 30 yds out and then as there was no movement in front they had to either go square, back or send in a hopeful RSH ball to a doubly marked player, usually either Ramirez or Puncheon. Now on a wet pitch like Saturday a few balls drilled in low from the sides of the penalty box would have brought far better results than the monotonous diagonal high balls for Lambert to lose out on a constant basis.

Good manager would have known that.

 

I agree a lot with what you are saying, but my interpretation is slightly different in that certain players are better suited to different formations. For Saints to be effective we need midfield control and then do the best with what is remaining as an attacking threat. Don't use Ricky as part of that midfield control unless you can manage the job most of the time without him. He just goes walk about into so many areas of the pitch to gain possession that the balance disappears for the midfield. I don't blame Kelvin for going long to Lambert all the time because there was no one free in midfield to pick out. Even though it made things predictable and easy to handle, compounded by the lack in midfield to pick up the pieces. Kelvin did nothing wrong but it's Gazzanigas extra options of delivery from hand and foot that gives him an edge, especially if you are looking to hit pace up front from the goalie.

 

-------------Ricky------------

Guly/Davis--Ramirez--Puncheon

-----Schneiderlin--Cork--------

 

That formation can still work for us but relies heavily upon the full backs getting forward to create the openings. No major issues as you still have some control of the midfield, can still nick a goal but the defence can push you up because you have little pace to keep them honest. The biggest problem we have seen with this in the past is that Ricky gets isolated and we are left in no mans land as to what to do next. We can still give an account of ourselves with this formation as long as the defence don't push us too far back and our sights are slightly lowered towards the draw. MON did his homework and all the negatives came home to roost. We could have picked out the same formation and team as against Newcastle and I still believe MON would have unpicked it easily. Now consider the alternative

 

------------Mayuka-----------

Guly/Davis--Ramirez--Puncheon

-----Schneiderlin--Cork--------

 

All you will need is a couple of decent balls to Mayuka and a midfield with the mobility to back him up and the defence is suddenly very reluctant to push you up to the half way line. That still does not stop you from bringing on Ricky in the second half where he can be effective against tired legs and MON not having the half time talk to organize them properly. This was the type of line up Adkins was trying with JRod at the start of the season, failing because we lacked too many missing / form players and JRod not up to it. It would not surprise me if this is tried with JRod again in the not too distant future.

 

This is just an opinion and I have seen many other valid posts around the same theme. One thing my belief is unshakeable on is that we have to have midfield parity / control otherwise it all goes to ratsheite and just do the best possible with what's left over. And as far as I am concerned we play a 451 when defending and something else when attacking, mainly dictated by the hole the opposition leaves that Ricky can operate from.

[david in sweden]

the main problem is still too much " pretty football ", and not enough attention to playing the final ball...and in some cases.. no-one there to finish off the move.

[Window Cleaner]

the main problem is still too much " pretty football ", and not enough attention to playing the final ball...and in some cases.. no-one there to finish off the move.

 

It's deeper than that. On Saturday we were woeful from the kick off. First thing we did after rolling the ball back from the centre-spot was for José to hoof it forward anywhere to be gobbled up by Sunderland who broke and forced a decent save from Kelv.

Then Rickie and Gaston contrived to just give them the ball, then Punch handballed it needlessly, then he fell over his own feet instead of getting a decent shot in. It was all wrong from the off, something wasn't kosher.

[captainchris]

I sometimes get the impression that the less time he has to think and tinker the better it is. I really, really think it's time for a change. Perhap JRod is injured, that would explain him doing an interview when all the others had gone (in theory) to Malta.

 

Our preparation has been very suspect before matches. This seems to particularly be a problem after two weeks off - why? I've been concerned at the way we prepare for a while..... Something is definately amiss. Too often we are soft and off the pace. Considering our massive back staff and general large team why is pre match prep of players poor???? This we business of 'we prepare in the same way' is not something to brag about - on the contrary this needs examining as its clearly not right....

[Lazlo78]

Anyone in here who can explain how a zonal defense works. Or are we just a bunch of opinionated ignorants with absolutely no knowledge of how a football team works?

 

I see. Interesting...

[Jonnyboy]

Are we the team in the prem with the least amount of pens awarded to us?