bridge too far Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/10/water-companies-tax Should I deduct a percentage from my water bill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 btf, as I recall it you were one of the people sticking up for water metering on another thread. If you want to make a point against those paragons of virtue that are Southern Water, go back to that thread, read up on their payment policies and refuse to pay them by metered charges. (unless you already have one, in which case you cant. Which to me is discrimination.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 11 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 11 November, 2012 btf, as I recall it you were one of the people sticking up for water metering on another thread. If you want to make a point against those paragons of virtue that are Southern Water, go back to that thread, read up on their payment policies and refuse to pay them by metered charges. (unless you already have one, in which case you cant. Which to me is discrimination.) In fact, Thames Water is my supplier and will be when we move house next month. It's a new house so it will be automatically metered as is our current house. I'll just stop using water Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/10/water-companies-tax Should I deduct a percentage from my water bill? Well if you do I don't think you'll find yourself in hot water Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopGun Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 In fact, Thames Water is my supplier and will be when we move house next month. It's a new house so it will be automatically metered as is our current house. I'll just stop using water Aside from the tax avoidance issue in the news now, people forget that most of your water bill is spent on taking sewage away and treating it, rather than supplying you with clean water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 11 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 11 November, 2012 Aside from the tax avoidance issue in the news now, people forget that most of your water bill is spent on taking sewage away and treating it, rather than supplying you with clean water. So I need to stop cra**ing too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St_Tel49 Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 So I need to stop cra**ing too? Keep taking the Immodium Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 I saw on the news some bloke who had turned his entire back garden into a huge well and hoped to completely cut himself off from the water company in time. The water he collected ran his sink, washing machine and toilets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/10/water-companies-tax Should I deduct a percentage from my water bill? A Thames spokesman said: "With nearly £1bn of deferred tax liability on our balance sheet, tax is being delayed, not avoided. We are structured in an efficient way in accordance with the tax system and the benefits from this flow through to Thames Water customers – in the form of £1bn a year of essential investment while keeping bills among the lowest in the sector. All of the Thames Water group's active companies are resident in the UK and pay tax to HMRC." A spokesman for Anglian Water said: "Tax is low because of the very significant capital investment that we are making (£2.3bn between 2010 and 2015). Under the UK's tax regime, we are entitled to capital allowances on this investment as an incentive to invest early. However, tax payable is only deferred, so looking at our future tax liability you can see that we will in time pay the tax in full. There is no tax avoidance here whatsoever. The intra-group loan system has no bearing on our tax liabilities." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 Thames Water, are they trying to become the pompey of the water companies by delaying payment of tax to HMRC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 So I can earn 1million quid this year and pay tax on it in 2015? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 11 November, 2012 Share Posted 11 November, 2012 I should read the op comment but Scottish water are going to ask us users if we are willing to pay more for a better service . What the **** if we had a service in the first place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Out of interest BTF, will you not be buying coffee from Starbucks, not ordering any Christmas presents from Amazon or refusing to use Google as your search engine? Or is it just the water companies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Out of interest BTF, will you not be buying coffee from Starbucks, not ordering any Christmas presents from Amazon or refusing to use Google as your search engine? Or is it just the water companies? Fess up johnny, youve been listening to the Today programme, havent you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Out of interest BTF, will you not be buying coffee from Starbucks, not ordering any Christmas presents from Amazon or refusing to use Google as your search engine? Or is it just the water companies? You don't have to worry about Christmas presents JB. She isn't religious and doesn't believe we live in a Christian country so her she wouldnt allow herself to betray those morals by celebrating a Christian festival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Fess up johnny, youve been listening to the Today programme, havent you No, just read the Groaniad article.... You don't have to worry about Christmas presents JB. She isn't religious and doesn't believe we live in a Christian country so her she wouldnt allow herself to betray those morals by celebrating a Christian festival. That's OK each to their own and all that. Hope none of the lefties use Google though, because there are other options available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Out of interest BTF, will you not be buying coffee from Starbucks, not ordering any Christmas presents from Amazon or refusing to use Google as your search engine? Or is it just the water companies? It's not a question of 'will' it's a fact that I don't. I also don't shop at Tesco or bank with Barclays. It's not always possible because the corporate world is so convoluted, bu,t as far as I can, I avoid companies that conflict with my viewpoint. And I don't celebrate christmas either. As Turkish so charmingly explains, I'm not religious. However, I disagree with him when he says that I don't think Britain is a christian country. It likes to think it is, although some people are only christian when it suits them e.g. weddings, christenings, funerals. My daughter is profoundly christian and lives her life accordingly. Not all christians do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20288077 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 It's not a question of 'will' it's a fact that I don't. I also don't shop at Tesco or bank with Barclays. It's not always possible because the corporate world is so convoluted, bu,t as far as I can, I avoid companies that conflict with my viewpoint. And I don't celebrate christmas either. As Turkish so charmingly explains, I'm not religious. However, I disagree with him when he says that I don't think Britain is a christian country. It likes to think it is, although some people are only christian when it suits them e.g. weddings, christenings, funerals. My daughter is profoundly christian and lives her life accordingly. Not all christians do. Fair enough. So what search engine do you use? I ask this because most of them are crap, so I take it you are prepared to have an inferior web experience in keeping with your principles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I must be missing something here - why would anyone boycott any of these companies? Do you boycott any further that employs an accountant to minimise their tax liabilies within the law of this country? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 It's not a question of 'will' it's a fact that I don't. I also don't shop at Tesco or bank with Barclays. It's not always possible because the corporate world is so convoluted, bu,t as far as I can, I avoid companies that conflict with my viewpoint. And I don't celebrate christmas either. As Turkish so charmingly explains, I'm not religious. However, I disagree with him when he says that I don't think Britain is a christian country. It likes to think it is, although some people are only christian when it suits them e.g. weddings, christenings, funerals. My daughter is profoundly christian and lives her life accordingly. Not all christians do. What do you say to your grandchildren when they ask you why you don't buy them any Christmas presents? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 What do you say to your grandchildren when they ask you why you don't buy them any Christmas presents? Most of them are to young (and thankfully untainted by materialism) to ask. The older ones know my views on the matter and are intelligent enough to understand - even my 10 year old grandson. In all honesty, I doubt the little ones notice because they get such a lot of stuff from other people anyway. However, as I'm sure I've said before, we do make a point of getting them fairly big birthday presents because, after all, their birthdays are special to them. I hadn't appreciated that Google were tax avoiders so thanks for pointing that out. I'll look for another search engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 "Christmas" was a pagan festival long before the date was hijacked by Christians ergo it's fine for non-Christians to buy gifts for people on the same day that Christians do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 "Christmas" was a pagan festival long before the date was hijacked by Christians ergo it's fine for non-Christians to buy gifts for people on the same day that Christians do. I'm not a pagan either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I'm not a pagan either Ah....fair dos.....well, there's nothing stopping non-pagans and non-christians hijacking the date either and giving "Winter Festival" gifts on a date that happens to coincide with Christmas Day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 ****** and soil yourself like some on here do. Just make sure you're not wearing grey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Ah....fair dos.....well, there's nothing stopping non-pagans and non-christians hijacking the date either and giving "Winter Festival" gifts on a date that happens to coincide with Christmas Day. Why - for what purpose? I love buying presents for the people I love at any time, just because I love them - not because I get caught up in some mad commercialised pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint1977 Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Besides the tax issue, which I don't think is quite as straightforward as some instances of corporate tax avoidance recently although the Cayman Islands wheeze should interest HMRC - when are the Conservatives going to deliver on Thatcher's promise of increasing competition via privatisation? 25 years have passed and I still can't change from the utterly useless South West Water to another supplier (and no, I don't have a well in the bottom of my garden!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 for what purpose? There is no purpose to life and the universe ergo nothing matters one way or the other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindsorSaint Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 There is no purpose to life and the universe ergo nothing matters one way or the other I'm off down the pub then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I'm always amused by the idea that boycotting a company that doesn't pay much corporation tax might actually prove any sort of point. If such a company receives less revenue as a result of negative publicity, all that will happen is their profits will be smaller which will encourage them to cut costs (i.e. jobs), which of course then results in less PAYE/NI being paid As if the company would think "oh noes, we'd better pay more corporation tax and fewer dividends" rather than "let's keep the same dividends but trim the staff" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I'm always amused by the idea that boycotting a company that doesn't pay much corporation tax might actually prove any sort of point. If such a company receives less revenue as a result of negative publicity, all that will happen is their profits will be smaller which will encourage them to cut costs (i.e. jobs), which of course then results in less PAYE/NI being paid As if the company would think "oh noes, we'd better pay more corporation tax and fewer dividends" rather than "let's keep the same dividends but trim the staff" Oh OK - let them get away with it then Bad publicity shamed many of our large employers into giving up on the idea of exploiting the unemployed by getting them to work for nothing so who's to say similar campaigns won't challenge these companies to do what's right. Some of them are being questioned by a Parliamentary Select Committee this afternoon so it's to be hoped that loopholes will be closed. And, as an aside, a public campaign in Totnes forced Costa Cofee into pulling out of plans to open a branch there. So people power can be quite effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Bad publicity shamed many of our large employers into giving up on the idea of exploiting the unemployed by getting them to work for nothing so who's to say similar campaigns won't challenge these companies to do what's right. Some of them are being questioned by a Parliamentary Select Committee this afternoon so it's to be hoped that loopholes will be closed. If the various loopholes are closed, great, but it seems somewhat odd to have a pop at companies who are doing what any good business should be doing and minimising its expenditure within the laws of the land they are operating Why would you pay more than you need to? And, as an aside, a public campaign in Totnes forced Costa Cofee into pulling out of plans to open a branch there. So people power can be quite effective. That had nothing to do with corporation tax. That was a bunch of NIMBY types getting uppity that their town full of 1970s-esque tea rooms might have faced some proper competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 ... That had nothing to do with corporation tax. That was a bunch of NIMBY types getting uppity that their town full of 1970s-esque tea rooms might have faced some proper competition. Which is why I said 'as an aside'. The salient point was that the public can be very persuasive if they have a mind too, whether you agree with them or not. Sorry I didn't make that clear enough for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Which is why I said 'as an aside'. The salient point was that the public can be very persuasive if they have a mind too, whether you agree with them or not. Sorry I didn't make that clear enough for you. And the first bit? Why direct your ire at companies who are merely doing what companies do, rather than the succession of governments who allow it (arguably actively encourage it) to happen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 And the first bit? Why direct your ire at companies who are merely doing what companies do, rather than the succession of governments who allow it (arguably actively encourage it) to happen? The first bit, obviously, was about public pressusre too. Of course (successive) governments should change things but, since the government is really only held to account in a meaningful way at election time, then public pressure in the meantime can flag up the issue and encourage both the tax avoiders and the government to reconsider the loopholes. As will happen this afternoon, maybe. This government has about-turned on a number of issues already due to public pressure so it's always worth a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 The first bit, obviously, was about public pressusre too. Of course (successive) governments should change things but, since the government is really only held to account in a meaningful way at election time, then public pressure in the meantime can flag up the issue and encourage both the tax avoiders and the government to reconsider the loopholes. As will happen this afternoon, maybe. This government has about-turned on a number of issues already due to public pressure so it's always worth a try. So "Tory u-turns" are a good thing because it shows they're listening to the public? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I'm sure they'll be shamed into pay tax when they realise a pensioner from Gloucestershire or where it is has outed them on a soccerball forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 I'm sure they'll be shamed into pay tax when they realise a pensioner from Gloucestershire or where it is has outed them on a soccerball forum. Really? Who was that? I didn't know the Guardian employed pensioners or that one of them lived in Gloucestershire. I think they might squirm about when questioned by the Select Committee in the House this afternoon, though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 12 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 12 November, 2012 Some numpty from Amazon getting a right old ticking off by the Select Committee for turning up without any answers to their questions. Obviously a fall guy who will, no doubt, get a huge 'golden goodbye' from his employers for taking the flak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Gotsmanov Posted 12 November, 2012 Share Posted 12 November, 2012 They must be squirming at being cross examined by Margaret Hodge. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/businesslatestnews/9668396/Margaret-Hodges-family-company-pays-just-0.01pc-tax-on-2.1bn-of-business-generated-in-the-UK.html When will our politicians stop being hypocritical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 13 November, 2012 Author Share Posted 13 November, 2012 And now it seems that the energy market is being 'manipulated' http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/12/libor-like-manipulation-gas-markets Some good comments at the bottom of the article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 13 November, 2012 Share Posted 13 November, 2012 And now it seems that the energy market is being 'manipulated' http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/nov/12/libor-like-manipulation-gas-markets Some good comments at the bottom of the article Yet another example of p1ss poor regulation jameshunt7612 November 2012 6:51PM Thank goodness the Tories privatised utilities in this country, eh? Especially the local monopolies that are the water boards who pay virtually no UK taxes on their often hidden or sequestered profits. It's about time Labour (hopefully the next government) adopted a policy to re-nationalise the Electricity, Gas, Water and Railways. Oh they'd have to buy the shares? Okay - pass legislation to provide for compulsory purchase orders for the same price they were orginally sold for. Erm...didn't they have 13 years to do this last time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 13 November, 2012 Share Posted 13 November, 2012 Yet another example of p1ss poor regulation Erm...didn't they have 13 years to do this last time? Yes , they did. For some reason, they got sidetracked into an invasion or two, in order to make us more popular and help to stabilise the global economy. Oh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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