Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I was thinking about the signings we have made over the last few years and also about the old 'Adkins isn't being forced to play Guly', 'Adkins can now pick his own team' opinions after the apparent showdown talks (did these actually happen) and I was wondering who was signed as part of this committee, and who was signed without Nigel's prior 'consent'. For me (this Summer) it goes like this: Committee Rodriguez Clyne Gazzaniga Non Adkins Mayuka Ramirez Yoshida Boruc Is this the best wat to be signing players, especially with such an important season, and will the committee identify the right players for January I wonder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KelvinsRightGlove Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 It would be extremely naive to think many managers have 100% control over transfers. This is only going to become more the case with the decreasing shelf-life of managers. It makes little sense in that respect really. People are overly hostile to this notion. If done well, it can massively benefit the side. You only have to look at Newcastle over the past couple of years to see this. Alan Carr's dad has a large role in player recruitment. Served them pretty well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanh Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I reckon that all of our transfers in the summer were a committee decision. I also think that different members of the committee had stronger opinions on some players than on others. We are pretty sure that NA has been keen on J-Rod for a while but the rest of the transfers could have been driven by any of the members of the committee. NA has been positive about all of the players recruited in the summer but then he's positive about almost everything so that's no guide. It would be more interesting to know whether NA has a veto on the players brought in or if there is a set of criteria that they have to meet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Alan Nixon on twitter said at the time that Mayuka was 100% a Cortese signing, as he know him. He also stated that it was direct deal between him and the club to the point that we avoided all agents fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mowgli Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 It's much simpler than people think. The coaching staff identify weak areas in the team, the scouts come up with a few potential targets. The Board decide whether they can afford them. Not sure who handles the contract negotitations but I would imagine this is something Cortese does not delegate so easiliy. As has always been the case at SFC and many other clubs. Some transfers work better than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I reckon that all of our transfers in the summer were a committee decision. I also think that different members of the committee had stronger opinions on some players than on others. We are pretty sure that NA has been keen on J-Rod for a while but the rest of the transfers could have been driven by any of the members of the committee. NA has been positive about all of the players recruited in the summer but then he's positive about almost everything so that's no guide. It would be more interesting to know whether NA has a veto on the players brought in or if there is a set of criteria that they have to meet. I seem to remember NA not even having heard of or at least not interested in Yoshida earlier in the Summer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I was thinking about the signings we have made over the last few years and also about the old 'Adkins isn't being forced to play Guly', 'Adkins can now pick his own team' opinions after the apparent showdown talks (did these actually happen) and I was wondering who was signed as part of this committee, and who was signed without Nigel's prior 'consent'. For me (this Summer) it goes like this: Committee Rodriguez Clyne Gazzaniga Non Adkins Mayuka Ramirez Yoshida Boruc Is this the best wat to be signing players, especially with such an important season, and will the committee identify the right players for January I wonder? has many ****ign times. All the players were signed due to a committee so the list will be Committee Rodriguez Clyne Gazzaniga Mayuka Ramirez Yoshida Boruc Non Adkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Regardless, "The Committee" ballsed up this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Regardless, "The Committee" ballsed up this summer. probably why NA is still in the job actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Regardless, "The Committee" ballsed up this summer. To be fair when I was complaining in the Summer you were one of the biggest dissenters to my opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 probably why NA is still in the job actually. I agree with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bartosz Bialkowski Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Cortese signs off every invoice, for baloons.... even Coca Cola. Its crazy to think he isnt involved in almost every part of the transfer process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 To be fair when I was complaining in the Summer you were one of the biggest dissenters to my opinions. Just thought your obssession with buying players with Premier League experience misdirected, which is still the case. As I've always said, we should have focused our resources on centre backs, a left back and a keeper, we didn't and have paid the price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Just thought your obssession with buying players with Premier League experience misdirected, which is still the case. As I've always said, we should have focused our resources on centre backs, a left back and a keeper, we didn't and have paid the price. Lol, you still think I said Premier League experience, and not just top division experience. Wow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Lol, you still think I said Premier League experience, and not just top division experience. Wow! Well we bought plenty of players with "top division" experience, Davis, Yoshida, Ramirez, Boruc, so I assume you are happy with our transfer policy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Well we bought plenty of players with "top division" experience, Davis, Yoshida, Ramirez, Boruc, so I assume you are happy with our transfer policy? I think it's implied that the top division should be decent, ie: England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain. You left out Mayuka as well if you're looking at it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I think it's implied that the top division should be decent, ie: England, France, Germany, Italy, Spain. You left out Mayuka as well if you're looking at it that way. Ah good point, yep Mayuka has played and scored against top-level European oppossition. So players from the top flight in Italy x 2, Holland and England on top of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Ah good point, yep Mayuka has played and scored against top-level European oppossition. So players from the top flight in Italy x 2, Holland and England on top of that. I was being facetious with Mayuka by the way...My point still stands, we didn't buy enough quality from the better top divisions, especially at CB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I was thinking about the signings we have made over the last few years and also about the old 'Adkins isn't being forced to play Guly', 'Adkins can now pick his own team' opinions after the apparent showdown talks (did these actually happen) and I was wondering who was signed as part of this committee, and who was signed without Nigel's prior 'consent'. For me (this Summer) it goes like this: Committee Rodriguez Clyne Gazzaniga Non Adkins Mayuka Ramirez Yoshida Boruc Is this the best wat to be signing players, especially with such an important season, and will the committee identify the right players for January I wonder? Why would we have a transfer committee if there are signings being made outside of the committee? That doesn't make any sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmel Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Regardless, "The Committee" ballsed up this summer. I think the article detailing which clubs had paid which amounts to agents, gives us a good clue as to what went wrong. We are apparently very difficult to deal (No real issues with that) and obviously not in favour of agents, or agent fees. We can argue as to whether that is right or wrong - But for now it seems that is the business model we are working to, which makes the "pool" of players a great deall smaller and why we will lose players mid negociaton, as their agents push them in other directions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 (edited) It's much simpler than people think. The coaching staff identify weak areas in the team, the scouts come up with a few potential targets. The Board decide whether they can afford them. Not sure who handles the contract negotitations but I would imagine this is something Cortese does not delegate so easiliy. As has always been the case at SFC and many other clubs. Some transfers work better than others. Best "simple " explanation to this derisive subject I've heard, Mowgli. I agree that the first three mentioned in the OP were probably NA's own choices. I recall Strachan saying one time "....I give the Chairman a list of the players I'd liked to have... .and leave it with him." Obviously .he who hold the purse strings, makes the offers, salaries and conditions. Then either they agree (or not).... or the player won't move / his wife doesn't want to move (seen that one a few times) ....or the player goes elsewhere for a better deal, or his club won't release him....or his face doesn't fit. Lowe was a bit like that, and Cortese has his own variation I'm sure. It's down to the ones we can afford to get in... and up to the manager to use them in the squad, as he will. At the end of the day - it's his head. I get the impression that NA had seen Yoshida play in the Olympics, and even seen Ramirez too , but I don't know how much he may have known about Mayuka. Whereas the average manager maybe in step with the better talents in the English leagues, I doubt if they have the same grasp of the World football scene to the same extent. Thats why we have scouts. Edited 4 December, 2012 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Why would we have a transfer committee if there are signings being made outside of the committee? That doesn't make any sense. I agree it doesn't. Of course that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 (edited) I agree it doesn't. Of course that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. It does. There is zero chance that Adkins signed Clyne, Gazzaniga or Rodriguez without the backing of the other committee members. The whole point of a committee is that everyone is involved. Quite likely that NA wanted these players, and also likely the Committee also did. As others have said most prem teams recruit in this way, to split them out like that is so naive. Please explain how NA can sign players without the backing of the committee. You won't be able to to therefore all the signings, as Chez said, should be labelled Committee. By all means slag off the Committee, but put to bed this idea that some signings are Adkins or Cortese and some are the Committee - it doesn't work like that. Edited 4 December, 2012 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 ....I'm sure that Cortese's knowledge of the financial world is more exact than that of the football world, but he does seem adept at signing players from struggling clubs.... and getting a deal. In the present market (and considering the Prem.standards) ..although £12 million may sound a lot for SFC, it must be a good deal by any standards. When we've seen half-a-season of Mayuka in action, we may come to the same conclusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 This is what I find strange in regards to Yoshida: Boss Nigel Adkins completely dismissed the prospect of landing the 24-year-old following the weekend's 2-0 home defeat to Wigan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 I reckon that all of our transfers in the summer were a committee decision. I also think that different members of the committee had stronger opinions on some players than on others. We are pretty sure that NA has been keen on J-Rod for a while but the rest of the transfers could have been driven by any of the members of the committee. NA has been positive about all of the players recruited in the summer but then he's positive about almost everything so that's no guide. It would be more interesting to know whether NA has a veto on the players brought in or if there is a set of criteria that they have to meet. Ramirez wasn't because when Adkins was asked about him before he signed he knew very little about him and made comments like "He sounds like a good player" and "yeah, i hear he's gonna be on a few bob as well" Not that it's a bad thing because Ramirez is a player that clubs like us really shouldn't be signing. Credit where it's due to Cortese for that one. Boruc was clearly a window shut panic buy when we realised we had f*cked up with our goalkeepers. Not sure who to had that one although i am advised it was the work of young Leslie. Adkins said we weren't going to be signing Yoshida the week before we did! I actually beleive the committee is the best way of identifying and signing players and i dont believe the manager should have sole responsiblity to this. But as he picks the team (supposedly) then i believe he should have a bigger say than the other two. For example, if Adkin, Reed and NC make up the committee, Adkins insists he doesn't want a player but the other two do, then they shouldn't persue him. However, if Cortese and Reed cant agree on a player than Adkins should have the casting vote. In an ideal world obviously all of them would agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 It does. There is zero chance that Adkins signed Clyne, Gazzaniga or Rodriguez without the backing of the other committee members. The whole point of a committee is that everyone is involved. Quite likely that NA wanted these players, and alos likely the Committee also did. Eh? I never said that did happen? I think signings are taking place outside of the Committee, but not from Adkins point of view, but Cortese's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 This is what I find strange in regards to Yoshida: Boss Nigel Adkins completely dismissed the prospect of landing the 24-year-old following the weekend's 2-0 home defeat to Wigan. It is strange, but Rhys Williams got injured that weekend... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 (edited) Eh? I never said that did happen? I think signings are taking place outside of the Committee, but not from Adkins point of view, but Cortese's. You said in the OP "For me it goes like this" and then listed Committee Signings and Non Adkins Signings. The Committe discusses everyone! Thats the whole point of it. Obviously Cortese sanctions the financials so he has a big say but if you remember Adkins said he watched Mayuka lots of times last season...its a team effort. Adkins is part of the Committee but there is a whole Recruitment Team, plus NC that makes that up - NA has an equal view, probably no more but the fatc he has watched some of the 'non Adkins' players last year makes it unlikely he was not involved in any of the discussions. Edited 4 December, 2012 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 It would be extremely naive to think many managers have 100% control over transfers. QUOTE] Agree totally. It maybe that " the manager " has his own list (if available) and the deals are OK'd by others, but there are obviously good players " elsewhere" who he may know little about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 (edited) You said in the OP "For me it goes like this" and then listed Committee Signings and Non Adkins Signings. The Committe discusses everyone! Thats the whole point of it. Obviously Cortese sanctions the financials so he has a big say but if you remember Adkins said he watched Mayuka lots of times last season...its a team effort. Adkins is part of the Committee but there is a whole Recruitment Team, plus NC that makes that up - NA has an equal view, probably no more but the fatc he has watched some of the 'non Adkins' players last year makes it unlikely he was not involved in any of the discussions. Committee signings: NA, NC, LR Non Adkins signings: NC, LR Ramirez he hadn't seen though from quotes in the Summer? Said he sounded good etc. And I remember similar quotes when Guly was being touted. Edited 4 December, 2012 by Dibden Purlieu Saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano6 Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 So the "Non Adkins" signings are made by Adkins (and Reed)? Confusing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 So the "Non Adkins" signings are made by Adkins (and Reed)? Confusing. Sorry, writing on phone. Changed now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Committee signings: NA, NC, LR Non Adkins signings: NC, LR Ramirez he hadn't seen though from quotes in the Summer? Said he sounded good etc. And I remember similar quotes when Guly was being touted. Why did Adkins go to watch Yoshida and Mayuka last season if he wasn't involved in the transfers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 why did adkins go to watch yoshida and mayuka last season if he wasn't involved in the transfers? prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 prove it. Sorry Turkish, I only PM my mates with proof of anything. I could be making it all up for laugh though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Sorry Turkish, I only PM my mates with proof of anything. I could be making it all up for laugh though. That's more like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Why did Adkins go to watch Yoshida and Mayuka last season if he wasn't involved in the transfers? Did he go see Yoshida last season? Have you got the quotes for these two? If so fairplay, but they certainly don't seem like his signings. He that should be moved if he did go see him, but he certainly didn't seem interested in Yoshida when he was asked about him after Wigan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Did he go see Yoshida last season? Have you got the quotes for these two? If so fairplay, but they certainly don't seem like his signings. He that should be moved if he did go see him, but he certainly didn't seem interested in Yoshida when he was asked about him after Wigan. He definitely siad he had been out to Switzerland to watch Mayuka, and said he had watched Yoshida in the Olympics and the Scouts had watched him last season, unsure if NA did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 He definitely siad he had been out to Switzerland to watch Mayuka, and said he had watched Yoshida in the Olympics and the Scouts had watched him last season, unsure if NA did. He did do this. I can confirm this is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Did he go see Yoshida last season? Have you got the quotes for these two? If so fairplay, but they certainly don't seem like his signings. He that should be moved if he did go see him, but he certainly didn't seem interested in Yoshida when he was asked about him after Wigan. Yes he went to Holland to watch him at least twice last season. Struggling to understand the logic behind who seems like an Adkins signing vs who doesn't? Is it a case that if the're English and from the Championship= Adkins, Foreign and from the Continent= not Adkins? Given that Adkins very rarely gives much away regarding signings when asked, I'm surprised you are using quotes after the Wigan game to justify your argument. How often do you see a manager say a player won't be signing only to parading them around a few days later? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 He did do this. I can confirm this is true. Yeah - he said this in the Saints Player interviews after they signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 If they didn't play for S****horpe they aren't an Adkins signing. FACT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Yes he went to Holland to watch him at least twice last season. Struggling to understand the logic behind who seems like an Adkins signing vs who doesn't? Is it a case that if the're English and from the Championship= Adkins, Foreign and from the Continent= not Adkins? Given that Adkins very rarely gives much away regarding signings when asked, I'm surprised you are using quotes after the Wigan game to justify your argument. How often do you see a manager say a player won't be signing only to parading them around a few days later? Yep - good sterotyping. NA is naive to any European or Worldwide players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 If they didn't play for S****horpe they aren't an Adkins signing. FACT. Seems that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 Yes he went to Holland to watch him at least twice last season. Struggling to understand the logic behind who seems like an Adkins signing vs who doesn't? Is it a case that if the're English and from the Championship= Adkins, Foreign and from the Continent= not Adkins? Given that Adkins very rarely gives much away regarding signings when asked, I'm surprised you are using quotes after the Wigan game to justify your argument. How often do you see a manager say a player won't be signing only to parading them around a few days later? You do hear that, but it was more that Adkins alluded to not wanting Yoshida, and not a classic 'I don't want to talk about any specific players', and also hardly playing Mayuka that made me think the signings weren't his. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 (edited) You do hear that, but it was more that Adkins alluded to not wanting Yoshida, and not a classic 'I don't want to talk about any specific players', and also hardly playing Mayuka that made me think the signings weren't his. If he played Mayuka instead of Lambert then the Forum would go mad....he can't win sometimes. The Prem is a hard league to play in, the pace, intensity etc - players need time to settle, and Mayuka is young. Yoshida he would have prefferred to allow to settle but Jos was so poor he had no choice. Edited 4 December, 2012 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 If he played Mayuka instead of Lambert then the Forum would go mad... I wouldn't, at least not until Mayuka had missed a couple of sitters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 4 December, 2012 Share Posted 4 December, 2012 You do hear that, but it was more that Adkins alluded to not wanting Yoshida, and not a classic 'I don't want to talk about any specific players', and also hardly playing Mayuka that made me think the signings weren't his. But he plays Yoshida every game so why does the same logic not apply with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 4 December, 2012 Author Share Posted 4 December, 2012 If he played Mayuka instead of Lambert then the Forum would go mad....he can't win sometimes. The Prem is a hard league to play in, the pace, intensity etc - players need time to settle, and Mayuka is young. Yoshida he would have prefferred to allow to settle but Jos was so poor he had no choice. I'm not saying he should, but even to freshen things up? It just seems with the lack of playing time that perhaps he was a signing that Adkins hadn't seen, that's all. He may have also said he went and watched these players to make the fans think the signings had something to do with him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now