norwaysaint Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Okay, it's a flippant title for a subject perennially worthy of discussion. Here are a few bitesize stats to set off some of the more angry types. I keep saying UK, but actually much of it's just England and Wales, apologies to all the Scotch people, I'd hate to offend them. The Christian population of the UK is down by 4 million from a decade ago, 33.2m people Muslims now make up 4.8 % of the UK population, up from 1.8%, (2.7m people) "No religion" (That's not necessarily atheism) up from 15% to 25% 7% growth in population, more than half of which is down to migration 45% of Londoners are white British, down from 58% White British population down 400 000, 80% from 87% 13% of usual residents were born outside the UK. Non-immigration/ethnicity stats: while fewer people own their own home, more people own it outright. average of 12 cars for every 10 households - up on 11 cars per 10 households in 2001. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20677515 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20675307 I, for one, am only happy because of immigration, but that'd be me immigrating to Norway, where I am a bloody immigrant stealing their jobs and turning them all into Muslims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudders Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Kucho Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 It just shows that our country is overcrowded, we dont have the homes, infrastructure, social services and the NHS cant cope. Though for reasons unknown to me the government thinks we should let more people in. Norwaysaint, I read this article http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2246192/We-risk-like-Norway-quit-EU-says-Cameron--PM-warns-Britain-unable-influence-laws.html, should we aim to be like Norway? I have never been to Norway, though I know they are the richest, happiest and one of the healthiest people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 It just shows that our country is overcrowded, we dont have the homes, infrastructure, social services and the NHS cant cope. Though for reasons unknown to me the government thinks we should let more people in. Norwaysaint, I read this article http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2246192/We-risk-like-Norway-quit-EU-says-Cameron--PM-warns-Britain-unable-influence-laws.html, should we aim to be like Norway? I have never been to Norway, though I know they are the richest, happiest and one of the healthiest people. They also survive buy selling their fossil fuels only, they are ardently against mass immigration and self sufficient because of the gas, oil, fish and timber they sell. The Dubai of Europe............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 11 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Norwaysaint, I read this article http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2246192/We-risk-like-Norway-quit-EU-says-Cameron--PM-warns-Britain-unable-influence-laws.html, should we aim to be like Norway? I have never been to Norway, though I know they are the richest, happiest and one of the healthiest people. Well, nobody over here wants to join the EU. I can't remember the last time I even heard it being discussed. The situation over here is very different though. Norway is very wealthy, because they kept the oil business nationalised (the tories sold off the British oil industry long ago). Most of the money Norway makes is actually saved or invested for the future in an "oil-fund", so despite being wealthy, it's not that flash. I know the standard of living is higher than most, I have no idea if happiness levels are higher, with half the country barely seeing sunlight for the next few months, probably not. Oh and plenty of Norwegians complain about high levels of immigration here too, although they seem happy with "invisible immigrants" like me. I'd never return to the UK to live, but neither would most of the ex-pats on this board who are residents in other countries. I've not heard of anyone discussing the problems of Norway mentioned by Cameron before. I think we're generally satisfied with our position in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 How much tax to you pay in Norway and how much of that is subsidized by oil? Its then obvious why you do mnot want to join the EU, I cant blame you to be honest but your position is false and you would be the same as Sweden and Denmark if you did not have the oil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindsorSaint Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Oooh! A Royal Albert Tea Set! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Kucho Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 How is the health service in Norway? I am right to believe that also is of a high standard? It beggars believe that people can still vote Tory or Labour after all they have done to our beautifull country, I dont think they could do any worse even if they tried. I can understand you wouldn,t want to leave Norway, with the fjords and the outdoor sports you can do there it must be amazing. I have lived abroad since I was 4(26 now, have lived in the Netherlands, and spent time in Spain, Australia and the UK), though I am planning my return to the south coast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 11 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 11 December, 2012 How much tax to you pay in Norway and how much of that is subsidized by oil? Its then obvious why you do mnot want to join the EU, I cant blame you to be honest but your position is false and you would be the same as Sweden and Denmark if you did not have the oil. I pay about 33% tax, tax is very high here on everything. Much higher than in the UK. I don't understand what you mean by the false position thing. Are you simply saying that having oil makes Norway richer than it would be without oil? Well yes of course, most countries would be poorer if you didn't take their natural resources into account. Without oil, Norway would still be the poorer member of the Scandinavian states that it used to be, poorer than Sweden or Denmark, but Norway has oil. There's nothing false about it. Norway has also been investing heavily into life after oil as well, so the wealth won't be running out for some considerable time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 To be fair to Cameron (which I'm not very often) he was making a pretty narrow point that Norway is subject to EU law but has no voice in setting that law. He wasn't making a wider socio-economic criticism of Norway. It's worth pointing out that Norway's oil and gas production are both around twice that of the UK and the money earned is spread over a population of 5m rather than 60m. Norway and the UK really aren't comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 The trouble with the immigration debate is that usually someone ventures that mass immigration isnt a good thing, shortly followed by charges of xenophobia / racism. Importing an extra 4 million people in 10 years with a housing and employment shortage doesnt make sense, especially when the majority are low skill profile. Ive got several foreign friends (russian, US, French) who have made trips to London in the few years who when asked how they liked it all gave basically the same answer - meh its was okay but it was full of foreigners and almost no British, not what we came for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 It's worth pointing out that Norway's oil and gas production are both around twice that of the UK and the money earned is spread over a population of 5m rather than 60m. Norway and the UK really aren't comparable. Thats true, but the big difference is that Norway invested the profits from oil and gas in a sovereign wealth fund so that the benefits will be had in perpetuity. Instead we decided to spend it all as soon as we got it and blew it all on day to day recurrent expenditures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 open door policy is total lunacy....anyone who thinks otherwise is a moron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 > should we aim to be like Norway? I have never been to Norway, though I know they are the richest, happiest and one of the healthiest people. Suicide rate in Norway 11.9 per 100,000 people. Rate in UK, 6.9 per 100,000. Interesting indication of 'happiness' ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 I have been to norway....hoffically expensive nice women though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Nothing changes unless we leave the EU. Labour were mental to allow the Eastern Europeans in when they didn't need to. They could have had seven years grace, bit of time for preparation. They chose not to take it. In any event, rules of the single market means free movement for any citizen once their country has been a member for seven years. We won't leave the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 I fail to see any good what so ever in allowing anyone in the EU to walts on over here... wander down any city centre now and there are more and more eastern europeans than ever before...but that is another point. the fact we didnt have enough houses before all this started should have been enough to say no....let alone now. how we expect the NHS to cope is beyond me..... what the hell do we as a society have in common with romanian, albanian, bulagarian migrants...? very little or nothing what so ever.. in the meantime...canadians, ozzies and kiwis...who we have a great deal of cultural similarities with..even share the same bloody head of state with...cannot come over like a romanian gypsie can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Slightly off topic, but cba to start a new thread. Andrew Rawnsley wrote a very good article on those assuming the UK would leave the EU a couple of weeks bad. It's worth a read. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/nov/25/britain-europe-european-union Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 The trouble with the immigration debate is that usually someone ventures that mass immigration isnt a good thing, shortly followed by charges of xenophobia / racism. Importing an extra 4 million people in 10 years with a housing and employment shortage doesnt make sense, especially when the majority are low skill profile. Ive got several foreign friends (russian, US, French) who have made trips to London in the few years who when asked how they liked it all gave basically the same answer - meh its was okay but it was full of foreigners and almost no British, not what we came for. I agree with this entirely, I think the fact that we have an open door policy more or less is crippling. I am not Xenophobic in the slightest, my boss and a lot of the people I work with are from eastern Europe and are more qualified then I am, and I am talking HV protection schemes etc here not a building site.. So this shows that of course in certain aspects we need foreign labour and it is in no means a burden. In this aspect we should be more like Australia, who if I rememver rightly will only allow entry if you are qualified to take a job they are short of workforce for and almost always require you to have a higher skill set AND a certain amount of savings behind you. Allowing any tom **** and harry in causes more far reaching problems, like Tim says, hospitals, housing and benefits systems are stretched to breaking point, and unfortunately if you ever speak up about this you are automatically branded a xenophobe or worse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 I love the EU immigration policy as I would like my kids to study and live in Europe with no hassles. It's going to remain as long as we are in the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 If you have come from poland and now live in the uK, How long before the individaul has to change there number plates to UK plates and do they not also require to get UK road tax. Or do they not have to pay that either? Can somebody please advise, as I want to bubble the driver to the authorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 If you have come from poland and now live in the uK, How long before the individaul has to change there number plates to UK plates and do they not also require to get UK road tax. Or do they not have to pay that either? Can somebody please advise, as I want to bubble the driver to the authorities. I thought you were Viking Warrior, not Petty Supergrass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stain Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Where I live there aren't any shops where I can buy an English newspaper. That can't be right, can it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the stain Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Actually, I forgot the newsagent down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonManager Posted 11 December, 2012 Share Posted 11 December, 2012 Actually, I forgot the newsagent down the road. Yes you did Mr Stainsworthy. Your copy of Stain and Blemish Weekly is double folded and laid out on the counter for your collection come the morrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Kucho Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 Suicide rate in Norway 11.9 per 100,000 people. Rate in UK, 6.9 per 100,000. Interesting indication of 'happiness' ! According to these surveys the Norwegians are the happiest nation, or are in the top 3 happiest nation. http://www.forbes.com/pictures/mef45ejmi/01-norway/ http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/344450/20120523/top-ten-happiest-countries-world-2012.htm#page9 http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/05/24/the-10-happiest-countries-in-the-world/#photo-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 According to these surveys the Norwegians are the happiest nation, or are in the top 3 happiest nation. http://www.forbes.com/pictures/mef45ejmi/01-norway/ http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/344450/20120523/top-ten-happiest-countries-world-2012.htm#page9 http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/05/24/the-10-happiest-countries-in-the-world/#photo-9 That'll be the ones who are still alive presumably? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 12 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 December, 2012 The Norwegians killing themselves are doing it mostly because they wanted to be in the EU. (Actually, I believe the figures are skewed by a much higher suicide rate in northern Norway, where during winter, the sun barely reaches over the horizon, creating depression in many people. We still get daytime down here, so we manage to resist the urge.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 The Norwegians killing themselves are doing it mostly because they wanted to be in the EU. (Actually, I believe the figures are skewed by a much higher suicide rate in northern Norway, where during winter, the sun barely reaches over the horizon, creating depression in many people. We still get daytime down here, so we manage to resist the urge.) The weather and climate can have a big impact on suicides. Once read that Darwin in Aus has one of the highest suicide rates in the Western world, it was put down to the oppressive heat and humidity during the rainy season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Sanchez Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 The weather and climate can have a big impact on suicides. Once read that Darwin in Aus has one of the highest suicide rates in the Western world, it was put down to the oppressive heat and humidity during the rainy season. And also being in the arse end of nowhere with no women. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 If you have come from poland and now live in the uK, How long before the individaul has to change there number plates to UK plates and do they not also require to get UK road tax. Or do they not have to pay that either? Can somebody please advise, as I want to bubble the driver to the authorities. Six months, I believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Who? Posted 12 December, 2012 Share Posted 12 December, 2012 We are a very diverse country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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